So, given that we need high difficulty shares, what stops p2pool from using not what a miner produces in a day, but in a week? This would require some more storage, maybe some more calcs, but should smooth out miner's variance. Am I wrong as usual?  spiccioli No not wrong but: a) it will require a hard fork b) it will mean new users see reduced compensation for 7 days until they have the expected # of shares based on their hashing power. Maybe 72 hours would be a good compromise for "b" but you still have the issue of "a". DAT, if a hard fork is the cost, I'd pay it. Having less miner variance would encourage people to switch to p2pool, I think. spiccioli |
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So, I understand variance and all, but is it normal for me to have 3 hour stretches with no p2pool shares found with 2.4 GH/s and expected time to share of 20 minutes?
I have incoming peers, Local hashrate is also about right, local dead on arrival are about 1-2%, efficiency is usually right around 100% or higher.
Is there something off somewhere or is this just variance again?
My node was getting all your luck!  I couldn't run my miners for most of yesterday, but had someone mining on it at about 500Mhash/s for most of the day and they found 6 shares in the time it took me to go for lunch  In all seriousness though, if what you describe's happened for a few days in a row, I'd be really concerned. If it's one day, meh, probably really bad variance. It seems to me that we need some way to mitigate the double variance to which p2pool miners are subject. We have pool as a whole variance, but also miner variance, for example today my payouts were are lower than those of two days ago even if the pool as a whole has more or less the same hashing power. So, given that we need high difficulty shares, what stops p2pool from using not what a miner produces in a day, but in a week? This would require some more storage, maybe some more calcs, but should smooth out miner's variance. Am I wrong as usual? spiccioli |
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Ciao, ho aggiunto la possibilita' di vedere i grafici dei minatori che accedono al punto di ingresso. Per finire nel grafico occorre usare un indirizzo bitcoin valido come username (dove arriveranno i pagamenti) e graph come parola d'ordine. I grafici (sono quelli standard che produce p2pool) sono visibili all'indirizzo: http://p2pool.soon.it:9332/graphs/spiccioli. |
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Hi, I've added graphs to my entry point, you need to use the bitcoin address for payments as username and graph as password to be able to see your worker/s at http://p2pool.soon.it:9332/graphs/spiccioli. |
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No you shouldn't have to port anything. PyPy should just work with normal Python code. It's simply a different implementation of the standard Python interpreter. No difference in the language it interprets, just how it does it.
For one thing it has a built-in Just-in-time compiler powered by LLVM, which means that instead of the writers of a Python implementation needing to worry about how to create an efficient Just-in-time compiler, the work of people from the LLVM project, who are already experts in constructing such a compiler, can be leveraged.
This made me curious, so I am running p2pool with pypy as we speak. It seems to be working fine, but I'll watch it for a day or two and see if there are any abnormalities. twmz, I've used pypy for a couple of days, it works ok, I don't see a big difference in CPU usage compared to python, but it has a problem: it is not compatible with pygame so you cannot show/generate graphs. spiccioli |
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Bene, mi hai convinto... "ci riprovo"..  Mi ha convinto il fatto (che non avevo pensato) della possibilità che si trovi il blocco tra di noi... Pensa con con il mio "misero" 1280 Gh/s ho già preso 2 blocchi in una pool... culetto e basta direi Mi sistemo un'attimo e in questi giorni switch da te... vediamo che succede. Intanto ti sparo 100,000 shares a 10.000 Gh/s che partono entro qualche ora Ciao a presto EDIT: Prevedi di fare qualche statistica...? sono un appassionato e restare con dubbi mi rattrista un po... Al momento non ancora, intendo con le statistiche, ci sto pensando per il caso che in effetti qualcuno si colleghi Per il fatto del blocco, chi trova il blocco ha un premio aggiuntivo, mi pare di mezzo BTC o di 1/4, io non ne ho ancora trovati. spiccioli |
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Yes, I understand the percentage of actually seeing some if not any shares are; the thing that confuses me is how am I able to show accepted on the miner when my pool doesn't show any shares, unless it's mining so low that the pool already is on another block. :\
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/P2Pool#Frequently_Asked_QuestionsQ: Why does my miner say it has found a lot of shares but p2pool say I have only found a few?! A: The real P2Pool difficulty is hundreds of times higher than on normal pools, but p2pool essentially lies to your miner and tells it to work on relatively easy shares so that it submits shares every few seconds instead of every few hours. P2Pool then ignores any submitted shares that don't match the real share difficulty. By doing this, P2Pool can more accurately report your local hash rate and you can see if you are having problems with too many stale shares quickly twmz, question: could p2pool use difficulty 1 shares to calc miner payout instead of using high difficulty ones? This should lower miner's variance and still be able to use high difficulty shares to solve blocks. spiccioli No. First high difficulty shares aren't used to solve a block. They aren't used for anything other than payouts. They need to be high to keep avg time between shares ~ 10 seconds. For example if p2pool uses 1 difficulty shares instead of 0.1 shares per second it would have 60 shares per second. The sharechain would simply collapse under the weight of dozens of forks a second. Shares are completely worthless (in terms of real value). This applies to any pool. You don't work towards a block. You either solve it or you don't. If you don't the hash produced is worthless. Pools simply use shares to record how much work was attempted and thus determine a fair split. Thanks DAT, I was missing (I didn't completely understand) this issue. I was thinking that using a higher "sampling frequency" could give a better estimate of miner contribution to the pool. I was wrong spiccioli. |
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Yes, I understand the percentage of actually seeing some if not any shares are; the thing that confuses me is how am I able to show accepted on the miner when my pool doesn't show any shares, unless it's mining so low that the pool already is on another block. :\
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/P2Pool#Frequently_Asked_QuestionsQ: Why does my miner say it has found a lot of shares but p2pool say I have only found a few?! A: The real P2Pool difficulty is hundreds of times higher than on normal pools, but p2pool essentially lies to your miner and tells it to work on relatively easy shares so that it submits shares every few seconds instead of every few hours. P2Pool then ignores any submitted shares that don't match the real share difficulty. By doing this, P2Pool can more accurately report your local hash rate and you can see if you are having problems with too many stale shares quickly twmz, question: could p2pool use difficulty 1 shares to calc miner payout instead of using high difficulty ones? This should lower miner's variance and still be able to use high difficulty shares to solve blocks. spiccioli |
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We should create a custom mining script that uses all of the pools in this thread (picking one at random for example) and using the others as a failover.
Could be an easy+convenient way to bring more gh/s to p2pool mining.
Shadow383, I think it is better if miners can choose the entry points that are closer to them instead of a random one on the other side of the world. spiccioli. |
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Your estimation was zero, because the bitcoin node wasn't up yet, to tell the server the difficulty, to tell you the reward estimation.
All services are up, it should be correct now.
redditorrex, yes, they're ok now. thanks. spiccioli. |
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Ho usato p2pool per 4 mesi e alla fine ho abbandonato, non tanto per l'idea che mi intriga molto ed è coerente con il progetto btc, ma per il fatto che è la pool più sfortunata che mi sia mai capitato.
Il suo pool luck da quando esiste è al 90.6%
Detto questo sono felice di questa novità che non sapevo e se ritorno sicuramente sarà da te!
Grazie, ciao
Ciao ziomik, si, c'e' stato un gran parlare nel thread del p2pool circa la "sfiga" del pool, ma nessuno e' riuscito a dimostrare che ci siano altri problemi dietro. D'altra parte, io mino dallo scorso maggio, sono stato su slush e btcguild e per entrambi ci sono dubbi che alleggerissero i compensi dei minatori e io con loro ho minato per mesi e non ho mai, ripeto mai, ottenuto quanto qualsiasi calcolatore diceva avrei dovuto ottenere. Avevo 7 BTC dentro quando hanno hackerato BTCServ.net e li ho persi, tanto per fare un altro esempio. Con p2pool tutto questo non e' semplicemente possibile, il pool sei tu, non c'e' un "operatore" dietro ne' un wallet da fregare (se non il tuo ) Certo, se usi un punto di ingresso come il mio dipendi anche dal punto di ingresso, ma: - puoi metterne un secondo di backup, cosi' se uno e' giu' il minatore si sposta sull'altro
- l'indirizzo che usi finisce nella coinbase del blocco, ovvero se il blocco e' risolto dal pool quei BTC (o parte di) e' tua da subito (devi solo aspettare che maturino).
Io oggi ho meta' dei miei MH/s su abcpool e l'altra meta' su p2pool, cosi' quando c'e' un giorno che p2pool produce di meno, recupero un po' su abc, ma l'altro giorno, per dire, p2pool ha trovato sei blocchi, oggi e' gia' a tre... Tieni anche presente che nell'ultimo mese tra versioni di p2pool incompatibili, cambio di protocollo della rete p2pool, incompatibilita' tra p2pool e bitcoind 6rc1 si e' ballato un po' e la cosa ha un po' danneggiato il pool stesso (ed era a questo che mi riferivo quando sopra dicevo che occorre un po' di sbattimento per restare su p2pool). In ogni caso, sul mio o su un altro punto di ingresso, l'importante e' che tutti provino a spostare un po' dei loro hash verso p2pool e non tanto per il 1/2 BTC di fee ogni 100 minati (da coloro che usano il punto d'accesso) che potrebbe restare a chi apre questi accessi, quanto per consentire a tutti di provare facilmente e, soprattutto, per aumentare la potenza del pool stesso che significa minor variabilita' per tutti quelli che lo usano. spiccioli. ps. Il p2pool e' piu' "cattivo" di un PPS, per esempio, in caso di potenze di calcolo piccole e/o di minatura saltuaria, ma se hai da 300 MH/s in su che vanno tutto il giorno non ci dovrebbero proprio essere problemi. |
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Ciao a tutti, immagino sappiate di p2pool, ovvero del pool decentralizzato con zero fee e peer-to-peer cosi' come bitcoin. Bene, fino a oggi "agganciarsi" al p2pool richiedeva un po' di lavoro, installare dei programmi... niente di che, ovviamente, ma una scocciatura nel caso si volesse solo provare a vedere com'e' e poi tornare indietro. Non e' piu' cosi', da un po' di tempo dei nodi della rete che costituisce il pool p2pool si sono aperti verso l'esterno e accettano minatori esterni al nodo stesso. Oggi ho aggiunto il mio nodo a questo elenco, il nodo si trova in Italia, a Torino, e quindi per un italiano dovrebbe essere piu' rapido rispetto a un nodo americano. Qui potete trovare l'elenco dei nodi attivi https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=66182.0Per accedere a un nodo p2pool occorre usare come username un indirizzo bitcoin valido e come password dei caratteri qualsiasi. Occhio anche che quando si usa p2pool si e' soggetti a una maggiore variabilita' nell'entita' dei pagamenti, e' un po' come minare in solitario: a volte si raccoglie molto, altri giorni di meno o niente. Quindi se provate a minare sul p2pool (in solitaria o agganciandosi a uno dei nodi di cui sopra) conviene farlo per almeno tre-quattro giorni e poi fare la media giornaliera di quanto si e' prodotto. Bene, per entrare nel mio nodo occorre configurare un minatore facendolo puntare a: http://p2pool.soon.it:9332/come nome utente bisogna usare un indirizzo bitcoin valido (occhio che altrimenti non riceverete alcun pagamento!) e la password puo' essere qualsiasi cosa, due tre caratteri, che so "ciao". Il mio punto d'accesso fa pagare lo 0,5% di fee. Per un approfondimento sul p2pool: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=18313.0spiccioli. |
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Hi all,
here is an Europe/Italy p2pool entry point
Turin :: Italy :: p2pool.soon.it:9332 :: 0.5% :: BTC :: p2pool :: spiccioli
spiccioli
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My balance is intact too Oh ye of little faith, why did you doubt? I'm investigating the issue future with our ISP. The box is up, but mining is down. Withdraws are disabled, but the balance looks fine. I'm moving funds off server just in case. I will let you guys know of any new information. redditorrex, Balance ? Processing ? Estimation ? Round Work ? Payee Address
BitCoin 0.49450961 0.00000000 0 22237
something is wrong I think, I have work but estimation is 0. spiccioli |
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How common is this error? I'm trying to get all my machines mining to a single p2pool wallet by running it on my windows VPS, but I get this error quite frequently: http://i40.tinypic.com/119cj7s.pngCommon. Don't use bitcoin-gt (GUI client) use bitcoind (command line daemon). I have never seen bitcoind crash. DAT, if you're on Linux, bitcoind on windows crashes as well, even if a little less than bitcoin-qt. spiccioli |
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With the improvements the bitcoinj team have made to downloading blocks, Multibit downloads around 1000 blocks a minute on a vanilla WiFi. (It does not save the transactions to disk so it is not doing as much work as the Satoshi client).
I think of it as roughly 1 minute of download for 1 week of blocks.
I haven't really looked at memory size optimisation but think it uses around 100MB RAM when running 4 peers and half a dozen wallets.
Edit: Just had a quick look. On a Mac with 12 wallets open, 4 peers it uses 133.5MB RAM.
jim618 I've just downloaded it, I did not know it existed before your message. It is great! The only missing feature being encrypted wallets! spiccioli |
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ztex,
I'd like to ask you a question about your bulk pricing, in particular, if I buy, for example, 25 units, do I pay them 229 EUR each (so the total is 229 * 25), or do I pay the first four 309, then the next four 284 and so on?
thanks.
spiccioli
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Oh well, I'm from the other side of this world, anyway just sent a little tip to show my appreciation for your efforts. spiccioli. |
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wait, it should have longer timeouts for longer rounds, if a round lasts less than 10 seconds the miner will throw away current getwork anyway, so while does it limit RollNTime to 10 seconds?
You can always modify your code (see doesn't open source rock) or maybe it can be added as a parameter but there might be unforeseen implications of an ultra long NTime that should be tested before adjusting the default network wide. Most pools have an NTime of 60 sec or less and that is on chains with an average LP interval of 300 sec (BTC/NMC merged mining) or 600 sec (BTC only). There likely should be some testing before changing NTime to larger than expected LP interval. Lots of different miner software out there and they may make some assumptions/optimizations which may clash with NTime > expected LP interval. Maybe not but given the small impact and low priority of a change testing seems wise. Maybe I am just a code coward. DeathAndTaxes, I was wrong as well in the way I thought RollNTime works https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Getwork#rollntimeIt seems to me now that 10 (seconds) is a good value for p2pool rounds. spiccioli |
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