I believe this thread is about you: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=437465.0

While I did acknowledge that there should be difference between trademark/copyright law and what would apply to Bitcoin, no I had not heard of that case as I am not a lawyer nor have I ever studied the law (other than to learn the lingo to win approval of a woman's father, but thats another story). But something does not sound right about your claim. If I was to change the Bitcoin code, and then redistribute it as allowed under an open source license, that would require essentially a 51% attack to successfully change the existing Bitcoin protocol. I don't see how there could be more than one official Bitcoin at any given time. If your fork was accepted and went through, that would then be Bitcoin and the old fork would not.

Maybe I'm not thinking of this the right way, but I cant put into logic how there could be two completely identical but seperate entities. If we define Bitcoin by its genesis block or blockchain surely there is no other way there could be another Bitcoin. If someone sues you for the theft of 10 Bitcoins, you couldn't make your own Bitcoin fork and send them your own 10 Bitcoins, as the network wouldn't accept it and your legal obligation wouldn't be fulfilled.

At this point, this more appropriate belongs in Bitcoin Discussion, however I am intrigued. If there is something I'm not understanding, I'd like to learn it, but I can't comprehend how what you are saying would make any sort of physical sense.

mmm looking back on this, I probably should have taken the 32 BTC offer I received, and ran with it.

I use the term donated loosely, be it time or money, people came here for Bitcoins. The Alt Coin section was added later with the invention of the early Alt Coins, just as a place to move threads from Bitcoin mining discussion to their own section.

The point is, the people that actually come here for Bitcoin info, or to discuss Bitcoin are being negatively effected by the Alt Coin section. Obviously, we don't want to remove the Alt Coin section as a whole, because then we will have the problem of people posting Alt Coin stuff back in with Bitcoin discussion. However the issue as of late is how Giveaway threads have far outspammed anything else, and leak out to the rest of the forum in a variety of ways. Although I'm not entirely sure if this thread is about that or not.

I had counted around 600 until I gave up about two weeks ago. The number may be slightly skewed, as I was just counting names that I hadn't heard before, and didn't investigate further to find out if some of the coins were jokes and never actually released.

My guess would be between 500 and 700 actually exist or have existed.

If we are strictly talking about legal definitions, and no longer discussing anything to do with the forum, you may be incorrect there. Assuming we are talking about Common Law jurisdiction, with Crypto Currencies being a thing that could not be precidented based on previous cases, a judge would try to draw connections to somewhat similar cases, in other words Software name and branding cases.

If a software comes out under a MIT/X11 License called "Duck" obviously they cannot patent or trademark the word "Duck" they can trademark logos, but that is unimportant for this example. Under the MIT/X11 license as you posted, people are free to make whatever modifications they wish. However! If someone decides to make another competing software that performs the same task as "Duck" and then they name it "Duck" the creators of the original "Duck" could indeed sue. If they decided to name it "Duck2.0" they could also sue, claiming that the name infringes on their software and confuses brand confusion. Now if they decide to name it "Goose" techincally if the software is close enough, "Duck" may still have a case against it, however that would depend on other circumstances and how good one's lawyers are.

Bitcoin is a SHA based Crypto Currency created by Satoshi Nakamoto in 2009. If a coin has any other description other than that, it is not Bitcoin. It can be a Bitcoin derivative, but you could not claim under any jurisdiction, that another coin is also Bitcoin. The MIT/X11 License gives people the rights to edit the Bitcoin source and create their own coins under other names, but should someone make Bitcoin2.0, Satoshi could techincally sue them over it, again not that he would.

None of that applies to the forum in anyway, but if Satoshi decided to indentify themself or themselves, while they would not have legal authority over Litecoin, Namecoin, etc etc, they would have legal authority over anyone who tried to misrepresent themselves as Bitcoin, in a way that infringes on his/her/their intellectual property. Satoshi designed Bitcoin for everyone, but everyone did not create Bitcoin.

Mayhaps, but I trust the OP to do their own research based on specific regulation that applies to where they are.

As I said, last time I asked, it was legal for me to sell Venison Jerky for Bitcoin from Wisconsin, as my family are big hunters and were taking 30+ deer per year (legally through crop damage). You can't sell it for USD, but you can "barter" for it which is what Bitcoin fell under at the time. There are also exceptions to that rule as well. You can go to a local farm stand and buy wild game in some states, you can donate wild game to food banks, etc. It is really up to the OP to look into what they are doing and make sure they keep it legal, else they will get pinched.

I was looking to do this same thing a year or two ago, at the time Bitcoin wasn't considered a legitimate currency, so it wasn't technically selling it. I don't know what the laws regarding it now are, but thats assuming it is even a problem if 1) you are in the U.S, and 2) It isn't farm raised deer (which can be legally sold)

I'd hope that you don't hunt unethically, but as far as the poaching allegation, thats a bit absurd at this point. The OP said:


They didn't say, I have as much deer as you want on demand, although some states (assuming you are in the U.S) don't have limits on how many deer you can shoot per year. I'd hope that the OP doesn't poison anyone, but there really isn't enough evidence to claim any wrongdoing at this point.

Well first, you can protect the name Bitcoin, by not mining/using other coin's named Bitcoin to your question above.

Second, the question to ban Scrypt Bitcoin or not to ban scrypt bitcoin came up over a month earlier (Staff forum)


At that point, I just asked that people put disclaimers make sure people were clear when saying Bitcoin vs Scrypt Bitcoin. There were issues with threads that said 1000 BITCOIN GIVEAWAY! And such, that was the preliminary issue. It was September 11th when I found out about the Dev's warning that the coin could overwrite SHA Bitcoin data,


Which is consistent with the date that I posted the ban in the first place. That leads me to believe, that we were concerned about the use of Bitcoin's name for a month before banning the coin for its potential threat. Really not that it matters to me anyway, knowing what I know now, I would disallow Scrypt Bitcoin again in a heartbeat, just because its annoying to be constantly confused as to what people are talking about. For example, if someone makes a 1 BTC bet with you, you win, and then pays you a scrypt BTC, its a pain in the ass.

I just want to make sure you guys know that even a decision as trivial as that, there was a month's worth of discussion. We don't just throw around bans on content willy nilly. Scrypt Bitcoin posed to be a massive inconvience for the forum users in general, and the moderation team, and the fact that we even allowed Scrypt Bitcoin for that month actually baffles me now. That being said, if there was that much discussion and lenience in a single coin, imagine how bad it would have had to be to put the smackdown on Giveaways of all types.




I couldn't say it better myself. We oppose censorship, but really there is a line that we must draw using our best judgement. Else no one would be able to post anything. I wont argue any Alt Coin's right to exist, that is solely up to the free market, however the Bitcointalk Admins and Mods are in charge of what content is allowed on their site. The "libertarian" policies are based on the owner's beliefs, not some fundamental or protected right. So if someone gets censored, we are accountable to ourselves and the rest of the staff, and we will give each other a hell of a hard time if a mistake is made and not fixed.

And I disagree with your statement based on my first post you have linked. It did have to do with the name, the name is the reason it was supposed to overwrite. Quite frankly, until the Coin Developer gave it the go ahead, saying it was safe, I didn't trust that the supporters weren't just lying to get it unbanned.


The original coin release from the developer on Cryptocointalk:



It was then later changed to:


which was when it was unbanned. Believe me, I actually appreciate that you are looking for real context and support rather than just making wild claims, but despite a lot of other's opinion not to allow Scrypt Bitcoin, I removed the ban once the developer released that it would not harm your SHA Bitcoin wallet. I knew quite well that even though we disliked the coin, it was junk and would die.

Well first off, it wasn't malware, the official spokesperson for the coin developer put out a warning, that since they didn't change the name of the coin at all, it was just called Bitcoin, both Scrypt Bitcoin and SHA Bitcoin would be saved to the same location, so if people didn't pay attention, their SHA Bitcoin wallets and saved data would be overwritten. That turned out to be false, which is when we lifted the ban on it. The moderation team still didn't like it, as they thought it was a cheap ploy at getting attention at the risk of harming Bitcoin itself, but it was allowed and not much has been heard of it since.

Honestly, I don't care what people think, they are making uninformed decisions. We are giving perfectly logical reasons, but the rationale of the community as a whole is to question authority. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but when people of the same mindset are in an authoritative position, its just redundant. If they think I'm intentionally trying to hurt my own investments, I guess they can think that, the truth is the truth, and really we have given pretty straightforward reasoning with no prior history leading anyone to reasonably believe otherwise. I don't know about Theymos' personal interests, but from the history of the Alt Coin section to this point, my best guess is that he doesn't care either way.

Lastly, I suppose even if there was a grudge against alt coins, and the Admins decided not to allow Alt Coins here, why would it matter? Its their site, Bitcointalk isn't publically owned as much as people like to think it is. While the Admins may be enforcing their own philosophies of free speech and as people like to so elequently call it, "libertarian policies", that doesn't guarentee that they have to, that is just their personal management style. If they decided to ban everyone with the letter T in their username, they could do so, at the risk of losing the people they do want here, but in principal, its their site. If removing giveaway threads from a specific subforum on a sole site is all it takes to significantly effect the value of an Alt Coin, my advice is not to invest in it.

*Sigh*

The admins here as far as I can tell don't care either way about Alt Coins and their existance. If they are however causing issues to the rest of the forum, that is when there is a problem. Alt Coins have lived peacefully in their section, secluded from the rest of the Bitcoin forum without any intervention or secret hate from the admins, besides perhaps for the occasional frustration when people are posting altcoin threads in the wrong places. Cklovias will attest to that, as well as some of Bitcointalk's more frustrated moderators.

The new "attack" against altcoins mostly has to do with that section, namely the Giveaway threads and their thousands of pages of spam contributing as a safe haven for paid advertising spammers to post (that is also an ongoing issue that effects everyone) as well as just providing a sheer amount of unwanted volume to the forums.

We have suggested incredibly reasonable alternatives, people are even allowed to post their giveaway info here, we just ask that they collect the hundreds of thousands of addresses elsewhere, be it twitter, their own forums, or whatever.

I'm a big supporter of Alt coins, and have been for years. The fact that I am actively supporting the changes mean either A) I've suddenly decided to hate Alt Coins or B) I see the problem giveaway threads create, and I think we are within reason to ask that people post them elsewhere. As I said a moment ago, its actually really being blown up out of proportion. We are trying to cut down on spam, and people keep looking for alterior motives such as why the admins are threatened by alt coins, when in reality as far as I know, Theymos has no public opinion of them, and John K. has a vested interest in some.

Had we targeted specific alt coins, I'd say that is unfair, but the fact of the matter is, we just don't want the posts. Create a giveaway thread asking new members to join your own forums, follow you on twitter, or facebook, or whatever, we don't really care. It should be a very slight inconvience on the community that wants Giveaways, a huge improvement for those that don't want them, and a HUGE improvement to those that don't want forum resources being wasted on hundreds of thousands of posts like this:

THX  1JXwGd1N8eP4WWMP6mLe6UNAycDhzqvhJo

Mayhaps have people post their addresses on Twitter? If you are willing to do something like that, I'll unlock the thread for you, just pm me. We don't hate alt coins, we just don't want the address spam posted on the forums.

Yes, as it is not pertinent to the Bitcoin forum in any way.

That is perfectly fine. We just dont want the thousands of pages of address spam.



Thank you, that is what we have been asking all along  


As far as I know, Bitcoin giveaways are still allowed in the Games and Rounds section. Do keep in mind however, that there are far fewer Bitcoin giveaways, so much less spam, and also this is a Bitcoin forum. Bitcoin giveaways are sort of supposed to be here, just like Alt Coin giveaways should be on their own forums.

This really wasn't an issue when the Alt Currency section was first made, as there were only a handful of coins. It has become a trend to make hundreds of coins per day now, and we just can't keep up with the volume.

This had absolutely no factor in the decision to disallow giveaways. The Bitcointalk admins really have little to no interest in Alt coins, nor whether they are premined, "scam coins", "shit coins" or whatever. It has to do with the sheer amount of volume that they were contributing to the forum, for a section that is non essential to the Bitcoin forums. We have never had any intention to turn Bitcointalk into Crytptocointalk. The hope has always been that people will develop their own forums for their own coins, and basic discussion/announcements can be done here for publicity. We do not have enough space or moderation power to keep up with the current rate that Alt Coins are coming into being, and the other issues the huge amount of posts that a person can make between 600 giveaway threads.

Giveaway threads are not coming back in the foreseeable future. Maybe with the new forum software? Possibly? But I wouldn't bet on that.

Well I have a few questions, I'd buy it for my parents, but you wont accept Bitcoins for it? Why post it on a Bitcoin forum then?

Anyway, if I'm misinterpreting that, and you do accept Bitcoins, you just mean that you would like to pin the value to USD at time of sale I am indeed interested and have questions.

1) How old is the build, does it come with manufacturer warranty info

2) What company manufactured the GPU, like is it XFX?

3) Does it come with a PSU

4) would you sell it without HDD

5) Does it come with the drivers CDs?

Anyway, I'd be very interested in putting in an offer for it if a few things check out.

Uhhh no, there wont be a vote, because what makes you think people would vote rather than for their own financial interest? If a coin is a virus, it is removed, besides that it can die on its own accord if it is indeed terrible.

You can get a free coin from the coin's own forum. Check my post above for an example of a giveaway thread that is perfectly fine. Really now that I think about it even more than I did before, why the hell do people care in the first place if they have to post their address on another forum rather than this one? Thats the only difference.