Let's get this straight:
People who bought "The DAO" tokens own lot's of Ethereum, in fact they probably own up to 50% of the Networks Ethereum.
Secondly, all GPU miners require the buy support of "The DAO" token holders on the exchanges.
Therefore, when the "The DAO" got a SUPER-HACKED and those people were getting stolen from, it had to be fixed in their favour!
To protect Ethereum's "Buy Support" on exchanges, the Fork was a necessity.
As for the couple of hundred people with ASIC hardware or expecting delivery ASIC hardware or with FGPA's, they simply explioted the Super-Hack to make a clone-coin to sell cheapo coins for the next few years:
Constantly, reminding "The DAO" owners, that the couple of hundred people behind ETC would happily chuck "The DAO" owners under Bus ain't going work!
same did stalin hitler and the other tyrans say your bs is priceless |
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thats the thing the only conection is alex van de sande
he said we drained it
who is we?
he sais now he wasnt involved but he gave them his tokens.
who is them ?
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As i recall that was one of the many options at that moment, stall untill hard fork happened. And anyone with knowledge could drain the DAO, from being one of the many that wanted to counter the initial attacker to the one that owns the funds, well theres a very very long way. So is there anything that ties ethereum developers to that except for these speculations ? Because there could be 1000 different people that posted as "whitehat" attacker.
Theres nothing in your links that prooves anything, aside for speculations. If any developer from foundation tried to drain the dao before the hacker atacked again, or any other hacker trying to replicate the first atack, by your logic it means automatically he/she owns the other ~7mil ether ?
thats the thing the only conection is alex van de sande he said we drained it who is we? he sais now he wasnt involved but he gave them his tokens. who is them ? |
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and since alex van de sande admited he gave them his tokens to do the white hat hack
he knows there names
he was in contact with them he had to give them acess to his tokens.
thats the red line to follow. then we will get names !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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So where does this leave us right now? Who or what entity is holding the funds in Poloniex? Since poloniex is a regulated exchange, the account that holds all the recovered funds surely must be held by a real person and he surely could be brought to stand trial in court if any owner of DAO thought so?
AFAIK polo allows anyone to create an account and deposit any amount of crypto currency. They will do KYC if you try to withdraw above a certain amount. So it's technically possible that the account holding the funds is anonymous. yes but if so they cant withdraw . and who would sent coins to a acount they cant withdraw ? or only little pices day by day. ok ok you are right look at the story they have no brain sure they are that stupid . |
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Free ETC coins credited to users balances (same balances as ETH on Wed, 20 Jul 2016 01:20:40 GMT (1920000 eth block). Damn, no free coins?  The other exchanges gave us tons of free coins. didnt they get informed by the ethereum foundation ? or is the rumor tru that vitalik sent letters to the exchanges and said etc will not happen they dont need to be prepared ? hmmm interesting case what if they decide to claim refund from the foundation ? |
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my thought about POS
the tech of pos is for sure a interesting one. but
my experiance with bitshares showed it is not yet makeable
i was with bitshares from the beginning
thought it is interesting.
updating wallets again and again
till at the end the chain crashed my pcs
i had to give up
and i do have average and some a bit better ones
had bitshares running on most of them
just to see how it turns out
i dont think the masses are ready for POS
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If you vote by address anyone can open multiple address with a light client like myetherwallet.com
If you vote by coin, many miners will miss out as they often cash out 80% each month to pay power costs.
Maybe there is a way of voting with a node, but some miners mine at a light client address from a mining pool and not run a node.
Lots of stuff just don't join up.
What do you feel about having 2 address for voting. One address "yes" / Other address "no"
You send a small amount (0.1) etc to the address of your choice but you can only send once from a wallet running geth.
Is that doable?
what are we voting on? voting clearly needs to be weighted by holding - the main holders of ETC will not go with any crap that each one wallet (and thousands of 1 ETC wallets on GETH) holding miniscule ETC should have equal say in anything ETC related compared to someone holding 1,000's of ETC in ONE WALLET. Its not representative of the community what you seem to be suggesting? The owners of ETC need to be represented by the investment and risk they are taking in this venture and the long term future of ETC. I'm a miner but not sure what you do to take this interest into account? Like me - most miners go where the money is. Few miners can afford to consider the long term and as such I don't feel that miners votes would be truly representative of long term interests and support for ETC. The miner votes would generally support continued mining - but it takes investors in the end to maintain price and if they vacate the scene because they are not represented - price falls and miners leave. As for using GETH - its a 3 legged dog. MIST and Etherwallet are based on GETH and too cumbersome IMO. Parity --geth mode and MyEtherWallet.com are the better options by far (MEW especially) - so I will NEVER use GETH even for an important vote. You need to understand that there are VERY major holders in ETC (pity no rich list - it would blow you away). carbonvote - developed by the Chinese ETH community was actually a very fair voting system. Its open source. Suggest you have a look. https://github.com/consenlabs/carbonvoteThats all that I will accept unless someone comes up with a better method of weighting to account for "skin in the game". For the record again - I favour POS for ETC before the diff bomb cuts in. As @iCEBREAKER seems to - and he makes sense: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1559630.msg15836594#msg15836594) So if there is any voting I will be holding out for it to be weighted for holding (and most ETC owners of any substance will demand this - you can expect that something like 5% of holders own 70% of ETC) and I will be voting for POS (this may be more contentious) but I believe its best for the long term for ETC. i do understand your argument about investments and the risk you take so you think you should have a bigger say in a voting. green and i are just starting this conversation about a vote becouse it was clear in the fork vote it was not a good one. many didnt know of it. so if you say carbonvote is good well is it save too ? and can it be manipulatet ? just questions ..... i think for the futur to avoid situations like the one we have now it need to set up rules for voting and forks plus a vote needs a information time befor vote. befor the fork there was fragments of info around or just statements like vitalik saying he is profork and they didnt really tell what the fork will do yes you say on the github but holders are not that good at techniqual stuff they want to know what it means for the futur of a coin. |
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the Merkle ran with...White Hat Hackers Caught Red-handed During Attempted ETC Sell-off"After the funds were recovered by the white hat hackers, some transactions were sent to exchange wallets This caused a lot of speculation among Ethereum Classic enthusiasts, as there was no official explanation for doing so. Moreover, the ETC price saw a significant decline, which seemed to indicate the funds was being sold-off by these “trustworthy” individuals."http://themerkle.com/white-hat-hackers-caught-red-handed-during-attempted-etc-sell-off/ can it get any deeper ? its a shame that the eth suporters dont see that eth needs a clean out or do they realy want to get on with such criminals among them ? |
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and it seems this white hat hackers( ethereum foundation devs) thought o great we put this etc we got and wont give them back to the dao holders
we sell them for eth and invest them in our project that way we hurt ETC and help ETH
wow
a rogue who thinks bad of them
not one unce of criminal in them
Yeah dude, that's where many of us have issue. They don't own those, they don't own the blockchain but they are getting homero garza syndrome (paycoin for you noobs, sec investigation..um yeah) and think they can do what they want. Not only is it wrong it's a huge insult to their supporters and a very telling situation of them as people. They should not be in charge of anything, especially a blockchain with this kind of market cap. I'm not fudding, I hate that shit. Just my opinion. right and thats why i will keep asking questions till the shit has moved from eth and eth can start new with honor and trust again |
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and it seems this white hat hackers( ethereum foundation devs) thought o great we put this etc we got and wont give them back to the dao holders
we sell them for eth and invest them in our project that way we hurt ETC and help ETH
wow
a rogue who thinks bad of them
not one unce of criminal in them
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It is very obvious there are posters on this forum that are hell bent on continuing to put Ethereum down anyway possible. They are not here to simple discuss things related to Ethereum. They can easily go to or create their own thread. These posters are going out of their way on purpose. This shows their malice. The arguments they bring up are so ridiculous, implausible, historical contradictory, and without any kind of credibility that they are not worth the time to bother about replying to. This may very well be the continuous co-ordinated effort by very few to try to keep etc alive in all ways possible. They are trying anything and everything.
The simple consideration that they could be trying to build there own community in there own space getting on with their own thing instead of doing this shows the psychology intent behind them and what they are all about.
The way things have and are historically playing out, continually enforces that the hackers and now any affiliates have alot to lose in this, and their whole world will be to extract as much out of this as possible. They are dealing with life changing amounts of money for themselves. Coupled to some peoples want to destroy Ethereum that will only be allayed by them trying to take control of it.
Amen. Forkers tried very hard to destroy Ethereum but they couldn't. They should move on to some other space to whine. This thread is for Ethereum. The Ethereum Classic has already declared its independence, so it should create a thread for its own. Ethereum Classic has never been dependent in the first place. This is why there is no point to declare its independence. The Ethereum Forked has already declared its dependence, so it should create a thread for its own. yes and those guy demanding someone like me has to shut up or go hate the fact that etherfork has a lot of problems not adressing them wont make them disapear. just imagine there are critical people like me who own ETH and are pissed off about how the leading is done. very bad decitions made so again the open questions is the hacker a insider ? and will they do something about it ? what about the diff bomb? and why on earth would someone do such a reckless thing and implement it ? whos idea was it ? a fork is always a risk so why this diff bomb ? and what will they do about the replay attack ? i know some will call this trolling but i realy would like to get answers. Yep to be clear I may come here and fuck with you all but that's because I'm a holder too, quite alot actually at premine sale prices so I could dump right now and still make even more profit than I have mining and trading eth. It all boils down to misleading and general shadyness, I mean I figured if your smart enough to pull off writing a programming language that runs on the blockchain, a new mining algorithm and round up millions of dollars surely you know the crypto community and the value and importance of the blockchain? Then all this DAO fuck up, then rolling back history white hats acting as individuals that are on the dev team/foundation...it shouldn't be any surprise that there are a lot of pissed off people.especially because now they seem like just straight up thieves.it's not what our community needs right now. It's too bad, it was going so good. If I offend you, sorry and fuck off. Some people get my humor some are fucking stupid so....I'll be exiting eth soon though, I have zero trust or interest in these selfish clowns anymore. But not until I see what they're tactic is on the horizon, myself and a few cohorts too can crash markets so we will just sit patient for now and see how this plays out. and permanent asking made this happen https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/4xasg3/follow_up_statement_on_the_etc_salvaged_from/?st=irr1dbga&sh=41e88fc6"Following the events of the last 24 hours we want to keep the community updated: After having received repeated legal threats from various individuals holding significant stakes in The DAO (still continuing), we sought legal advice to help us pursue our goal without endangering ourselves or the salvaged funds. We found support and legal advice from Bity SA, a trusted Swiss entity. It has agreed to protect, secure and later distribute the funds equitably under an independent Swiss legal structure. The number 1 goal has always been to ensure that the salvaged funds are distributed in a fair, transparent and just manner. This remains unchanged. When the salvaged ETC were able to be recovered, signals were received from the greater community to distribute these ETC in ETH, to continue to support Ethereum projects. Also, a large portion of the community does not have the technical ability to safely work both with ETC and ETH in the same address; therefore, returning part of salvaged ETC in ETH seemed to be the safest for all the parties involved. The first actions from the Swiss structure took place Tuesday August 9th and it preferred to not announce the movement of ETC in advance to avoid speculators taking advantage of the situation. Part of these funds are still on exchanges and the rest of the funds are held in the following accounts: ETC Multisig: 0x1ac729d2db43103faf213cb9371d6b42ea7a830f ETH Multisig: 0xd3b0b4fc31ee1f8570c75c19caa93cc1557e538f BTC Multisig: 3JYwxuaHGKt8rZ9NbTEcyYRXtqkfN5Lz5Y It has now become clear that this approach will introduce many unnecessary complications and wouldn’t bring certainty to all DAO Token Holders that they would be treated equally and with fairness. The objective evolved from the most desirable outcome (distributing ETH and ETC) to the most efficient and comprehensible distribution solution, that all funds will be made available in ETC to the DAO Token Holders. To achieve this, all exchanges will be asked to return the funds to the Multisig wallets. We would like to thank the community for their trust and ask for their patience as the responsibility of returning this value to the DAO Token Holders is not an easy task. We are under a lot of pressure, but throughout this process we will continue to do the best that we can to protect the interests of the DAO Token Holders. All the legal and technical work of the community members and the companies involved, has always been on a volunteer and pro-bono basis. Following our first statement, members of the community have expressed their keenness to donate crypto assets in recognition for the efforts deployed to salvage the ETC from the attackDAOs and to distribute it back to the community. Accordingly, it will be possible to donate when retrieving the funds. We will communicate next with a detailed plan for the distribution." Let's not overlook the details here, the whole reason for the rollback bailout fiasco was to save peoples eth. There was no such thing as etc. Now after they forked and have control over the eth, they are pulling the switcheroo and paying people in etc. Gee isn't that something? Pay attention people. You dao folks should demand your eth, it's worth alot more. Don't let them pocket even more eth to sell and get majority of the PoS rewards. This is what I'm getting at guys. Pay attention, quit defending and open your eyes. can it be you misunderstand? prefork there was a chain on that chain there was the dao hack both dao hacks. after the fork there are twin chains. on the second chain whats now called ETH the dao as a whole is rolled back so every dao investor already got this ether but on the twin chain every ether holder befor fork ( and that includes ether invested in the dao) gets a twin etc coin. so the dao investors got there originaly investment back on the ETH chain and must get equal ETC on the ETCchain like every other prefork ether holder. the code is the law blockchains is unchangeable |
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thank you MalReynolds and all the others
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It is very obvious there are posters on this forum that are hell bent on continuing to put Ethereum down anyway possible. They are not here to simple discuss things related to Ethereum. They can easily go to or create their own thread. These posters are going out of their way on purpose. This shows their malice. The arguments they bring up are so ridiculous, implausible, historical contradictory, and without any kind of credibility that they are not worth the time to bother about replying to. This may very well be the continuous co-ordinated effort by very few to try to keep etc alive in all ways possible. They are trying anything and everything.
The simple consideration that they could be trying to build there own community in there own space getting on with their own thing instead of doing this shows the psychology intent behind them and what they are all about.
The way things have and are historically playing out, continually enforces that the hackers and now any affiliates have alot to lose in this, and their whole world will be to extract as much out of this as possible. They are dealing with life changing amounts of money for themselves. Coupled to some peoples want to destroy Ethereum that will only be allayed by them trying to take control of it.
Amen. Forkers tried very hard to destroy Ethereum but they couldn't. They should move on to some other space to whine. This thread is for Ethereum. The Ethereum Classic has already declared its independence, so it should create a thread for its own. Ethereum Classic has never been dependent in the first place. This is why there is no point to declare its independence. The Ethereum Forked has already declared its dependence, so it should create a thread for its own. yes and those guy demanding someone like me has to shut up or go hate the fact that etherfork has a lot of problems not adressing them wont make them disapear. just imagine there are critical people like me who own ETH and are pissed off about how the leading is done. very bad decitions made so again the open questions is the hacker a insider ? and will they do something about it ? what about the diff bomb? and why on earth would someone do such a reckless thing and implement it ? whos idea was it ? a fork is always a risk so why this diff bomb ? and what will they do about the replay attack ? i know some will call this trolling but i realy would like to get answers. Yep to be clear I may come here and fuck with you all but that's because I'm a holder too, quite alot actually at premine sale prices so I could dump right now and still make even more profit than I have mining and trading eth. It all boils down to misleading and general shadyness, I mean I figured if your smart enough to pull off writing a programming language that runs on the blockchain, a new mining algorithm and round up millions of dollars surely you know the crypto community and the value and importance of the blockchain? Then all this DAO fuck up, then rolling back history white hats acting as individuals that are on the dev team/foundation...it shouldn't be any surprise that there are a lot of pissed off people.especially because now they seem like just straight up thieves.it's not what our community needs right now. It's too bad, it was going so good. If I offend you, sorry and fuck off. Some people get my humor some are fucking stupid so....I'll be exiting eth soon though, I have zero trust or interest in these selfish clowns anymore. But not until I see what they're tactic is on the horizon, myself and a few cohorts too can crash markets so we will just sit patient for now and see how this plays out. and permanent asking made this happen https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/4xasg3/follow_up_statement_on_the_etc_salvaged_from/?st=irr1dbga&sh=41e88fc6"Following the events of the last 24 hours we want to keep the community updated: After having received repeated legal threats from various individuals holding significant stakes in The DAO (still continuing), we sought legal advice to help us pursue our goal without endangering ourselves or the salvaged funds. We found support and legal advice from Bity SA, a trusted Swiss entity. It has agreed to protect, secure and later distribute the funds equitably under an independent Swiss legal structure. The number 1 goal has always been to ensure that the salvaged funds are distributed in a fair, transparent and just manner. This remains unchanged. When the salvaged ETC were able to be recovered, signals were received from the greater community to distribute these ETC in ETH, to continue to support Ethereum projects. Also, a large portion of the community does not have the technical ability to safely work both with ETC and ETH in the same address; therefore, returning part of salvaged ETC in ETH seemed to be the safest for all the parties involved. The first actions from the Swiss structure took place Tuesday August 9th and it preferred to not announce the movement of ETC in advance to avoid speculators taking advantage of the situation. Part of these funds are still on exchanges and the rest of the funds are held in the following accounts: ETC Multisig: 0x1ac729d2db43103faf213cb9371d6b42ea7a830f ETH Multisig: 0xd3b0b4fc31ee1f8570c75c19caa93cc1557e538f BTC Multisig: 3JYwxuaHGKt8rZ9NbTEcyYRXtqkfN5Lz5Y It has now become clear that this approach will introduce many unnecessary complications and wouldn’t bring certainty to all DAO Token Holders that they would be treated equally and with fairness. The objective evolved from the most desirable outcome (distributing ETH and ETC) to the most efficient and comprehensible distribution solution, that all funds will be made available in ETC to the DAO Token Holders. To achieve this, all exchanges will be asked to return the funds to the Multisig wallets. We would like to thank the community for their trust and ask for their patience as the responsibility of returning this value to the DAO Token Holders is not an easy task. We are under a lot of pressure, but throughout this process we will continue to do the best that we can to protect the interests of the DAO Token Holders. All the legal and technical work of the community members and the companies involved, has always been on a volunteer and pro-bono basis. Following our first statement, members of the community have expressed their keenness to donate crypto assets in recognition for the efforts deployed to salvage the ETC from the attackDAOs and to distribute it back to the community. Accordingly, it will be possible to donate when retrieving the funds. We will communicate next with a detailed plan for the distribution." |
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So all DAO token holders get their share in ETC back from the white hats?
I think that's right...but this is still such a confused, chaotic mess I'm not absolutely sure... lol thats all we wanted isnt it ? i often asked why do they not come forwart themselfs and say tao holders thats how we plan to give white hat attack etc back a shame they had to be pushed to do it |
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If you vote by address anyone can open multiple address with a light client like myetherwallet.com
If you vote by coin, many miners will miss out as they often cash out 80% each month to pay power costs.
Maybe there is a way of voting with a node, but some miners mine at a light client address from a mining pool and not run a node.
Lots of stuff just don't join up.
What do you feel about having 2 address for voting. One address "yes" / Other address "no"
You send a small amount (0.1) etc to the address of your choice but you can only send once from a wallet running geth.
Is that doable?
yes for me that sounds fair. every wallet can vote once i think miners devs or biz who have reasons pro fork or contra fork should have a platform to speak befor vote. a place where every one who wants to vote get informations. in such a way pro adn contra can form up in a faster way |
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