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Author Topic: bitcoincard.org  (Read 27198 times)
jwzguy
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April 26, 2012, 09:12:16 PM
 #21

I hope this happens.

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Matthew N. Wright
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April 26, 2012, 09:15:34 PM
 #22

Charlie said he used the device, he didn't say it even sends/receives bitcoins. It's a really cool concept but it's not going to work for bitcoin, and the fact that it won't work for Bitcoin is probably why you don't see anything on their website but a video that doesn't refer to bitcoin at all.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Ad-hoc Bitcoin blockchain is MintChip.

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April 26, 2012, 09:27:28 PM
 #23


Correct me if I'm wrong but Ad-hoc Bitcoin blockchain is MintChip.


Nah... it just needs private keys and a way to check balances and send transactions.  You could have a few trusted servers that sign all messages to verify they haven't been altered.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
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April 26, 2012, 09:33:13 PM
 #24

Hate the dumbed down nature of the video (do you really need to explain "credit-card size" so much).  The only thing you need is a smart card, like the openPGP card, that stores a small wallet in secured storage and that can make transactions.  (Wallet on smart card can be smallish and should be backed up to your desktop so you can move money on and off the card)
Here is how it would work:
1) POS terminal connects to smartcard telling it the amount and the address to send to
2) Smartcard makes transaction and gives it back to the POS terminal (smartcard could be made with a small display for amount and a confirm button so user could verify request before proceeding)
3) POS terminal verifies that it is valid (inputs have the necessary amounts to cover outputs, etc) and uploads transaction to Bitcoin network
4) Profit!  <-- Literally

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April 26, 2012, 09:39:25 PM
 #25

Charlie said he used the device, he didn't say it even sends/receives bitcoins. It's a really cool concept but it's not going to work for bitcoin

While there are several reasons to believe that it won't work very well for anything at all, since it looks like it combines about four different technologies that aren't really particularly mature, there's not any reason to think this wouldn't work for Bitcoin.  All you really need is a network connection and some basic processing.

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April 26, 2012, 09:54:30 PM
 #26

Ok, I can't watch the video right now.  Can someone give me a quick summary of what the card does?

(I hate it when companies release promotional videos without also explaining the content of the video in text form)
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April 26, 2012, 10:40:19 PM
 #27

Ok, I can't watch the video right now.  Can someone give me a quick summary of what the card does?

(I hate it when companies release promotional videos without also explaining the content of the video in text form)

The video has absolutely nothing to do with Bitcoin


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April 26, 2012, 10:44:19 PM
 #28

Ok, I can't watch the video right now.  Can someone give me a quick summary of what the card does?

(I hate it when companies release promotional videos without also explaining the content of the video in text form)

sure,

Quote
- digital signature keys are created and stored inside the card, and never leave it;
- the card does not have an operating system or the ability to download additional software, which protects the card from attacks by viruses;
- the exchange protocol with the outside world is simple and protected by encryption;
- if the wallet is lost, the money is also lost; - the card is completely anonymous;
- the card has unmatched energy efficiency, and does not need to be charged;
- the card has unprecedented processing power for an ordinary smart card;
- the cards communicate using their own radio protocol, and do not require any communications infrastructure.

In essence, Bitcoincards are Bitcoin clients and support the following operations:

- creation of an electronic wallet (addresses);
- receipt of coins from Bitcoin clients;
- transfer of coins to Bitcoin clients;
- transfer of coins from card to card (bypassing the Bitcoin system during transfer, but with subsequent confirmation in the system).
 

for more info http://www.bitcoincard.org/bitcoincard_read_more.php

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April 26, 2012, 11:17:07 PM
 #29

The first thing that came to mind for me is that its just like the tube thing they had in Max Headroom.

Just call me "Blank Shire"  Cool

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April 26, 2012, 11:29:58 PM
 #30

Ok, I can't watch the video right now.  Can someone give me a quick summary of what the card does?

(I hate it when companies release promotional videos without also explaining the content of the video in text form)

sure,

Quote
- digital signature keys are created and stored inside the card, and never leave it;
- the card does not have an operating system or the ability to download additional software, which protects the card from attacks by viruses;
- the exchange protocol with the outside world is simple and protected by encryption;
- if the wallet is lost, the money is also lost; - the card is completely anonymous;
- the card has unmatched energy efficiency, and does not need to be charged;
- the card has unprecedented processing power for an ordinary smart card;
- the cards communicate using their own radio protocol, and do not require any communications infrastructure.

In essence, Bitcoincards are Bitcoin clients and support the following operations:

- creation of an electronic wallet (addresses);
- receipt of coins from Bitcoin clients;
- transfer of coins to Bitcoin clients;
- transfer of coins from card to card (bypassing the Bitcoin system during transfer, but with subsequent confirmation in the system).
 

for more info http://www.bitcoincard.org/bitcoincard_read_more.php
Thanks.  It does sound like a pipe dream, but I hope they can make it work!

And how did you find that page??  I clicked on all the links from the homepage and they were all under construction...
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April 26, 2012, 11:36:45 PM
 #31

Thanks.  It does sound like a pipe dream, but I hope they can make it work!
Judging by the technology they claim they need to make it function, the method they're using to transmit, and the slightly over-the-top claims, I'd say it's highly unlikely in succeeding in this form and that they don't actually have a working system yet (or else we'd be hearing about how people were using it to send bitcoins at the conference etc)

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April 26, 2012, 11:39:26 PM
 #32

Thanks.  It does sound like a pipe dream, but I hope they can make it work!
Judging by the technology they claim they need to make it function, the method they're using to transmit, and the slightly over-the-top claims, I'd say it's highly unlikely in succeeding in this form and that they don't actually have a working system yet (or else we'd be hearing about how people were using it to send bitcoins at the conference etc)

What about:

what is this, when can i get mine?

http://bitcoincard.org/

A few Bitcoiners and I are meeting the guys behing BitcoinCard in Europe at the end of the month to talk about US Distribution.

Will keep you all updated!

are you saying this card is for real?

sounds like something out of science fiction movie!

Oh its for real! I was playing around with it at Future of Money Summit on Monday.

The dudes are super cool and LOVE BITCOIN.

Here is his twitter https://twitter.com/#!/shurakuzmin

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April 26, 2012, 11:44:12 PM
 #33

What about:

Oh its for real! I was playing around with it at Future of Money Summit on Monday.

I know, I know. It's a neat gadget I bet. But I would think that with all the bitcoiners that were using it and actually meeting with the developers that they'd even mention one single detail in praise of how bitcoin can be sent through it, wouldn't you?

It seems like it's a device that was created as a prototype at one point (probably sometime last year) and then bitcoiners picked up wind of it and someone convinced them to start developing it for Bitcoin (I bet I know who too  Wink).


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April 27, 2012, 12:19:00 AM
 #34

What about:

Oh its for real! I was playing around with it at Future of Money Summit on Monday.

I know, I know. It's a neat gadget I bet. But I would think that with all the bitcoiners that were using it and actually meeting with the developers that they'd even mention one single detail in praise of how bitcoin can be sent through it, wouldn't you?

It seems like it's a device that was created as a prototype at one point (probably sometime last year) and then bitcoiners picked up wind of it and someone convinced them to start developing it for Bitcoin (I bet I know who too  Wink).
Oh... I made the assumption that "playing with" the card meant using it with Bitcoins.  I got the impression that the card was made for Bitcoins.  Guess I was a bit wrong on that front!
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April 27, 2012, 06:32:27 AM
 #35

Welcome to the mushroom kingdom.

Quote
- limit on the size of transactions accepted, transferred and processed (currently no more than two inputs and two outputs);

Ripe for abuse.

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April 27, 2012, 08:45:53 AM
 #36

Umm...I've actually used the product, held it, and met the creators...a few days ago

Did you actually use the product as well? Tested the functionality? Sent bitcoins with it?

I agree with others, pics or didn't happen...

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April 27, 2012, 01:56:00 PM
 #37

First I have to say... WOW.  The video is great!  Whoever did that has a lot of talent!  It has style, it is clean, and shows enough to get you very excited.  Please make a video for bitcoin itself of that quality!!


Is this device even possible?   YES.  Just barely and with some tricks.  Can it do everything shown in the video practically and in the real world.. no.  But it can do most of what is shown and if made (if it has not been made already) will be a great boost to bitcoin and it's makers/investors.  COINLAB ARE YOU LISTENING?Huh 

My rough guess as to the specs/device:

CPU: something in the ballpark of S3CT9KW.  Maybe 4x better but probably not.
RAM 144KB
ROM 320KB
CPU speed 5Mhz

Display:
flexible epaper

Due to these choices of a super low cpu speed and super low power usage on the display the device can run off of solar power and/or tiny battery.  With this level of power the device could SEND and hold bitcoins.  It could accurately display a balance of what is held IF the keys were not held elsewhere because it knows what it sent out.   

What can it not do?  Receive bitcoins and know the balance accurately.  It could talk to a central computer for that, but the device is not going to be able to hold the blockchain or process it on its own.  Still this is good enough! 

Texting/display:
This is all possible.  The device could communicate with others near it or more realistically communicate to a base station that did the relay work.  A commodore 64 could run a full BBS, a device with 4x the power could easily run a texting service.  Coupons, offers and ads could be delivered as shown.

Tracking:
Of course.  This is pretty easy.  The base station is doing all of the work.  The card is just providing a beacon and a GUID. 

Mesh:
This is where the device breaks down.  Mesh has been the most over exaggerated area of computing I have seen.  Mesh stuff simply does not work that well in the real world.  The device could communicate with others nearby and form a mesh.... but it would not have the power to keep up that mesh all of the time.  With devices being in peoples pockets and not getting much power, the mesh would not get the density it needed except in a crowded space with many users all holding them up to the light. 

Now base stations all over the place would fix this.  And this might be possible do to with a very low cost  base device.  But the mesh is going to be formed by the base stations, not by the cards. 

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April 27, 2012, 03:29:40 PM
 #38

I've spoken with the creator via phone this morning. I do not believe the device is vaporware. Pricing is in the range of "extremely low."

They've been working on this thing for about 5 years, long before Bitcoin. When Bitcoin came around, it made some of the card's former features obsolete so they've retooled it to be heavily Bitcoin-focused. They said they found Bitcoin to be "far superior" to any of the community currencies the device was intended to be used with.

I'll be talking with the creators more and I can say perhaps in a month or so there may be some more solid information/news/review of this thing. In the mean time, just stay tuned and remain appropriately skeptical
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April 27, 2012, 03:52:17 PM
 #39

Sounds very very interesting.

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April 27, 2012, 04:07:37 PM
 #40

Fascinating.

And I'm pleasantly surprised at the FAQ having some level of detail, even if it includes info that wouldn't be seen as entirely positive (like a hard limit in the amount it can carry.) It's as if the creators (*gasp!*) actually know a little something about how bitcoin works, enough to toss more than just a few lines of fluff on there.

Cannot wait to see how this develops. Smiley

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