Isn't changing DIFFICULTY_TARGET kind of bad for the small pools?
Maybe. If you guess that "small" pools have less bandwidth, then having more time between blocks will help with their orphans (more than larger/faster pools). Variance shouldn't matter much, unless by "small" you mean "infinitesimal". IMO, it's probably a net positive for small pools. |
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We are approaching very soon 10 million XMR mined since May of 2014. I want to know is there a limit to how many XMR can be mined? I can't remember if there is a cap. Is it true the new release 0.8.8.9 will slow the blocks down from 1 minute to 2 minute finds? Or do I have that right?
Oh and who ever pointed all or some of their hashing power at Monerohash.com over the last few days thanks for spreading the hashing out some. Makes the network better IMO.
There is no cap. According to my spreadsheet, maintenance emission (157,680 XMR / year) will kick in when ~18,132,307 XMR have been mined; it should occur around 2022-05-31. Yes it is planned to double blocktime. Emission parameters will of course be changed to match (so they are the same as now). |
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My first report on 0.9 beta release
+ Windows 7
+ Sync from start to block 797721: take more than a day
+ Database size after sync-ed: data.mdb 9,437,187 KB (9.4 GB) (block 797721)
+ Memory:
Private Working Set): 21,277 KB (21 MB)
Commit Size: 109,880 KB (109 MB)
Working Set: 38,040 KB (38 MB)
+ Startup time: About 2 seconds
+ Exit time: About 3-5 seconds
Huge improvements over 0.8.8 release!
Nice report! The bolded is probably due to a slow connection or a HDD. It takes around 45-60 min to fully sync from scratch on an SSD and it took me around 4 hours on a HDD. Just to clarify, 9,437,187 KB is 9.00000 GB, not 9.4.  |
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Great stuff! Monero just gets better and better. Re block time - if it is changed to 2 minutes, will the block reward be doubled to keep the emission curve the same? You're correct. Yes of course, it's not some trick to change the social contract.  |
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The 2.5ms on an i7-2700K came from NoodleDoodle's commit notes I think. It was obviously intended as a CPU-only number that was not realistic for the full system at all. I'm pretty sure even today with a multi-processor server using newer CPUs you could do many times better (if you wanted all full nodes to be on big servers in data centers). But that's still not a realistic end-to-end number at all.
Oh, I thought it was a 2600k, but what's 0.1Ghz among friends? So for fun: http://www.supermicro.com/products/system/5U/5086/SYS-5086B-TRF.cfmThrow in 8x http://ark.intel.com/products/84685 @ a per-unit price of $7174. Ignore other components (who needs 'em?). Let's assume that the per-clock "tx checking" performance of these Haswells are the same as Sandy Bridge (unlikely, should be better). That's ~286 Tx's / sec / core. 286 * 18 * 8 = 41,142 TPS BAM, we're VISA. I should find something better to do. |
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This is assuming you have the "Amount Key"?
No. The equality sum(in)-sum(out)-fee=0 is independently verified by every node or any observer without any key. (...) Else, you could have the problem of being too opaque, because the network peers would not be able to check if moneros were being created at will. This is a really big deal. If/once confidential transactions are integrated into Monero, it will be the best cryptocurrency hands down mathematically possible. The only way to improve upon it would be to enhance it's transaction per second scaling through some yet-unheard-of mathematics, but it's likely such a radical shift would break all the excellent privacy features we have built up so far. We can handle a theoretical 1600 tx/sec now; perhaps if a way to scale easily to tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands were proposed it would be compatible with the Monero implementation.
As well, we aren't sure if 1600 tx/sec will even be our final maximum (may improve over time with upgrades to software/hardware) and even if it is, that's good enough to serve as a backbone for a giant international settlement mechanism. Visa does 40,000 tx/sec, but by the 2030's we may not be using Monero to buy coffee with - it's possible that it will serve as a financial backbone for other centralized sidechains and centralized/national/NWO currencies. I think that most people wouldn't have as much of a problem with US Dollars, even inflationary ones if the Federal Reserve issued a view key each year and said: " As you can see, the US Dollar is currently being backed by 34 ore each. If inflation proceeds as planned, considering our mining operations, next year the dollar will each be backed by 33.8 ore each." (or whatever an atomic unit of Monero is designated as in the 2030's  ) That was based on smooth's calculations (with an i7-2600k using 4 cores IIRC). I don't know how he got to 2.5ms per tx, but I assume it's accurate. Unless CPUs hit some kind of brick wall, it's a certainty that that number will improve (obviously that's for a single CPU desktop as well); the 2600k is also 4 series behind the present (or something, Intel has dorked it up). I believe bandwidth and hard drive space are much more pressing concerns for "big" usage. A 5 input, 5 ouput, 5 mixin Tx is about 2kB. 1,600 TPS at that made up average size would equal: 25.54 mbps up/down bandwidth (assuming receive/send each Tx once) ~269 GB / day in storage ~96 TB / year I said somewhere that I thought 100-200 (or more) TB SSDs would be available in ~8 years, so the storage might not actually be that bad. Bandwidth will surely come a long way in 8 years too, and 25.54mbps will likely be inconsequential (which was an idealized case of course). What's my point? Basically it is that CPUs seem to be 5-10 years "ahead of the curve" as far as cryptocurrency requirements go. |
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By the way the ratio of the emission to the number of coins of Bitcoin will be below that of Monero in about 13 years. (1.5625 XBT per 10 min vs 3 XMR per 10 min). This is a lot sooner that many realize.
Actually it'll happen at the halving prior to that (about 9 years): 3.125 / 21m < (0.3 * 10) / ~18.4m -- about 8% lower |
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Hard to imagine an (above poverty line) adult who never uses an ATM card in this, the Year of Our Lord 2015.
I never use an ATM card. |
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The 1 TB version i built comes to ~$300 with a 750 ti, so you could get 250 h/s. And these are all retail component costs. Perhaps someday I'd be able to get scale prices somehow. Proper cooling has proven to be a pain - its difficult to find high quality small form factor fans - fans that could last 5 years of constant runtime. And then the question of how loud the fans can be.
No fan lasts that long. 5 years? Sure they do. I have a server from 2009 that's been running essentially 100% of the time (still running now) with no fan failures. I have desktops from 2003 that have been running more or less all the time (not 100%, but almost certainly >80%) with fans that appear to still be working well enough. One of them did recently die on me. |
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Is this all just about hoping for The Big Pump so we can cash out to fiat and buy Lambos or are we actually trying to accomplish something here?
I just want my Lambo. But in all seriousness, technology will always be an arms race against governments and organizations trying to regulate and profit from it. We may win some battles, but I doubt there will ever be a time where we can sit back and live happily ever after with a perfectly incorruptible form of money. True, but to win any battles you have to recognize them as battles worth fighting. I see a lot of people (not only here but also in other threads, reddit, etc.) assuming and accepting that Monero is just going to follow right in Bitcoin's footsteps. Exactly, and I agree with those people if we just sit back and do nothing. The battles are worth fighting. My point is we have to continue to evolve to stay ahead or we risk being consumed by the politics. As far as I'm concerned, it's too late for Bitcoin to be saved because it failed to evolve quickly enough. I'd like to try and accomplish something. What prevents us from following in bitcoins footsteps? IMO, fighting for decentralization, which probably means the following needs to be addressed: 1. pooling countermeasures 2. blockchain size The first is probably 75% of it. I'm very pro technology development and figure that in 10 years we'll be near $5 / TB or something ridiculous. pooling countermeasures are tough though. Just for fun... http://www.pcworld.com/article/128400/article.htmlHitachi notes it took the industry 35 years to reach 1GB (in 1991), 14 years more to reach 500GB (in 2005), and just two more years to reach 1TB. It took 16 years to go from 1 GB to 1 TB. Now I'm not suggesting we'll have a repeat (or am I?), but only 8 years have passed since we hit 1 TB. It cost $399 then. Now for just over 50% of that we can get 6 TB. It does seem we've hit a bit of wall, with only roughly 3 doublings in the past 8 years (1 -> ~11 TB at same price level), whereas we need ~10 doublings each 16 year period to obtain the 3 OOM jump. Therefore, we (me) are counting on flash to "bridge the gap", but even without a breakthrough, I'd be quite surprised to NOT see sizes within 1 OOM of the 1 PB target for 2023 (100-200 TB or so). We already have this: http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/08/samsung-unveils-2-5-inch-16tb-ssd-the-worlds-largest-hard-drive/It only needs 3-4 doublings to be inside my "not surprised" window (and come *substantially* down in price ). Color me optimistic.  |
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and how much would you be willing to pay?
how much would you be willing to pay if it could also mine (~200 or 250 or 500 h/s)?
how much would you be willing to pay if it could mine and also ran the pool software (so, you'd have your own private pool)?
how much would u pay if it could run additional decentralized software?
and why ssd?
I don't think the price should exceed 200$, and the "dedicated" means that box should only keep blockchain and run the latest daemon. All other services should run outside the box, as they are able to communicate with daemon over TCP/IP network, aren't they? Perhaps there are security or performance issues in TCP/IP versus shared memory, I don't know. I assume, when running daemon and "service" on the same LAN subnet, it should work OK. Well yeah, using SSD might be an exaggeration. My own testing showed that starting / exiting daemon on SSD is way faster that on regular drive. So when you need to do some daemon maintenance, SSD should reduce the downtime. In regular operations (in my case, one wallet communicating with daemon  ), indeed, there is no difference between drive types. Hrmmm... in my opinion, the "only keep blockchain and run the latest daemon" is a not how these networks were initially designed / envisioned - i.e., a full node is one that mines - it can create its own blocks. IMO, A non-mining node is like an auditing relay - for instance, a non mining node will still play a part in the hardfork vote (if I understand things correctly). And if one transacts on a non-mining node, they're also participating more than just keeping a copy. Indeed, there's a full blown discussion raging about what a node is and how many are needed somewhere in bitcointalk. "other services outside the box" not entirely sure what you mean. The pool software definitely needs to run on the same silicon. Welp, I'm designing such a device. It won't be pretty, as they will be handmade (you can do ANYTHING with a dremel!) . I was asking about the SSD because you can get much larger HDs with a HDD, and I'm imagining these devices will just sit next to your router for years, so ideally a 10 year device will be at least 500 gigs. The 1 TB version i built comes to ~$300 with a 750 ti, so you could get 250 h/s. And these are all retail component costs. Perhaps someday I'd be able to get scale prices somehow. Proper cooling has proven to be a pain - its difficult to find high quality small form factor fans - fans that could last 5 years of constant runtime. And then the question of how loud the fans can be. If Monero goes "anywhere", 1 TB will likely not be enough space in 10 years. |
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Just copy the keys files to the folder where your simplewallet.exe is located. You can also copy your bin files so that you don't have to refresh the wallet from scratch (I think they're compatible).
Basically the [walletname].keys file has your encrypted spend+view keys pair.
The [walletname] file stores the info about the incoming/outgoing transacions.
I don't know if you meant to do this for 0.8.8.6 or the beta. Since I had the beta running and it would take a while to get 0.8.8.6 running I copied and pasted my .keys file into the folder of simplewallet of the 0.9 beta and it still didn't recognize it as an existing wallet when I started simplewallet. I'll have time tonight to do it for 0.8.8.6 if that's what you meant. @Nik4692, It was seemingly straightforward so I have no idea what I could have done wrong  You are doing something wrong. What's the exact name of the .keys file for the wallet? What's the exact command line you are trying to execute to open this wallet? I can't see the exact name of the .keys file anywhere. I assume this is name of the wallet? If I open the file it looks like Chinese characters. I open simplewallet and after "Wallet file name:" I put in the name of the wallet like I've always done. Thank you There is no need to try with the previous version (0.8.8.6.) of bitmonerod.exe. Do you have any files that have the extension keys in their name? Better yet, could you tell us the full name of the files you copied? Edit: When one creates a wallet with simplewallet 3 files are generated: - [walletname]
- [walletname].address.txt
- [walletname].keys
Of these 3 the important one is the [walletname].keys file because it's that one that has your private keys. There are only two ways of recovering an account: with the mnemonic wordlist and with the keys file. Are you running simplewallet from the command line or by clicking? If the later try this: - Open the folder where simplewallet.exe is located
- Make sure you have the [walletname].keys file there
- Right click inside the folder on windows explorer and select open command line (i'm not sure of this description here since i'm not in windows)
- Run simplewallet from the command prompt
If this does not work, there probably is a problem. Right don't open the *.keys file; tell us what the * is and also what exactly you're typing into simplewallet. Edit (for edit above): In Windows, hold Shift then right click in blank space within a folder with nothing selected to enable an "Open command window here" option. |
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OK I'm trying the windows 0.9 beta again. I once again created a new folder for it as the last one disappeared after I closed the daemon without exiting as it hung up when I tried to exit after the syncing hung up. I am currently syncing the blockchain from scratch as I did the first time and this time it started from ~ block 376206 so maybe it was stored somewhere?
It seems obvious but I want to check to make sure I don't mess anything up. Once the daemon syncs I can then open any simplewallet I have? And transact with it?
Blockchain is stored in %ALLUSERSPROFILE%. You definitely aren't syncing from scratch if it started from 376206. Yes to your last two questions (unless there's some compatibility issue that I don't know about, but why not just use the matching 0.9 simplewallet?). |
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So I feel completely idiotic right now ... this whole time I've been having trouble running these programs on my windows for 64-bit because that's what I thought I had, only to realize that I think I have a 32-bit because when I finally took time to read the error message that comes up when trying to extract bitmonerod.exe or something of the sort it says that "this application is not Win32 compatible" ... sigh, I guess that's what I get for being very impatient with things. So I guess my question would be, is it worth it to try and run this stuff on my computer? Or should I just stick with buying monero and putting it into mymonero for holding? the truth of the matter is, if you're really just holding, you can just run simplewallet, or use moneromoo's offline generator, to create an address, and then send funds to that address. Your account is just an entry in the blockchain - you don't need to actually run *anything*. The only reason you would need to run something is to transact, or to verify that your coins have been deposited. But thats not entirely true, because recently luigi1111 made a thingy that can confirm that your transaction went through to a wallet you sent it to. It's not super user friendly... well, I don't know... I've never tried it. Long story short, mymonero is fine, you don't need to run anything, but running something is always better (because it supports the network). Is simplewallet bit agnostic? I guess it's user friendly *enough*, though ugly (someone is working on it I hear). Actually I don't really see how you could make it much easier than it is now. Several people I know have used it with success for cold wallets. The other function (proving a destination received some outputs) mooo has added to simplewallet now (not merged): https://github.com/moneromooo-monero/bitmonero/commit/46c7989854c07c26d8a31b5bdf266cc658a62119 |
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But I must do my best to redouble my focus. As I said, mea culpa.
I'll refrain from prolonging this discussion as well. I wish you all the best. |
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wall street money pouring in.
Yup, currently 3.2 thousand dollars bids at Gemini, this looks sooo bullish... The bid sum / ask sum ratio is about 20$, might be an insight into the future of bitcoin...  And those are probably just nerds from this forum "Taking Part in History!!!". How do we link to Gemini's exchange (trading and books) information? Do we need to create an account? Only institutional representatives can create an account, no? I use this: https://cryptowat.ch/gemini/btcusd/5minI think you anyone can open an account as long as they live in one of the US states currently supported. AFAIK anyone can open an account; you just can't do fun things like fund and trade unless they're in your state. In other news, I created an account yesterday, got the "we are not operational in your state yet". Then this morning, I received an email saying "we're operational in your state", but after logging in, I'm still getting "we are not operational in your state yet". I'm so confused.  |
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For a long time I respected smooth for his logic and also for his desire to be fair minded. I have no idea what happened today. It has gone totally off the rails.
(as someone who hasn't participated in this thread before/has no stake in this/whatever) This looks to me like a fairly good indicator that you should back off a bit and maybe give yourself a chance to see others' perspectives. |
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See you in the 0.001 's in a few weeks. In my country, the 0.001 's means 0.0009-0.0011 , pieces of shrimps. Your country is a very strange place. |
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See you in the 0.001 's ladies.  LeL, we're already in the 0.001's...what now? |
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Does anyone know a site that features more advanced charts for Monero?
It's easy enough to find block explorers and exchanges with the set of charts generally available for all currencies (hashrate and exchange rate etc)
What I am looking for is for example # of transactions per block, avg fee per tx/block, avg size per tx, etc
Related to this: does anyone know the current size of the "global output list"? Isn't that a major scalability concern? (as it's monotonically increasing) Well, its encoded pretty poorly currently but aside from that it fundamentally shouldn't be very large compared to the outputs themselves, so not by itself a scalability concern (other than the implementation needing work someday). Isn't it a 64-bit # that's just monotonically increasing? I think that was his point(?), not sure. I meant the lookup tables for it. Ah, ok. *whistling nonchalantly* "Nothing to see here, folks." |
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