You haven't said anything I didn't already know. It's a popularity contest and isn't related to transactions.
It is exactly not a popularity contest. But I guess, that is the MNW way to confirm you are just not smart enough to grasp it. |
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Time to rigorously boycott Intersango and the "Bitcoin Conference" then?
Please don't boycot and hurt the conference over this. You're just hurting Bitcoin as a whole.
You have missed, that it could be BitBusters (and quite a few others) agenda to actually hurt Bitcoin. And that should be an even greater reason for all of us not to boycott it. |
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The point was that your claim that it wasn't a "rating" goes against the very name and method. You are in fact "rating" people, and my original statement about being able to rate people at will with absolutely no transaction related to the rating or reasoning behind it were correct. If we have a transaction together and you send me an item, I send you money, and everythign is fine BUT I don't like your avatar on the forums, I can rate you -10 just for shits and giggles, and guess what-- it works, it's permanent, and there is no way for me to refute it. -That- is why I think the system is a joke until it's fixed. If you care to comment on -that-, please do. Posting quotes from the website only proved my point.
You rate how much you trust the other person. So say, I don't trust you because you are named Matthew, and hence rate you -10. This is no problem, because it only means I don't trust you. Look at this example: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=MetabankSomeone rated him -5 for whatever reason. Would you still trust him? Most probably, because a single bad trust rating means nothing, if there are other trust ratings. Quite the same as one customer complaining, while there are a lot of happy customers. And as soon as you realize that this is a trust rating and not some beauty contest, you look at all the individual trust ratings before doing a trade. Sometimes you even look one step further, you look at all the trust ratings of the raters. That is how it works and why it works. And if I want to state that I don't trust you, then, yes, I don't want you to be able to remove it. You can behave to gain my trust, and then I can change my trust rating. Probably you don't know, but one can change a trust rating anytime. |
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Matthew, you did misunderstand the otc rating system. You don't rate the other person, you state your trust in the other person. http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/OTC_Rating_System# Rating_guidelines  I know clicking a link is very difficult while having some ultra heavy ellet prototype on both hands, so I quote this here for you: Here are some basic guidelines on what ratings to hand out to people.
Rating Guideline
10 You trust this person as you trust yourself. Reserve this for close friends and associates you know in person.
8 Large number of high-value transactions, long period of association, very trustworthy.
5 You've had a number of good transactions with this person.
1 One or two good transactions with this person
-1 Person strikes you as a bit flaky. Unreasonable/unexpected delays in payment, etc.
-10 Person failed to hold up his end of the bargain, took payment and ran, fraudster.
Of course, other considerations like the size of transactions, the nature of your relationship and interaction, length of history, etc., will have an impact. These are just rough guidelines.
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Why Zhou Tong trying to prove he is real? If we believe he doesn't really exist then his ass will be safer, coz noone will try to sue him for recent Bitcoinica hack...
Since almost a year Bruno has some strange obsession about ZT being not ZT. So a long time ago, ZT posted this picture with the "Dear Bruno..." writing on it. As you can see, Bruno is still obsessed. And I am sure he would still doubt ZT being ZT after he had successfully dissected him. |
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With that said, I still believe ZT is innocent and is doing his best, but I reserve my judgement and I respect other people rights to voice their opinion.
Right - and you've got a huuge stake in this issue. May I ask you why you think he's innocent because from where I'm sitting it sure does seem like he's more guilty than he is innocent? Too much foolish mistakes have been made in this theft, so either ZT was drunk when doing it, or he is innocent. I would like to add that Intersango team responsability is as well huge and clear and that they deserve much more than the attacks that get thrown at them
I agree. Why is everyone's efforts aimed at ZT? Is it because he was silly enough to try and help everyone? Shouldn't more be asked of Intersango? Shouldn't they at least release a statement saying what's happening? Intersango made a wise choice by going silent. Once there is no response for a long enough time, the lynch mob moves on to some other target. |
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Goat, selling at 1.6 and buying back at 1 would also be a great option if you know that pirate will default in the next few days.
How do you address this?
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I've been reading this thread on and off for a while now and I can't hold it in any longer.
Shouldn't a person be innocent until proven guilty?
To me, it doesn't seem like there's enough proof to confirm WITHOUT A DOUBT either way, although there is more evidence against ZT than for him.
It seems to me that there's more information the exchanges have but aren't able to release just now and until that happens, it's not possible to decide one way or the other.
If he's guilty then hang him, but let's say that he's cleared of all crimes. What will those who are baying for blood do then?
Will some of the accusers then admit that they've no integrity and that their word should count for nothing forever more unless ZT agrees to forgive them?
I don't think a simple "Oh, I'm really, really, really sorry!" would cut it after all the things that have been said but I guess integrity is only something some of the accusers expect from the accused.
If he turns out to be a 17yr old CHILD, can you imagine what it must feel like to have the whole community that you've been working with, turn on you? You've gone and lost a friend's money ($40K), you've been instrumental in damaging the community you helped to build and you have no idea who to turn to for help. I'd be pretty scared.
Someone of a more mean spirited nature might call it child abuse but it would certainly be no less than hateful bullying.
Some people in here are already in such a bloodrage, that even if ZT turns out as a innocent child, they would still hang him, just to satisfy their bloodthirst. |
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Difficulty proving that I am not a scammer gets me down more then anything.  I thought BTC transactions were supposed to be easy and painless??? It's not like I'm new to Bitcoin. Don't tell me about bitcoin-otc.com. Although I was able to use the system, it's in no way user friendly to the average person who wants a Bitcoin. Hear, hear. It's also inappropriate as you can give someone negative or positive ratings based on your opinion of the color of their hair if you want. Matthew, you did misunderstand the otc rating system. You don't rate the other person, you state your trust in the other person. http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/OTC_Rating_System#Rating_guidelines |
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I like the idea of weekly withdraws on Mondays! On the other hand you can allow immediate withdraws for a fee, I guess 1% would be fair "the interest of one day". I guess making 1% on immediate withdraws can allow you to have liquide BTC that are always ready and devoted for immediate withdraws.
That would not work, because payb.tc does not know when and how much will be withdrawn. And without any withdraws he would lose 1% daily! |
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I don't believe Ƀ is going "up, uP, UP!",
I believe it's going horizontal, as it should go.
We can only hope, that Ƀ will go down, while BTC will go up  |
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Whoever bitchen is, he appears to be a scammer: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=bitchenuser feedback: I bought MP. Days later account locked. Appears to have scammed others with MP Scammer, attempted to dispute a moneypak and/or used a stolen one Note: sgitcoin != sgbitcoin (so the Zhou Tong - BitChen connection is not clear at all imho) Dont crash the party with such minor details  |
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any way to add a date to the withdraw section? i.e. request a withdraw on monday but not process it until when needed on thursday. some of us work 24 on and 24 off shifts and it would be a major convenience, plus we both would get more interest that way lol. if not, carry on as you are, service is great.
i suppose i could make it so that you can specify a date, but not a time, but even after the request becomes active, it may take 24 hours from then to be processed. are you saying you aren't able to access the site for 2 minutes on thursday to make the request? I think that this feature would actually be an advantage for you payb.tc, because you would know about a withdraw a few days in advance. So you can probably match some deposit with a withdraw without going through pirate. |
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Whatever, man. I don't care what happens once the thief is held accountable. I don't care what happens to him once he is caught either. Like many other people, I grew sick of the games of Zhou and his sock puppets. Time for the boy to face the real world.
There are only 2 logical explainations for this behavior a) poor Martin just hates Chinese or Asians (boys?) b) he is jealous that some 17yr old Chinese kid, instead of 42yr old Martin, was able make such a prime time website Most probably both. He calls him a boy, but at the same time, he don't believe a 17yr old can do it. Since last year. "© 2011 xWaylab Inc."
How can a 17 year old incorporate a company?
He accused ZT of making up the numbers, while we know today that there have been too much coins there. We have no reason to make up the numbers ourselves.
You don't? Do you realize if no one is trading on your exchange, it will not attract new users? If you make up large numbers it would encourage others to join and trade, as an alternative to MTGox. |
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You guys may call it stalking, but the kid stole half a million dollars. I'm bringing him to justice, and no court in the world will call that stalking. If Zhou's payroll perma-bans me, then that's life.
Yes, and I think your stupid actions will actually prevent us from getting anything back. Your crusade will cost us all a lot of money. Hopefully someone with deep pockets (Roger?) will find out, how to sue you for this. You're not getting your money back from him this way anyway. At least this way we can bring him to Justice and seize his assets. He already returned 15kBTC. I think your crusade already affects your thinking. And we'll get the other 25kBTC back. It's very probable a police investigation will tie him to the first hacks as well, so we will get MORE money back. It's a win win. You must be a complete noob... So I recommend watching http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Um63OQz3bjo to you. Your account can not be frozen Good luck seizing his Bitcoins. Sorry, but really epic stupidity |
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You guys may call it stalking, but the kid stole half a million dollars. I'm bringing him to justice, and no court in the world will call that stalking. If Zhou's payroll perma-bans me, then that's life.
Yes, and I think your stupid actions will actually prevent us from getting anything back. Your crusade will cost us all a lot of money. Hopefully someone with deep pockets (Roger?) will find out, how to sue you for this. You're not getting your money back from him this way anyway. At least this way we can bring him to Justice and seize his assets. He already returned 15kBTC. I think your crusade already affects your thinking. |
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You guys may call it stalking, but the kid stole half a million dollars. I'm bringing him to justice, and no court in the world will call that stalking. If Zhou's payroll perma-bans me, then that's life.
Yes, and I think your stupid actions will actually prevent us from getting anything back. Your crusade will cost us all a lot of money. Hopefully someone with deep pockets (Roger?) will find out, how to sue you for this. |
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Pirate, lol it's about damn time.
I hope you realize that this is probably the single most important thing you've done to build trust for your operation (in my opinion, at least).
Care to explain why? |
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...
I can't say it was a waste though as I still feel this community is stale and lacking character (or the character it has chosen is basically anti-social and troll infested). I mean, look at this thread as a clear example. The only times anyone is passionate and involved in something is when they're out for blood. It's really sad. Whenever a member of the bitcoin community stands up for what they believe in and makes a mistake, they are treated like some sort of plague by the trolls here. It's a vivid reflection of world politics, "I can't stand what's going on but I refuse to get involved, learn a skill and help change it!". Zhou Tong developed and supported an idea, as a child. Adults, with logic and reason dumped way too much money into a child's website. The website is sold to someone else. The child no longer runs or owns it, and it gets hacked. The forum's solution? Blame the child. What a sick bunch of losers they must be.
...
Matthew, while I am probably not your greatest fan, you are right on that this "community" contains a lot of people that seems to have a really bad character. But lets face it, eventually Bitcoin will replace a lot of banking related things, and I think what we see is only the beginning. I guess to some of those "trolls" Bitcoin is a real threat. Do you know how much revenue the banks and other entities make by just, well, keeping and transfering our money? It is really gigantic, and Bitcoin will, not today or tomorrow, but eventually, cost them a few billions. So I think we should get used to have tons of people in the Bitcoin world, which have only one agenda, and that is to destroy Bitcoin. Think about it, we even have passionate "fans" of litecoin, solidcoin, or whatever name the daily scam-coin has, who would love to destroy Bitcoin in favor for their scam-coins. And now guess what all those people in the fiat world would love to do, once they see their billions of easy profit in danger. And then there are also tons of frustrated guys out there, that just love to do some witch hunt, and currently ZT is the perfect victim for them. We have to learn to deal with people from both of those groups. |
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Actually there is. While ZT at least tries to pay back the funds, the overall impression from mlawrence (and a few others) is that he tries to prevent exactly this from happening. Now the only one in the world that does not like a payback to happen is the actually thief himself, so...
... that's why ZT has only returned 15k of the 40k bitcoins he has stolen? Maybe he did not steal this himself, but somebody else, lets call him Chen, did it, and ZT takes time to get it back? Chen exists no where except in Zhou's mind.
Right now only Zhou knows for sure, if Chen really exists, so your knowledge would prove that you are Zhou |
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