Darn... as you can see I have no glass ball, but I can bet 48651667069 BTC that in the next year the average increase of difficulty will be between 15 and 20% on every step of 11-13 days  

Duh jumped that line, thank you!

So here's the result: https://tradeblock.com/mining/a/c42525c314

Good to mine for 6 months, then you can trash it away again  

Thank you!

It looks that you won't take back your investment if the machine costs 1000$ (but I think it will cost more).
https://tradeblock.com/mining/a/bb554ee8f3
And of course I have put in there the sheet values: 470 GH/s and 366W.

But if you spend 0 in electricity you will actually earn 21$ (0.03 BTC) after one year!
https://tradeblock.com/mining/a/2feb5cfd9d

Thank you for the explanation but I don't know if there's much to discuss.
If you FIND a block, you were actually LOOKING for something, that's why I use the word "extract".
In fact, you don't really FIND bitcoins, right? They are a reward because you FIND a block.
So you extract them thanks to your mining. Or you get them as a reward.
It's just words I think, there's 2 different POVs here, that's all.

Anyway, what do you think the price will be for this new piece of miner?

You must have some brain damage, or you are just playing dumb because you are friend with the owner of the "service".

You look a bit stupid with this question.

Here, if you are not a complete idiot, you can see that the difficulty is rising by around 15-20% on average for each step.
To be more precise, the average on the last 20 steps is around 18%, so my counts are even too sweet, as I based them on a 15% increase.
This last increase was a 24% hammer anyway.
And the more people will put power to mine (and this IS happening), the more the difficulty will rise.

But you know this perfectly, you are only playing dumb to not get your "activity" exposed  
I'll be here though, and I'll try to save as many people I can from cloud mining and especially from PBMining  
You better lower your prices and give back at least some chance of recovery of investment or you'll find me here wasting your efforts every time I'll find a minute.

As per title, asking you experts.

I'm not saying I can do it cheaper, I'm saying that PBMining (and probably all the other cloud miners as well) don't pay back.
As far as I know PBMining is the cheapest for MH/s so I guess the others are even worse.
Anyway, cheaper or not, you know perfectly that at 0.0036 per MH/s the payer will never get his money back  
So, you are actually scamming people or, at very least, teasing them.

BTW, I wish you spend all the money you will hold from me in doctors and medicines 

I wasn't considering the fact that BACK THEN when you made the contract, if you paid 0.0036 for GH/s, you GET them back.
This is because back then difficulty was lower, so you got much more reward.
It's new contracts that will never see it coming back.

Yes sure.
I proved it with simple math.
At 0.0036 / GHs you won't ever get back what you pay.
The image is there.
Numbers are there.

That's simply impossible unless you have referrals.
But referrals make of it a perfect Ponzi scheme.
You didn't get fucked, but you fucked somebody else.
Still, the site is a scam.

And Germany will lose 0 - 2

I didn't talk about the % of net owned by somebody in my thread, the title is clear.
The title is boring but very clear, but you didn't read the post and you talk about % of network owned.

Anyway, can you prove my calculations wrong somehow?
Otherwise you are just talking.
And my calculations are very easy to reproduce:

Initial cost.
First BTC income after 12 days.
Previous BTC income after 12 days - 15% (now 25% sigh).
Repeat.

See what you get back after 1 year.

The image in the opening post is very easy to understand.
Unless you can prove that image false or wrong, I am right.

And I am not posting here to attack PBMining, CEX.IO pays even less than PBM.
I am here to say that cloud mining will never get you back what you put in, by simple math, not in 1 year, not in 2, never.
Unless difficulty will get lower than 10% or something like that (not great chance).



Edit: mhhhhh I see your signature... and your reliability... high chance you are the same owner of PBMining, just another account made to fight people uncovering your scam, you probably have several accounts for this purpose. Or maybe a friend, it doesn't matter anyway.

Or maybe just somebody who can't count (there are many, anyway, and I also trashed some money in PBM before realizing it was wrong) and now can't admit he mistaken.

This thread may interest somebody...

You are right but keep also on mind that this is a completely new thing, and many people not only can't understand how they get hacked, many don't even install or keep updated an antivirus... the truth is that half population of the world is simply not ready for Bitcoin... it's like they would walk with a bag full of money on their shoulders and don't care if they are going into the bad famed spot of the city.

Erm... they PLAY, in return.
Bitcoin has no other function than replacing money, it's not so fun as CoD.

I mean it, you gave good info, but the way you post is irritating.
Keep in mind there are probably something less than 7 billion people out there that know far less than what I know, about Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies.
It's good to explain things, it's not good to talk to people like if they were idiots.

Could you add an image based password?
That would make it perfect, probably.

Thank you for all the info, that's all good news, but even when you know everything about Bitcoin you shouldn't talk (write) like a presumptuous dick.

Anyway, the basic problem of giving people a good impression since the very first moment they enter Bitcoin, remains.

As I wrote, most people aren't computer experts or geeks, they just want to escape from the bank system (the ones who understand its perversion).

For how I see it, a Bitcoin light client ready in the very same page where you can download the Bitcoin full client, probably on the model of Electrum, would be the best solution.
Then they'll have all the time to learn that there are other wallets, web wallets, etc. but as first impact I think this should be done.

Less nodes probably means also slower confirmations of transactions.
But this shouldn't be a real problem, as the userbase widens, also full nodes will be more.
I would hold a node up as well if I didn't have this crappy connection.

But anyway, what I wanted to put the accent on, is that this file is becoming large and annoying.
I don't want to say that you can't deal with it, but the world is NOT USA, there are other countries.
With my connection, in that shit of country named Italy, I need more than two days to download the whole blockchain.
Space is not so much a problem FOR ME, as I have over 3 TB of hard disks, but many people have old computers, they are not geeks or nerds and are only interested in disconnecting themselves from banks and saving their money.
Not to mention people going around with tablets and smartphones. You can't ask them to fuck up all their memory with the blockchain.

What I want to pass on over here is that NEW USERS will get annoyed by this, and I think there's no doubt this file IS a bit heavy.
And I want to pass over that if Bitcoin will boom, like everyone of us hopes, the transactions number will grow exponentially.
Then what will you do if you go on 4GB per month growth of the blockchain size?
Better solve this problem now, I think.

Plurality is also a factor of security.
Once a dev shuts down its wallet for whatever reason, what will you do?

Why I can't vote?