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341  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: secp256k1 library and Intel cpu on: January 08, 2017, 11:41:37 AM
I am also interested in a faster secp256k1.

I've been tampering with the asm a bit and had some luck, especially in scalar performance by merging the various stages into one function, however do note that it's gcc only (clang had some issues with rsi/rdi use on the manually inlined function and to work around it one has to move rsi or rdi to some xmm register and restore it before the function ends - which adds a few cycles)

https://github.com/Alex-GR/secp256k1/blob/master/src/scalar_4x64_impl.h
https://github.com/Alex-GR/secp256k1/blob/master/src/field_5x52_asm_impl.h

In 5x52 asm I found 2-3% by simply doing what the cpu scheduler should be doing and issuing together the adds + muls (the cpu integer unit typically has one add and one mul unit and ideally we want to be using them at the same time).

For example:

/* d += a3 * b1 */
    "movq 8(%%rbx),%%rax\n"
    "mulq %%r13\n"
    "addq %%rax,%%rcx\n"
    "adcq %%rdx,%%r15\n"
    /* d += a2 * b2 */
    "movq 16(%%rbx),%%rax\n" <=== this must be moved upwards
    "mulq %%r12\n"

becomes:

/* d += a3 * b1 */
    "movq 8(%%rbx),%%rax\n"
    "mulq %%r13\n"
    "addq %%rax,%%rcx\n"
    "movq 16(%%rbx),%%rax\n"
    "adcq %%rdx,%%r15\n"
    /* d += a2 * b2 */
    "mulq %%r12\n"

So the adcq+mulq are issued together to the mul and add units of the cpu respectively. (edit apparently the mul+add are in the simd unit, in the integer part it's just 3 integer units waiting to do parallel work of any kind - except load/store, which is 2 at a time). I'm baffled on why the cpu scheduler wasn't already doing this but then again I do have an older cpu (core2 quad / 45nm) to play with - it might not be an issue with modern ones.

Also, of the three temp variables used for temp storage in the field asm, some can be eliminated by rearranging the code a bit and thus reducing a couple memory accesses.

(ps. I don't claim the code is safe - I've only used it for benchmarks and the builtin test)

One question I have regarding secp256k1 is whether endomorphism is safe, and if yes, shouldn't it be enabled in bitcoin builds if it's faster (benchmarks show that it is)?
342  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 07, 2017, 08:21:28 AM
I feel bad for the panic sellers. Look at the order books. How's everyone going to buy back? Or are you guys quitting bitcoin?

Interesting. Very thin on the sell side, pretty strong on the buy side. This is more or less the same across most western exchanges that I just checked.

Is that what is called a bull trap? I have no idea, I'm not much of a trader.

It depends on what you expect it to do. If you view the longer-term trend as increasing, then a temporary (mostly artificial) fall is a bear trap. If, on the other hand, expect the long-term trend to be decreasing, then a temporary (mostly artificial) rise is a bull trap.

I think if there was real selling pressure, we'd see this reflected in the order books. There's not too many BTCs on the upside. A few thousand coins take us back to 1000$. On the other hand, it takes multiple that to go down to 700. So, given the positioning and strength of the buys and sells on the order book, I'd say the market expects BTC prices to rise.
343  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 07, 2017, 06:54:35 AM
I feel bad for the panic sellers. Look at the order books. How's everyone going to buy back? Or are you guys quitting bitcoin?

Interesting. Very thin on the sell side, pretty strong on the buy side. This is more or less the same across most western exchanges that I just checked.
344  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 06, 2017, 09:59:03 AM
23-year history? Roll Eyes
345  Economy / Speculation / Re: The Bullish Media Center (The 1 stop Bullish BTC news source) on: January 06, 2017, 09:28:09 AM

I don't get how this article is bullish... It seems to suggest that bitcoin is helpless in getting money out of china...

Seems like mainstream FUD that denies both the power of bitcoin and the difficulties to crack down on it, even if there were a willpower to attempt to crack down on it.

Both alternative and mainstream media are epic fails in terms of covering things related to China. The capital control narrative was bullshit to begin with. As is the "CNY strengthening" narrative right now (the rise is insignificant to account for the drop in BTC).

Now, if you buy BTC to bypass CCs you only need them for a limited time as a vehicle. You buy here, dump there - you don't own many for any serious amount of time (accumulation will tend to increase price and also increase the amount of money you lose during the dump), thus the supply equilibrium is not seriously affected to create an increased price.

Plus the average Chinese citizen will never hit the 50k usd limit when CCs kick in. So who is affected really? Big guys. Big guys make their money from owning big businesses. China is an exporting country and one very easy way to get foreign currency while living in an exporting country, is to export stuff. You buy locally with national currency, export the stuff, get paid in $$$ in a foreign bank account and you are ok. Countries which have stuff to sell that the rest of the planet needs, have a very different experience of "capital controls" compared to countries that don't.
346  Economy / Speculation / Re: The Bullish Media Center (The 1 stop Bullish BTC news source) on: January 06, 2017, 09:18:05 AM
That's very sad for you and your people but you have one thing wrong. You can avoid paying taxes with bitcoin, you just need to have the desire to do so. If you are safe and anon with your bitcoins no one can ever tell you what you owe. They might say you earn from x and y but they can never say in bitcoin.

The origin of the taxes is the problem. If you are alive and breathing, they say you are earning money and have to pay taxes. If you have a car, a home, you are told you earn even more money.

They don't care to speculate where you get your money from, whether it's bitcoin, or something else: It's up to you to pay them from wherever your fictional income comes. And that, in a country with a known rate of >25% unemployment.

Bitcoin is an antidote to many things, but not this kind of taxation scheme.

How is that even legal? So they just demand taxes on x amount even if you earned less, What if you earned less and con prove it?

There are generally 2 ways to prove it:

1) Burn capital from prior years declared income
2) Show that you've got a loan or donation during the same period that covers the expected difference

If you go route (1) you must have shown this income in past years (so you've already been taxed - you can't escape it)

If you go route (2), both loans and donations have to be declared. Donations are taxed heavily (up to 40%).

So the taxman will get his way.
347  Economy / Speculation / Re: The Bullish Media Center (The 1 stop Bullish BTC news source) on: January 06, 2017, 02:32:33 AM
That's very sad for you and your people but you have one thing wrong. You can avoid paying taxes with bitcoin, you just need to have the desire to do so. If you are safe and anon with your bitcoins no one can ever tell you what you owe. They might say you earn from x and y but they can never say in bitcoin.

The origin of the taxes is the problem. If you are alive and breathing, they say you are earning money and have to pay taxes. If you have a car, a home, you are told you earn even more money.

They don't care to speculate where you get your money from, whether it's bitcoin, or something else: It's up to you to pay them from wherever your fictional income comes. And that, in a country with a known rate of >25% unemployment.

Bitcoin is an antidote to many things, but not this kind of taxation scheme.
348  Economy / Speculation / Re: The Bullish Media Center (The 1 stop Bullish BTC news source) on: January 06, 2017, 01:52:31 AM

If this really happened I can see btc going to over 10K easy. All the greeks with their cash under their bed will come running to bitcoin. Normally it would have been gold but even gold is out. BTC is the new better gold.

It's happened since 1/1.

We are now obligated to use electronic transactions for a percentage of our income - whether this income is real or imagined by the government (the government can claim you are making XXXX euro just because you have a car or a house - and tax you based on it).

Bitcoin will not save you from this tax obligation.

Just by being alive, you are considered to earn 3000 euros per year to sustain yourself. "You have to feed yourself, so you are making 3000 euros". And then you are taxed on this fictional income. If you have a car, the government then says, ah, right so now you are 3000+another 3000 due to your car expenses = you are making 6k.... if you also have a house you are considered to be making 8-10k, etc etc. All fictional income, but still very taxable.

Only solution to the above is migration.
349  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 05, 2017, 10:23:58 PM
Always been confused by this and maybe someone can help.

How will bitcoin get to a high price if it can't do big jumps in price?

Surely slow and steady will take us tens and tens of years.

How can 10k (for example) be even remotely realistic any time soon?

Not trolling, just wondering your thoughts.

This is a good question, one that I have been thinking about.

Vinny Lingham predicts a slow and steady rise to 2k-3k during 2017. His judgement seems as good as anyone's to me. But I agree there's no way in hell we're gonna go slow and steady to 100k, or even 10k. And yes I'm thinking in log axis. Suppose price multiplies by 2.5 x per year. Five years of that would get us to 100k. But can you imagine that actually happening? Once that pattern establishes itself, someone who thinks in terms of years is gonna try to frontrun it and will be willing to buy at a premium, short term traders will see that happening, the price will go parabolic, everyone will know it's day traders responsible for the short term parabolic rise and will try to front-run them cashing out, big crash, and there you have it. So if it's truly going to the moon, I think it's safe to assume that it will be a volatile ride all the way to the top.

Hmm, that gives me an idea on how to model the magnitude of the swings. If you knew how many speculators there are (in terms of how much capital they are working with) and what time frames they are working in (long term investors or "long-termers," minute to minute day traders of "short-termers," and everything in between), and the first people to go long are the long-termers and the last to go long are the short term day traders, with the in between being the in between, then the parabolic rise ends when the progression from long termers to short termers runs out.

I've been thinking about this too. The moment the market becomes predictable ("it will go to 2k-4k-10k"), it's the exact same moment that someone can front run the legitimate non leveraged buyers - making their purchases much harder (while the leveraged trader gets all the money). From that perspective, some uncertainty with periodic dips is a good thing.
350  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 05, 2017, 10:19:05 PM
Average fee per TX in last block is about 350k sat each..

Average should include those who overshoot it because they are lazy to calculate it - it's not a requirement.

Quote
https://bitcoinfees.21.co/

The fastest and cheapest transaction fee is currently 100 satoshis/byte, shown in green at the top.
For the median transaction size of 226 bytes, this results in a fee of 22,600 satoshis (0.17$).

Pretty much the same as yesterday.
351  Economy / Speculation / Re: Bitcoin just dropped to under 900$ and it keeps going down on: January 05, 2017, 02:06:43 PM
So did the bubble popped already? price showing in blockchain.info at this very same time is $957 and  transactions not being confirmed for 3 hours now, if the market is correcting itself then I'd suggest to stay idle for now.

What are you talking about? Blocks are issued normally (13468 transactions in last 6 blocks).


Height   Age   Transactions   Total Sent   Relayed By   Size (kB)
446747   18 minutes   2046   46,210.72 BTC   AntPool   998.19
446746   35 minutes   2463   48,702.46 BTC   F2Pool   999.99
446745   47 minutes   2673   19,541.99 BTC   BitFury   998.12
446744   52 minutes   1880   30,974.79 BTC   F2Pool   999.87
446743   59 minutes   2384   37,938.93 BTC   shawnp0wers   998.22
446742   1 hour 10 minutes   2022   24,366.78 BTC   ViaBTC   999.12
352  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 05, 2017, 03:04:45 AM
When do I sell?! I have lost the ability to figure anything out  Huh
Life savings are stuck in there. No sleep tonight!

Well I decided to move/sell 3.6 btc via coinbase.....going on 2 hrs unconfirmed...ugly...ugly....
had standard fee included (or always was that way in the past) so....busy busy...the btc transaction elves they are...

says fine at coinbase end.in that is showed and is unconfirmed there too..but still annoying....may drag out a bit huh?

prepare for a dump in price before I can cash out..the crypto gods hate me Smiley (you have been warned..I broke the price rise)

(or so it seems most times I try to cover my butt somewhat on such rapid rises w/some buffer to $$$ on such a rise)

Next time, check this:
https://bitcoinfees.21.co/

Coinbase, banks, etc will all take commissions that will be in the tens of dollars for a 4k USD tx, so it's a crime not to spend 10 extra cents in fees for first priority (hint: there is no standard fee). But I think it'll go upwards in terms of price so in that case you'll be glad it got delayed.

The link below the guy claims that chinese are NOT using BTC to move $$ out in mass. There are still better methods....he said he tried a business doing so and it went no place...
so if he is correct we have seen nothing yet

https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitquant-founder-bitcoin-useless-for-dodging-china-capital-controls

The capital control narrative always sucked. Using BTC as a vehicle does not create such an upward price pressure of 2x (600->1200) in a couple of months.

You buy one place, sell another place, and then loop the process - but the supply/demand equilibrium is ultimately not very affected because you used the BTCs to dump them.

On the other hand, using BTC as a diversified store of value and an investment, in light of a probable devaluation, makes sense.
353  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 05, 2017, 02:57:50 AM
something that one can observe very often:

if stamp moves either up or down that move is also made by the other exchanges, be it huobi, okcoin, finex, whatever

but if lets say huobi starts a big move and stamp doesnt follow, then thats it. huobi backs off and comes back again.

so stamp is the one that has to "confirm" any movement in china, if that doesnt happen then the move fails.

edit: thats why its so interesting at the moment. lets see if china has to back off or they have the power to drag stamp higher.



not really, china always controls the price.

nope, china controlling the price and being the reason for the rally is just the message that's perfect for the media and noobs.

That majority of volume of trading and ming is in china and you are trying to tell me that they dont influence the price?

Miners are just selling to cover their costs thats all. Doesnt matter if its chinese miners, swedish miners or american miners. They all behave the same.

Trading volume in china is known to be fake, mostly exchange-bots.

Its just a nice story that everyone likes to believe and media likes to sell newbies.
china's volume is likely highly exaggerated but its got to be somewhat real... its not hard to believe that the country with the largest population, largest amount of hashing power, its poeple know to be risk takers and have many large investors(who's buying up all the housing all over the world? the F'in chinese!) not to mention the nature of their fiat... would lead bitcoin.
plus there exchanges have suckered in poeple from all over the world to speculate on BTC with CNY because of 0% fees.

The chinese are pretty good at understanding resource scarcity (resources / population) because that's what they have been trained to do all their lives, whether it's food, real estate, etc etc.

If you live in a country with 1.4 billion people it's pretty easy to figure out what that means with only 16 million bitcoins around...
354  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 04, 2017, 02:22:55 AM
Bitstamp 1036.2 BTC-e 1000 Bitfinex 1045.5 Huobi 1082.08/7526
355  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 03, 2017, 11:57:29 PM
Lets see 1000GBP next!!

20 Billion, c'mon!!!

A better milestone would be 1% of gold's marketcap (Gold marketcap=7trn so 1% of that = 70bn)... price would be near $4444 Tongue
356  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: January 03, 2017, 12:35:53 PM
Updated chart  Cool





About time Cheesy
357  Economy / Games and rounds / Re: 0.5 BTC GIVEAWAY! TO END THE YEAR IN STYLE :D on: January 01, 2017, 03:48:17 AM
Happy new year Cool
358  Local / Ελληνικά (Greek) / Re: [INFO] Συζήτηση για την Ισοτιμία on: December 30, 2016, 04:07:33 PM
αναρωτιεμαι αν υπαρχουν καποιοι που αγοραζουν-πουλανε βαση διαγραμματων!
και τι αποδοση εχουν απο κερδη!
παντως μη ξεχνατε οτι "η σταθεροτητα ειναι η μανα της ανοδου"  Wink

Αποκλειστικα βαση διαγραμματων δε γινεται. Ο λογος ειναι οτι τη πρωτη φορα που θα σου ξεφυγει προς τα πανω ενω εσυ εχεις πουλησει περιμενοντας κινηση προς τα κατω, αν ακολουθεις τυφλα ενα διαγραμμα τοτε πρεπει να περιμενεις αιωνια μεχρι να ξαναπεσει στο σημειο που θες να αγορασεις.

Πχ αν η τιμη παει 200 αλλα εσυ πουλησες και περιμενεις να ξαναγορασεις στο 170, αλλα η τιμη δε ξαναπιασει ποτε 170, τοτε πρακτικα εχεις χασει τα coins σου αλλα και την ανοδο 170->1000.

Οπότε,

1) απλα παραδεχεσαι οτι εκανες λαθος προβλεψη και σε πιανει το FOMO (fear of missing out) ξαναγοραζοντας υψηλοτερα απ'τα 200 που πουλησες οταν το βλεπεις να ανεβαινει και να εχει καλη προοπτικη επιπλεον ανοδου ή
2) το σκεφτεσαι ως εξης "δε γινεται να κανω sell low (200) / buy high (250+) γιατι ετσι δε βγαινουν λεφτα, αρα αστο να παει στο διαλο" και χανεις το τρενο Tongue
359  Local / Ελληνικά (Greek) / Re: [INFO] Συζήτηση για την Ισοτιμία on: December 28, 2016, 01:52:41 AM
Μόλις πιάσαμε το ATH σε ευρώ  Grin. 896€ ήταν κάποτε στο MTgox

Για να δουμε αν χτυπησει κανα 1000ρικο πριν το τελος, με το ρυθμο που ανεβαινει....
360  Economy / Speculation / Re: rpietila Wall Observer - the Quality TA Thread ;) on: December 23, 2016, 10:24:50 PM
When you start hearing noises

https://www.wired.com/2007/12/the-voice-of-go/
...
https://www.wired.com/2007/06/darpas_sonic_pr
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