If you are really worried about it. There are a number of (very small) countries that will authorize it as a currency of their country for a small fee. Then you are authorized to be making a national currency. I've contemplated this route. Many others have taken it, but I prefer to remain producing non-governmental private pieces at this time.
I am delighted when more folks enter "the business". Especially folks with good ethics, and attention to quality. I am happy to help where I can
AND, since you asked nicely....this advice cost quite a lot of legal time, so feel welcome to tip if you like. It will go into my legal defense fund. If "they" are going to be going after anyone, it will likely be me first and winning with a well funded defense will set a good precedent.
:
The origin of the prohibition against coin “of original design” is explained in the Annual Report of the Director of the Mint for 1871, reprinted in the Annual Report of the Secretary of the Treasury for 1871, Report on Finances #9 (p205-214). It provides (in brief) for the punishment of any who make or pass counterfeit coins in any metal or alloy, in the resemblance of those of the United States or of foreign countries; or who make or pass coins of "original design" for the purpose of money. ... [G]reat quantities of original design were issued more than thirty years ago... small pieces designated as “half dollars” and “quarter dollars,” with some claim to be considered gold coins, as they really contain as much of that metal as is to be found in common jewelry. The pieces which began to be issued in San Francisco, in 1859, and perhaps have been coined more recently, may not have been ... pushed into circulation, but may rather have served as playpieces or curiosities. However, they were sold at their pretended value, while in fact the half dollar, weighing six grains on an average, and about 423-thousandths fine, was worth eleven cents; the quarter dollar nearly in the same proportion, some pieces being actually worth six cents. No doubt they have been imposed upon ignorant persons as real money. Their shapes were various, some octagonal, some circular.
Case law more than a century old sustains this view:
In U.S. v Bogart, 9 Ben. 314, 24 F.Cas. 1185, 24 Int.Rev.Rec. 46, No. 14,617 (N.D.N.Y. 1878), the Court explained, “One of the Rules applicable to the offence of counterfeiting is, that the resemblance of the spurious to the genuine coin must be such as that it might deceive a person using ordinary caution, and a conviction cannot be had for uttering pieces of metal which are not in the likeness or similitude of genuine coins.” (California gold).1 (These pieces deceive no one).
Another case, U.S. v Hopkins, 26 Fed. 443 (D.C. 1885), supplemented this by saying “counterfeit coin is one made in imitation of some genuine coin. It is not necessary that the resemblance should be exact in all respects. The resemblance is sufficient if the coins are so far alike that the counterfeit coin is calculated to deceive a person exercising ordinary caution and observation in the usual transactions of business, though the counterfeit would not deceive a person who was expert or has particular experience in such matters. This rule has been more fully applied in cases of written or printed instruments which are used in ordinary business transactions, as prudent men are presumed to exercise reasonable caution in accepting instruments which are evidences of contracts and obligations.” Id., at 443-444. (Emphasis added). (They don’t look like an American coin; don’t have the feel of an American coin and don’t act as a coin does either on first use, or subsequent use).
And in yet another case, U.S. v Hargrave, 26 F.Cas. 164 (D.C. N.D. Ohio 1872), the indictment contained seven counts, four of which were framed under the act of March 3, 1825 (4 Stat. 121), and three under the act of June 8, 1864 (13 Stat. 120). The main question was whether the spurious coin in question came under either act. “It was claimed by the prosecution that it came under both, that is: First, that it was in the similitude of the genuine coin; second, that if considered of ‘original design,’ it was within the later act above cited; and, third, that the question was, not whether it would deceive a person of ordinary skill and caution, but whether it was capable of, and designed to be used for deceiving the incautious and unskillful”. These (a) deceived no one; (b) would not deceive the incautious or unskillful, and (c) would not deceive a person of ordinary skill and caution.
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when we reach 180 new walls will appear, the size of these walls piling up fast will strike fear even in the most bullish bulls.
180 will be run over... 169 is US$2B Market cap. Closing at 170 may wake up some sleepers. This market is still tiny and illiquid. Big players can't get their money in without stirring it up like this. And there are so many of us working on making it succeed, just for the love of it, that it is not going to stop in our lifetimes.
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"Current Money" =/= "Currency" Do your own research. "Current Money" is national, government-made coin. Titan is not violating this arcane US anti-counterfeiting law any more than the Franklin Mint is. You may go FUD yourself now. you suck beyond belief Don't be mad just because information dispels fear. Titan is looking to make something new, to be creative. Your attempt to instill fear and stifle this creativity with nonsensical laws written in the 19th century that have only a handful of cases based on them is shameful. I'm sure you were just seeking to inform and enlighten us all with this link, but it just has absolutely nothing to do with anything in this thread. wtf is wrong with you? this is your business, issuing "new liberty 'dollars'": http://newlibertydollar.com/this is someone who went to jail for "liberty 'dollars'": http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052748704425804576220383673608952you're either trying to make yourself belief the law doesnt exist so you can continue being a criminal without feeling guilty, or found some brilliant way to get around it. I'll bet on the 1st. Do you make a career out of being wrong? Bernard von Nothaus is not in jail. He has never been in prison. The misapplication of that law to his activities is not decided law. The law exists. It was written to prevent the gold miners in the California gold rush from making things that looked like government issued coins that were not properly adhering to the weights and measures, anti-counterfeiting. It has absolutely nothing to do with either my, nor Nothaus nor Titan's activities, despite the nonsense put forward by the political prosecution of Nothaus for his support of Ron Paul. Please keep up this line of nonsense. People might care to learn the truth and I, for one, am happy to help them out. you need to supply sources of all your claims Or do I? I am perfectly OK with not convincing you of anything. People that seek the truth may find it easily. There are enough that already know. If you are slower to learn than others, that is not my burden to bear, its yours. In the mean time we are just bumping this thread.... bumpity bump bump If our OP considers this all off-topic, am happy to take it elsewhere.
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interest rates to borrow usd are sky high just now on bitfinex.
300%!!
wha? you can short USD? you lend your USD to traders at wtv % interest you want. no one is lending right now... thats why its 300% interest, i guess its because the bulls exhausted the USD, everyone is long. This is a bearish signal, suggesting the run-up is extended. Bitcoin kills bears for breakfast though so don't think I am recommending anything.
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I'd bet they spent it all. It is going to be hard to get anything out of them. My condolences go out to anyone that has had to deal directly with them.
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"Current Money" =/= "Currency" Do your own research. "Current Money" is national, government-made coin. Titan is not violating this arcane US anti-counterfeiting law any more than the Franklin Mint is. You may go FUD yourself now. you suck beyond belief Don't be mad just because information dispels fear. Titan is looking to make something new, to be creative. Your attempt to instill fear and stifle this creativity with nonsensical laws written in the 19th century that have only a handful of cases based on them is shameful. I'm sure you were just seeking to inform and enlighten us all with this link, but it just has absolutely nothing to do with anything in this thread. wtf is wrong with you? this is your business, issuing "new liberty 'dollars'": http://newlibertydollar.com/this is someone who went to jail for "liberty 'dollars'": http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052748704425804576220383673608952you're either trying to make yourself belief the law doesnt exist so you can continue being a criminal without feeling guilty, or found some brilliant way to get around it. I'll bet on the 1st. Do you make a career out of being wrong? Bernard von Nothaus is not in jail. He has never been in prison. The misapplication of that law to his activities is not decided law. The law exists. It was written to prevent the gold miners in the California gold rush from making things that looked like government issued coins that were not properly adhering to the weights and measures, anti-counterfeiting. It has absolutely nothing to do with either my, nor Nothaus nor Titan's activities, despite the nonsense put forward by the political prosecution of Nothaus for his support of Ron Paul. Please keep up this line of nonsense. People might care to learn the truth and I, for one, am happy to help them out.
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"Current Money" =/= "Currency" Do your own research. "Current Money" is national, government-made coin. Titan is not violating this arcane US anti-counterfeiting law any more than the Franklin Mint is. You may go FUD yourself now. you suck beyond belief Don't be mad just because information dispels fear. Titan is looking to make something new, to be creative. Your attempt to instill fear and stifle this creativity with nonsensical laws written in the 19th century that have only a handful of cases based on them is shameful. I'm sure you were just seeking to inform and enlighten us all with this link, but it just has absolutely nothing to do with anything in this thread.
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"Current Money" =/= "Currency" Do your own research. "Current Money" is national, government-made coin. Titan is not violating this arcane US anti-counterfeiting law any more than the Franklin Mint is. You may go FUD yourself now.
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I would be cautious in using Aocs mint (mulligan mint) http://blogs.wsj.com/bankruptcy/2013/09/20/texas-coin-maker-for-fed-estranged-files-for-bankruptcy/As I say they made the Bitcoin round and a globe and gear round from my design which they resold the royalties would then have been a discount on any that I purchased. They probably expected that I would have been ordering large quantities as that wasn't the case they aren't interested in paying any royalties now - looks like there still using the artwork though on a silver round, anyway it was only a gentleman's agreement nothing in writing. Rob Gray, who "founded" AOCS is an interesting character. I do not know him personally, only by reputation. And have spoken with many who have had much more personal involvement. He arrived on the Liberty Dollar scene and wanted to be the head of it, despite not having done anything. Full of gusto he wanted to be given everything and made the head of national organization. This candidacy was not supported by the incumbent RCO's (regional currency officers) to put it mildly. As part of this attempt, he gained knowledge of the mechanics of the Liberty Dollar, how it is priced, the manufacturing basics, some knowledge of minting, and a lot of contacts. At the failure of his bid to take over, he went off on his own and founded AOCS, the American Open Currency Standard which was based on the Liberty Dollar model... By "based" I mean that it was an exact copy. This was all well and good, the founder of the Liberty Dollar, Bernard von Nothaus had always been very free with his knowledge and expertise. He is a great teacher and has more knowledge, creativity and expertise than any 10 others in the industry. Where Rob Gray failed in basic ethics was in then claiming that he, Rob Gray devised this model and not its true architect, Bernard von Nothaus. This lie alone should have been enough of a warning, but it did not end there. Further to add insult to injury, Rob Gray then "decertified" the Liberty Dollar as non-AOCS compliant! It would be laughable and entirely ignorable were it not for the concurrent unjustified legal prosecution of the Liberty Dollar. When seen in that light was worse than adding an insult to an injury, it was a betrayal. A backstab maneuver against one of the heroes of the evolving history of alternative currency, Bernard von Nothaus, to whom he owed everything that he had built. This personal betrayal which came so easily to Rob Gray has been a pattern of his behavior over the years. It is for these reasons that we have elected to not do any business with Rob Gray or Mulligan Mint, due to his lack of ethics, and his history of personal treachery, greed and narcissism. Our condolences go out to Republic and any other who placed trust in this man. I owe you an apology for not bringing this story more to the fore. I never enjoy speaking ill of others, but in this case there is an obligation to police our own industry and keep those of ill-repute and untrustworthyness outside the circles of honest business so that people do not take risks for which they are not aware. For those of you who have suffered due to your dealings with him, again, we apologize for not giving stronger voice to these suspicions.
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I really like the way it looks. Well done :3
Hey, did you get any of these before I left the country? I ran out while I was there, but I have plenty now.
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In the last few weeks we have had an outpouring of support. It has been very heartwarming. As Bitcoin grows as an international currency, the need for off-chain transactions using real-value bitcoin-denominated specie pieces will become increasingly important, and we are honored to put forward this project to serve that purpose.
One of the challenges we have currently is one where YOU CAN HELP, and by helping, you can make money, do good, and have fun!
We have been receiving many small quantity orders from folks all over the world, and although this is very encouraging, it does not provide the best service to the wide world of bitcoiners. Since this physical currency has to be shipped, small quantity long distance orders are not the best bargain or best distribution model. These transactions are perfect for bitcoin but not for bitcoin specie, which is best for local.
We have started to reach out to regional distributors who can purchase in quantity and distribute locally. The great benefit to these distributors is that they get a much lower price per piece than any individual buyer can get. This allows them to profit by the difference of what it would cost to have a single bitcoin specie shipped and insured overseas (high), and the cost of a local transaction (low).
So if you know someone in a position to serve such a role, or you yourself are one of these rare and special people. Please do not hesitate to contact us. It will be good for your own bitcoin wallet, and good for Bitcoin in that it will help spread the Bitcoin economy in your local community.
Be a Bitcoin ambassador, use bitcoin, and bitcoin specie in transactions. Use Bitcoin Specie to educate and bolster your outreach efforts. Be the local distribution hub and give yourself a Bitcoin job.
When you do this, we will encourage people local to you to buy from you, instead of from us.
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... Fission or thorium might be even better for those purposes, and safer, and cleaner. The technology is available for decades but who builds them? The problem with those is that governments don't like them on account of the fact that you can't make nuclear weapons with the byproducts.
Fusion or thorium, right? Fission is how cooking-grade reactors work. But there's plenty of research on both, and US has enough weapons-grade stuff to depopulate the planet several times over -- no need to encroach on commercial nuke reactors. Just for weirdness & curiosity factor, you might like this.Yes fusion, thank you for correcting that. And I'd agree, there is more than enough offensive and area-denial weapons at the command of nations, US and otherwise. Nuclear is really the only "mass destructive" weapon in the arsenal in the sense of destroying mass to create energy...
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I've a very good law firm in FL. PM me if you want contact info.
Also, someone (or someones) ought to take the task of writing up a clear, concise and supported "timeline and fact summary" to brief these folks and speed the process. Preponderance of evidence in civil matters is important.
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I don't like how the wall at 155 is staring at me. Can someone deal with it? Battering ram to the fore, miners dig under, catapults to the ready... CHARGE THE BATTLEMENTS!!!
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I'm up for nuclear power, but nuclear cars? You've got to be crazy. Atomic planes are a no-no because appropriate shielding for personnel would weigh too much, same goes to the cars, AND with the rate of annual car accidents - imaging tearing that shielding off and giving nearby people a tan . Medical personnel or police approaching the vehicle should be protected too and so on. There was a fuss about radioactive batteries for consumer electronics, but it ended nowhere, as we are to far from that technology. EDIT: yeah, and problem of availability to general public, imagine lots of accidental poisonings, and some grease bombs. Yeh, i was joking on there, though only kind-a. Seriously, though, i think nuclear power is the most promising energy source, and even without further development, the accident rate is acceptable. The reasons you listed were pretty much the reasons those projects were scrapped (both projects were real -- no joke). On the other hand, i'm sure small-scale reactors could be developed which are safe *enough*. Fission or thorium might be even better for those purposes, and safer, and cleaner. The technology is available for decades but who builds them? The problem with those is that governments don't like them on account of the fact that you can't make nuclear weapons with the byproducts.
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Bitstamp is leading this rally just now.
Or maybe.. ExAnte traders did...
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Edit: As far as "which group's better at protecting the environment"? Neither. It's explodin' nuclear reactors. After the whole Chernobyl thing, you know what the wildlife around there is like now? Frickin' awesome. I say we forget environmentalism & drain the cooling cores in all the nukes, fill the suckers up with heavy crude, and see what happens OK, we'll use your example instead. Nuclear reactors. What do the environmentalist folks say about that? "No nuclear reactor has ever been built anywhere in the world without substantial government subsidy, and no reactor ever will be built without substantial government funding in future." http://www.thinkglobalgreen.org/NUCLEAR.htmlI'm not qualified to say whether the reactors are "good" or "bad", just that it is likely that but for government taxation+subsidy, they wouldn't be either.
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So... either you are hoping to be stealing from him (or someone else), or you are doing a favor for him (and aiding and abetting an alleged criminal), or stealing from a government?
would it be stealing if someone would own the private key in your opinion? Sorry for this but I might not be understanding the question. If you are asking: "Is it stealing if you crack a wallet that does not belong to you without permission of the rightful owner of the (private key of the) wallet." Yes, I think that is stealing. I don't think anyone is really arguing that it isn't stealing, (or plunder, if it is indeed pirate booty). Instead I think that they feel that it is justified because of their belief about who might own it and the circumstances around that. I'd love to hear what you mean by "a wallet that doesn't belong to you"? c.f. artistic license Or if you prefer, consider the difference between owning the wallet and pwning it. Realistically, the statistical probability of anyone getting at these coins without the pvt key is... unlikely. So if here be something ulterior, perhaps the purpose of plausible deniability for the prospective prospector partaking in the probabalistically preposterous? Yeah... with all these trying... just maybe that future spender of these, is just, lucky.
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To all the people saying 2^256, please know that it's actually 2^160 to brute force a bitcoin address. You don't need to find the exact private key, you just need to find another key which collides with the hash to form the same address. Did you know that for any given bitcoin address, you can expect there to be roughly 2^96 different public keys which are valid for that address.. and so you just need to generate *one* of them to be able to spend from that address.
2^160 is 1,46e+48. Good luck even if you bruteforcing 1000s of top addresses with dedicated asic units and your own power plant Yeah.. it's impossible.. hence why bitcoin is secure. I just get annoyed when I see people incorrectly saying that brute force requires 2^256 work. You are *not* searching for a specific private key, because you don't even know the user's public key. You are trying to generate a keypair which, when hashed, collides with their bitcoin address, thus allowing you to spend from it. There haven't been any significant deposits to 1933 since November'12 so one might expect there to be other lost chests stranded around. With all the spotlight on this wallet, the enterprising treasure-hunter/thief might better quest at other cursed coin caches. This legendary pirate has left in the wake of his sunken vessel an intriguing tale of absconded booty for digital diggers of posterity.
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