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4761  Economy / Marketplace / Re: MPEx goes live! on: August 20, 2012, 08:52:26 PM
What is the outcome if:

a.) The domain polimedia.us (which hosts MPEx) gets confiscated by a government authority?

b.) The sytems that MPEx is hosted on are confiscated by a government authority or breached by a criminal?

How does this affect the asset issuer?  How does this affect the investors?
4762  Economy / Securities / Re: S.DICE - Want a piece of SatoshiDICE? IPO this week before new site launch! on: August 20, 2012, 08:43:19 PM
I'm surprised no one has mentioned this as a potential risk - a .com address is quite vulnerable given the propensity of the United States government to do as it pleases.

Wagers on SatoshiDICE occur over the P2P network and use the blockchain.

The site itself is simply a fancy front entrance.

SealsWithClubs took this on by creating a SealsWithClubs.eu and redirecting the .com and .org to the .eu domain.

[Update: As far as the equity, I don't know MPEx's contingency for that, though since authentication is via GPG key, there is probably a workable method should the site itself be disrupted.]
4763  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2012-08-20 forbes.com 'WikiLeaks Bypasses Financial Blockade With Bitcoin' on: August 20, 2012, 07:55:23 PM
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonmatonis/2012/08/20/wikileaks-bypasses-financial-blockade-with-bitcoin/
Quote
Jon Matonis

People shouldn’t fear their government; government should fear its people. Publishers and journalists will not be intimidated nor silenced. Now entering day 626 of the financial blockade against WikiLeaks, Julian Assange sits in the Ecuadorian Embassy in London awaiting safe passage.

So now it is time to bring it on?

Basically, bring it on.  Let's encourage Wikileaks to use Bitcoins and I'm willing to face any risk or fallout from that act.
No, don't "bring it on".

The project needs to grow gradually so the software can be strengthened along the way.

I make this appeal to WikiLeaks not to try to use Bitcoin.  Bitcoin is a small beta community in its infancy.  You would not stand to get more than pocket change, and the heat you would bring would likely destroy us at this stage.

4764  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Bitcoin anonimity on: August 20, 2012, 07:43:14 PM
From the FBI Bitcoin report (page 5):

Quote
All Bitcoin transactions are published online and Internet Protocol (IP) address are linked to the public Bitcoin transactions.

AFAIK Bitcoin messages and transactions format, there are no entries containing sender's IP address.

AFAIK, to determine sender's IP address, your client must be connected directly to sender's Bitcoin client.

What did FBI mean with this quote?

They don't really care about the IP address.  They care about identifying who the party in the transaction is.  So, they were wrong on that technical detail.  But there is information that will help towards giving a clue as to who a party in the transaction might be, even if that doesn't come from the IP address (presuming the party didn't take privacy precautions):

Here's an example:



 - http://toolongdidntread.com/neo4j/i-really-wanted-to-release-this-weekend/
4765  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Alternative cryptocurrencies and proof-of-stake on: August 20, 2012, 07:37:52 PM

So PPCoin was launched last night.

From what I can tell, it looks to be the first alt-coin implementation that has proof-of-stake.  Am I correct in that?

Not in its current form, apparently:

 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=101954.0
4766  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Do you trust BFL? (Butterfly Labs) on: August 20, 2012, 07:16:13 PM
This is not an accusation - just a theory of what a reseller of mining equipment might do to maximize profit.

Did they ever promise to not "burn in" their equipment against the live network?

If they are first, they possibly will have the technical ability to perform a 51% attack.  If they are in it for the long haul, they know that faith in bitcoin as a currency outweighs any short term advantage to mining where they reach 51% themselves.  So that is your upper bound.  At least starting out -- so they might mine using a dozen SC mini rigs until that difficulty adjustment rise is reached and then ship them out and work on the next batch.  That way they've never exceeded 51% themselves, the network is stronger when they are done, yet they made some nice revenue from the testing.

They may not be the first and/or only ASIC to be producing from a working design.
4767  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Where can I get the BTC for registration on: August 20, 2012, 12:56:22 PM
Where can I get BTC to register? Bonus-like as the site coinbase.com

Previously, he was paying 0.10 BTC for the registration of, or involvement of a referral!

That was a very generous offer that coinbase had for a short period of time [update: and was very vulnerable to fraudulent registrations and referrals]

You might find you can earn trivial amounts of bitcoins as described here:

 - https://ogrr.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=1424
4768  Bitcoin / Project Development / Re: Valuation estimate for "Bit-Pay" ? on: August 20, 2012, 12:36:07 PM
  • how long would it take, to build a 'bit-pay' from scratch?

Incidentally, Paysius has many of the same features.

 - http://paysius.com
4769  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Get Cash funding anon. debitcard. on: August 20, 2012, 12:29:57 PM
well it doesnt need to be anonymous . but it must be funded with BTC. i prefer to have instant cash from btc to debitcard . like aurumexchange.com used to got.

so that i can sell my btc to an site and from there to cash it with reloadable creditcard

This from BitCurex was just launched (still working on getting BTC to fund it apparently)
 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=101874.0
4770  Economy / Currency exchange / Re: FastCash4Bitcoins Support Thread (Update: bank funds added) on: August 20, 2012, 11:37:38 AM
Is it safe to cash out to moneybookers?? I have an account there but I heard they had a strong anti-bitcoin stance and have been known to confiscate funds.

Probably that is for the other direction -- using Skrill/Moneybookers to purchase bitcoins is where the problem lies.
4771  Economy / Long-term offers / Re: The sorry and thank you Pirateat40 thread on: August 20, 2012, 11:26:36 AM
Not only did Pirate brought us a great opportunity for investors (once in a lifetime actually), he did help stabilise and grow steadily bitcoin price, volume exchange, and thus contributed to the success of bitcoin. For that, Pirate, I want to thank you. You've done a wonderful work, and I hope you're stay around here.

Regardless of the outcome, I dont think anyone owes an apology

There was a swing in the Bticoin "market cap" of nearly $75 million in under 48 hours.  That kind of volatility is harmful to Bitcoin.

The announcement occurred when the ability to send wire transfers to Mt. Gox had ended on Friday.  Perfect timing for maximum damage over the weekend.

Pirateat40 is not a friend of Bitcoin.  Pirate ... is a scoundrel.

I do apologize.  But not to pirate.  I apologize for not having the courage of conviction to yell at the top of my lungs that this entire deal stunk to high heaven.
4772  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Easiest current way to exchange BTC for cash? on: August 20, 2012, 10:51:23 AM
Hi, first post here after one year. I am persuaded that the BTC economy will really take off when we can go to the pub and buy a beer in BTC. In the meantime a _very fast and easy to use_ system to exchange BTC for cash would be useful. Perhaps based on NFC in phones? I am sure something like this must exist, please post links.


If you want to do a trade, you can use the service of a Local Bitcoin trader:

 - http://www.LocalBitcoin.com

One method possible with this servcie is that the seller (person paying with bitcoins, and receiving cash) can release the bitcoins using SMS, after having secured the cash in hand.

There are a number of cash-out methods:

 - http://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Selling_bitcoins

And there is NFC-enabled mobile apps for Bitcoin.

Bitcoin Spinner for Android is one:

 - https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.miracleas.bitcoin_spinner&hl=en

You can also use QR code.  There are a number of mobile apps that do that:

 - http://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mobile_Payment_Apps
4773  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: How do I send bitcoins form mtgox to instawallet on: August 20, 2012, 09:58:22 AM
I cant figure out how to transfer funds from mtgox to my wallet on instawallet. How do i do this step by step. When I click withdraw on mtgox it bring me to a thing that says something like withdraw wizard where I can choose to withdraw to a band dwolla or okpay, but I dont want any of these I just want to send it to a wallet. HOW?

1.) In Instawallet you will be shown your Bitcoin address (e.g., 1Nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn) Select it and then Edit Copy

2.) Login to Mt. Gox and access:

 - https://mtgox.com/trade/funding-options#withdraw

3.) From the Withdraw tab, enter amount and for the Bitcoin Address field do Eidt Paste
Scroll to the bottom and click Confirm.

4.) Wait until the transaction confirms.
You can see the progress using Blockchain.info

 - http://www.Blockchain.info  (Enter in the search field your Bitcoin address that you withdrew bitcoins to).
4774  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Proving you own a bitcoin address on: August 20, 2012, 09:48:29 AM
You should sign the message with the private key. Virgin, not, doesn't matter.

And if the OP wasn't aware, this feature is built into the Bitoin-qt client.
4775  Economy / Securities / Re: S.DICE - Want a piece of SatoshiDICE? IPO this week before new site launch! on: August 20, 2012, 09:23:23 AM
From the prospectus (Full):

Quote
These amounts are subtracted from revenues before calculating net profits. SatoshiDICE does not
pay salaries or compensation to any person and thus salaries will not be taken out of net profits.

Legal expenses have thus far been paid out of pocket by the operator, Erik Voorhees. If legal
expenses exceed $1,000 per month, the amount will be deducted from SatoshiDICE’s net profits and
this will be described in the monthly Profit and Loss statements. There are currently no ongoing legal
expenses.

Web development expenses for the new website have been fully paid (there will not be upcoming
costs for this site). In the future, if other upgrade plans are implemented, these expenses will be
subtracted from net profits.

Subtracting expenses out before the reported revenue numbers skews the profitability.  I get that they are relatively a small amount, but I don't get why you would do that?  I would think P&L should list all revenues and expenses.    Even if there is no outlay for an expense, it still should be booked, I would think.  Without doing that paints a rosier picture (margins) than actually exists. (Again, probably inconsequential, but why not include them?)


From the Asset page on MPEx:

Quote
virtual trading of virtual shares of unregistered corporations

 - http://polimedia.us/bitcoin/mpex.php?mpsic=S.DICE

I still have a hard time grasping how these voluntary associations are being referred to as companies and corporations.

I can see how the operator might be protected from being sued personally by a customer, for instance, if I am understanding the concept of corporation by estoppel.  But I hate to see the word corporation used for these "assets".    These are voluntary associations of otherwise unrelated parties.  I've written on this elsewhere:

 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=80139.msg897131#msg897131

When someone is talking about raising something like $7K for a project that you'ld never get a loan for from a bank or never would see finding through an Angel, for instance, then I think these cyber equities are a fantastic innovation.   But raisng over a quarter of a million dollars, with a valuation of several million dollars -- I wonder if this cyber-equities approach should be reconsidered.

What's the downside to finding a nice jurisdiction with great privacy laws an incorporating there?  There probably are several jurisdictions where you could incorporate yet still raise the funds through MPEx.
4776  Other / Off-topic / Re: What card are you using for M.Paks on: August 20, 2012, 07:57:06 AM
I need more then one card,as M.Paks only allows 1k max card load, per 7days...So what prepaid cards are you using?You can just PM me the card or cards that you have and the links..Thanks..

Ones with no monthly charge and accept Moneypak include:

 - https://www.americanexpress.com/us/content/prepaid/american-express-prepaid-card/faqs.html
 - http://www.wuprepaid.com/


From this thread:

 - http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=93152.msg1030597#msg1030597
4777  Economy / Service Announcements / Re: BuyBTC.cz - First BTC for Czech Crowns Service. on: August 20, 2012, 07:48:38 AM
we are the first site (anywhere as far as I can tell) that accepts Czech Crowns for BTC!

Well, technically second but I don't think Bitcoiny.cz is doing trades anymore:

 - http://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Bitcoiny.cz
 - http://www.bitcoiny.cz


So far it has stayed out of the European Currency Union, and Czech are very smart and pragmatic people.

Zing!

Welcome.  Please consider creating an article on the Bitcoin wiki for this.
4778  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Expanding Bitcoin as Payment Option on: August 20, 2012, 07:04:15 AM
The BC community is pretty large it seems.

The density of Bitcoiners in most any geographic location is low.

Where geography isn't a factor -- online, however, the numbers are larger, and are growing (though at varying degrees).  The Bitcoiner that buys bitcoins to feed a bad habit, for instance, doesn't have the same desire to see Bitcoin progress and gain wider acceptance.  Bitcoin serves a need and the person is content.  Then you have others who finally figured out that Bitcoin isn't dying down a deflationary spiral or that it hasn't been hacked into oblivion now more than a year since first learning of.  These are the new arrivals where two weeks after looking into Bitcoin has a trading bot or ecommerce site up and running, for instance.


I figure if enough people email the stores they shop at, some websites would really consider accepting BC and take it as a payment option.  Thus strengthening BC place in the world. :-)

I would bet the responses range from "Thank you, but we don't have any plans to support Bitcoin" on the one end to " > /dev/null' on the other.

What a store does respond to is an article in which some small operator became a big operator and credited Bitcoin as one of the reasons that happened.  We don't need ten online sellers who offer tea and accept bitcoin, we need ten Bitcoiners a week to be placing orders with one that does -- like New Mexico Tea Company which just added Bitcoin as a payment method.
 - http://www.nmteaco.com

We don't need ten restaurants in your city to get bugged about adding Bitcoin, we need every Bitcoiner in the area to agree on a single restaurant to focus on and then patronize it.  But as part of each visit, give bitcoin for the tip, and to appeal for the ability to pay the tab using bitcoin.  

Determining which retailer to focus on is pretty easy.   If the retailer takes Dwolla or Square, that likely means the manager is an early adopter and willing to try something new.  That would likely automatically avoid the situation where even if the local manager might be interested the franchise or individual that owns the place has no interest in Bitcoin or would be resistant to change.

And after a weekend like this last one, where the exchange rate dropped 50% in less than 48 hours, Bitcoin may not yet be mature enough for soliciting general acceptance.  It is preferable that the merchant wants to bring Bitcoin in versus being pushed towards using it.

4779  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Quick question: Does any site offer the ability to short sell? on: August 20, 2012, 02:31:37 AM
would be a pretty cool feature to add  Cool

There are also options.  

You could buy a PUT, giving you the opportunity to sell your bitcoins at a higher price even after the price goes down as you suspect it will.
Or you could sell a CALL option, and you collect the premium now.  When the price goes down the CALL expires worthless and you profit.

 - http://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/MPEx

and some peoeple are offering options through Bitcoin-OTC.

4780  Economy / Service Announcements / Re: bitinstant paycard on: August 20, 2012, 01:16:50 AM
Question:  Does BitInstant convert the BTC to $$ when you:

1) send the BTC to the address on the card,

or when you

2) swipe the card?

If (2), I love it.  If (1), I don't see the point.  The attraction for me is being able to keep my cash in BTC until I am ready to spend it.  If (2), I can pre-load the card with spending money once a week.  If (1), I would have to whip out a calculator and load the card with just enough funds 60 mins prior to every transaction. Too much hassle.

If I am comprehending this correctly, it would appear to mean if you have a BTC balance, it can convert from your BTCs when you make the charge.

Code:
<ThomasV_>	bitinstant: is there an option to keep the deposit as BTC until the card is used to make a payment or withdrawal?
<bitinstant> ThomasV, yes

<bitinstant> The Bitcoin Address on the card, is YOUR address we give you
<bitinstant> you can see balance on blockcgain

So the only time there would be a delay in being able to use the card is if both your BTC balance and your USD (or whatever) balance for the card are insufficient.  So then you send BTCs and after 1 confirmation (for an under $1K USD charge) those BTCs can be used for credit card purchases.

I don't know how they found an issuer (bank) that was willing to work this way.  From what little I know about it, for a prepaid debit card the process of adding funds to the card account are not in real-time.  Perhaps there is some notification when a charge authorization comes in that an external party (BitInstant) can transfer funds immediately and thus the authorization would never fail, as long as there were sufficient BTCs available.

I thought this might actually be a credit card used like a debit card where you get approval for a credit limit, and then all transactions are settled on a per-transaction basis from your BTC funds, but that's not at all the way this is being described.

Who knows, maybe there is some innovation occurring that allows them to work the way Charlie is describing them.  Looking forward to getting one!
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