Bitcoin Forum

I left most recently, and since I'm no longer under their control I can now share with anybody interested two important things.

One, bcp19, whose first name is Bruce, DOES work for BFL. Ask him and I'm sure he'll say yes, but if he doesn't, I have no problem with linking to pictures of him while employed at the plant. He's been there since last fall. I seriously don't know what game he's playing on this forum and what he's trying to accomplished, but I'm pretty sure it ain't good. To be fair, he is a nice guy.

Second. BFL received chips months ago that were intended for what you guys consider the Monarch. Thousands of miners have already made at BFL's plant using those new chips. Ask Bruce that also. He knows. Since you're now curious as to where all them miners went and are continuing to go, here... http://www.coinware.io/. Moreover, HashTrade, NimbusMining, LiquidBits, and Netsolus. The lead guy for CoinWare is named James (I'm not stating his last name because I don't want to get in trouble, but I'm sure you smart guys can figure it out). James visits the plant a lot, walking around assembling unescorted then heads to the offices of management to discuss whatever.

This post is valid https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=262052.msg6877963#msg6877963 because I was there when two guys from HashFast (don't get the name mixed up with HashTrade) walked the plant with Sonny, David, and Josh.

I honestly don't want to get mixed up with this mess because I have a family and all. BFL treated me pretty fairly while I was there, but feel it important for you guys who have millions still tied up and waiting for equipment to be aware. It's a shame that you guys who ordered first will probably be the last to get your miners. At least when you do get them, you'll make your money back, even if it takes longer than you planned, if I understand correctly how the whole thing works. Still, it's a screwed up deal.

One more thing, for what it's worth. Everybody in the plant knows about Sonny's past, and some not mentioned here, and we all joke about how we are (was for me, now) working for crooks and scumbags, most the time in Spanish when management is not around, of course.

Heck, I might as well add this tidbit, even though it doesn't matter none except to Sonny's girlfriend. Sonny has been screwing one of the pretty Mexican girls in assembly since early last year. I'm not going to mention her name for obvious reasons, but everybody at the plant knows it except Sonny's girlfriend who have a son together. I don't see that relationship lasting too much longer due to them fighting a lot, where then Sonny may start seeing the Mexican girl full time then.

Sorry if I said too much. All I wanted to say was about Bruce and CoinWare and how you guys are getting screwed big time.

Peace.

Thanks for your honesty...

We're all rooting for the S3.

Goodbye Butterfly Labs!

bcp19, do you work for Butterfly Labs ?

Are you asking me? I'm not bcp19/Bruce. I used to work for Butterfly Labs, but not anymore. Apologies for not stating when or why I left but it was recent. I just don't want them to get a bearing on whom I am.

No, not asking you. Asking bcp19 publicly as I'm sure he will see this post.

If this is legit information, thanks!
 
Peace

Good thread, thanks.  Nice bit about Sonny's girlfriend.

Stupid me! I am so sorry. I misunderstood.

For the person above this post who asked: "If this is legit information, thanks!"

Is legit, and you are welcome.

Gibson?

And I'd like to request some pictures of bcp19 working on the BFL factory floor.  Feel free to PM them to me if you'd prefer.

I wonder if we will see this in Jody's shipping blog lol.

All kidding aside, if legit you should consider contacting the law firm with the lawsuit against BF Labs, you may have information which could help in the prosecution.  If you're claims are legit you would be doing a great service to the mining community by talking to the law firm.

You definitely don't understand it correct, no one that is still waiting for a Monarch will ever make their BTC back.

Thanks very much for your candour.


This is wrong, no regular miner will make back what it cost them to buy these devices ever unless they proceed to sell them.

I'm confused. Sorry. If a person can't make their money back on them Monarch Miners, then why did people order them paying a few hundred dollars a piece for? I'm guessing they could be used for other things as well thus making them more valuable. Or, like you said, flip them for a profit. That makes sense, come to think of it.

Yep, started there last Sept, it was bound to come out at some point.  PG can confirm it.  Beyond that, a lot of nibbknot's statement is completely false.  Since you tin-foil hat types will believe his/her lies, I won't waste my breath.  

You are paid to say that his statements are completely false.

Nope, I'm not paid to post on here, I've said that many times.  What I post on here is of my own free will.  Just because you believe I am being paid means you are starting from an incorrect premise and therefore are coming to an incorrect conclusion.  Everything you derive from that is also false.

bcp you are one sad excuse of a human being.

Do you have any proof that could substantiate any of the claims laid out, even a bit? A uniform badge with your forum ID for example?

That would explain lots of stuff. Especially how BFL can continue to be in business without delivering product. The money has to come from somewhere right? Now maybe we know.

Everything makes so much sense now.

Forgive me for not believing a word that comes out of your mouth.

And let me correct myself in saying "You have direct monetary reasons to say that his statements are completely false."

Did you get a refund on your Monarch order yet ? Did you have one to begin with ?

Sadly you have like 3 pieces of a 10,000 piece puzzle and you think you know what's what.  I think that makes YOU the sad excuse for a human being.

So the one thing he has correct, you work for BFL? C'mon, if that is indeed true then why would he lie about everything else?

I was skeptical at first. Now I believe everything nibbknot said.

You can believe what you want, that doesn't make it correct.  Go ahead and have your field-day, I know you'll repeat the falsehoods told to you this day many times over to justify your already misguided perceptions.  

That's because people who preorder things believe they might be one of the lucky ones should the hardware arrive quickly and they be the first to mine with them before the diff rises and make a killing. This happened precisely once in the history of ASIC hardware for bitcoin mining, while delays and guaranteed losses happened with virtually every other piece of hardware that has come out since. Some obviously worse than others. The other mistake is most new miners don't remotely understand how much bitcoin they really are going to make, nor do they understand the way diff rises, and always believe they're buying a money making machine.

Do tell. What are my apparently misguided perceptions ?

I never said he/she had one thing correct, I'd say about 50% of his/her statement is true, but the 50% that is not is the part you'll believe above the rest.

Why do you assume anyone cares what you say?

Your credibility has been reduced from 1% to 0%.

I am far from a BFL fan but am curious as to why BFL wouldn't be able to somewhat easily narrow down who this post belongs to, assuming it is true?   OP acts as if he doesn't want to reveal too much because he doesn't want BFL finding out who he is, but unless BFL is laying off multiple people at a time, it should be easy for BFL to know who would post all of this.

bcp19, unless you are paid specifically to try to defend BFL in these forms you should probably stop while you are merely behind. Seriously... no one will believe you here now. You should do your job and not give people more ammunition to throw your way. Any rational person immediately understands why BFL is reviled here. Working there gets that bad goo all over you. You will be hated as much as Josh pretty quickly. Save yourself while you can... if it isn't too late already.  You should practice saying "I work there but I really don't know what happens to all the boards we produce."

Pictures are worth a thousand words:

http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h148/Bigblock462/PhinampBCP19_zpsd7abf72f.jpg (http://s63.photobucket.com/user/Bigblock462/media/PhinampBCP19_zpsd7abf72f.jpg.html)

Upper right top first two folks,Phin & BCP.


So there WAS more to this meeting,not just a "dinner & a miner" to soothe the savage Phin  :D

Thanks nibbknot  8)

Like I said, Bruce is a nice cool guy and glad he fessed up. I'm calling it a night all because I have to work in the morning.


Well, I was almost gone. This is so true. James of HashTrade/CoinWare ordered thousands of miners late last year. I think it was even in the Kansas City paper I once read in the break room when the order was placed. And it is Gibson since somebody already guess it. Wasn't sure how much I can say on this forum board.

Darn, I'm trying to post this but you people keep commenting. By the way, everybody that wanted a monarch miner that has been working at Butterfly Labs for awhile gets one for free as a Christmas present last year. Some already got theirs while others have to wait. Not sure if Bruce got his early or not. I'm pretty sure you can exchange them for cash, but we are not suppose to sell them till this fall sometime. Those that don't mine, like me, got a bonus for Christmas.

Like I said, I like Bruce as a person and never had a problem with him at the plant, but not sure what his angle is here, nor care.

To the guy that mentioned some lawsuit, like I said I don't want to get involved with any of that having to think about my family and all.

I just tried to post again and saw 9 more replies. Like WTF! I need to go to bed.

You speak like I should care what you think.  I don't.  *I* know the truth of the matter, you do not.  I also know you'll believe the lies told this day because there's the bombshell that's been dropped about my employment.  That's the thing you all fail to see... this person has mixed lies and truths in such a way that you think it's all true.  I can't wait for Bickfail to take up the baton and run with the lies.  That's what makes this so much fun, being one of the few who know the truth and laughing at those of you who are truly clueless and who believe the lies told daily on here.

I think most people can respect that position and obviously it's your choice. 

BFL has a caused a lot of damage to the mining community, LOTS of people looking for blood so don't be surprised if you get a fair amount of attention with a controversial post like this.

BCP is chatting with Josh as we speak & they'll DOX their socks off to find out who you are,so be ready for the process servers nib  ::)

Best of luck & thanks for the info,if you need legal help,just set up a donation addy for BTC.I'm sure you'll get the financial help ASAP  ;)

So is Sonny a cheater?  I would like to spill another secret about Sonny.  I heard Sonny is also into guys.  I heard he was flirting with that Puerto Rican guy at the end of the assembly line.  

Le Smokin' Gun? Has Wood Law and the Probation Officer got this information? Oh my... jail forgone conclusion.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_mupm2BmIjtc/S74vtzPCUxI/AAAAAAAALY8/9RSFZ9TfhcM/s1600/smoking-gun.jpg

Being a part of a company that is fucking all of the little guys to pad the wallets of their friends and you're "laughing" because you're privy to the truth and everyone else is caught up in the bullshit lie after lie they've been fed.

I feel pity for you.  You may be a "nice cool guy" at work, but your true persona shows here and it's really quite sad.

Pic of Mexican side piece?

Damn, I need to go to bed. Remember I have a wife and don't want her mad at me.

That's the guy. The one with the beard. He was there that day with Bruce. He didn't come back after lunch though. Just Bruce who hung around for awhile.

I've seen that guy in the red shirt on the left next to Josh at the plant a lot also. I assume you know his name because I rather not say it in fear of getting in trouble.

I apologize if I somehow started some kind of hornet nest for that was not my intent. Just relaying some facts.

Just tried to post again and saw a new post.

Seriously? This is controversial? I was just trying to help, people. Apologies again if I did something wrong.


Wow! Thanks guys. I never had bitcoins before and had to get a wallet so I went to blockchain.info and got one: 1zS6bFrAjLw6QY6rDmPFBHZUJoVGoNDvv

Never realized how fast a person could get their own wallet. I always thought bitcoins had to be mined or purchased first. The instructions were really simple to follow so I don't think I screwed it up.

Depending on how much I get I will buy something special for my wife's mom who is very very sick. We hope she makes it till her birthday in July which we all think she will.

Thank you again everybody.

Tried to post again but new posts to address I guess.

Sonny is not gay. Josh is bi, though. Maybe I shouldn't have said that but I don't think he comes on this forum since Butterfly Labs has their own I believe because I've heard Jody talk about it.

http://x1.fjcdn.com/comments/4430968+_f453f9abe3038b0692b687ea5c2cd7ec.jpg
BCP is a BFL employee paid to astroturf on bitcointalk.
Latest in the long line of shills...

A significant amount of personal information there, from someone who is trying to remain anonymous. A suspiciously large amount. I'm not a fan of BFL by any stretch of the imagination -- but just what's going on here? Is someone trying to frame someone else?

He is going a little too far now.

Simple solution.

Get all the documentation and evidence to Sonny V's probation officer and Wood Law and voila problem solved. This reveals any number of avenues now for customers to explore.

The rabbit hole is bigger and it will require proper investigation.

One more post and I'm going to bed.

I got to figure on how to put pictures in my post. I see I was able to do it by quoting. I'll figure it out I guess.

That's the second picture of Sulu I've seen on this thread which reminded me of something. There was this actor that showed up about four times (at least) late last year and early this year. Again I don't want to name names but he was in some Duck movie and played a president's son.

WOW! I just looked up his name to see what other movies he was in and saw that his girlfriend committed suicide in Singapore but some people think something else is in play. Maybe I shouldn't have stated this thread. I'm going to bed.

Somebody posted again while I was trying to post.


Did I say something wrong? Or did something wrong? I'm sorry if I did because that was not my intention. I only came here to state stuff about Bruce and CoinWare but maybe added more along the way that I shouldn't have and am sorry for the everybody. Now I hope my life isn't in danger in which I don't think so but you guys now got me thinking it may me. All because I came here to help. This is so weird.


I don't want to be part of some investigation. I just want to live a normal life. I guess I should have kept my month shut. If I get any bitcoins fine. If not fine too because I'm spending the money for my inlaw regardless.

Goodnight everybody and hope I've helped.

Just use "[ img]LINK.jpg[/img ]" without the spaces.

http://fr.xfire.com/profile/bcp19/
http://www.mylife.com/bcp19 ?

https://i.imgur.com/75SKPfz.png

This thread is epic, what I want to know is what PG has to do with BFL?

This is better than a soap opera!!! If it wasn't centered in Kansas City, I would be tempted to say it's the answer to "Who shot JR?"

PG used to troll BFL bigtime.  Then one day he stopped.  I think there might have been a bet involved which PG won,  which was seen as some to be a bribe?  Some suspect that he was payed off by BFL to go troll and dox competitors.  

To his credit,  he at least seems to only go after the ones that are not that great for the consumer.  He has seemed to spend a lot of time on Hashfast and BA, for instance. Although a lot of the attacks he use seem to be ad hominim.for example,  he focused a lot on HF's marketings deparments ties to Kink.com... a fairly respectable company in the porn industry. This seemed sex negative, and really had nothing to do with how HF was run by a bunch of no good theives who deserve to spend time in jail...

This thread is awesome,  btw.  I don't care if OP is making most of it up.  Great drama.  I would think that if BFL were making miners for coinware,  it would be very hard to hide this from the right subpoena.

...Getting out the popcorn...

Oh,  and OP.  If the monarch were delivered in December/January,  people would have made their profit back and then some.  The problem is that bitcoin mining equipment depreciates in value 10-30% every 2 weeks or so.  So a bitcoin miner today is worth about 1/12th what it was worth when the monarch was supposed to come out. It's impossible to make back what people spent on these. 

Having visited their facilities in September last year and having had lengthy conversations with Sonny, I find this hard to believe.  They may be incompetent, but I don't believe for a second that they have intentionally screwed over their customers.  Also, if there were any Mexican employees, they sure didn't stand out to me amidst the many people working hard in their assembly rooms.

Wait a second, were talking aboout Sonny, the same Sonny that pulled a lottery scam on old grannys and grandpops.. Oh no, for sure he wont intenionally screw anyone over!

FAIL

Well im glad the truth has come out about BCP and his BFL shilling.  Hes paid and that says it all.

Im sure people can share the trust rating love the rest of the brought and paid for BFL shills have received like Josh/Indaba has with BCP. It seems only fair people should know his connection and scamming.

The probation officer doesn't need one... Sonny V's biz partners have to be notified that in any dealings they have to handover everything that the Probation Officer would like to see depending on where the work product is.

Chaaaaa CHING!

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/04/digging-for-answers-the-strong-smell-of-fraud-from-one-bitcoin-miner-maker/


http://www.scribd.com/doc/217190031/2014-01-28-USA-v-Vleisides-Transcript

That be wise.

There is plenty just on the claims alone to move forward. Seems he is telling the truth BCP19 confirms he is an employee for what that is worth.

Anyhow I bet someone has already forwarded these claims to Wood Law and Sonny V's Probation Officer so the fact is you don't really need this guy to follow up on all the claims and prove them to be true. In fact I bet someone is checking out all these claims independently right now and will probably report back to this forum or Reddit etc. If most or all of these claims are true I don't see how Sonny V's going to avoid breaching his probation.

Well this explains a lot of BCP's postings - I mean who would defend that company that vigorously.... it's like defending Enron or GM and their recall coverups.

If what was posted in the OP pans out I can see this turning into major jail-time for those high on the BFL hog.  Karma's a bitch.

PG won (bribe same diff) 10BTC to keep quiet.It was just after that pic I posted was taken.Yeah he thunders for the little guy,BUT taking hush money is/was wrong IMHO  ::)

Oh man, I'm going to start writing a Bitcoin soup opera with all this stuff!!!

That comment from the BCP shill about us knowing just a few pieces of a big puzzle just confirms the fact that there is a huge puzzle in place in which he participates in. Any honest guy participating in an honest business would never refer to it as a "puzzle" Cmon! He's just trying to further stir up the bottom of the pond to cloud your view from seeing thru it.

All I now care is about this hot Mexican assembly line girl ;-)  I'll feel bad for her if she'll now have to visit Sonny in jail.

All this is unbe-fucking-lievable. It confirms the worst fears and accusations everyone has ever expressed about BFL. I was always willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they were merely grossly incompetent, but not dishonest and corrupt.

If Josh and Sonny want to fuck the girls - or even the boys - on the assembly line, that's their business, as long as it doesn't affect their work performance. But collusion, bribery, hush money, and fraud are all illegal and have no place in a proper business.

I hope everyone on the board who is complicit in these actions gets at least 10 years in PMITA prison, mining buttcoins.

Typical, you have 1 piece of information that is correct, yet you still get it wrong.  Yes, I do work there, no, I am not paid to post.

While the OP does seem to know me, there are inconsistencies in what they say...

1) The group picture with Sonny, Josh, PG and I... the person they are identifying is Goat.  Goat has never been to the BFL assembly 'plant'.
2) While the employes did get miners for Christmas, they were unsellable Jalapenos, not Monarchs (they ran at 3-4GH and were stamped Warranty Void).

As xrobau mentioned, this person is dropping an awful lot of information for someone trying to remain anonymous.  Too bad they can't do a simple copy and paste... their wallet address is invalid.

That was a metaphor, to indicate you have very few *accurate* pieces of information, yet you have come to this wildly inaccurate conclusion that you are sure is right. 

This is what I am talking about, the only part of your statement that is factual is the fact I am a part of the company.  The rest of your statement is your distorted view of the information you and others have pieced together.  What I find funny is that I have told the truth, yet you and others believe the colossal BS that is spewed daily on here by people like Bickfail.  This is why I refer to tin-foil hats when I talk to you... you see conspiracies behind every bush and discard the truth, even when you're hit over the head with it.  Even now you are discounting everything I say "because I am paid to say it".

I have no idea what the OP's intent was for posting here, but it's far from 'getting the truth out' and 'remaining anonymous'.  Maybe he/she is clueless enough to think that an underspeed Jalapeno *IS* a Monarch.

Remember back when you did your email exchange... what happened then? What is happening now? And you don't believe he is a scammer? Ok.


 Do we remember when? (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=53530.msg732994#msg732994)

*grumbles something about*

Jessep: You can't handle the truth! Son, we live in a world that has walls. And those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago and you curse the Marines. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know: that Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives...You don't want the truth. Because deep down, in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall. You need me on that wall.

We use words like honor, code, loyalty...we use these words as the backbone to a life spent defending something. You use 'em as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then questions the manner in which I provide it! I'd rather you just said thank you and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you're entitled to!

Kaffee: Did you order the code red?
Jessep: (quietly) I did the job you sent me to do.
Kaffee: Did you order the code red?
Jessep: You're goddamn right I did!!

Is this the same James (gigavps) from mega-giga-teramining that posted last week he was working on tripling his hashrate ?

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/28686048/bfl/sonny-josh-goat.jpg

Is that goat next to Josh ?

http://www.woodlaw.com/cases/butterfly-labs-and-bf-labs-inc-bitcoin-miners

No, I'm sure you can claim you get paid to do "your job", which seems to be pretty high up, considering you're sitting at the table with the Chief Scammer and VP of Bullshit. Shilling for BFL on this forum is just a hobby. Maybe you'll be lucky enough to share a jail cell with the rest of them when this all blows up in your faces.

Too bad you've lost all credibility you may have ever had on this site (which isn't saying much). Time to retire this account and start a new one (or just switch to one of your other ones).

Yes, no one on this forum will ever believe a word you say again (if they ever did). A shill is a shill and can never be trusted.

I'm sure you, Josh, Sonny and the rest of the jolly robbers in that pic are laughing all the way to the bank as you mine on your own accounts with that first batch (and the second and third?) of "unsuitable" chips and all those batches of "unreliable" boards. Like I said, I hope you get to share a jail cell with the rest of them.

Dishonest, scamming pieces of shit.

So does anyone know if BFL's fiscal year begins in July?

Darn, more popcorn...

This is better than owt on TV atm, I must admit I've never seen so much drama on any other forum.

Almost makes BTC mining worth it  ;D

As of this point, if anyone even shows the slightest hint of supporting BFL or cracks a joke about what's happening then I'm declaring them BFL employees because this certainly isn't funny and I'm not walking through smoke and mirrors for anyone!

This information requires investigation so anyone that can bring this to the attention of any media organisations i.e. CryptoCoinsNews etc will be doing us credit towards finding out the truth about all this.

What a bloody mess !

I wonder if BCP is one of Sonny's old lottery scam buddies.
Was he brought in to continue the scam here after Josh got run off the boards?

Anyway, it is no longer a mystery about why BCP posted misinformation and derailed every thread on BFL for the last 9 months.  ;D

Next on "Breaking Bit".  Difficulty rate spelled out in bacon on pancakes...

BFL - We know drama...

I do recall, and I have only 3 thoughts on it.

1. Pre-ordering an FPGA rig box (in the end, 2 FPGA mini-rigs) from BFL was, at the time, the best financial decision I had ever made, even though I was shortsighted and sold all the BTC as I mined them.
2. Pre-ordering ASIC mini-rigs from BFL was, once again, the best financial decision I've ever made, even though they delivered incredibly late.
3. Since they took so long to deliver the 65nm ASIC line, I had zero faith that they were capable of delivering the Monarchs less than a year late, so I didn't order.

I am satisfied with my BFL experience, even though it was very rocky at times.  I don't personally believe they're dishonest, based solely on my experience with them.  I have not been following much of anything on them since last September, other than occasionally noticing that the Monarchs haven't shipped yet.

Until you prove otherwise, you're just another BFL shill working on the long con.

Because shills often call their benefactors incompetent; makes perfect sense.  I'm sure there's enough proof in my fairly long post history for anybody who really cares whether I'm being truthful.

I'm just commenting with my thoughts, and, in case it wasn't apparent, I feel for those who have had a less satisfactory experience with BFL.  Just saying that mine was mostly good.  Other than being slightly annoyed, it makes little difference to me whether you believe me, as I have no stake in BFL.  Pretty soon I'll be shutting off the 65nm gear I bought from them and moving on to KnC Titans.

You were in a train wreck and managed to escape without injury. That is not a good experience, that is a bad experience that could have turned out much worse.
Then you got on the next train and got in another wreck, again escaping without serious injury.

I don't know of anyone who would call their experience good under those circumstances, even if they managed to escape death and dismemberment.
Standing among the bodies of those less fortunate and declaring that the train ride was the best they ever had would strike many as strange. Then again, there are many strange folk on these boards.

The FPGA Singles were the product they delivered late.  I, and other FPGA Mini-Rig customers, actually received the rigs close to on-schedule.  Mine were 11 days later than their initial estimate.  That is why I had confidence in them to deliver the 65nm ASICs roughly on time.  When they failed, I lost faith and did not order a 3rd time.

However, your analogy and assessment is humorous, apt, and insightful.  At best, what I said was taken by most as pointing my finger and laughing at those who feel screwed by BFL.  I apologize to anybody I may have offended and and am going to keep such thoughts to myself in the future.

No worries. Things can be so easily taken out of context on these forums.  :)

So when BFL is not busy fucking their customers, they are fucking themselves?

Thanks for bringing this to light. bcp19 has been quite deceitful in hiding his employment (I'm not surprised, Josh does the same thing). In fact, he has now deleted posts to try to hide the fact of his shilling. Take a look at this quote, which he has now deleted:


Now it all makes sense! That also explains why he was able to get a refund out of order (if he actually did request one).

SHILL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shill)


That perfectly describes bcp19.

That's what retards get for pre-ordering.

Not sad one bit.

You give a blank check to a stranger, that is what happens.

is there a court case open against BFL yet.
These ppl deserve jail time

 Ohh snap!  ;D

im not even considering this "news" , we all know what BFL is

So when does the movie come out? I am tired of reading.

What's a movie without bullets and a bazooka ?

We seriously need to call all the hacker community to assemble our own permanent, auditing, self-regulated BitcoinLeaks branch and dismantle all fraudulent operations by colluded and even non-colluded crooks and cartels (HF, BFL, etc) and whoever else is involved. It is for the good of the Bitcoin network.

Too much money brings them like cockroaches. No different from drug dealing. These people are ruthless criminals. Not necessarily your most ethical type of venture entrepreneurs.

The name of this movie is called BitFellas:

- Barber is looking thru the window, calls Josh and says: "deCastro is pissed off with Sonny, why don't you have your boy BCP go fishing with him in the lake? You know what to do"

I sure hope you didn't buy any lottery tickets... cause when you're wrong, you're WRONG.  I haven't deleted anything, that post was removed by one of the moderators for being 'off-topic'.  Kind of amazing how the response to it wasn't off-topic though...

If anyone is having trouble getting a refund out of BFL, you can track down BCP19 and ask him for one.

bcp19's real first name is Bruce and has been working at BFL since September of last year since he and that bearded guy toured the plant with Josh.

Butterfly labs has been making monarchs since at least February of this year after they got the chips and had them put on pcbs since January that is why there were 50-60 employees working in February like the court papers stated otherwise we all wouldn't have had anything to do.

What was made was delivered by BFL or picked up by vans and delievered to hosting companies seen on this page... http://www.coinware.io/

http://www.hashtrade.com/about.html Greg Bachrach is related to James Gibson by marriage I believe but don't know how.

Josh has been lying about most everything I've read so far on this forum and BFL's forum. I just learned that Inaba is Josh. Josh is bi. Sonny is straight and also dates a Mexican gal at the plant unbeknown by his livein girlfriend who have a son.

I no longer work for BFL and was happy when I worked there and paid decently for what I did. I have a new job now that pays a little better and am very happy there.

While working at the plant we all knew (us in the back) what kind of people Sonny, Josh, David... etc. are and their background and joked about such daily always making sure that they or other management like Jody were not around. I came here on my own occord to share the truth with you guys since so so so much money is involved that you guys put up first and that those who put up last got and still are getting miners first because their orders are so much bigger... in the millions.

Hope this answers your question.

I forgot to mention HashFast above. I just learned to quote too.


I hope it's ok to quote what was quoted and quoted again but wanted to answer the guy above as complete as possible.

I will triple my hash rate by buying IN-HAND equipment from manufacturers who do not keep giant order queues waiting for months.


While I was affiliated with Coinware/HashTrade in the middle of last year, I am now only an investor in LiquidBits and have yet to receive any hash rate from my investment.


I am not related to Greg Bachrach by marriage. nibbknot, if you are going to post stuff you "think" is factual, maybe you should verify your information first.

I didn't start working there until a week and a half later, don't you remember when my Trans Am broke down in the parking lot and I was waiting for 2 days for Bob's friend to come help me get it fixed?  Kind of hard to miss it, it was burnt orange and had the T-Tops.

So you still work there though?  ::)

Watch him dodge this question:

BCP,
Have more than 5 monarch miners been delivered to anyone outside of the BFL employ? (i.e. a retail customer or business)



 

I'm not an expert on math but if over a 1000 is over 5 then the answer is yes. Bruce should have no problem confirming this.

i take everything I read with a grain of salt. I can't read threads like this one because I just get so damned mad.

I am so confused as to who owns what.

http://www.hashtrade.com/about.html


One of the Jacobson Brothers is Jean-Marc Jacobson that goes by the name Jake Hobson and owns the building that the Bitcoin Embassy in Canada is located.


He has owned the building since at least 2002 as we guys can see here https://opencorporates.com/companies/ca_qc/1160763448


But then i find that Greg Bachrach said that he owns Liquidbit here http://www.scribd.com/doc/225704506/Bachrach-Declaration-Liquidbits-v-HashFast


But according to this http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/SearchResultDetail/EntityName/domp-p11000084688-a24cc0de-1b71-4c2d-a0dc-be0acfc07400/liquidbits/Page1 the Jacobson family members own it since 08/16/2011.


What is really weirder is this


That would make Jake or Jean-Marc Jacobson into bitcoin in March of 2012 but he clearly owned a bitcoin company in August of 2011. To me it is like he already knew that he was going to use a building he already owned in Canada for a Bitcoin Embassy.

When I was a kid I got in big trouble for lying. Did these guys even had parents because all I've been reading is a bunch of lies?

That's insulting to drug dealers who actually deliver a product to their customers. Don't lump them in with BFL and HF, they are just straight up thieves

Those guys couldn't get laid in a whorehouse

You can't ask specific questions like that. BFL is pro at redefining terms. When you say "Monarch", they mean a specific product sold only to customers. They can ship all sorts of products using the new chips and not call them "Monarchs". Just like how they mine with customer equipment because they don't call it customer equipment until they are done mining with it.

If you say so but http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/SearchResultDetail/OfficerRegisteredAgentName/flal-l10000000778-4c88d511-40a6-4bd8-b7ca-a9aed3a44d8d/jacobson%20remy/Page1

Nasser and David work together : https://www.linkedin.com/pub/emmanuel-david/45/22b/113


I think that's how I got confused. What was built for the hosting companies uses the same chips that was designed for the monarch. If I'm not mistaken Butterfly labs is now waiting for the 4th or 5th batch of chips to finish up the production for the hosting outfits then start making the monarchs for the individual orders. Two different designs but using the same chips. I guess that is how HashTrade was able to get in front of everybody else that ordered way before them if what I read I read correctly.

Josh could probably get laid at Missie B's.  :D

Well maybe this has been addressed...but BFL has been selling 'chips' the 65mm type since last summer...If they did actually (doubt it) tape out the monarch chip in august 2013 as they claim they could simply (and legally) be selling chips to these guys for making their own clone of a bfl miner to spec...ie...BFL makes them 'specialty cards' that 'don't' in include a format of their monarch and the 'buyer' cools them in his/her own method ...ie specialised equip

makes sense if they ran into real production delays and just plain can't get a working monarch out nothing to say they could not setup a specialized chip
arrangement that is the responsiblity of the people ordering the specialized equip to cool on their PH farm

makes sense...if they have NOT done this it means that BFL has moved NO product out of their doors (doubt anyone last fall was buying 65mm in bulk to cool) since last oct or so when they almost completed 65mm shipping..and the trickle imho of 65mm since then by newbies probably an't enough to keep the BFL doors open

so yeah ...all that 'unknown' you see on the blockchain pie chart could be BFL monarch chips in specialized rigs..it is that or they have moved NOTHING out of the plant since last year or note....(then again they have kept all the pre-order $$$ and shipped late so maybe I know zip)

but it sure looks like something BFL would do behind the scenes if their a*s was in a 'crack' and lets face it ..even if BFL was a scam and late to move equip I kinda think even they
thought they'd have something to us foo...er I mean customers by march 1st not July 1st ...if for no other reason the 'revenue stream of $$$ ie more newbie suckers"

but again they likely imho did do the above and it is all perfectly legal in that it is a 'separate' mnfg line they will say and they have stated before they 'would' sell chips..so
likely them and the partners on this..have their butt covered

and imho I'm sure the chips DO run too hot to put on a 'card' arrangement in a tower anyway...so they even have an 'out' that these chips would not work in the monrach
on a card anyway..so they moved these unsuitable chips out the door in this manner

again BFL being BFL

So either the OP on this thread is telling the 'complete truth' or it is all a 'fabrication' ..no real middle ground even so the above in my view though the above chip deal out the back door is veryi very very likely

and if I'm completely wrong tell me they 'would not' do the above if they have the means to do so with an actual monarch chip even though it MAY run too hot for the current monarch product.....(but then again they could just have been making up they even  had a chip till recently)


Searing

Goat is the ugly mofo with red 11 t-shirt?

Yes that is him.

June 21st 2014...

<.< 

BFL still exists.. :O.

LOL!. If justice is served, do a small one then a documentary

Bruce,

Did you work for MW in the late 90's?

Is MW a code wode for the U.S. Navy?  If not, then no.

BCP,

Still waiting for your response.

Yes or No?

No it is code for a computer company in Lenexa, KS in the late 90's.  I don't think you are him. 

BFL most likely did the same thing to 65nm customers.

This kind of revelation kind of shows how greed tend to screw things up. None of this is particularly illegal because as someone pointed out the chips are on thing but the product called the Monarch is another.

Actually, all of it is illegal. BFL made predictions about shipping dates they knew could not be met because they had already determined to send the chips elsewhere. They put those dates out there to entice customers knowing they would never be met. BFL refused refunds they were obligated to give. BFL mining with equipment they should be shipping to customers isn't illegal though.

There is a lawsuit that is working on certification as a class.
There are individual lawsuits that are in progress.
One lawsuit has already been won vs BFL.

The wheels of justice grind slowly when it comes to consumer facing fraud (just look at what GM did for 2 decades). Once enough lawsuits surface, the AG's will take notice then Sonny et al will get some jail time.

+1

I thought the same thing last year after waiting over a YEAR for my Singles.

At least one mystery is solved and we know what happened to the 'bullet run' chips

This picture is way too reminiscent of the pirateat40 meetup in vegas

reminds me of what happened to my old 5ghz miner, both of them went dead after like 2 weeks of mining. Everytime i see the word BFL, makes me rage lol. We will ship in <insert date here>, yea right.

Hereafter going forward, anyone shilling or defending a company that is not worthy of being defending with be known as:

                       BCPing for a company.

In common usage:

"Dude can you believe he is defending that company after how they have been treating their customers?"

"Dude he has been BCPing for that company for the last year!"

Well looks like BFL is going down the drain and people working for the mare resigning from their company. Wont be long before more relies their not doing business good and the rest of their employers start leaving and the business falls apart. I bet 50BTC that the final remaining person who works for them is Josh lol

BCP what do you do for bfl? Are you the gimp they bring out on special occasions? Have you been moonlighting for KnC when they use the gimp on their customers?

Josh is going to the bitcoin conference in Hong Kong. I am going too and will beat the crap out of him! :)

Goat is next to Phin, the OP never worked for BFL, BFL did not sell any 28nm chips, nice try.  Next.

 SLok, do you work for Butterfly Labs ?

SLoK, Goat is next to Josh, I am next to Phin.

ok, I remember it was mentioned long ago when that picture was first out that he was on the right side row. I work for nobody, btw.

Slok, aren't you a admin on the BFL forums?

Slok is bcp'ing it up here. BFL called in the shillenforcments!

Ok, he is or at leas was a Mod there. With knowledge of the warehouse, shipments, production runs, etc. So if he doesn't work for BFL that means he is a partner/owner/etc. He is just trying to be ambiguous about his relationship with the entity. Pretty sad.

He is still a mod on the forums.

https://i.imgur.com/Tn2sPsD.jpg

I believe SLok is a good guy and he has been very helpful to anybody  on the BFL forum needing help. I feel he does not work for BFL as I have seen his responses on the forum and his answers were not that of a person with inside knowledge of the internal workings of the company but would try and steer a person in the right direction for help and I have seen him even make post as to call out BFL on a few things. With that being said I have since sold all my BFL singles and went with S1's miners and have not followed the BFL forums for 3 months or more.

No one cares.

How long has BFL been shipping the Monarch to its secret customer base?

You dodged it three times so we now know its true, now we want to know how long?

No Monarchs have been shipped but they are shipping the cock off the Monark!

I changed the question slightly, they can't get the 'Monarch' to work, so whatever they are shipping will be called something different.

 ;D  ;D  ;D

Ah, the delicate sounds of full-contact capitalism.

The guy you call Goat is next to Josh on his right. Bruce is to the left of the bearded guy (Phin). I have no idea who the other two guys are. I have no idea if BFL sold 28nm chips or not but am damn sure they were on PCBs and made into miner then delivered to various hosting outfits mostly in the KC area owned and operated by the same gain. For a person who never worked for BFL I sure do know a lot of what went on as well as the 50-60 who were assembling the miners in February forward. Very little was mailed from the dock except for replacement parts or rare orders for the oldline miners. Very little packing has taken place since the first of the year because where the miners were going the hosting cos. weren't far away.

To the person who said that there were no Mexicans at the plant this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSu5Yyc1bEM (I just found some funny BFL videos for the time-----WOW!)

I bet they have been selling to colo companies the whole time. Including for their 65NM chip products.

Pre-orders to raise cash. Build equipment. Sell large quantities of in-hand equipment to bulk purchase farms (because they wont drop 3M on a preorder. They need immediate delivery.). Try to catch up with the original consumer orders after the farms aren't interested anymore.

Thus defrauding the consumers.

It seems pretty obvious now.

Classic bait and switch.  Elon Musk did the same thing with the Tesla car pre-orders, but at least he readily admitted that he did.

BFL can't keep playing the "Oh well we made our best effort guess of when development would be done for our products."

If that is true then they have THE WORST development and planning team in history.

Pushing of deadlines over and over and over is unacceptable. I thought the first batch of suckers who bought BFL vaporware would have set a precedent for people to learn from their mistakes. I guess not.

For reference.

https://i.imgur.com/kxwSXzJ.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/XkYHit2.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/Tyo5y70.jpg

I'm probably going to get in trouble for this (I did sign an NDA), but this has really gone on a bit too long and the lies are getting worse and worse.

Late Dec/Early Jan, BFL caught up on all of thier 65NM product lines and were (when available) shipping from stock.  The people on this forum who would daily link to the fact that "X" was now up for sale or was taken down knew before I even did that we had product advertised or delisted.  At that point in time, there was an order placed for 4000 boards to be built into a new type of unit that had just come out... the 250/230GH rack mount.  This is what was being built during the time frame that nibbknot claims we were building Monarchs.  I can very plainly state that there were NO 28nm chips available during that time frame.

The claim that employees were given Monarchs as X-mas presents (which he later changed to singles with the option to wait for Monarchs) is also a blatant lie.  There are at least 50-60 people who can verify that we were all given 2 Jalapenos that ran between 3 and 4GH and that no one was offerred cash or a free upgrade for waiting.  I remember the day well, as I had over a dozen people ask me if I wanted to buy theirs as they didn't want to learn how to use them.  Since I was still saving up money to get a valve job done on my car after it broke down in the parking lot, I didn't take many people up on their offers. 

Check out the link he posted... here it is again... http://www.coinware.io/.  What's the first listing on there?  Nimbus Mining.  Look back to your own posts, you guys ragged about the 65nm product being used to offer cloud hashing at $40 per GH when it was first announced.  Considering there were *NO* working 28nm chips until late April, it was impossible for them to be built in Jan/Feb.

Then there's all the other lies he's told... I'm beginning to doubt this person was ever an employee of BFL.  If you were to ask a REAL employee of BFL, you'd find out that I almost never take a break.  I can count on 1 hand the number of times I sat down at the table in the break room to have lunch.  While I did end up getting a Nexus Tablet from the christmas party, I didn't even take it out of the box for months.  To claim that I'd sit around posting from work is complete horse manure... I can't stand the tablet, I'm too used to keyboards, not tiny little buttons that take me 30 minutes to correctly type 1 sentence.

The plain and simple truth is that all you have to do is go read Josh's posts about the Monarch development and you'll know the real story.  I've lost 45 pounds since I started working at BFL from the stress... in addition, I work 60-70 hours a week, first it was to keep product moving out the door, and now it's trying to get the next one working so we can send it out the door.

Joe... I'll admit, I've been ducking your question for 1 reason and 1 reason only... cause I know you'd never believe the truth.  If you don't count the boards being built right now to go satisfy the cloud hashing for the first customers(as Josh posted), the only boards in existance are in the hands of the developers/engineers.  I've had to relearn skills I have not used in 20+ years (back when I was first in the Navy) in order to change components in an effort to get these boards to run at speed.  You think the customers are frustrated?  You have no idea how the employees feel.  Try spending an hour swapping components you can only see through a microscope sometime...

When nibbknot first posted, he was only at about 50% lies, but now it's like he's one of you guys and has to expand the lies because he's in the spotlight.  Personally, I think he's a coward.  He hides behind anonymity and tosses out the lies faster than Bick does.  You want to see a picture of the 'Monarch' he claims to have built?  https://products.butterflylabs.com/250-gh-s-rack-mount-bitcoin-miner.html  <-- plain as day, THAT is what was being built so feverously back in Jan/Feb.  Click the 2nd picture... 65nm Single boards with black heat sinks.  You're trusting the word of a person who can't tell the difference between a board with 16 11MM chips on it and a board with 2 25MM chips on it, who thinks an underspeed Jalapeno is a Monarch/Single, and who is an outright coward.

I refrained from telling Bick to run with his smoking gun, because I figured I'd get in trouble at work, but now the lies are so overwhelming I don't care any longer.  Take your smoking gun to the authorities Bick and then you'll find that you're just a troll who believes any lie shoveled into your face.  nibbknot seems to have all the answers, but ask HIM for the pictures to back up his statements... Ask him for the proof you demand so often from others.  I know you won't, because you're too afraid the bubble will burst and you'll find you were had yet again.

To the idiots that think I am trying to derail threads:  I rag on Bick for 1 reason... I *KNOW* the majority of what he claims is a lie.  By harping so on his other lies, sooner or later people will start to realize his current lies.  Maybe nibbkknot is Bick's sockpuppet... that would explain a LOT.

For posterity.

With respect to your quote "I've had to relearn skills I have not used in 20+ years (back when I was first in the Navy) in order to change components in an effort to get these boards to run at speed.", this gives more context to PM's I've had with the user that, in my mind, validates the fact that they have been previously employed at Butterfly Labs and have insider knowledge.

Furthermore, "At that point in time, there was an order placed for 4000 boards to be built into a new type of unit that had just come out... the 250/230GH rack mount.  This is what was being built during the time frame that nibbknot claims we were building Monarchs." would seem to be a plausible explanation assuming someone, in-fact, placed an order for 4000 rackmount units.

Edit: Consider nibbkknot is more-than-likely in error, and was mistaken about which chips were being used - They were working with 65nm chips instead of 28nm, and came to the erroneous conclusion they were building products using 28nm chips.  Don't get me wrong, I love a good conspiracy theory just as much as the next guy, and certainly have no love for Butterfly Labs, but let's try to stay rational about this and not get caught up in a wild goose-chase by someone that meant well, but may have got some details wrong.

I've watched and read this thread with interest.  I don't have a dog in the fight, although I've purchased bfl products and have had problems with products that required customer service.  Jody even gave me a tour of the facility back in April-May 2013.  I've never been politically correct, so forgive my ignorance for the following.

For who ever it was to say they did not see mexicans/latinos, etc. working at BFL doesn't hold up.  When I toured there, there were several men and women (some very cute I might add).  Jody said they were college kids.

My personal overall experience with them has been positive.  IMHO, both sides of the finger pointing are lying.  I think Josh stated their policy best one day on their forum.  They only care about their top 20% customers.  So are side deals done for the big fish? Probably. Do they care if your $10,000 or less order is delayed? Nope.  Are they deceptive? Depends on perception.  Illegal? Doubtful.

So let's refill the popcorn and read some more. Don't expect a smoking gun, read what is not being said, and look at it as entertainment.

If you invested 40k plus (3200btc that would now be worth a shit ton) I think you would have a different tune. I've learned that buying coin and holding is the way to go.. You don't have to tell me 2 err i mean 3 times...

 Given that "intent" differentiates between deception and an honest mistake, the fact that BFL managers are deceptive is not dependent on a persons perception other than perhaps the requirement of normally functioning cognitive abilities.
 Illegal? Acts outlawing deceptive business practices exist in most states in the USA.   It is my hope that any BFL managers responsible for the deception are eventually held to account.

They may well have been an employee, but if they were, they were either completely clueless about the product being produced or are upset at having been let go.  When I first saw the OP, I thought had a good idea who it was, but then there was the comments about the wife and then the kids and then the sick mother... The person I thought it was wasn't married... but after all the other lies I've seen him toss out there, those now become suspect as well.  

Surely the network would have been small enough at the time to have seen 1000s of singles hiding somewhere?

Mores lies from the guy who lied about not being a BFL employee while filling threads with his nonsense?
Who cares. Still no Monarchs in the wild. BFL shilling. BFL mining with their customers equipment. Release the lawyers and second amendment enthusiasts!

Just don't get any blood on my popcorn.  :D
Plus, grrrrr Portugal.

Well at least you responded, like you said, questionable whether you will be believed.

FWIW, while I don't have much insider knowledge in BFL day-to-day operations, I do know that as of right now, Nimbus doesn't have software working for any 28nm BFL hardware.
Only just recently, did we finish getting BFGMiner to work properly with the Monarch (despite the announcement for its support in 4.0, there were some bugs that came up as BFL tweaked the firmware to get to the full hashrate).
Nimbus currently relies on a proprietary fork of cgminer, so they can't even deploy that right now.
And while it's possible they could use software I'm not aware of, I was recently asked (with pay) to help adjust Nimbus's operation so it could handle the Monarch - which wouldn't make sense if they already had something working.
So, at least that part of this guy's story sounds like it's completely bogus (which makes me question the whole thing, even if I can't personally refute it).

Trolls who are going to FUD against my credibility, don't bother: I'm not putting this up here for you, but for the honest people who might otherwise not know better.

Hey smoothie check this out about how bad is their development team:


Year 2014, design and create high performance ASIC chip, BUT swapping small components by hand! An he feels frustrated because of that. Amaizing.


So after lying for the last 9 months the shill comes here and wants to tell the truth! RIGHT! Notice the emphasis on the "NO" chips. Please tell us more bcp19. We DO believe everything that you say. There were no chips before April and Inaba will commit seppukku if he misses the power draws! Yes we believe everything that a BFL employee says. Tell us more about you changing microscope components by hand and how were you so frustrated about that. It surely helps your customers who lost money on their BFL pre-order scheme. We know that ALL BFL customers are idiots because you made "ROI" because you asked for a refund.

There were NO chips before April. Please remember that everyone!

I apologize for being a coward and not stating who I am since I'm married and have three kids (the oldest home only parttime). The only person I know for sure on this forum is Bruce with the rest being strangers to me but I want them to know the truth as to what is really going on at the plant.

That 4000 order was a rush job early this year. It was finished long time ago. Since then 50 plus assemblers have been sitting around doing nothing for months waiting to build monarchs first for those who ordered first then for those big hosting companies that ordered last. Think about that for a second before you go hunting for any lawsuits of unhappy industrial clients suing butterfly labs because of breach of contract because you won't find any. Why? Because they all have been made happy is why.

I had to laugh at the part time college students comment. Some in their mid to late twenties. Some with greencards. Some speak very little English. Some with kids like me. All work five days a week (or more) during the hours that college courses are offered. I couldn't do it if I wanted to but somehow the majority of everybody I just stated could. I don't think 10% of them can spell college and please don't take that out of context for I not implying anything rasist. I too misspell a lot of words. The crew are hard working people and many are my friends to today.

While trying to inform the public of wrongdoing by a manufacturer is noble, making false accusations about others like Bachrach / Gibson is just as bad. The type of accusations you made could have consequences and should not be made without supporting facts. I can guarantee that Monarchs were not getting shipped as you described. It is plausible that what was being shipped were the rack mountable 65nm product. I do not know this for a fact. However, I can confirm that after the initial batches of 65nm chips were delivered to buyers in the fall of 2013 the supply of surplus chips dried up. This is most likely due to the fact that the price of BTC shot up and the 65nm surplus suddenly became viable again. Obviously, many of them went into rack mountable gear which is what you would expect an industrial scale miner to buy.

If you do a little research you will find that both James and Greg (Liquidbits) have gotten screwed like everyone else along the way with respect to hardware delivery. Take a look at the Hashfast bankruptcy as a point of reference where Liquidbits fighting to resolve that clusterfuck of a situation.

I am by no means trying to refute the known facts about BFL in general, nor am I claiming to know the details of the dealings you reference. I am simply making the point that you need to be very careful not to falsely accuse people of "fraud by association" unless you can prove it. There are plenty of bonafide dirt bags in this community that need to be called out.

I didn't know Luke was on this forum. I do remember what the crew used to refer to him as and pretty sure Bruce can confirm. When he wasn't around they called him Chupacabra. I'm not trying to be mean all just stating facts of what I know from working at the plant.

As least we're getting a heads up on this.

I can't help it! Those goats just look so delicious! Mmm!

Nah, sounds much more likely that your goal is neither.
You're not trying to be mean.
But you're also not stating facts.

What you're really trying to do is stir up fights.
I'm not falling for it.

Sorry Luke.You burned your credibility when you claimed BFL shipped you product oh so long ago, when in fact it was sitting at BFL labs the whole time.

BFL has already admitted to mining with customer equipment (under oath to the courts) and BCP has confirmed his employment with BFL. The rest is just window dressing really.
No monarchs shipped to customers. The same cast of characters singing the same tune as last year. Meanwhile the hash rate moves on.

Don't put words in my mouth, thanks.

I'm not trying to pick a fight or stir up stuff but I can't help but comment on this for a little humor.

"Those goals just look so delicious! Mmm!"
"Don't put words in my mouth, thanks."

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=163261.msg1713137#msg1713137 <--- Thread about Luke claiming to "have his first ASIC"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=163261.msg1713163#msg1713163 <--- Screenshot of Luke posting a picture demonstrating he has his ASIC
https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm9.staticflickr.com%2F8404%2F8608273267_04e5e7f50f_z.jpg&t=541&c=9DDsr5MM9BOv7Q <-- picture of the workbench at BFL the shows a disturbing similarity to the picture Luke showed

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=163261.msg1715316#msg1715316
Quote from: Miner99er on April 01, 2013, 08:21:13 AM
For this bet to be won tho, there needs to be a shipping label and/or tracking number.

Luke's reply: There is, but I'd prefer not to give the trolls my personal info.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=163261.msg1719599#msg1719599  <-- Luke finally admitting that "BFL has it at their office now only at my own request that they keep it there for the time being." The unit was not shipped to him.

For the record, I am not putting words in your mouth. I am putting them in a textarea element in an HTML page in a browser.  ;)

Was that bet on one of Sonny's betting sites or another bitcoin betting site? Also did the guys who won the bet since the deadline wasn't meant did they have good odds and came out good?

Great, at least this time you quoted what I actually said.
You will note that at no point did I say BFL had actually shipped it (at the time).

betsofbitcoin, iirc.

now all this story reminds me of the rumor someone got their bfl mini-rigs first, skipping the line thru the back door.

haha                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                   

wow! So this is the kind of stuff that was written about butterfly labs when I was working there and Bruce still works there? And they're still lying today as in today?

How to deal with chupacabras
http://media.animevice.com/uploads/1/18405/506520-chupacabra.png

You claimed you had your ASIC device. You claimed you had a shipping label and tracking number for the device but declined to show either of them.
Somehow you manage to reconcile those two statements with BFL not shipping the device (thus no tracking number or label) and you not having the device (because it was still at BFL).
BFL was paying you at the time to develop the mining software.
BFL stood to gain 1000 BTC (now worth roughly $600,000) if they could claim the device had shipped by April 1st.
That is why you have no credibility on the subject of BFL. It has already been demonstrated that you are willing to deceive if the stakes are high enough.

Both of which were true.
I showed the device. I didn't show the tracking number for reasons I stated.

Don't forget the context of the tracking number/label bit. I was responding to pedantry with pedantry.

Are you claiming I said that too, or are you just stating random rumours from people who wouldn't know as if they are truth?

I don't know anything about that.
But to use present-day valuation for something that occurred in the past is ridiculous.

What stakes? I gained absolutely nothing from your so-called "deception" (where I stated only the truth).

Edit: Also, I'm curious what stakes you think there are in this thread? I don't see any stakes for anyone...

YES.  If ANY of this is true its pretty obvious where the "bullet run" of "BROKEN" chips went.

They claim they are all defective, OK SURE.  Their co-conspirators to this huge scam get their BIGTIME orders
for their farms right away and they keep up the ruse of 2 more weeks over and over.

This might be my favorite BFL thread of all time because alot of shit is coming to light here.

The bigtime farms get there stuff right after payment, mine for months on low difficulty, and the little customers
sit here with a BFL dick in the ass.  OMFG I hope these guys BURN soon in court / jail.

One last and humor post for today.

"Those goals just look so delicious! Mmm!"
"Don't put words in my mouth, thanks."
"I don't see any stakes for anyone..."

Of course both are true, but tell us how close were you to the actual miner at the time of the post. Have you actually touched it or it was at BFL warehouse at the time of the post?


You didn't know anything about the bet, but you posted right before the deadline? Please allow me to NOT believe that. And 1000BTC is 1000BTC no matter the exchange rate. It's somethin BFL gained just because of your post, not because of their direct actions.

I may have touched it a few weeks earlier when I was there in person, but it was being hosted by BFL until the rest of my order was ready.
Where they had it physically located (their warehouse, office, or whatever) I don't know/care.

I don't know anything about BFL having a stake in the bet, even to date (it's long enough ago that it's possible someone told me and I forgot).
I don't think I'd seen the bet until after my post, either.
I posted when BFL turned over my miner.
Furthermore, nobody won the bet. It was called a draw.
So even if BFL had made bets on their own delivery, they lost what their winnings would have been, they didn't gain.

Yes, but 1000 BTC is not $600,000 no matter the exchange rate.
Pretending it had today's value is what is ridiculous.

Don't forget that same little guys that are waiting for monarchs may also have paid for mining contracts from the very hosting companies that are mining with the devices made from the chips that are suppose to be in miners that they have been waiting for and Sonny has a vested interested in all of them. I only regret not knowing all this when I was working there because I may have done things differently. If Bruce's cred wasn't shoot all to hell he could let you guys into so much more stuff than I could even though I believe I helped out as much as possible.

Popcorn for everyone !!!!!!!!!!!!  :D

http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu90/vanessa68_2009/Macros%20and%20gifs/hrzfab.gif (http://media.photobucket.com/user/vanessa68_2009/media/Macros%20and%20gifs/hrzfab.gif.html)

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p184/Mulla2006/Jackson_popcorn.gif (http://media.photobucket.com/user/Mulla2006/media/Jackson_popcorn.gif.html)


http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n92/melissamcculloh/popcorn.gif (http://media.photobucket.com/user/melissamcculloh/media/popcorn.gif.html)


http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y169/photosonthenet/24ergas.gif (http://media.photobucket.com/user/photosonthenet/media/24ergas.gif.html)


http://i865.photobucket.com/albums/ab211/ontdforkari/gifs/2h34jyf.gif (http://media.photobucket.com/user/ontdforkari/media/gifs/2h34jyf.gif.html)

Since I just figured out how to implant an image I might as well add one with a comment.

Is there enough popcorn to feed the coons?

https://31.media.tumblr.com/8b010bf9e851100f60e3fb32c931088c/tumblr_mxkek9VJCF1r3gb3zo2_400.gif

wow! The guy feeding the coons looks like Bruce.

So since the unit wasn't actually delivered to you then it's fair to say that the bet should have ended as a Lose for BFL and the one that made the Draw decision was wrong. Also your statement from here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=163261.msg1713137#msg1713137 is just a lie because you didn't had the unit at the time of the post. BFL had your unit, not you.


There was no shipping label at the time of the post if the unit was in BFL's warehouse. Lie again. Or there was a shipping label ready sitting right next to the unit in the warehouse. No shipping occurred before or on 1st April.

There goes your credibility in this whole story since you covered up for BFL.


I agree.

By the terms of the bet, it actually should have been a Win for the BFL side.

Um, no. You're trying to be pedantic, but failing.
Learn English: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/have

The latter (where the label physically was, I don't know - but I was given a tracking number).
I never claimed it did.

I can't find the original terms of the bet, but please enlighten me why it should have been a Win for BFL.


Not English native, but having something that hasn't been delivered yet is weird for me.


So you claim that you received a shipping label, but the unit was hashing in BFL's warehouse? When exactly did you received your shipping label and when did your unit stopped hashing so that it could be sent to you?

I'm sure it's somewhere in this forum thread (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=163261.0).

I received the tracking number in the same conversation as (eventually) setting up remote access to my miner.
I don't recall when it was finally shipped exactly - months later due to further delays of the minirigs.

P.S. If someone who I know I can trust with my privacy wants to waste their time confirming it exists as stated, I wouldn't mind sharing it with them. I just confirmed FedEx still has record of it (including at least origin, date, and destination).

Thank you for being evasive. So you state that the bet should be a Win for BFL, but you don't want to back up the statement with anything. I won't bother searching for it (maybe k9quaint will do it), but anyone can create a shipping label anytime and can use it at a later time (like in your case) so that can't be your reason, as for actually having the unit that is off too since you claimed to have it in BFL's warehouse.

So that's it everyone. Luke-Jr thinks that the bet should be a Win for BFL because they created a shipping label and they plugged his unit from their warehouse! This is his definition of having the unit.

well actually ..that is as close to actually having a unit 'on time' more or less then any I've heard....they say it is your unit and plug it in at BFL ...(take it and run with it) the other 99% did not even get that much!

Searing

So you're not interested in the facts, just trolling.
Thanks for clarifying that; I'll stop wasting my time answering you.

Actually, unfortunately not. Even for that unit, I think I waited longer than the average wait time. :(

What I want to know is what happened at BFL between 3/31/13 and 6/30/13.  It took over 3 months for BFL to go from "shipping" Luke's Single to shipping my Single, and my Single was one of the first 100 ordered.  During that 3 month delay I lost the potential return of my 209BTC outlay.  I want to know if BFL was actively mining at extended length with first Singles.  Ultimately I was only able to mine a little over 17BTC with something I spent 209BTC.  There's not making positive ROI and then there's having a company steal your money outright by using your hardware while blatantly telling lies "oh we can't get it to work".  >:(

I am interested in facts. Facts which you are evading to tell and you put me to search for them. If you say that the bet should have been a Win for BFL then you must know the terms for the bet. Putting me to search for them is a waste of time. If you don't know the terms for the bet then you just talked without nothing to back it up, but I am sure it's not your case.

Please tell us why should the bet be a Win for BFL! Only because there was a shipping label which was never actually used for a long period of time?

Probably not the whole picture, but note that Little Single was the original design (square case that was later used for the 5Gh unit) and used 8 chips (IIRC) to run the 30 Gh/s.
The final 30Gh unit ended up something like 2x the size using only 4 chips (again IIRC), and uses less electrical power.
It probably has a longer lifetime too (the original one already died and got RMA'd a long time ago).

While it probably doesn't help (we all still lost a lot on this downtime), we can't actually know the total loss value.
Had BFL actually delivered on time, the difficulty would have skyrocketted even before the Avalons shipped...

I don't think they were, but I don't have any evidence either.

It's either you or me searching; I already know the conclusion, so I don't care to take the hours looking through the thread (stupid bitcointalk won't let me download all the posts in it for some reason).
I knew the terms over a year ago when it was an active topic.
I recall the conclusion (that it should have been a BFL Win), but not the details.

I know they revised it but I can't see the revision taking 3 months - 90 days since they said they were working weekends as well.

My 55GH/s (barely scraping the 10% tolerance rule they set) Single died 5 days after it arrived, and it took them 11 days to RMA it.  If BFL got their units out before Avalon Batch 2 they would have at least tried to commit to their advertising failure of being the first ASIC manufacturer which is what they touted when they hooked me in 6/2012.

I thought put this all past me and just wanted to keep it as a learning experience to not trust people, but now I am reliving this nightmare again.  And with the new "revelation", I think the community can agree that BFL has committed blatant fraud.  If I did similar things I lose my license and probably my house and all my assets.

BFL will have their day in court to defend themselves.  Too bad Satan can't be called in as a witness.

Ok. I won't search and you won't either. I remember that bet was for BFL delivering units before 1st April. No matter how you or me interpret the terms of the bet, the purpose was the same. No matter happened with your unit the facts remain and those are that the next unit and even your unit left BFL 3 months later. This whole discussion on the terms of the bet is pointless for me. The bet wasn't made by lawyers or by someone who can state some neutral terms. Bet was made by a normal person and he put what he thought to be decent terms for it (unfortunately very vague and arguable like in our case). Trying to twist the bet statements is a waste of time since BFL really failed to deliver units before 1st April.

Even if they have physically delivered the unit to you it was still a twist because next units went out of the door 3 months later. I realize that in a court that would stand as a win, but in real life you get shit on your door and some human parts stuck in your holes for such gimmicks.

Carry on!

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=165500.0

Problem was the title of the bet was at odds with the description of the bet which is why it was classed as a draw (rightly or wrongly, I wasn't involved so am not interested)

Thank you. As I said the bet was made by a rushed person, not by lawyers. I am sure that he wasn't even aware that the title is part of the agreement. What matters is that the scope of the bet was is BFL will ship units before 1st April. They clearly haven't shipped anything before or on 1st April. They didn't ship anything the whole April and May month. That's what matters. Luke-Jr says that the bet should be a Win for BFL because they clearly shipped so many units before 1st April.

Edit: Unfortunately the bet was made so horribly wrong because it only asks for a hashing proof. Not having the unit in hand. Worst bet ever! But thank you Luke-Jr for helping scammers from BFL to get a draw on that bet by posting the required pictures 30 minutes before the deadline. We really need more people like you!

From 'A point of order: Conduct in this subforum' :

".... Generally the subject matter should be boring —
technical, procedural, dry things. ..."

This thread might not fully comply with this rule I guess:)

Indeed not but it's been enjoyable watching it.

Anyway I've been watching to try and decide where it fits so I'm now moving it to scam accusations.

If I remember the bet correctly BFL was supposed to ship their "ASICs" on or before April 1st.

Shipping doesn't consist of walking over to the other side of the building you are in to give Luke-Jr his free ASIC. lol

And that was one unit if I recall.

The context of the bet was that BFL would be shipping "en masse" which is what Josh kept claiming would happen in the never ending Two Weeks (TM) statements he kept giving.

No, that's not what the bet said.

lol yet you provide no evidence of what it really said.

I remember clearly the bet was claimed to have been won because BFL "shipped" your unit to you which equated to them walking the unit over to you. Or was it they put your unit on your work bench (area)?

All this infighting will only lead to one thing, the collapse of the BTC core development and support group.

I hereby call for a CEASE FIRE before something really pisses someone off enough to let a virtual nuke go BOOM.

lol?

no lol

*cue serious music*

Wow, you are clueless... no, wait... CLUELESS.  Ask an EE about rollout of a new concept item sometime.  Up until then, your ignorance just shows you deserve the tin-foil hat you wear.

I may be cluesless, but you are the one in a managing position that was frustrated by his or the others incompetence while you were swapping microscope components by hand. Also the continuous delays from BFL show how good are the people that run this scammy business. Of course there are some other reasons like mining with customers hardware or selling it to someone else, but the technical and the managing skills are clearly lacking in this company.

I was asked (with hardware and pay) and declined.

should probably not say this in the i have bcp19 on /ignore...and I never read the users on /ignore in that it really really p/o's the people in question (i can tell by the many many posts to the unseen either in my direction after some posts of mine)

But to add to the above ...to further ( I really thought this was not possible that I could hold BFL in even less esteem...then was already the case..the fact that somewhere in the management of BFL they decided to HIRE Bcp19 ...well .....if that don't put a cherry on the Sundae of BFL not knowing what the hell they are doing...nothing further will imho.

heh...(i await not looking at your reply with breathless anticipation...this /ignore game only works if you don't peek! :)

Searing

"Burn testing" does not imply "actively mining at extended length" IMO.
It implies a brief period of testing to ensure the device works and doesn't fail within a few hours.

You better hope those legal documents which seem to imply their burn in was well above a few hours are wrong :P

Whether they are or aren't has no effect on me.

Anyone remember that 10k BTC bet by Matthew N. Wright? He lost and doubled everyones wager by multiplying the amount by two and putting the number into a spreadsheet. His wording was: "Post in this thread how much you're committing and I will double that amount you commit"

I just remembered that story when reading about the infamous "BFL will deliver"-bet in this thread. Pretty much the same... Of course you can say MNW was right and of course you can say BFL delivered, but, well...  Don't be surprised if no one wants to bet with you again or people are saying your credibility is going down. Because you can interpret EVERY statement in the way you want, but just because you can does not mean you should.

Quite the shameless mercenary, huh ?

[quote author = The Churchlady]
Next witness please.  Could it be ... SATAN!?
[/quote]

If I read the posts correctly in another thread Josh was the one who took the pictures thus trying to give Luke more cred.

The correct answer to this is either:
Yes, I was being paid by BFL.
or
No, I was not being paid by BFL.

A lot of units were going through testing some in the glassed room at the entrance and some in the semi trailer backed up to the loading dock where Bruce first worked when he was first hired. A whole bunch were sent to the butterfly lab's other facility (not one of their warehouses) in which Bruce should know where that one is. After the long testing period the miners were sent back to us where they were packaged and mailed out to customers. Later some of those miners starting coming back to us and were unpacked inspected and resent out to new customers. Jody handled that aspect mostly making sure the labeling was correct. Tense times it was then. Eventually there were so many people at the plant we all had trouble just working around each other. It was like a three ring circus. New product made and sent out for testing. Testing miners back at the plant to be shipped out. Miners sent out being shipped backed to be replaced and some not even opened then sent out to new people. Some of them the parts were taken off and used on other miners and the process started all over again.

Around March or early April a whole bunch of miners came back to the plant from some hosting company in KC probably because they were replaced with the upgraded models we were making. It makes perfect sense to me to replace 65nm miners with new 65nm miners now that it was explained what was REALLY produced back in February.  ::) (hope this smiley works)

This is so sad! Now I'm labeled as a scammer when all I was trying to do is help you guys. This is one reason why I can't give my real name because somebody on this forum can claim stuff about me and it will be on the internet for ever. I am so mad now!

I come here and tell the truth and am labeled a scammer. Butterfly labs misuses millions of dollars of other peoples money and is not. What kind of place is this forum anyway?

I cant imagine how much they paid PG. He is the worst troll ever and not a peep from him.

I concur that the miners were probably only tested for a few hours at their other facility (come to think of it it might have been at butterfly labs dedicated hosting companies). We put them in vans. Several days later the miners arrive at the testing facility. They are tested for a couple of hours. Then they are put back in the vans and delivered back to the plant arriving several days later. Reason? The traffic is terrible in KC. Oh My!

This sub forum and the thread being moved here does not mean you're the scammer.  I shouldn't speak for the mods but the sub this was originally in is technically for technical issues.  If the thread is about the hardware manufacture scamming it's customers then this is technically the right sub for it to be in.

It's kinda weird here, threads go massively OT and aren't moderated, some threads stay in the wrong sub for ever or too long, some get moved right away.  I think the mods do the best they can but nothing is perfect.

I wouldn't take this as the forums accusing you of being the scammer.  If I remember correctly Josh on the BFL forum said you were the scammer.  I don't remember anyone here giving a rats ass about the bitcents someone gave you.

Now I feel better. Thanks. The thread was only moved to a new section and has nothing to do with me being a scammer that was only said by Josh. But Josh said it on his forum not on this forum. Still confused but think I understand. Thanks again.

"Burn testing" should have been done on testnet. It should have produced the same results from a hardware standpoint.

I would like Luke to answer this.

But it is possible he may not.

Statements like this make me think more and more you are either more clueless than Bick or you never worked there.  There were only 2 types of units that came back from hosting... RMAs and Units customers no longer wanted hosted and were sent in to be shipped out the them.  Bick's dumb enough to believe that equipment that is still earning more than the cost of electricity to run them would be returned to be scrapped.  Then of course there's this gem:
My first thought reading this was a Wizard of Oz reference... "I don't think we're in Kansas anymore Toto" and "Lions and tigers and bears OH MY!".  But wow, even the people in customer service aren't this clueless.  Off-site testing?  Bwahahahahaha.  Your lies are getting more and more ludicrous, pretty soon you will earn that scammer tag you thought they gave you...

How will I get a scammer tag? I read and commented on some guy here who even had a hard time paying for a scammer tag. Do they really give scammer tags to people on this forum for those trying to help but not to those who work shill for a company? And why are you helping butterfly labs so much especially since you know so much more than me and can easily help the other bitcoin guys here?

I have helped more with the three days that I have been here with only 40 posts then you have with being here almost a year with your 1331 posts. 6 more posts and you would be elite status. 1 more post my me and I get a 10% discount at some restaurant located somewhere in the galaxy.

remember when they promised to do burn testing on testnet?

haha, as if it will ever happen.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             

As that Nibbknot called me a liar in another thread I withdraw my support for his story. You meany you.

You misunderstand.

First, the forum does not use scammer tags.

Second, you're the one claiming BFL are effectively scammers which is why the thread was moved here. Apart from BFL staff/affiliated people, no one here is actually calling you the scammer.

No wonder BFL and their brethren are able to operate. Critical posts that (exceed a certain threshold) about hardware companies end up moved away from the hardware forum.
Talk about selection bias. Hardware companies accused of being scams get moderated back to legitimate status.

Newbies will visit the hardware forum, see no threads about scams and think everything is safe and sound. Not that it matters at this point, I think the bad actors may have poisoned the BTC well past redemption. Time will tell.

Allowing them to advertise here is a much worse things to do than having no scams threads in the Hardware section, but you have a valid point even if the BTC isn't well past redemption. BTC will live no matter how many Inaba tards there will be out there.

Hi,
Around two weeks ago due to lack of update from Josh aka Slok, I become suspicious if only fraction of percentage of money received by BFL allocated to actual Monarch development or even fake development. The reason for this was, after almost 6 month, I havent seen any sign of proof there is an actual working monarch other that grainy video that could easily be forged.  When I asked Josh/Slok in forums to please provide solid proof of work, they just banned me.  Since you worked there, could you please confirm to best of your knowledge if there is an actual working monarch card or did they just develop chips ? Do you think their cloudmining is being done using actual monarch cards ?  Any information would be helpful.  We spent ton of real money for this stupid thing and the only update from Josh is he is on a plane and probably taking a poop in a first class toilet.

Thanks

dear BCP19 Is there actual Monarch under development or is this whole thing smoking mirrors? When I asked Josh to post proof of work, he simply banned me from BFL forums.  Apparently using logic is not a correct method of communication with bunch scam artists.  They advertised this Monarch thing 2-3 month away from production, 6 month later your company "Butterfly Labs" only produced a grainy video.  Josh latest update is on the plane... probably taking a shit in first class cabin.  Could you please provide useful information to prove there is an actual monarch development? Bunch of kids running lemonade stand would have completed this Monarch with sum of ~$100 Million received. I also think your bosses pocket around 99% of the funds and allocated around 1% to development that is why this development taking too long and or havent been able to hire talented people to actually roll this out of production.  Any valuable information from you will be helpful.

Thanks,
btw, I am an actual customer who paid real money for this Monarch.

Bunch of kids running a lemonade stand are not plagued with greed. If there is a monarch, and I do not doubt there will be a piece of shit in a box labelled a monarch, it will take an extreme amount of time to receive, while you watch Josh's online circus. But don't worry, they usually give you some type of coupon on their next piece of shit in a box.

… in the end, its all smoking mirrors man.  ;)

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_XP31g6bQ8f8/TEAFSoCDbJI/AAAAAAAAAVw/-h6SJaRG6pw/S900-R/Blog+Header+70dpi.jpg

Yes, we are trying to finalize development now.  dropt has said he's an EE, so this is for you:  I'm a tech, not an engineer, I test and troubleshoot, I don't design, I may not know the 'PC' words for this phase of development.  I will give you this though... 300 amps at .6v... maybe now you understand the problem...

So you still don't have a handle on the heat dissipation on the boards yet?  Thanks for sharing that development tidbit.

Looks like Two Weeks™ then.

Good to know that BFL's top asshole shill PCB technician/engineer is on the job, working tirelessly to ensure "the problem..." gets solved as quickly as possible*

_{*When he isn't trolling the fuck out of bitcoin forums. One must set priorities, after all.}

reserved

The fact is BFL has lied and lied and lied. THIS IS A FACT
Some Ex staff member comes here and tells us possible things that have been going on for the last 10 months,(You have agreed are partially true) thats much more than BFL has told us with there lies
And Bfl expect us to believe them now,
 Come clean and show us what you have been doing for the last 10 months with all our money and stop the lies

Thank you BCP12 for this bit of information.  Josh has failed to provide any tangible proof of actual development perhaps because he doesn't know how to make walk through video but he and Nasser are good at login in as Slok in BFL forum banning and censoring legitimate customer questions or login as fake customers almost as if they are playing with themselves in public forum (BFL forum).

I am EE myself but I have ton of respect for Technicians because many of my own techs are 100 times smarter and sharper than myself. Do you think you would be able to post a walk through video of working monarch to ease some doubt. Walk through video is simply connecting unplugged monarch, plugin it in, and start hashing while being followed with a simple cell phone video? 

I afraid if BFL can not even make descent walk through video as a proof of work, how the heck they are building this Monarch.  Hopefully you can ease some of these questions.

Thanks,
Sean

I think that the Habanero is running 600+ watts through a single board. 4 6 pin power plugs.
It gets pretty dang hot.

Just as a comparison.

I encourage BCP19 to help uncover BFL mysteries and scams. All these HW operating #s probably meaningless if this Monarch turns out to be an imaginary development or smoking mirrors.  FBI knocking on doors of BFL, Josh, Nasser is RSN any day now.

I believe you are meaning to use the metaphor "smoke and mirrors".

Exactly, Yep, I mean no magic tricks or fake videos etc.  I dont have anything against their technicians or employees, they are just doing their job.  But their board of directors are bunch of tricksters.

Sean you are obviously newish here I'll assume by activity.
Did you choose BFL because all the posts/threads/everything on forum was hidden, moved or deleted.
Not being negative regarding you, It just would be good to get clear clarification that the forum could be doing alot more to assist people in not getting screwed by these people that have been running the same trick for what 1.5 years now ?

I know the forum doesnt hold peoples hands... but jeeesus christ. come on.. help a little...

Habaneros are capable of pulling about 800W readily, with around 90% efficient phased VRMs outputting around 900mV. Assuming 90% conversion to 0.9V that's 800A of low-volt DC. 300A at 0.6V isn't actually too hard to pull off reliably. Just saying, but every other ASIC manufacturer has accomplished that or better in a heck of a lot less time.

Absolutely I appreciate the question specially by senior members or moderators such as yourself hopefully to make possible tweaks for future customers. But first little demographic about myself: Technologist, software architect, robotic hobbyist, internet sway, and reverse engineer, and of course a crypto currency fan as of 8 month ago.  

I am dumb but not too dumb nevertheless fell in Butterfly Labs trap for following reasons:

 1- I did research them for scam including most other big players. They all equally had several # of complaints, but I didnt find major law suites that I could pin point or they all had similar allegations.
 2- BFL was located in US.  I figured worse case scenario I be dealing with a company in US than China or Europe.
 3- I noticed many good reviews on BFL Singles on youtube, and even saw ads such as this one that they being sold in retail such as Tigerdirect & Walmart.  For example see this one: http://www.walmart.com/ip/34952957?wmlspartner=wlpa&adid=22222222227023099684&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=36174013381&wl4=&wl5=pla&wl6=65388671101&veh=sem
 4- They accept USD, in addition to Bitcoin.  Most others would take bitcoin which I didnt have.


What I didn't know or just realized several weeks ago was the fact that they pocket 99% of funds received and allocate less than 1% to development, which is the reason for super late development.  I used to think the complex technology was a contributing factor, and didnt know they under fund development.  Also I didnt realize their board members are bunch of Jackass running ponzi scheme with hardware.

I even searched top 10 bitcoin miner in google and landed in PC Magazine or Toms Hardware and BFL was right on top.

I think what this forum or similar could do to help is a recommended manufacture link and rated by trusted senior members like your selves.  I am sure such link probably exist but perhaps buried or crowded with many posts.  I guess clean list of scam alerts for member and or manufacture, that is easy to locate would be very helpful and could reduce number of people falling in this trap.

I am also twitting some of my findings to reporters who apparently interviewing BFL and using appropriate # hashtag to help expose these jackasses whenever I get a chance.  As you would see in Josh twitter.  However I am doing it based on facts also copying FBI and KC police, in case they actually read the tweets.

Hope this help.

Thanks
Sean

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=456691.msg5035154#msg5035154

Excellent I wish I saw this before.  Great link to be pinned on top of the forums.  I recommend manufacture complete name be used accompanied by their abbreviation.  i.e. Butterfly Labs (BFL).  I just sent PM to Dogie for this tiny edits. 

Thanks for the link Intron

The Habanero actually has 4 6 phase VRMs compared to 2 6 phase VRMs on the Monarch.  Each of the 4 VRMs are tested to 300A but only operate in the 100-150 amp range.  If you have a copper trace with .0001 ohms of resistance, 100A is 1 watt of power loss, 150 is 1.25 watts.  Compare that to 300 amps... 9 watts of power loss.  So the Habanero has 4-5 watts of heat compared to 18 watts of heat if it's traces have the same resistance as the Monarch.  Then compare the voltage/resistance to hit the amps... R=E/I or .9/100-150 (.006-.009 ohms) vs .6/300 (.002 ohms).  .0001 ohms is 1.1-1.6% added resistance compared to 5%.  .9v becomes .909-.911v compared to .6 becoming .63v to get the needed voltage to the chips over the added resistance line.  More voltage becomes more heat, more heat becomes more resistance, more resistance becomes more amps... Designing a .9V VRM is much easier than a .6V one.

I can confirm this also :)
Power is (yet again) an issue.

Small correction, 150A through 0.1mOhm is 2.25W because P=R*I^2 but I'm guessing that was a typo.

So what you're saying is, you've been working for at least two months (or ten, somewhere in there) to design a VRM that isn't as good, to push power through traces that aren't as good. When did y'all find out you needed to be able to source 180A at 0.6V? Because that would have been a pretty good time to design the PCB with heavier traces.

Deja Vu BFL, Did the same f*ck up you did with the 65nm line. I looked up "Stupid" and there was BFL.

Obviously you don't know the US laws very good because you are better off with a company from China or Europe than the ones from US which at this moment have a very "good" record of 100% failed companies out of all bitcoin hardware manufacturers. The US laws clearly protect the lying and scamming businesses, NOT the customers.


Welcome to the BitcoinTalk forum where it's a Free For All land. While there is logic in what you say it's not Admins/Moderators job to warn you about scams and you should make your own research (which you did). Add Reddit too next time, but a simple look over the Hardware forum and you could've saw the BFL threads. At least it was a lesson learned and next time you will do it better.

Here you can find a guide: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=456691.0



ArsTechnica had a good article http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/04/digging-for-answers-the-strong-smell-of-fraud-from-one-bitcoin-miner-maker/

Twitting to reporters is okish. Better go and tell your story to Sonny's officer who is likely to put him back to jail and maybe Josh Zerlan too for deceiving their customers.

Yes, that was a typo.  The point is still valid though.  The problem is one of how do you test a circuit when you need a device capable of handling massive power at very very low resistance?  I don't know of an available resistive load capable of duplicating the ASIC chip in operation.  .002 ohm resistors capable of handling 300 amps are not something you can order at the local electronics store.  Maybe that is why other companies went the route of dozens to hundreds of chips instead of just two.  As to when, it was towards the end of last month when Josh posted we needed heavier traces.  He actually has been very transparent about what is going on.  The problem is this community doesn't believe anything and is forever looking for the ulterior motive. 

Bingo sir;)

I don't think that's an excuse for delivering hardware 12 months late.

The posts about the Monarch really sound identically to the posts which we saw with the 65 nm prodcuts. "Just a small tweak", "we are almost there", "minor PCB modification", "oh, another firmware tweak", "small problems with VRM", "adding clock buffers" etc. etc... In the end all those very minor problems sum up to 12 months.

And BFL insisted the Monarch will not have any delays because of the experience from the 65 nm products. You must have learned a lot.

While I'm looking at the landing page: "The Competition - at least $ 17.50 /GH". What?

The Antminers S1 last price was 1.3 $/GH/s. Your Monarch is two times more expensive. The Antminer was already deliverd. There is no sign that the Monarch will be delivered anytime soon.

The BFL homepage is full of deception. Why does BFL need that? Other vendors just sell hardware, why can't BFL do that?

I built a 300A-capable watercooled adjustable active dummy load in my basement in a couple weeks for stress-testing our 200A-capable PSU interface boards. Mind you it's designed to operate at 12V nominal but would probably work below 1V (I think the main limitation is low-side current sense resistors limiting my minimum voltage to .625V at a full 300A draw) but if one guy can do that, a multi-million-dollar business can figure out how to do sink 300A. Bolting 20 of http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/WSBS8518L1000JK/WSBSA-.0001-ND/2421966 together in series for .002ohm 720W-capable would be a good start for under $200 if you wanted a fixed load. Stick 'em in an oil bucket or something.

Anecdote: I wanted to be a good patriotic citizen and "Buy American" by supporting Butterfly Labs. One of the biggest commercial mistakes of my life and really opened my eyes to how corrupt things have been allowed to become in this country.

Never again will patriotism guide my purchasing decisions as a result.

Good point...  but the only thing we make these days is babies most other things pretty much made in China.  Kidding aside, I wont buy anymore miner, but if I do, I sure come to this forum to get some intelligent advice from you guys.  I love that link Dogie posted about Manufacture reports.  I think it should be cleaned up a bit and broadcast by senior members.  I am doing my tweeting but I am a peon compared to you guys.  That would help a lot of people.  Note BFL stuff being sold in retail, what people dont know these guys pocket almost all the funds and their preorders take forever to build.  That real problem is their greed stealing all the money and they dont adequately fund their dev and customer service teams.  Which means they dont really give a FU#$ when their customers get product or they mine with the Miners customer paid.  Luckily I havent used their RMA thank goodness. 

I'm an American manufacturer but please don't be scared to buy our stuff. I like to think that how BFL does business is not representative of American business in general (though, realistically...) I look to my uncle's die casting company for inspiration - he and half a dozen other guys left a crappy outfit because the management weren't allowing them to make their products better, so they started their own business and within a few years were doing more work (and better) because they actually put focus on doing the job right and taking care of the customer. That's what American business is supposed to do. Thanks for crapping the rest of us, BFL.

From what I understand BFL is owned by Sonny who once left the US to try to start a new country in Costa Rica selling memberships for thousands of dollars and from there ripped off the elderly mostly in the US with his lottery scheme because they are an easy mark. Now that he's back in the US he found easier marks to buy his money machines that I and Bruce and a bunch of Mexicans that were eaten by a Chupacabra help built.

The only part of the above that may or not be true is the Chupacabra part and I'm starting to wonder about that because Bruce, who now has me on ignore, never denied it. Speaking of Bruce, remember when I told you guys that Josh is Bi? Well, so is Bruce. You can put two and two together so I don't have to.

Because that is what works and because BFL couldn't get it right on the first try EVER

Sidehack products rule.

I have a box of them!

Explains so much.

Just wondering... PG, is nibbknot your sockpuppet?

I posted before that I am not PG and don't have sockpuppets (had to look it up to make sure it meant what I thought it meant which is other accounts). Don't know if PG does but ask him. And why do people keep asking me this?

1) You're obviously hiding your identity
2) PG is awfully quiet lately
3) It seems PG would have access to the information you have
4) PG apparantly got paid off to stop ragging on BFL
5) Then PG of course wouldn't be able to keep this info quiet for too long... Making a sock puppet to get the info out seems par for the course on this forum.
6) Your writing style is quite different, but there are still some characteristics that I would attribute to PG

1. I don't want BFL to know who I am that is why I'm hiding my ID.
2. No way for me to address this one.
3. If PG is the bearded guy name Bruno (didn't know his name then) then how would he have as much info as me when I worked there and he was only there one morning?
4. Don't know anything about this.
5. I'm confused. Did he make this sockpuppet or did I make his you're claiming?
6. I guess I could take time to edit my writing so that it's not as close to his or make it closer whatever the case may be but I opted to just write what comes to mind and as simple as possible.
7. I have crossed dress once but that was in high school.
8. I don't cuss much because I'm a little relegious. (why the fuck can't I spell that word right?)

Hope this covers that.

You write like him

VERY similar:
writing style (use of sarcastic humour and lots of meme's)
post formatting
thread topics of interest

He knew BCP19's first name and that he worked at BFL, nothing else he claims about BF Labs has been substantiated yet.

It doesn't matter much at this point anyway, OP is currently unwilling or unable to substantiate his claims (either for legitimate reasons or for some other ones).

Do I believe BFL are up to no good and could be mining the hell out of customer gear, or shipping to industrial client and generally lying through their teeth? ABSOLUTELY I believe that, but we have no hard evidence of it yet so it's all still speculation at this point.

Do I believe OP is PG, yes but again until something he claims can be substantiated it doesn't much matter.

Nibb, whomever you are, thank you for the information about BCP.  As for the rest I think most people here just want the truth and while most people suspect or would not be surprised if most of your claims were true we simply shouldn't use your unsubstantiated information as evidence.

It is him.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=405986.msg7531748#msg7531748

nibbknot == bcp19?  OR is PG nibbknot making a post to make it appear to be bcp19?
ahhh… damn the internet and these stupid names that have no meaning or faces behind them.  ;D

Oh, hell no. That's some funny shit. I haven't seen it that bad since the argument between Garr and Josh over Garr's shipment. Both of them were posting from so many socks at once that they were forgetting which one to use. LOL

Ho Lee Fuk says have a nice flight.

The drama of Bitcoin continues...

This whole thread explain so much about why I still haven't received my order from November last year.
Thank you all who have posted.

And yes the drama continues. lol

Bruce quit wasting his breath ~6 months later:


It's been proven that he still lurks using one of his many sockpuppets.

FTFY.

No? Its 4 months ago, and 6 months after the quoted message. GG was right originally.

I have no idea why I added "ago" later.  ::)

Best thread ever.

So convincing that not only did Sonny Vleisides go nutsy-coo-coo over it, but a judge subpoenaed this forum to release any and all information pertaining to this ex-BFL employee using the moniker nibbknot.

Here's nibbknot taking a break from his duties at BFL in the break room.

https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fc4.staticflickr.com%2F8%2F7475%2F15854433751_4739a5bf7a_z.jpg&t=552&c=oeFgQVyqE6XBAg

Here's nibbknot at one of BFL's board meetings. Note the Essential Employee, Bruce Peterson, sitting to nibbknot's left.

https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fs11.postimg.org%2Fxs0lg473n%2Fimage.jpg%26t%3D550%26c%3D8HIGAMhuP_Wr6A&t=551&c=nkKehDOK2ZJEug

Haha, fucked em all.

All of the BFL employees except the bearded guy look completely gay. I can imagine them dancing together at a gay club. lol

Okay, so this guy has many sockpuppets, which we cant obviously stop.

But, what the hell happened with BFL, whats their judgment last time I check it was raided and SEC and all this commotion which was good for us, since most of us got screwed on pre-orders.

This is the thread to go to for that information (that Xian01 kindly supplies): https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1022931.0

I am a huge fan of nibbknot. h/t to that fuckin' geniuss!

i just went to that thread, its intresting how they have the mining pool still up?

Like wtf? And they also launched a charity at the same time laying off people?

And I bet bcp19 shit all over himself, the one thing that he knows best. Blue Crappy Pants a very fitting name for him  ;D

After all this time, this thread was just moved to the Scam Section.