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Author Topic: [ANN][SLR] SolarCoin | PoW to PoS v. 2.0 | Solar Proof of Generation (§1 = 1MWh)  (Read 432298 times)
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April 16, 2016, 08:26:09 AM
 #3401

Why would a merchant accept Solarcoin? A partner recently asked why would a merchant accept solarcoin?  Thought I would share the answer for those interested. 

 The currency acceptance issue is an interesting one and a classic chicken and egg scenario.  Currency: a social protocol works most effectively when there are lots buyers and sellers willing to accept it. 
Right now solarcoin is where bitcoin was in 2012 two years after launch. A small network, but growing quickly.  Once a merchant perceives a personal benefit in signaling they accept Solarcoin they will. We have a small candle manufacturer accepting solarcoins and I even sold a few copies of my book for it. As the network grows, we anticipate uptake in SolarCoin but for now one needs a gateway service. see below. 

There are 2 main benefits for a merchant to accept solarcoin, pending market growth etc. to a more critical mass. 

1. Green goodwill as a marketing exercise. This is mostly a one off novelty effect for the merchant and has smaller appeal.

2. Cheap clearing fees.  Many retailers operate on 3-8% net income margins.  Visa, AMEX and Mastercard charge 1.5-3.5% for processing.  So the impact to free cash flow >real ROE for a merchant can be significant 10-30% improvement. It is the reason gas stations for example give a cash discount or discount for debit cards.

Bitcoin is a useful example here.  Bitcoin has roughly 3m users/acceptors.  As of early 2015 there were 100,000 bitcoin merchants, there are probably more now as there is price stability and better services globally. 

Gateway services:

1. SolarCoins can be converted into bitcoin and are traded 24/7.  https://www.coingecko.com/en/price_charts/solarcoin/usd

2. There are many bitcoin debit cards which effectively transfer  bitcoin into fiat during the debit card use. This works similar to what happens when a tourist spends money abroad with a credit or debit card. So effectively one can "spend" bitcoin anywhere they can use a debit card.  Most likely as solarcoin grows, similar automatic transaction services will spring up.  Expect it around 500k user network size.

Note that new SolarCoin wallets should include support for Android and IOS mobile wallets https://copay.io/  These will be udnerway post 2.11 release.

Hope this helps.

These are reasons why Merchants WON'T accept SolarCoin. BitCoin is not Green and in order to get out of the market the merchants have to take risks with it in order to give the appearance of being Green with SolarCoin. These risks could gain them money but they can also get stuck at percentages well above the normal fees for Visa or be forced to wait. So Merchants must sell to BitCoin to get their costs of goods back. This means they also have to give their identity and banking information to an Exchange under KYC-AML just to achieve liquidity. They also risk that the exchange may hack itself and take the customers funds. Questionable security along with market maneuvering just to accept a coin that people would have to take their FIAT that they could already hand the merchant and yet they go buy BitCoin, to then go buy SolarCoin, and then give it to the Merchant who must go Sell to BitCoin and then Sell to FIAT. Not many Merchants would put themselves through the wringer just to use a coin, and if they were going to accept Crypto they could just accept BitCoin since they have to get back to that anyways.

If SolarCoin was used outside of BitCoin it could be green and be adopted, instead it is now SolarCoin supporting and sustaining BitCoin usage. Another upside would be that there are not many people using SolarCoin so Merchant exposure would be very small. This may be the only reason to accept it and normally a Merchant who would agree to use SolarCoin would already be accepting BitCoin and have the channel setup for usage. So the 100,000 BitCoin merchants should be targeted as merchants and let the SolarCoin POW sell off for these merchants products commence!

Merchants build it into the costs of goods. The grants are free, it may cost a little more to buy something with SLR, but it's found money, everyone wins. Does Bitcoin do that? No, you have to buy it in order to spend it.

Someone has to buy SolarCoin with BitCoin first in order to pay the merchants even if the costs could be built in, meaning in the event of a dump to nil the merchants could lose everything along with an exchange hack that is very real. So churning out BitCoin will be the foundation of SolarCoin, as BitCoin is a Proxy for SolarCoin and can be given away for free like any alt coin could do at any time, why people buy it is the mystery.

Without BitCoin there are no SolarCoin merchants. It is like you are saying SolarCoin is so Green it is like finding a shiny free new electric car powered by the sun, only problem occurs since it has no charging capacity unless it is plugged into a BitCoin pump. But still you tell people SolarCoin is doing good... look at how fast it is moving on the highways right now! Only to find out that your Hybrid SolarCoin is moving fast, but on the back of a BitCoin Tow Truck spewing Black Smoke into the air gobbling up massive amounts of fuel just to move with SolarCoin winched up to it.

There will always need to be BitCoin in order to be liquid for merchants. If people just accept SolarCoin for trade then it works no problem, but why give something they can get money for to trade for a coin they may not get anything back in trade for eventually. The real possibility is that they just lost possession of the goods or service they traded, and the store they go to buy milk at only takes Fiat and not SolarCoins. Since they have to pay for costs of goods there is no way to just take SolarCoins in this market. It all goes back to BitCoin and Fiat. BitCoin bears the entire weight of SolarCoin and its Free coins, and creates the worth for SolarCoin simultaneously.

You think there will be a day when the tail wags the dog on this one? If they outlaw BitCoin chances are they outlaw SolarCoin too. Or if BitCoin becomes more valuable and sought after then why would people buy SolarCoin when they could own BitCoin instead. And if you say that perhaps BitCoin will become less sought after and cheaper, unfortunately SolarCoin must sell to that market and also have their coin devalued in the process.

I have created ways around these issues now. I am waiting for further developments to make sure it gets done correctly. I am not a coder so I have to rely on a team to implement it. Too bad it isn't the SolarCoin team.
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April 16, 2016, 08:48:01 AM
 #3402

Why would a merchant accept Solarcoin? A partner recently asked why would a merchant accept solarcoin?  Thought I would share the answer for those interested. 

 The currency acceptance issue is an interesting one and a classic chicken and egg scenario.  Currency: a social protocol works most effectively when there are lots buyers and sellers willing to accept it. 
Right now solarcoin is where bitcoin was in 2012 two years after launch. A small network, but growing quickly.  Once a merchant perceives a personal benefit in signaling they accept Solarcoin they will. We have a small candle manufacturer accepting solarcoins and I even sold a few copies of my book for it. As the network grows, we anticipate uptake in SolarCoin but for now one needs a gateway service. see below. 

There are 2 main benefits for a merchant to accept solarcoin, pending market growth etc. to a more critical mass. 

1. Green goodwill as a marketing exercise. This is mostly a one off novelty effect for the merchant and has smaller appeal.

2. Cheap clearing fees.  Many retailers operate on 3-8% net income margins.  Visa, AMEX and Mastercard charge 1.5-3.5% for processing.  So the impact to free cash flow >real ROE for a merchant can be significant 10-30% improvement. It is the reason gas stations for example give a cash discount or discount for debit cards.

Bitcoin is a useful example here.  Bitcoin has roughly 3m users/acceptors.  As of early 2015 there were 100,000 bitcoin merchants, there are probably more now as there is price stability and better services globally. 

Gateway services:

1. SolarCoins can be converted into bitcoin and are traded 24/7.  https://www.coingecko.com/en/price_charts/solarcoin/usd

2. There are many bitcoin debit cards which effectively transfer  bitcoin into fiat during the debit card use. This works similar to what happens when a tourist spends money abroad with a credit or debit card. So effectively one can "spend" bitcoin anywhere they can use a debit card.  Most likely as solarcoin grows, similar automatic transaction services will spring up.  Expect it around 500k user network size.

Note that new SolarCoin wallets should include support for Android and IOS mobile wallets https://copay.io/  These will be udnerway post 2.11 release.

Hope this helps.

These are reasons why Merchants WON'T accept SolarCoin. BitCoin is not Green and in order to get out of the market the merchants have to take risks with it in order to give the appearance of being Green with SolarCoin. These risks could gain them money but they can also get stuck at percentages well above the normal fees for Visa or be forced to wait. So Merchants must sell to BitCoin to get their costs of goods back. This means they also have to give their identity and banking information to an Exchange under KYC-AML just to achieve liquidity. They also risk that the exchange may hack itself and take the customers funds. Questionable security along with market maneuvering just to accept a coin that people would have to take their FIAT that they could already hand the merchant and yet they go buy BitCoin, to then go buy SolarCoin, and then give it to the Merchant who must go Sell to BitCoin and then Sell to FIAT. Not many Merchants would put themselves through the wringer just to use a coin, and if they were going to accept Crypto they could just accept BitCoin since they have to get back to that anyways.

If SolarCoin was used outside of BitCoin it could be green and be adopted, instead it is now SolarCoin supporting and sustaining BitCoin usage. Another upside would be that there are not many people using SolarCoin so Merchant exposure would be very small. This may be the only reason to accept it and normally a Merchant who would agree to use SolarCoin would already be accepting BitCoin and have the channel setup for usage. So the 100,000 BitCoin merchants should be targeted as merchants and let the SolarCoin POW sell off for these merchants products commence!

Merchants build it into the costs of goods. The grants are free, it may cost a little more to buy something with SLR, but it's found money, everyone wins. Does Bitcoin do that? No, you have to buy it in order to spend it.

Someone has to buy SolarCoin with BitCoin first in order to pay the merchants even if the costs could be built in, meaning in the event of a dump to nil the merchants could lose everything along with an exchange hack that is very real. So churning out BitCoin will be the foundation of SolarCoin, as BitCoin is a Proxy for SolarCoin and can be given away for free like any alt coin could do at any time, why people buy it is the mystery.

Without BitCoin there are no SolarCoin merchants. It is like you are saying SolarCoin is so Green it is like finding a shiny free new electric car powered by the sun, only problem occurs since it has no charging capacity unless it is plugged into a BitCoin pump. But still you tell people SolarCoin is doing good... look at how fast it is moving on the highways right now! Only to find out that your Hybrid SolarCoin is moving fast, but on the back of a BitCoin Tow Truck spewing Black Smoke into the air gobbling up massive amounts of fuel just to move with SolarCoin winched up to it.

There will always need to be BitCoin in order to be liquid for merchants. If people just accept SolarCoin for trade then it works no problem, but why give something they can get money for to trade for a coin they may not get anything back in trade for eventually. The real possibility is that they just lost possession of the goods or service they traded, and the store they go to buy milk at only takes Fiat and not SolarCoins. Since they have to pay for costs of goods there is no way to just take SolarCoins in this market. It all goes back to BitCoin and Fiat. BitCoin bears the entire weight of SolarCoin and its Free coins, and creates the worth for SolarCoin simultaneously.

You think there will be a day when the tail wags the dog on this one? If they outlaw BitCoin chances are they outlaw SolarCoin too. Or if BitCoin becomes more valuable and sought after then why would people buy SolarCoin when they could own BitCoin instead. And if you say that perhaps BitCoin will become less sought after and cheaper, unfortunately SolarCoin must sell to that market and also have their coin devalued in the process.

I have created ways around these issues now. I am waiting for further developments to make sure it gets done correctly. I am not a coder so I have to rely on a team to implement it. Too bad it isn't the SolarCoin team.

/facepalm

Still, I keep waiting for that shining moment you say something brilliant. It's happened before, I'm hoping to see it again soon. Smiley

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April 16, 2016, 09:55:22 AM
 #3403

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April 16, 2016, 10:06:04 PM
 #3404

I can see the day btc-e adds a SLR/BTC pair. We need to get SLR on to a another proper exchange!

Edit:  We need to really start trading Solarcoins. If we want exchanges to add SLR we need to show them that there is interest. Everybody here should take a small portion of their coins and start trading
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April 16, 2016, 11:16:45 PM
 #3405

Why would a merchant accept Solarcoin? A partner recently asked why would a merchant accept solarcoin?  Thought I would share the answer for those interested. 

 The currency acceptance issue is an interesting one and a classic chicken and egg scenario.  Currency: a social protocol works most effectively when there are lots buyers and sellers willing to accept it. 
Right now solarcoin is where bitcoin was in 2012 two years after launch. A small network, but growing quickly.  Once a merchant perceives a personal benefit in signaling they accept Solarcoin they will. We have a small candle manufacturer accepting solarcoins and I even sold a few copies of my book for it. As the network grows, we anticipate uptake in SolarCoin but for now one needs a gateway service. see below. 

There are 2 main benefits for a merchant to accept solarcoin, pending market growth etc. to a more critical mass. 

1. Green goodwill as a marketing exercise. This is mostly a one off novelty effect for the merchant and has smaller appeal.

2. Cheap clearing fees.  Many retailers operate on 3-8% net income margins.  Visa, AMEX and Mastercard charge 1.5-3.5% for processing.  So the impact to free cash flow >real ROE for a merchant can be significant 10-30% improvement. It is the reason gas stations for example give a cash discount or discount for debit cards.

Bitcoin is a useful example here.  Bitcoin has roughly 3m users/acceptors.  As of early 2015 there were 100,000 bitcoin merchants, there are probably more now as there is price stability and better services globally. 

Gateway services:

1. SolarCoins can be converted into bitcoin and are traded 24/7.  https://www.coingecko.com/en/price_charts/solarcoin/usd

2. There are many bitcoin debit cards which effectively transfer  bitcoin into fiat during the debit card use. This works similar to what happens when a tourist spends money abroad with a credit or debit card. So effectively one can "spend" bitcoin anywhere they can use a debit card.  Most likely as solarcoin grows, similar automatic transaction services will spring up.  Expect it around 500k user network size.

Note that new SolarCoin wallets should include support for Android and IOS mobile wallets https://copay.io/  These will be udnerway post 2.11 release.

Hope this helps.

These are reasons why Merchants WON'T accept SolarCoin. BitCoin is not Green and in order to get out of the market the merchants have to take risks with it in order to give the appearance of being Green with SolarCoin. These risks could gain them money but they can also get stuck at percentages well above the normal fees for Visa or be forced to wait. So Merchants must sell to BitCoin to get their costs of goods back. This means they also have to give their identity and banking information to an Exchange under KYC-AML just to achieve liquidity. They also risk that the exchange may hack itself and take the customers funds. Questionable security along with market maneuvering just to accept a coin that people would have to take their FIAT that they could already hand the merchant and yet they go buy BitCoin, to then go buy SolarCoin, and then give it to the Merchant who must go Sell to BitCoin and then Sell to FIAT. Not many Merchants would put themselves through the wringer just to use a coin, and if they were going to accept Crypto they could just accept BitCoin since they have to get back to that anyways.

If SolarCoin was used outside of BitCoin it could be green and be adopted, instead it is now SolarCoin supporting and sustaining BitCoin usage. Another upside would be that there are not many people using SolarCoin so Merchant exposure would be very small. This may be the only reason to accept it and normally a Merchant who would agree to use SolarCoin would already be accepting BitCoin and have the channel setup for usage. So the 100,000 BitCoin merchants should be targeted as merchants and let the SolarCoin POW sell off for these merchants products commence!

Merchants build it into the costs of goods. The grants are free, it may cost a little more to buy something with SLR, but it's found money, everyone wins. Does Bitcoin do that? No, you have to buy it in order to spend it.

Someone has to buy SolarCoin with BitCoin first in order to pay the merchants even if the costs could be built in, meaning in the event of a dump to nil the merchants could lose everything along with an exchange hack that is very real. So churning out BitCoin will be the foundation of SolarCoin, as BitCoin is a Proxy for SolarCoin and can be given away for free like any alt coin could do at any time, why people buy it is the mystery.

Without BitCoin there are no SolarCoin merchants. It is like you are saying SolarCoin is so Green it is like finding a shiny free new electric car powered by the sun, only problem occurs since it has no charging capacity unless it is plugged into a BitCoin pump. But still you tell people SolarCoin is doing good... look at how fast it is moving on the highways right now! Only to find out that your Hybrid SolarCoin is moving fast, but on the back of a BitCoin Tow Truck spewing Black Smoke into the air gobbling up massive amounts of fuel just to move with SolarCoin winched up to it.

There will always need to be BitCoin in order to be liquid for merchants. If people just accept SolarCoin for trade then it works no problem, but why give something they can get money for to trade for a coin they may not get anything back in trade for eventually. The real possibility is that they just lost possession of the goods or service they traded, and the store they go to buy milk at only takes Fiat and not SolarCoins. Since they have to pay for costs of goods there is no way to just take SolarCoins in this market. It all goes back to BitCoin and Fiat. BitCoin bears the entire weight of SolarCoin and its Free coins, and creates the worth for SolarCoin simultaneously.

You think there will be a day when the tail wags the dog on this one? If they outlaw BitCoin chances are they outlaw SolarCoin too. Or if BitCoin becomes more valuable and sought after then why would people buy SolarCoin when they could own BitCoin instead. And if you say that perhaps BitCoin will become less sought after and cheaper, unfortunately SolarCoin must sell to that market and also have their coin devalued in the process.

I have created ways around these issues now. I am waiting for further developments to make sure it gets done correctly. I am not a coder so I have to rely on a team to implement it. Too bad it isn't the SolarCoin team.

/facepalm

Still, I keep waiting for that shining moment you say something brilliant. It's happened before, I'm hoping to see it again soon. Smiley

Sorry I am keeping those ideas to myself now. I gave the best possible competing idea to SolarCoin a few posts back though and it would be great to see my coin idea help propel SolarCoin to a better place. Even though SolarCoin would still be hitching a ride on the BiTow Truck at that point it would boost the coin and cause claims. Where I would create a currency and SolarCoin would still be a stock with no PnL statement only PnD.
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April 16, 2016, 11:17:28 PM
 #3406


Anything over .0000001 is over valued for alts.
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April 16, 2016, 11:29:02 PM
 #3407

https://coinreport.net/conversation-francois-sonnet-co-founder-electricchain/

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April 17, 2016, 09:46:23 AM
 #3408


If you say so  Shocked    What is it with you? did you sell all your BTC at 1$ and all your SLR at 0.005$ ? haha
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April 17, 2016, 02:00:42 PM
 #3409

No he wants everyon to give him free solarcoins.

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April 17, 2016, 05:05:17 PM
 #3410

Someone just bought a nice chunk of Solarcoins.

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April 17, 2016, 05:39:43 PM
 #3411

Hi Guys,

I've been watching the Solarcoin for a while now and i want to jump in.
Does someone wants to sell slr over the counter(OTC) for some btc ?

Thanks in advance
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April 17, 2016, 07:37:00 PM
 #3412

Hi Guys,

I've been watching the Solarcoin for a while now and i want to jump in.
Does someone wants to sell slr over the counter(OTC) for some btc ?

Thanks in advance

Given all of the scams in Crypto your better off getting it in an exchange. Just set your price and see what happens.

§: 8Q7zvaH955cCbqu2nCvpPcTvczGfe9psxE
§1 = 1MWh
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April 18, 2016, 12:17:38 AM
 #3413

Quote
Why not just dump and tell us after you do. Its not a prediction if you are the one selling.

Wooah Steady on tiger, your barking up the wrong tree, I have no interested in driving the price down, but I do watch the movement every day

My observation is just based on pure speculation and gut feeling and am really hoping that my observation is wrong as I want the price to rise, but there has been a lot of buys and sells around the same figure over the last day or so hence my prediction.

No need to start squabbling when we all share the same interest?!!!


Hey guys come over to the solarcoin-group.slack as there is a channel to discuss pricing/movements/trading. Also here there is a lot of discussion.
Cheers,
lfloorwalker



|Solcrypto|ElectriCChain| SLR Tips: 8Hocu8s8u8FFAyh5ev2qsNmLZYgeiVToHi
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April 18, 2016, 01:14:13 AM
 #3414


Great interview with Francois.

cheers
lfloorwalker

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April 18, 2016, 02:47:02 AM
 #3415

My wallet total on the Dashboard is different than the Transaction total.

The transaction tab total is correct. The Dashboard is +500 or so over. I've closed the wallet and re-opened it (it was +1000 before closing and now at the 500 level). Anyone else experienced this or know what might be wrong?
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April 18, 2016, 02:58:58 AM
 #3416

Do a file --->  rescan.

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April 18, 2016, 09:02:25 AM
 #3417

Quote
Insert Quote
Quote from: Napoleon863 on April 17, 2016, 05:39:43 PM
Hi Guys,

I've been watching the Solarcoin for a while now and i want to jump in.
Does someone wants to sell slr over the counter(OTC) for some btc ?

Thanks in advance

Quote
Given all of the scams in Crypto your better off getting it in an exchange. Just set your price and see what happens.

Yes I agree, most secure way is to buy from Bittrex, great time to get in now.
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April 18, 2016, 10:09:22 AM
 #3418

Quote
Someone just bought a nice chunk of Solarcoins.

Yes very nice, we need some more like that  Grin
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April 18, 2016, 09:32:11 PM
 #3419

Do a file --->  rescan.

got it. thx
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April 19, 2016, 06:29:14 PM
 #3420

http://solarcoin.org/en/corepack-renewable-energy-first-solar-installer-granting-solarcoins-in-canada/

"The value of SolarCoin is projected at around $1.00 by the end of 2017 and $20.00 in the next five years. The Digital Asset is an open community project launched by the SolarCoin Foundation which is composed of experts from the solar industry and economists who believe in solar energy taking a big part of the on-going energy revolution."

Please note the quote above has been removed from the site for risk and liability exposure reasons. The SolarCoin foundation hopes the solar energy community finds granted SolarCoins to be useful but can not guarantee or imply a future price for the SolarCoin tokens.

The SolarCoin foundation urges participants in the SolarCoin community to form their own opinions as to the relative value and usefulness of SolarCoin relative to their own situation.  We never encourage or recommend speculation in SolarCoin as we believe each individual should form their own opinion as to the usefulness of SolarCoin for their particular situation.  There is no cost for solar energy producers to claim solarcoin. They are granted at the discretion of the SolarCoin foundation based on verified solar energy generation.

The SolarCoin foundation is working towards decentralized algorithmic and community auditing and verification and granting of energy claims.

Solarcoin (§ SLR) are like airmiles. Each 1 Mhw generated gets you §1 free. Solarcoins can purchase what others will trade: USD,BTC, Soy candles..etc.
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