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Author Topic: [Announcement] Butterfly Labs  (Read 64038 times)
BFL_Josh
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September 05, 2012, 04:01:02 AM
 #181

Ok, lets deconstruct this a minute.  BFL has stated that our chip is a custom ASIC, end of story.  That's what it is.  bASIC is a Cell Based ASIC, which is another name for a sASIC for all intents and purposes.  So we have a parity there; we've both stated what our chip is.

Performance figures based on a prototype no one has seen and Thom has refused to give evidence of.  Now, I'm not saying he's lying, because I believe he probably does have some fashion of a prototype, but we're talking about comparing apples to apples here.  I could just as easily tell you the same thing and you'd ask me to prove it, so instead of going down that path, I am not going into detail with regards to that because I do not want to be in the same situation Thom is currently in. (or is it Tom?  Sorry, I have seen it both ways, so my apologies if I have it wrong).  I'm sure he's regretting making that statement now.

The ModMiner Quad was delivered almost a half year later than BFL and had the benefit of the trail BFL and others had already forged to work with.  It's easy to be on time and under budget when you don't have to create a device from scratch that few or no one has created before. Couple that with the fact that it was and still is the best performing, least expensive FPGA device and I think there needs to be some leeway there.

Who ordered a single that got an email that said 9 - 10 weeks?  We just shipped orders from early August today, we are under 4 weeks at this point.  But regardless, the ASIC generation is going to be quite a bit different in terms of construction and parts, so it can't even be compared.  

As far as the statement goes, I don't see how an opinion such as that needs to be qualified with anything more than has already been said to be considered reasonable.  I honestly believe he will be happy with the device(s) outright, but especially when compared to the competition.
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ChipGeek
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September 05, 2012, 06:43:38 AM
 #182

Who ordered a single that got an email that said 9 - 10 weeks?  We just shipped orders from early August today, we are under 4 weeks at this point.  But regardless, the ASIC generation is going to be quite a bit different in terms of construction and parts, so it can't even be compared.  
Me.  I ordered early August (the 8th).  Based on what you said here, I guess I can expect my order to show up in a week or so.  That is very good news!  Here's that part of my order confirming email.

Quote
Thank you for your order and payment for the product listed below. Please note that Singles are shipping 9 to 10 weeks from the date of purchase.
Best Regards,
BF Labs

I am 100% OK with this.  Instead of promising 4 to 6 weeks then delivering 6 to 10 weeks later, they told me 9 to 10 weeks and it looks like they will deliver sooner - in (maybe) 4 to 6 weeks.  So: EARLY!  Smiley  I am excited.  (Really!)

Edit: If my new single does show up soon, I will be more of a believer that the SC's will start shipping by early November.  Disclaimer: As stated elsewhere on the forum, I have also ordered an SC upgrade.

Tip jar: 1ChipGeeK7PDxaAWG4VgsTi31SfJ6peKHw
stick_theman
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September 08, 2012, 10:26:53 PM
 #183

Ok, lets deconstruct this a minute.  BFL has stated that our chip is a custom ASIC, end of story.  That's what it is.  bASIC is a Cell Based ASIC, which is another name for a sASIC for all intents and purposes.  So we have a parity there; we've both stated what our chip is.

What's the difference between the your custom ASIC and sASIC?  I understand the answer may be proprietary, my understanding currently is, BFL ASIC is cheaper than bASIC from $/gH stand point.
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September 09, 2012, 03:23:20 PM
 #184

I dont care how its made, who by, or what of.  I want to know how fast it will hash, what its power requirements will be and when I can expect to see it.  At present the answers I have are:

Jalepeno- hash at 3.5 GHash/s
Power- Unknown- USB but will have a plug??
Delivery date- Unkown- possibly early November- looking good?


                  ▄▄▄▄▄▀▀▀▀▄▄▄
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       ▄▀▄█▀                        `ⁿ▀▄\▀▄
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STACK









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btharper
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September 10, 2012, 12:34:21 AM
 #185

I dont care how its made, who by, or what of.  I want to know how fast it will hash, what its power requirements will be and when I can expect to see it.  At present the answers I have are:

Jalepeno- hash at 3.5 GHash/s
Power- Unknown- USB but will have a plug??
Delivery date- Unkown- possibly early November- looking good?
BFL_Josh has definitely been putting some of this information in the official thread. My understanding is that it can hash using only USB power and should go out late October or November depending on how many they can ship when
SgtSpike
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September 10, 2012, 06:22:41 PM
 #186

I dont care how its made, who by, or what of.  I want to know how fast it will hash, what its power requirements will be and when I can expect to see it.  At present the answers I have are:

Jalepeno- hash at 3.5 GHash/s
Power- Unknown- USB but will have a plug??
Delivery date- Unkown- possibly early November- looking good?


Josh (and others at BFL) have stated multiple times that the Jalepeno will be powered by USB.  I don't know where people keep getting this idea of it having a power plug.  It might be multiple USB ports, but it will NOT have an external power source other than USB.

With that said, the maximum wattage a USB port can provide is about 2.5 watts.  So there's your expected power draw maximum (or maybe 5 watts if you believe it will utilize 2 USB ports).

Delivery date begins late October, and Josh recently stated that he aims to have all of the current preorders shipped by Christmas.
kano
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September 10, 2012, 09:15:45 PM
 #187

...
Josh (and others at BFL) have stated multiple times that the Jalepeno will be powered by USB.  I don't know where people keep getting this idea of it having a power plug.  It might be multiple USB ports, but it will NOT have an external power source other than USB.
...
It will - for the coffee warmer - that has been stated ...
(gotta be the most stupid idea I've yet heard of in BTC mining hardware Tongue)

Go order a real ASIC device - not a coffee warmer toy ...

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=79637.msg1177543#msg1177543

... again with more details and even support for developers to get real mining software running on it at release time!
(Yeah my name's there also)

Pool: https://kano.is Here on Bitcointalk: Forum BTC: 1KanoPb8cKYqNrswjaA8cRDk4FAS9eDMLU
FreeNode IRC: irc.freenode.net channel #kano.is Majority developer of the ckpool code
Help keep Bitcoin secure by mining on pools with full block verification on all blocks - and NO empty blocks!
WhitePhantom
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September 10, 2012, 09:17:19 PM
 #188

With that said, the maximum wattage a USB port can provide is about 2.5 watts.  So there's your expected power draw maximum (or maybe 5 watts if you believe it will utilize 2 USB ports).
I've heard USB 3.0 provides additional power.  The following thread suggests 4.5w, but it's hardly authoritative.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2255324

Does anybody know for sure what kind of power USB 3.0 can provide?
LazyOtto
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September 10, 2012, 09:24:46 PM
 #189

"I don't know where people keep getting this idea of it having a power plug."

Because BFL has stated it will.

But then again, they also stated "four to six weeks".
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September 10, 2012, 09:41:58 PM
 #190

...
Josh (and others at BFL) have stated multiple times that the Jalepeno will be powered by USB.  I don't know where people keep getting this idea of it having a power plug.  It might be multiple USB ports, but it will NOT have an external power source other than USB.
...
It will - for the coffee warmer - that has been stated ...
(gotta be the most stupid idea I've yet heard of in BTC mining hardware Tongue)

Go order a real ASIC device - not a coffee warmer toy ...

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=79637.msg1177543#msg1177543

... again with more details and even support for developers to get real mining software running on it at release time!
(Yeah my name's there also)
Where was it stated that the Jalepeno would require a power plug?  Everything I have seen from BFL has said that it will not.

Also, an FPGA?  You're kidding, right?

With that said, the maximum wattage a USB port can provide is about 2.5 watts.  So there's your expected power draw maximum (or maybe 5 watts if you believe it will utilize 2 USB ports).
I've heard USB 3.0 provides additional power.  The following thread suggests 4.5w, but it's hardly authoritative.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2255324

Does anybody know for sure what kind of power USB 3.0 can provide?
They wouldn't go with USB 3.0.  That would alienate 95% (NOTE: statistic made up) of the population from using them.

"I don't know where people keep getting this idea of it having a power plug."

Because BFL has stated it will.

But then again, they also stated "four to six weeks".
I must've missed this announcement.  Where did BFL state that it will have a power plug?  The most recent message about the Jalepeno was yesterday from Josh, and he said that it would be powered by USB.
LazyOtto
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September 10, 2012, 09:52:17 PM
 #191

Nope, can't find it. However, I've observed the parties involved deleting posts before.

For hearsay evidence, in addition to my recollection, you can see:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=102488.msg1123674#msg1123674

-- edit --
And here's another example of BFL changing their story:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=108456.0

Bottom line, you don't know what you'll get, or when you'll get it, from BFL until you get it.
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September 10, 2012, 10:01:38 PM
 #192

Fair enough LazyOtto, I'll take you at your word that some sort of announcement was made in the past and deleted/redacted.  Hopefully BFL_Josh will jump in and clear things up once and for all.
BFL_Josh
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September 10, 2012, 10:07:03 PM
 #193

Who has deleted posts before?  Certainly not me.

I don't recall anyone stating that there would be a secondary power supply just for the coffee warmer; I'm not saying someone didn't say that, but I don't recall it and it's not true.  The coffee warming aspect is completely secondary to actually mining, so no it probably won't really keep your coffee all that warm.

There will be no secondary power source for the Jalapeno.  In retrospect, we probably shouldn't have associated it with a coffee warmer, but it is flat and you can set your coffee on it.  It gets warm. 
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September 10, 2012, 10:09:23 PM
 #194

Who has deleted posts before?  Certainly not me.

I don't recall anyone stating that there would be a secondary power supply just for the coffee warmer; I'm not saying someone didn't say that, but I don't recall it and it's not true.  The coffee warming aspect is completely secondary to actually mining, so no it probably won't really keep your coffee all that warm.

There will be no secondary power source for the Jalapeno.  In retrospect, we probably shouldn't have associated it with a coffee warmer, but it is flat and you can set your coffee on it.  It gets warm. 

do you have spec's of this product or based on which information you can make such statements?
BFL_Josh
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September 10, 2012, 10:12:15 PM
 #195

Who has deleted posts before?  Certainly not me.

I don't recall anyone stating that there would be a secondary power supply just for the coffee warmer; I'm not saying someone didn't say that, but I don't recall it and it's not true.  The coffee warming aspect is completely secondary to actually mining, so no it probably won't really keep your coffee all that warm.

There will be no secondary power source for the Jalapeno.  In retrospect, we probably shouldn't have associated it with a coffee warmer, but it is flat and you can set your coffee on it.  It gets warm. 

do you have spec's of this product or based on which information you can make such statements?

Yes.
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September 10, 2012, 10:14:27 PM
 #196

Who has deleted posts before?  Certainly not me.

I don't recall anyone stating that there would be a secondary power supply just for the coffee warmer; I'm not saying someone didn't say that, but I don't recall it and it's not true.  The coffee warming aspect is completely secondary to actually mining, so no it probably won't really keep your coffee all that warm.

There will be no secondary power source for the Jalapeno.  In retrospect, we probably shouldn't have associated it with a coffee warmer, but it is flat and you can set your coffee on it.  It gets warm. 

do you have spec's of this product or based on which information you can make such statements?

Yes.


for the record.
BFL_Josh
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September 10, 2012, 10:16:31 PM
 #197

Who has deleted posts before?  Certainly not me.

I don't recall anyone stating that there would be a secondary power supply just for the coffee warmer; I'm not saying someone didn't say that, but I don't recall it and it's not true.  The coffee warming aspect is completely secondary to actually mining, so no it probably won't really keep your coffee all that warm.

There will be no secondary power source for the Jalapeno.  In retrospect, we probably shouldn't have associated it with a coffee warmer, but it is flat and you can set your coffee on it.  It gets warm. 

do you have spec's of this product or based on which information you can make such statements?

Yes.


for the record.

No.
jamesg
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September 10, 2012, 10:24:58 PM
 #198


No.


That was a rather amusing exchange...  Cheesy
LazyOtto
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September 10, 2012, 10:25:29 PM
 #199

Who has deleted posts before?  Certainly not me.
Do you really want to take that position, BFL_Josh, also AKA <someone else>?

Perhaps BFL_Josh has never altered history. But <someone else> absolutely has in the context of BFL communications.
(Search for "memory hole" and folks can find one of my follow-ups where this happened.)

--

I remember what I've read. And I've read all the BFL related threads starting with the Fall 2011 BFL one's.

I recognize that you're new to BFL corporate membership, but there is a *lot* of history to overcome before BFL has a good reputation.
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September 10, 2012, 10:25:44 PM
 #200

Who has deleted posts before?  Certainly not me.

I don't recall anyone stating that there would be a secondary power supply just for the coffee warmer; I'm not saying someone didn't say that, but I don't recall it and it's not true.  The coffee warming aspect is completely secondary to actually mining, so no it probably won't really keep your coffee all that warm.

There will be no secondary power source for the Jalapeno.  In retrospect, we probably shouldn't have associated it with a coffee warmer, but it is flat and you can set your coffee on it.  It gets warm. 

do you have spec's of this product or based on which information you can make such statements?

Yes.


for the record.

No.

I enjoy having you here Josh.  Wink
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