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Well I still don't see anyone linking any reasoning behind why this isn't just a fly-by-night scam, but I guess we can all just hope for the best.
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i think we should consider some % of GPU going to ebay
at this time i think 70% power is from gpu wchich will be unprofitable in few months.
people will sell rigs.
' People will only sell rigs when GPU is overshadowed by ASIC, which will only happen when ASIC occurs en masse, which will make the loss of GPUs likely less significant. I wouldn't expect 70% of the current network to be GPUs. Currently the network is on a big high, but its looking like there is about 120TH online. Roughly 30TH of that is ASICMiner (asicminercharts.com), which is already 25%. 21TH is Batch 1 Avalons, If we assume 25% of Batch 2 Avalons are online today thats another 10TH (may be more), we're already at 50% of the network being ASICs. Then there are FPGAs, which I'll just guess at 10%, so GPU is likely closer to 40% of the network. I'm guessing most GPUs will start to go offline as difficulty passes 45Million depending on efficiency, and BTC value, at which point GPU would only comprise ~10% of the total network. |
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I like that there is a forum ad directing people to this thread, and that if they decide to see where the thread headed, going to the last page (like me!) this is what they read.
BitcoinTalk you always have something to offer don'cha?
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To date I have yet to hear of one person happy with their dual PSU setup, almost always leads to problems. I am intrigued by the product http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817206001 however I do not know if it is a good value, but that's probably one of the only ways I'd recommend dual PSU. You are probably running your PSU close to its limit, so maybe underclock/undervolt a bit and hope for the best. |
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You're unlikely to break even anytime soon if you're buying all of this stuff brand new, you'd be better off using the money from rig costs to just buy bitcoins.
Now onto your questions
1) 2600mhash -- 2800mhash depending on how well your cards perform and if you're willing to overclock them.
2) ASRock z77 extreme 6 mobo is pretty decent, lots of pcie slots. You'll need a 1200watt psu but I'd recommend 1300watts and the highest quality psu you can get. Get some pcie riser cards 1x --> 16x as well as 16x --> 16x. Cheapest processor that'll fit your mobo (1155 socket), cheapest ram you can get, cheapest hdd you can get. I'd build a custom case so you can cool the cards better and fit them in easy, check the "Show us your mining rig" page for ideas.
3) The difficulty for mining is about to skyrocket with all of the asics coming on board in the next few months meaning gpu's won't be profitable for mining as the electricity costs will strip your of any proffits from mining. If you just want coins, easier to just buy them. Of course if AMD release their 9xxx series gpu's they might be useable but that's a long way off.
Thank you for your responses. Are there any threads around (I looked and was not met with much success) detailing the finer aspects of building a mining rig (instructions, etc.)? Also as for ROI buying it now, I am not going to mine BTC with it. I intend to mine LTC in the dead time and when new altcoins are released, mine them in hopes they increase in value (such as WDC). Would that method of mining be met with profit? Thanks in advance  This is probably one of the simplest most sensible builds I've seen. It's easy, pretty affordable, replicable, and modifiable (it's for litecoin but you can of course use it for bitcoin or whatever you choose). You can buy a slightly bigger milk crate or stuff the cards in more tightly and get 4 cards on the same design as well, if you use the motherboard recommended above, or any 4+ PCI-E board. |
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They don't look like a scam based on what exactly? I don't speak russian so I'm at a disadvantage, but I don't see any pics of prototypes, designs, models, contracts with fabbers, etc. Have they made any previous products, like FPGAs or whatever?
The non-refundable no-chargeback bitcoin only sale is nerve-wracking.
I'm just curious what makes you so confident in these russian fellows.
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Then stop complaining. I had £12 in my bank account. Was bored, started my own £1M company at 13. Do something about it other than complain. In either case, why do we have to hear the QQ?
Paying for college: 15UhE4x7d1hD2o2YKCcdddzuhymsTKdeuz Ah internet... 4 years of engineering and a 2 year MBA at Harvard/MIT = big bucks. Your attempt at logic was a good try though. In other news, ASICs are retardedly priced right now, but I blame the bitcoin community more than the manufacturers. ASICMiner is a perfect example, they publicly announced that pricing would be based on the auction results, and more or less true to their word, they were. The first batch auctioned for ~75BTC (more than a blade will probably ever make in its lifetime), Second batch went for 66 or so (see above). Third batch was priced-in at 50BTC and sold out the same day I believe? With a backlog of 140orders on top of their offering.
The third batch may or may not break-even or produce a tiny amount of profit, yet demand for them is so high it is as though they were batch 1 avalons (the price people are paying for a blade is roughly equivalent to what people are paying for batch 2 in-hand avalons, so don't try to say "oh but they ship now!").
So again, the community is at fault, too much capital, not enough sense. C'est la vie.
Have to say it for the 3000th time. Even at 150m difficulty in a year, blades still ROI in 16-20 weeks depending on batch. Remember when it was QQ Avalon B2s overpriced, then QQQQ Avalon B3s rip off? Being bemused by your self-aggrandizing and likely fabricated statements is not an "attempt at logic". I do hope "Harvard/MIT" are a little more selective in their candidates (or perhaps they are revamping their courses in logic, be it electrical, mathematical, or philosophical), but perhaps not. 150M in a year at what rate, linear? I'm sure a "Harvard MBA" like yourself can think outside linear growth. |
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Then stop complaining. I had £12 in my bank account. Was bored, started my own £1M company at 13. Do something about it other than complain. In either case, why do we have to hear the QQ?
Paying for college: 15UhE4x7d1hD2o2YKCcdddzuhymsTKdeuz Ah internet... In other news, ASICs are retardedly priced right now, but I blame the bitcoin community more than the manufacturers. ASICMiner is a perfect example, they publicly announced that pricing would be based on the auction results, and more or less true to their word, they were. The first batch auctioned for ~75BTC (more than a blade will probably ever make in its lifetime), Second batch went for 66 or so (see above). Third batch was priced-in at 50BTC and sold out the same day I believe? With a backlog of 140orders on top of their offering. The third batch may or may not break-even or produce a tiny amount of profit, yet demand for them is so high it is as though they were batch 1 avalons (the price people are paying for a blade is roughly equivalent to what people are paying for batch 2 in-hand avalons, so don't try to say "oh but they ship now!"). So again, the community is at fault, too much capital, not enough sense. C'est la vie. There is method to some of our madness. I am using the blades as a hedge against the 5 batch 3 Avalons I have on order. If my Avalons arrive super late, I am betting that the difficulty won't be so high and my blades will make an ROI sooner. If the Avalons arrive earlier, maybe my blades won't be as profitable but 360,000 MH/s of hashing power should heal that wound pretty quick. Moral of the story: don't assume you know what everyone's motives are. I understand all your rationalizations, and some of them might even make a little sense in certain contexts, I don't disagree with that. They are still irrationally narrow-focused, 'motive' aside. I don't even want to get into a debate about what kind of hedge a 4-month break-even 50BTC device is against an 80BTC (difficulty doubling) device, that's for you and your god to work out. The market has borne a great deal of capital-glut, and it may yield a great number of happy individuals, or we may hear a bunch of crying and moaning about destroyed lives. No one knows, but it is still a capital-glut nonetheless. I don't begrudge you fellows, because it doesn't affect me, except in keeping me out of the market, but I wasn't banking my life on that anyway. I enjoy mining as a tech-geek, but I don't feel the need to expect it to replace my day-job. The customers have spoken, and created device costs that are close to unreasonable, excepting under self-convincing circumstances, and that's just how it is. Needn't really be a big debate either way about it. |
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Then stop complaining. I had £12 in my bank account. Was bored, started my own £1M company at 13. Do something about it other than complain. In either case, why do we have to hear the QQ?
Paying for college: 15UhE4x7d1hD2o2YKCcdddzuhymsTKdeuz Ah internet... In other news, ASICs are retardedly priced right now, but I blame the bitcoin community more than the manufacturers. ASICMiner is a perfect example, they publicly announced that pricing would be based on the auction results, and more or less true to their word, they were. The first batch auctioned for ~75BTC (more than a blade will probably ever make in its lifetime), Second batch went for 66 or so (see above). Third batch was priced-in at 50BTC and sold out the same day I believe? With a backlog of 140orders on top of their offering. The third batch may or may not break-even or produce a tiny amount of profit, yet demand for them is so high it is as though they were batch 1 avalons (the price people are paying for a blade is roughly equivalent to what people are paying for batch 2 in-hand avalons, so don't try to say "oh but they ship now!"). So again, the community is at fault, too much capital, not enough sense. C'est la vie. |
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Just because I *should* be sleeping I will reply here.
You are based in florida but you have priced your auction in euros? Kind of strange and random.
Your order is from March 2013, yet you expect to sell a pre-order for > $140,000 (~$14,000 per unit)? One could order 6 units today for the price of one of your units, and expect to receive them roughly in the same time period (by which I mean after difficulty has been jacked to the moon).
I'm not a fan of thread-crapping, but this sale makes no sense. Assuming your last ebay auction wasn't a troll bid, I feel bad for whoever bought into that.
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I would just snag some PCI-E power splitters. http://www.ebay.com/itm/290778077889?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649Running gfx cards off a molex is bad. It's too much load on that single 12v. Thats why PCI-E has 3 12v and 3-5 grounds. I own about 26 of them in my basement mining rigs, never had a problem. Last time I used molex for my gfx cards, I melted the wire and the modular connection at the power supply and killed the port, and that was with only 2 radeon 5850. Holy god, I'd be much more worried about that than molex->PCI-E. 6-pin PCI-E is designed to transfer 75W, 8pin is designed to transmit 150W, 1x75 -> 2x150W seems like a bad idea. I've run a number of cards off 2xmolex->1x6pin and never had any problem. I suppose YMMV. |
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AX = Seasonic ? Well learn something new everyday. Thanks. I'd say get the AX then Almost all major PSU suppliers are rebranded OEMs from actual manufacturers. The people who actually make the PSUs you probably haven't heard of most of the time (except Seasonic perhaps). You always need to dig beneath the mask to figure out what's going on. For example, The CX-400 is a seasonic unit (the X line? Not sure precisely), while the CX-430 is a Channel-Well product. Now even beyond that, you should recognize that CWT is a hit or miss company, they make some good/decent/bad products. For example the GS corsair line is also CWT, but they're fairly crappy low quality units. The HX-1050 is CWT, but actually high quality build, and one of the standards of high power PSUs for years back in the day. The TX750v2 is a seasonic product, that is actually one of my favs, although it's only a Bronze unit and not modular. |
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let me fire up this computer again...looks like they just came back online a little bit ago. They were down yesterday and this morning
I can see the website, no need to DDOS. Anyone dumb enough to send money to people who can't spell and who put up a pic of a router next to a shit mouse and 5 year old iPod as 'proof' deserves to loose their money tbh. Lose. Loose is the opposite of tight, or restrictive. |
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Your profit margin is MUCh greater with litecoin. Don't bother with mining bitcoins, only ASICS can make money on mining bitcoins these days.
Welcome to the world of uninformed opinion. Over in the world of data based information: Bitcoin SHA-256 238234 12153411.709776 25 1.000000000 100.00%
Litecoin scrypt 360300 595.65349676 50 0.024000000 Vircurex 97.94% Litecoin is currently trading at 98% profitability hash for hash. Discounting the finnicky nature of litecoin mining, the higher power consumption and heat issues, you're still making less currently mining litecoin. That said, since the two are roughly equivalent, there isn't that much difference, unless you are speculating on the future. Some people are bullish on litecoin, some are bearish. I myself would be bearish, but there's really not enough data to provide any kind of substantive answer. |
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CX is the budget line, lowest quality, still decent
TX is the next step up, more for casual gamer builds, decent as well
HX is the enthusiast line, high power, good quality, slightly older line however.
AX is the top of line quality power snob units, superb quality (was seasonic in the older AX, I believe the newer units are Flextronics however)
I personally would go with the AX because I feel like you can't go wrong with higher power quality, but anything typically has had good results. Maybe skip CX if you're really going high power.
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Wow, why is this thread 8 pages long?
First page should just be "sup, this is a scam move on" and it should never have gone past that.
I think this is part of why I can't really get motivated by bitcoin the way I want. The community seems to have far too much money, and far too little sense.
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None of this is news. It's been this way since the beginning of bitcoin, and it's actually why the spread of ASIC is potentially the savior of the bitcoin network. CPU -> GPU was the same thing, $1M in GPUs would have totally destroyed the fledgling bitcoin chain then (admittedly GPUs were more readily available than ASICs are, but the idea still stands).
However after ASICs there are no (known) revolutionary advancements of the same kind, that allow minimal investment to dominate the existing infrastructure. This is a rocky time where the network is vulnerable, but as ASICs start rolling out and the network expands it will quickly close the gap.
Not really sure what it has to do with SHA256 though.
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Mincoin scrypt 71322 0.722 2 0.001030010 mcxNOW 138.71%
Worldcoin Worldcoin scrypt 74611 2.50674314 32 0.000190150 mcxNOW 118.00%
DigitalCoin DigitalCoin scrypt 34530 1.683 20 0.000195500 Cryptsy 112.94%
BitBar BitBar scrypt 8878 11.101 0.172421 0.140000000 Bter.com 105.71%
Terracoin Terracoin SHA-256 134717 25063.342011809647 20 0.002620000 Bter.com 101.64% All more profitable than bitcoin atm. Now there's huge swings so doubtful that any of them will be long term winners. That aside, ASICs will definitely drive tons of GPU miners to alt-coins and drop their profitability significantly. Will it tend towards 100%? No, of course not. It is only tending that way due to GPUs being the majority of both networks. When GPUs are the exclusive domain of alt-coins (scrypt based at least) there will most likely be a push towards a ratio which makes alt-coin mining slightly profitable over electricity cost, as was bitcoin, on the semi-useful / new coin chains. I would be more intersted to see if all the new coin nonsense that we see now will continue after ASICs dominate bitcoin, GPU miners sell off their rigs, and there is less people interested in network hopping and speculating in alts. |
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I don't know about 7970, the ones i ordered are coming this monday, but my 3 x 7950 are using 510W (at the wall) right now, 1.4 GH @ 1.125v, Will try this mod to lower it to 1.100V first, then 1.050v, I'm pretty sure it would reduce the power consumption at least for 80W or more, but yes, modify the bios by hand is dangerous hehe Altsay: Yes the PSU i am using is 5% LESS efficient than a coolermaster GX (tested it, but have to change it anyway because my GX is only 650W and using 500W from a 650W PSU scare the shit outta me, so I stick with the Sentey SDP850SS (850W), less efficient but more secure, more than 300W spare. You might want to look into your settings, you are running super slow. While you are saving a little bit by having lower power consumption, you are also losing a ton of $/Mhash by running expensive cards at low speeds. |
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Hello,
I am waiting on a BFL ASIC that hopefully will arrive some time this summer. I am told end of July is likely. I would like to find out if there is any calculator out there that can make a reasonable prediction of the expected bitcoin network difficulty some time into the future using existing data about the network growth rate.
What difficulty can be expected 1st of august, 2013?
check my sig about difficulty going to 1 billion Are you referring to the organiofcorti link in your sig? Since all of the assumptions it uses are wrong, it is essentially invalid? 1. Assumptions
Updated information plus my current guesses and estimates:
Arrivals are constant. Rather than modelling arrival times, I'm assuming a constant rate of hashes per second added to the network for each of the batches.
Batch 1: COMPLETE. (I know it's not quite, but near enough for this analysis).
Batch 2: 600 of 67 Ghps units delivered from 1st May to 31st May.
Batch 3: 500 of an even mix of 67 and 85 Ghps units, delivered from 1st June to 30th June.
BFL delivers 2000 Ghps per day (~35 SC Singles per day) from 15th May to 31st July.
ASICMiner delivers 1.15 Thps per day for a total of 100Thps until 31st July.
Batch 2, almost no units delivered to date as of 5/26/2013 (may 26th); Batch 2 assumption wrong Batch 3: It's almost June 1st, batch 2 is barely trickling out, no word on batch 3 plans, Batch 3 assumption basically wrong. BFL Delivers 2000 Ghps per day: Lol. Not even a single SC single has gone out. BFL assumption way way way wrong. ASICMiner delivers 1.15Thps per day: Uhm, again, not even close. Peaked at 23TH, currently down to about 18TH, definitely not adding > 1TH per day. Every assumption is wrong, so all calculations based on those assumptions must be wrong as well, so why would you reference that? Will difficulty go to a billion? Hell yeah, but not that way. |
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