Paycoin (XPY) is scam

[muhrohmat]

but they say in 1 february of 2015 the coinbase will release a price of 20 dollars per XPY soo im going to be alert for the possibility of that paycoin to be not a scam as inddeed it does not seems to be

[spinnel]

Well, at least Paycoin is getting some free publicity....
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/01/bitcoin-startup-gaw-miners-reportedly-under-sec-investigation/

I cannot believe how f**ked up this is, JG and Paycoin seem to stumble from one clusterfuck to the next,  like the 3 Stooges with a massive pile of someone elses money.
A rollback of Paybase trading (even though there seems to be no evidence that the platform was actually faulty) would be the cherry on top of the cake.

Anyone with money still in XPY must either be the most optimistic noob ever, or simply daytrading for quick bucks.
I can't believe that anyone could now take this shit seriously as a long term investment.

So I take you consider a foregone conclusion that he will not honor his promised $20 per XPY reiterated offer and, consequently, he will face ruin, jail and/or the prospect of living outside of the US Justice System for the rest of his life, including wife and children, right?

.......

I expect he will run to Mexico or some place like it and hide from the US Justice System there.

[Crestington]

And Paycon flies to the Moon like a Cannonball.
Happy to see real coins taking their rightful places on coinmarketcap after Paycon pushed them aside and claimed to be third biggest currency in the world, for a week 

And the dust begins to settle,
Viz.

Reworking of code takes some time to be done properly, I made a small update to the progress of the PayCon code. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=912034.msg10235230#msg10235230

[barabbas]

I expect he will run to Mexico or some place like it and hide from the US Justice System there.

I expect the justice system will ignore the accusations, as most of them are people who invested in XPY hoping it will instantly skyrocket and sold when the price went down. I wonder what these people will do if 6 months from now paycoin reaches $20

XPY will reach $20 not in 6 months but in 2 weeks. At least for those benefiting from GAW's guarantee. In my opinion, Garza has no alternative but to make good on that warranty, so we will see long before 6 months pass.

[DaveWave]

XPY will reach $20 not in 6 months but in 2 weeks. At least for those benefiting from GAW's guarantee. In my opinion, Garza has no alternative but to make good on that warranty, so we will see long before 6 months pass.

I guess the alternative would be to do a runner and take all your bitcoins with him.

Looking at the current price, it seems more people believe the alternative then GAW's gurantee.

[barabbas]

XPY will reach $20 not in 6 months but in 2 weeks. At least for those benefiting from GAW's guarantee. In my opinion, Garza has no alternative but to make good on that warranty, so we will see long before 6 months pass.

I guess the alternative would be to do a runner and take all your bitcoins with him.

Looking at the current price, it seems more people believe the alternative then GAW's gurantee.

Relatively speaking. Considering that the last 24 hours' volume has been basically 10% of what it has been since launch, it would appear that most people is just waiting.

But I don't know so you may be right, you appear to be certain about many more things than I do.

[suchmoon]

I expect he will run to Mexico or some place like it and hide from the US Justice System there.

I expect the justice system will ignore the accusations, as most of them are people who invested in XPY hoping it will instantly skyrocket and sold when the price went down. I wonder what these people will do if 6 months from now paycoin reaches $20

XPY will reach $20 not in 6 months but in 2 weeks. At least for those benefiting from GAW's guarantee. In my opinion, Garza has no alternative but to make good on that warranty, so we will see long before 6 months pass.

I'm going to quote both of you just in case.

[DaveWave]

suchmoon, I was just going to post this from you, think it sums up where we are perfectly.

Unfulfilled promise of a $20 “floor”, or guaranteed buy back and stability of Paycoin.
Original promise (note “will buy”):
Amended promise (note “will manage”):
(archived)
Subsequent attempts to back out:
https://hashtalk.org/topic/26931
(archived)
Community responses:
Shapeshift drops Paycoin
Litecoin requests to be removed from GAW-owned exchange coin-swap.net
Current price well below $20:

Unfulfilled promise of merchant adoption of Paycoin:
100k merchants
(archived)
Ability to use Paycoin at Amazon: https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/josh-garza-speaks-paybase-launch-amazon-shopping-using-paycoin/
As of now there is no way to spend Paycoin directly, except a couple of obscure merchants such as Meganet and PexPeppers.

Claimed but not implemented technology innovations in Paycoin.
Note “beyond the powers of nearly every developer”

Link to whitepaper (see chapter 5):

Source code analysis, for example, hard coded Prime Controllers without voting features described in the whitepaper:
https://hashtalk.org/topic/24790
Most of the other promised features either don’t exist in the code or are implemented in a similar haphazard fashion.

Claimed but unproven $100 million investment. Not a single investor has come forward, which is unusual for such a presumably innovative project. GAW has not fulfilled promises based on those investments, such as the “floor” promise above, and Paycoin/Paybase development has been underwhelming for such a large investment.
Investment claims:
http://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2014/11/25/bitbeat-gaw-miners-to-launch-bitcoin-challenger-paycoin/
https://hashtalk.org/topic/22975
(archived)

Guaranteed but questionable profitability of HashStakers.
Link to announcement:
http://www.gawminers.com/pages/official-hashstaker-announcement
(archived)
(note “everyone who owns one will be profitable.”)
At the current exchange rate and slightly less than 1% daily payout HashStakers would not recover the $10-$20 cost:
At $5 exchange rate the payout is less than $0.05 per day, or less than $4.50 per 90 days. 90-day HashStaker cost between $10-12.
At $5 exchange rate the payout is less than $0.05 per day, or less than $9.00 per 180 days. 180-day HashStaker cost between $18-20.
The exchange rate would need to stay above $10 for HashStaker owners to break even.

Other arithmetically questionable claims:
ZenPool hashrate back in August was reported to be in excess of 250 GH/s (Scrypt). This would have been more than 1/3 of Litecoin network. This level of activity was never visible on Litecoin network.
Third party stats: https://xively.com/feeds/1229182496
ZenPool removed their stats page after criticism: https://www.zenminer.com/pool/#pool-stats
It has been claimed that 60% of Paycoins were distributed to HashPoint miners. This would result in even more unbelievable stats – 2500 GH/s, or 10 times more than the August estimate:
Claim (archived)
Math: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=857670.msg9833591#msg9833591
GAW has never provided cryptographic proof of mining either Scrypt or SHA256 coins, which calls the above claims into question.

[DaveWave]

....so I'm sure GAW will honour their buyback lol.

[barabbas]

Just how much would your opinion change if the price of BTC would be double, or triple, the current one, min a month or two? Do you remember the price at the time those promises were made?

Now, the current guarantee is in US Dollars, which makes things significantly different.

But, like I said, you are way more certain of the final outcome than I am... which is good because that way you avoid the investment subject altogether and not be caught regardless. Good for you.

Others though, would prefer to assume the risk hoping NOT to have to request the guaranteed pay out (because the price would be higher).

Within less than two weeks, we will have a much clearer picture.

[DaveWave]

I'm not sure that btc has so much of an impact on this coin. I think it's value was always going to be based on the promise of a buyback at $20.

Funny as we get ever closer to the time when the buyback is meant to happen, the coin continues to fall in value.

I think you're right, there are a lot of people who have invested too much in this coin and won't sell just in case the price goes up. Poor sods, you have to feel for them.

[barabbas]

The  what it was for weeks. time to "feel for them" though will be when/if Garza doesn't comes through with his guarantee AND if the price is not over $20 by then. It seems to me price is stabilized and has found a bottom.  But i could be wrong.

What is true is that volume has come down to less than 10% of what it was for weeks.

[DaveWave]

Watching the trades just now, all the volume is sells. There was resistance at 0.01 btc but we've just gone through it.

If the price is only $2.xx then it shows how much people trust Josh. I mean I'd quite happily pay $18 if I trusted someone to pay me $20 next week lol

[Crestington]

Watching the trades just now, all the volume is sells. There was resistance at 0.01 btc but we've just gone through it.

If the price is only $2.xx then it shows how much people trust Josh. I mean I'd quite happily pay $18 if I trusted someone to pay me $20 next week lol

I have heard rumors of attacks on Coinfire by PayBase over the SEC allegations on Reddit recently https://ihb.io/2015-01-23/news/coin-fire-hacked-15795

I hear little actual talks from Josh himself, why wouldn't he want to be part of the largest Communities and talk with holders? This is really more about trust than anything. I could trust NXT, BitShares or Nubits because when questions come up they will respond and discuss peoples objections. Take the Bitshares for example, one guy ended up changing his the whole title of his thread because they argued their case so well.

When we look at PayCoin though we see a lot of pretty dodgy stuff happening around the Coin and promises that may or may not happen, lots of misrepresentation, possible market manipulation. I can't say I've seen any real posts from Josh on anything that didn't seem like it was proof read by someone else and all negative criticism is removed from HashTalk.

The question for me that comes to mind is how do we know that there isn't a large amount of money being funneled out?


I don't have any PayCoin so I am just on the sidelines watching. Can someone please prove me otherwise?

[rokkyroad]

Many suspect Gaw of dumping coins but I have not seen any definitive proof as yet.  The way this whole paycoin/paybase thing has transpired makes the *premine dump* VERY believable.
Gaw has, literally put squat into infrastructure since paycoin's inception in Sept. All this time and only a basic paybase/exchange.  The "coin adoption fund" supposedly consisted of millions of dollars. What did they do with it?

Gaw is far from transparent about the whole thing which sets off so many alarms its not funny.

[Bit_Happy]

It seems really obvious that they will not pay $20 each for their own coins:
Are the current optimists mostly serious believers, or paid shills?

ps. You can admit being paid, don't be shy.   

[DaveWave]

So the price crashed through the 0.1 barrier and fell 20% overnight to below 0.08.

I believe this triggered Josh to issue this statement.

I am working with the development team to provide a timeline here that breaks down all the features. Here is a summary update:

The majority of the "gap" in our features has been for compliance. With the added attention, we decided to speed up our compliance process to make sure it was all in place before we needed it. It required building our features out of the original order. I know everyone wants it now, but it will serve us in the long haul.

We are in a waiting pattern to get our final debit card approval. All paperwork is done and initial applications have been accepted. We are waiting for the final go ahead with will allow for international physical wallets and e-wallets.

A BETTER replacement for PayFlash is coming, stay tuned. (think......what could be better )

We are finishing the integration with 3 different payment gateways. We are at their speed right now

I know from the outside, it sees like not a lot is happening. Nothing could be further from the truth, we have never been busier. But, I would be remiss if I did not say we have held back due to the current "climate". We had to make sure we were not taking any unnecessary risk.

We have recently hired one of the best legal firms in the country to represent our regulatory compliance and litigation. They are going through every feature to make sure we are 100% compliant. We have to watch every move we make.

So whats that mean to you?

Two things.

One, you can count on us being around. I think we will see MANY crypto companies be shut down soon. The government agencies are collecting information on all large crypto companies. Those that hold back, and do things correctly, will survive.

Two, many of the features will hit at once and with no warning. Be ready

(Source https://hashtalk.org/topic/30213/small-update)

Hats off to Josh, seems his price manipulation is working as most of his cult seem to have fallen for it yet again.

Think this could be an on-going trend for some time.

[flipme]

[SolidStateSurvivor]

Any day now, it's going to the moon. Or wait... The moon aint worth $20.

[DaveWave]

So the price just started to tank, as soon as it did Josh puts up this post

https://hashtalk.org/topic/30380/small-update-part-2

Hello,

I wanted to provide a small update from snowy New England.

We are all hands on desk for the Honors Program. Our developers are going to knock it out of the park. We realize how important it is that this program has a perfect launch. We have saved our resources to help re-stabilize the value of Paycoin.

The terms of the Program will be available when it launches. You will have 30 days to review.

We also some small updates coming: graphs for the market place, etc

The majority of the larger features are waiting on some type of regulatory or legal approval. PaySave, PayCard, PayFlash. Just waiting on the green light from all departments.

Between the launch of these features and the Honors program, we are excited to see the value of Paycoin start to rapidly move.

Premier Accounts are in development, and we hope to roll out the first features to those accounts first.

Finally, we have been strengthening our relationship with Team Paycoin. I will not ruin the surprise, but they have some goodies coming that rival even our work

I said a few days ago that I thought Josh would start playing this game, I think all he has left in his armoury is words, keeps going on about on feb 1st he will announce plans for the buyback, but nothing will  happen for another month. I think he's just milking it for as long as possible.

Of course, there are lots of people who committed to this at $10 dollars plus so I guess at the current price they're not going to sell as they've pretty much lost everything anyway. Expect these guys will hold on, possibly even but more cos it's such a steal lol

Watch Josh continue to ignore questions from his loyal followers but I expect he will post again the next time it tanks. Only 5 days to go Josh