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Question: Bitcoin fork proposal by respected Bitcoin lead dev Gavin Andresen, to increase the block size from 1MB to 20MB.
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Author Topic: Bitcoin 20MB Fork  (Read 154258 times)
theskillzdatklls
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February 19, 2015, 03:40:00 AM
 #1681

is there an estimated time for the 20mb thing to roll out?




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danielpbarron
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February 19, 2015, 03:44:58 AM
 #1682

is there an estimated time for the 20mb thing to roll out?

Never. Seriously go back and read the thread or something. Start here.

Marriage is a permanent bond (or should be) between a man and a woman. Scripture reveals a man has the freedom to have this marriage bond with more than one woman, if he so desires. But, anything beyond this is a perversion. -- Darwin Fish
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February 19, 2015, 04:48:41 AM
 #1683

Bitcoin isn't for everybody.

Who says so? You? Why? Bitcoin IS for everybody, but we just need to agree on how it will be done. (everyone directly on the blockchain or via some other way like sidechains). If you state that "Bitcoin isn't for everybody" I can easily state that "Bitcoin isn't for you" because I want it so.

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danielpbarron
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February 19, 2015, 05:17:24 AM
 #1684

Bitcoin isn't for everybody.

Who says so? You? Why? Bitcoin IS for everybody, but we just need to agree on how it will be done. (everyone directly on the blockchain or via some other way like sidechains). If you state that "Bitcoin isn't for everybody" I can easily state that "Bitcoin isn't for you" because I want it so.

You can state anything you want -- sure. Does this usually work for you? If so, why are you wasting time on this forum? You could be wishing golden toilets and perpetual motion machines into existence.

Notice this: the author of that particular quote did not preface it with "I wish." The statement is more akin to observing the effects of gravity. Not that everybody won't be affected by bitcoin; they will. It's just not for them. Take bureaucrats, for example. Bitcoin is not for them any more than the noose is for the condemned.

Quote from: #bitcoin-assets
mircea_popescu: what was the hands-down, no question asked, no doubt possible dominant party and c ultural force of the 1930s ?
mircea_popescu: anihilated by 1960.
mircea_popescu: completely gone by 1990.
mircea_popescu: such success...
mircea_popescu: that the socialists are doing the same thing...
mircea_popescu: so what, anihilated by 2020, completely gone by 2050, hopefully we'll be smarter than to do it over.
mircea_popescu: (but to anyone not quite seeing the world for what it is : yes we are at war, and yes the year is about 1944, and yes the fucking nazis are running the fucking concentration camps and invaded russia and so on and so forth. you had no idera about it, but similarly you had no idea about it in 1944. the only reason this is being an issue is because the introduction of the bitcoin tank/bomber/submarine is massively turning
mircea_popescu:  the tide, and suddenly all sorts of disparate and previously doomed forces are now converging.
mircea_popescu: you wouldn't have known there's such a thing as "french partisans" if there wasn't a 1945, either)
mircea_popescu: so no, when i'm talking about hanging each and every us bureaucrat, through a war crimes court, within our lifetime i am not being in any sense and to any degree metaphorical.

Marriage is a permanent bond (or should be) between a man and a woman. Scripture reveals a man has the freedom to have this marriage bond with more than one woman, if he so desires. But, anything beyond this is a perversion. -- Darwin Fish
RoadStress
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February 19, 2015, 05:26:34 AM
 #1685

Bitcoin isn't for everybody.

Who says so? You? Why? Bitcoin IS for everybody, but we just need to agree on how it will be done. (everyone directly on the blockchain or via some other way like sidechains). If you state that "Bitcoin isn't for everybody" I can easily state that "Bitcoin isn't for you" because I want it so.

You can state anything you want -- sure. Does this usually work for you? If so, why are you wasting time on this forum? You could be wishing golden toilets and perpetual motion machines into existence.

I can say the same thing about you and we are in a dead end. You brought nothing new to the topic except citing someone who wants to impose his ways in a consensus network. I am sure that you and his retardness MP will not sense the absurdity of this desire.

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theskillzdatklls
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February 19, 2015, 05:45:08 AM
 #1686

is there an estimated time for the 20mb thing to roll out?

Never. Seriously go back and read the thread or something. Start here.

thats just like your opinion, man.




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February 19, 2015, 05:51:46 AM
 #1687

Bitcoin isn't for everybody.

Who says so? You? Why? Bitcoin IS for everybody, but we just need to agree on how it will be done. (everyone directly on the blockchain or via some other way like sidechains). If you state that "Bitcoin isn't for everybody" I can easily state that "Bitcoin isn't for you" because I want it so.
It just kinda can't be for everyone, because of the way that people are. The majority are sheep and/or dogmatics. Often, you can't even reason with them.                                                                                                     The idea of Bitcoin is about 100 quadrillion light years away from their 'in the box' thinking style. Also I often get the question: 'why should I, there is already fiat?'...


Then again, what does the 'Bitcoin isn't for everybody' discussion have to do with the fork?

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February 19, 2015, 05:56:30 AM
 #1688

Bitcoin isn't for everybody.

Who says so? You? Why? Bitcoin IS for everybody, but we just need to agree on how it will be done. (everyone directly on the blockchain or via some other way like sidechains). If you state that "Bitcoin isn't for everybody" I can easily state that "Bitcoin isn't for you" because I want it so.
This is a wrong premise. It just kinda can't be for everyone, because of the way that people are. The majority are sheep and/or dogmatics. Often, you can't even reason with them.                                                 The idea of Bitcoin is about 100 quadrillion light years away from their 'in the box' thinking style. Also I often get the question: 'why should I, there is already fiat?'...

There are two different meanings of “for everyone”. One of them is: can everyone use it? And the other: is everyone accepting to use it?

I believe we must make the answer to the first question yes even if not everyone is accepting it right now. I really see no point in making it an elitist system when only a few can use Bitcoin.

An economy based on endless growth is unsustainable.
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February 19, 2015, 07:07:20 AM
 #1689

There are two different meanings of “for everyone”. One of them is: can everyone use it? And the other: is everyone accepting to use it?

I believe we must make the answer to the first question yes even if not everyone is accepting it right now. I really see no point in making it an elitist system when only a few can use Bitcoin.

100% agree.
Since we all know that Bitcoin is superior to fiat, where the public are stealth-taxed by never-ending CB inflation targeting, then this is the morally correct action.

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February 19, 2015, 07:32:40 AM
 #1690

this is the morally correct action.
morals aren't subjective.
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February 19, 2015, 07:34:46 AM
 #1691

Just popped in here to see if everything has been sorted out yet.

I see more of the same.

And talk about morals?!
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February 19, 2015, 07:35:15 AM
 #1692

Ideally
He said it!

It seems we have a complex decision to be made.
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February 19, 2015, 07:59:05 AM
Last edit: February 19, 2015, 08:33:47 AM by hdbuck
 #1693

There are two different meanings of “for everyone”. One of them is: can everyone use it? And the other: is everyone accepting to use it?

I believe we must make the answer to the first question yes even if not everyone is accepting it right now. I really see no point in making it an elitist system when only a few can use Bitcoin.

100% agree.
Since we all know that Bitcoin is superior to fiat, where the public are stealth-taxed by never-ending CB inflation targeting, then this is the morally correct action.

The more i read here and there, the more i tend to disagree.
I first came into bitcoin with that silly idea that it was revolutionary, unchaining the whole world from monetary despotism, blabla..
But now, i mean, seriously, this kind of speech seems 1/unrealistic 2/egomaniac 3/cultish

Yes bitcoin is a great innovation,
Yes, we, people invested in it, people developing its ecosystem, people reading all day long things about it, want it to succeed.

But 'succeeding' doesnt necessarily imply bringing it over 'the masses' or the 'african' people...

This is retard thinking imho.
IDGAF about the masses, and they pretty much DGAF about bitcoin.
Their use of the internet is pretty much giving away all their private life on social networks and wanking over porn sites.
They couldnt care less about 'cryptography'.
As for the developing countries, bring them food and water before trying to get them on bitcoin FFS.

Bitcoin is not cash, bitcoin is not gold, bitcoin is not money.
Bitcoin is Bitcoin and we're still experimenting it.
So stop pretending you know what to do or what not to do.
Just enjoy the ride.
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February 19, 2015, 08:03:57 AM
 #1694

But 'succeeding' doesnt necessarily imply bringing it over 'the masses' or the 'african' people...

This is retard thinking imho.

Bitcoin is not cash, bitcoin is not gold, bitcoin is not money.
Bitcoin is Bitcoin and we're still experimenting it.
So stop pretending you know what to do or what not to do.
Just enjoy the ride.

So because some people who actually invested time and resources in developing stuff related to Bitcoin have a different thinking from yours it's automatically "retard thinking"? And you don't see that as being egomaniac? Ok...

Please share your vision of Bitcoin succeeding because I'm so curious about it.

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February 19, 2015, 08:05:34 AM
 #1695

But 'succeeding' doesnt necessarily imply bringing it over 'the masses' or the 'african' people...

This is retard thinking imho.

Bitcoin is not cash, bitcoin is not gold, bitcoin is not money.
Bitcoin is Bitcoin and we're still experimenting it.
So stop pretending you know what to do or what not to do.
Just enjoy the ride.

So because some people who actually invested time and resources in developing stuff related to Bitcoin have a different thinking from yours it's automatically "retard thinking"? And you don't see that as being egomaniac? Ok...

Please share your vision of Bitcoin succeeding because I'm so curious about it.

Thats my point.. I dont have a 'vision'.
Or at least i dont indulge myself with that kind of egomaniac thinking.
I'm just a part of it. Having fun. Learning.
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February 19, 2015, 08:42:56 AM
 #1696


Please share your vision of Bitcoin succeeding because I'm so curious about it.
Make it gold until it fixes the world, then cooperatively decide to make it more useful once we have AI.

(idiots)
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February 19, 2015, 08:43:31 AM
 #1697

Do I seriously have to live in this world with you? WE ARE FIGHTING OVER A CONSENSUS!!!!

If satoshi is an alchemist that turned "something" into gold. And shinichi does pi squaring in relation to the pyramids.  We are quantizing time.

Gravity, time, light, thought.  Quantized.

And y'all are arguing the architect is CIA.

You are dumb. each of you.

4-1 year old children.

ban me...but don't delete my posts.

Any idiot can argue.
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February 19, 2015, 09:04:52 AM
 #1698

Please share your vision of Bitcoin succeeding because I'm so curious about it.

Thats my point.. I dont have a 'vision'.
Or at least i dont indulge myself with that kind of egomaniac thinking.
I'm just a part of it. Having fun. Learning.

Some people "have fun" due to the fact they have a vision and they are passionate about it.

That said I dare to remind you humanity is what it is precisely because of the visions great
people had/have.

Enjoy the ride in the way you prefer and don't blame other people way's, otherwise you're not
actually enjoining your ride Tongue 

Bitcoin is a participatory system which ought to respect the right of self determinism of all of its users - Gregory Maxwell.
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February 19, 2015, 09:37:07 AM
 #1699

...since it is not just about going to 20 mb blocks but the code that is going to ramp the block size up bigger and bigger over time , even by 2020 looking at 100 mb and it goes up and up from there , actually looking at the spread sheet linked here https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CuOEM9uwO5w-RwWGCCZpVGVFwhHHHegxJZqTP5KyapI/edit?pli=1#gid=0 from Gavins blog eventually a couple dozen blocks are going to be the size of what the blockchain was two years ago.   

The algorithm proposed by Gavin is very simple.

"Let's kick the can far enough each time so it's always far ahead of us" Smiley

There are probably reasons for that. Maybe adding block size into the header is too difficult or some other concerns. I haven't yet found a detailed explanation of why this particular algorithm should be selected, but that's probably argument from ignorance Smiley

Granted, anything even remotely more complex has a very slim chance of being implemented and agreed upon. So we probably won't be able to put any additional pressure on miners and will have to hope that everything will eventually work out somehow.

But are there really any good reasons to prefer the exponential curve to the simple sliding window algorithm, which stays reasonably ahead of the current block size?


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February 19, 2015, 09:39:13 AM
 #1700

I haven't yet found a detailed explanation of why this particular algorithm should be selected

Valid point. Magic numbers always look suspiciously.
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