I'd add to that list an entire host of other factors:
• Final board production works (heat sink/cooling design, correct components used, etc.)
Correct components? I don't think that Terrahash is going to walk into Frys with a shopping list and ask if they have something close to this capacitor or similar to that resistor. There is a mountain of information available on BKKCoins thread. • Has the processes in place to get the assembly completed and tested (much more complicated then one might think). This one is key. You seem to think that all TH has to do is get some files from BKK to an assembler and then magically boards will be spit out the other end. It just isn't that simple.
Terrahash employee 1: "Hey, I got the files downloaded. Where do we get them assembled?" Terrahash employee 2: "Gee, I don't know. I never thought about that." doubtful. • Has the chips to populate the boards (I've seem some evidence that TH has ordered 10K chips, but don't see evidence for 20K chips they claim to have ordered yet -- providing a link to the block-chain transaction for the orders honestly isn't that difficult).
Terrahash employee 1: "Hey, the boards just got delivered. Where are the chips?" Terrahash employee 2: "Gee, I don't know. I never thought about that." doubtful. • Not a scam (and for the record, I don't think TH is a scam at this point but I think we'll know soon enough)
Then why post if you're willing to "know soon enough"? Simply because you enjoy typing the word "scam"? |
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ask yourself how many buyers are "working with BkkCoins" as opposed to waiting for the end result and simply waiting to pay the royalty. Did you pay a company like Terrahash to develop the boards or to ship you a system? TH has publicly stated on the klondike developer thread that he would contribute in a timely manner any relevant/useful development information back to BKK. He has not done so as publicly stated by BKK. IMO, that means he either doesn't have any new information (hasn't made substantial progress on the development) OR he is withholding information (in which case he is breaking his contract with BKK). Neither one are good signs, IMO. My vote would be for Option A - No New Information If you ordered from Terrahash, did you pay them to roll up their sleeves and assist BKKCoins in getting boards hashing, or did you pay them to deliver working units to your doorstep? Not everybody in the world has years of experience designing boards. Here is what they said back on page 1 of this thread: Basically what we are doing is as follows: - We have ordered 20,000 chips from Avalon. We will be ordering Klondike boards, as soon as the design is ready. We are in process of ordering all the other components. Once we have everything, we will assemble the boards and sell them.
- Once we have all the components, we will start taking orders for board assembly. In this case, you will send us your chips, we will put them on a boards along with other components and ship them back to you, for a fee of course
- We will also be offering plug and play kits with an enclosure, power supply, cooling fas, cables etc.
Isn't this what they are doing? Importance 1-10 about a 1 In this case I guess importance is relative to the observer. I think taken together the items above (and others I didn't post) determine the likelihood that the TH or SB will ship products in a timely manner which greatly effects ROI. If you read the SB and TH threads you'll see just how differently they are running things. You can think that won't effect when they'll ship, but I think it shows a huge difference in professionalism and competence which will most definitely impact when/if they ship. The likelihood of Steamboat and Terrahash shipping units depends on 2 factors: Avalon chips showing up, and BKKCoins producing a board to use them. EDIT ----- I forgot this little item Thank you all for the support. We are not claiming to be doing any rocket science. We are just taking Avalon's chips, Klondike PCBs, a bunch of components and putting them together for a fee. We just saw there was a huge demand for this, with 700,000 chips already sold and no reliable assembly operation.
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Tempting. Let's see: Steamboat profiteering sale - 63Gh / $5,2000 - 82 $/Gh Terrahash regular order - 18Gh / $900 - 50 $/Gh Steamboat profiteering sale - waiting on chips Terrahash regular order - waiting on chips Steamboat profiteering sale - Klondike design Terrahash regular order - Klondike design Steamboat profiteering sale - hashing yet? Terrahash regular order - hashing yet? You forgot a few important ones: Steamboat regular and thorough communication with customers - yes Terrahash communication with customers - not so much Importance 1-10 about a 3 Steamboat working with BkkCoins (designer of Klondike) - yes
Terrahash working with BkkCoins (designer of Klondike) - not so much
Importance 1-10 about a 1 Out of the 800,000 chips that were ordered from Avalon, ask yourself how many buyers are "working with BkkCoins" as opposed to waiting for the end result and simply waiting to pay the royalty. Did you pay a company like Terrahash to develop the boards or to ship you a system? Steamboat provides proof of Avalon chip purchases - yes
Terrahash provides proof of Avalon chip purchases - no so much
Importance 1-10 about a 1 Didn't a screenshot get posted about 50 pages ago? |
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Tempting. Let's see: Steamboat profiteering sale - 63Gh / $5,2000 - 82 $/Gh Terrahash regular order - 18Gh / $900 - 50 $/Gh Steamboat profiteering sale - waiting on chips Terrahash regular order - waiting on chips Steamboat profiteering sale - Klondike design Terrahash regular order - Klondike design Steamboat profiteering sale - hashing yet? Terrahash regular order - hashing yet? |
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So, I say, 'ASICMiner, lock and load. We're coming for your coins!'
Too late, they've been dumping their coins for a week. ASICMINER proved that they can put up enough 110nm to be 30% of the universe. It was fairly inexpensive. To maintain that market share against AM 28nm will be much tougher. Let's see in a couple of months... |
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It should be not called Active Mining (AM) as it is difficult to differentiate from ASIC Miner (AM)
With ASICMINER running at 110nm and Active Mining running at 28nm, it's them that should be worried. |
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I am in 100% agreement with the last 2 posts. If this gets sorted out properly I have more BTC to invest and I will start telling friends to put some of there net worth in to this venture.
+1 |
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Are you going to be actively "Buying Up" AMC Shares until there are none to buy after the trade-in deadline? Maybe I missed it but your intentions on AMC after the shareholders "trade-in for VMC shares" has passed is not clear.
My impression is that Ken is saying: "I'll make him an offer he can't refuse"  After reading some more, current shareholders have a clear choice. Shares in VMC would be worth a lot more than shares in AMC moving forward. After the first sale of equipment, or the first bit of profit for VMC the difference will be obvious. Anybody that didn't swap will regret it. |
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I think it is time we stopped with the 'What about x'? questions because, although well meant, they are often drilling down into concerns people don't share. This 'Hey Ken, what about...' could go on for weeks. We need to focus on bringing hardware online to mine coins.
Well, no. Ken's posting clearly states: ---------------- [VMC/AMC] Merger This is a Pre-Merger VMC Offering. (This Is For Community Review Only) ---------------- It is up to the community to review the wording. This is a rare opportunity to participate. Take advantage of it. |
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----------------
VMC130307-1
Update:
Investors must have 100,000 shares before getting a second right of refusal.
----------------
If I am reading this correctly, anybody who owns 100,000 shares of VMC will be able to purchase mining hardware at VMC cost. Is this correct, Ken?
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I'm winging it here, so dismiss this idea if you think it is a stupid. Does BitFunder allow private sales of shares from one person (ie Ken) to another (aka 'the buyer')? You know about a Dutch Auction? Ken could ask 'who wants to buy x shares at y price' (example: 10k @ 0.005) then reduces the price in 0.0001 increments until someone bites? This technique would only be used to issue new shares into the market. Obviously once bought, they trade on the exchange as you'd expect. The main benefit is it removes the need for large walls, and allows Ken to test the market in a fair way, ie everyone sees the first high Ask and is welcome to grab the offer when the price is reduced to the level they find acceptable?
Like I say, this could be an insane suggestion, but remember the Facebook IPO? They couldn't even get that right with the 'smartest' brains in Wall Street, the price went all over the place on launch.
1. Bitfunder allows transfers between accounts, you could just sell them here. 2. If VMC (gotta get used to that name) wants to do a Dutch auction on this site, shouldn't be a problem. |
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AMC volume has really picked up in the last hour, what happened?  Democracy.  "A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where 51 percent of the people may take away the rights of the other 49." - Thomas Jefferson What happened on this thread was proof that 50 heads are better than 1. |
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Just one quick question, how would he handle the holdouts. Surely, there will be a few who decide not to trade in 100% of their AMC for VMC. Would they eventually become liquidated at a certain time, and the funds would then be sent to the holder's account?
I asked this question about uh, oh, 3 pages ago. |
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Ok, I create a VMC offering, AMC shareholder can exchange 1 share of AMC for 1 share of VMC. After the exchange period VMC will continue when
possible to purchase AMC shares on the open market until it has acquired all of AMC's shares. How does that sound?
Sounds like an opportunity to game the system. What happens to the hold-outs who don't convert? No problem, they stay in AMC as long as they want. We do not force anyone to move their shares to VMC. AMC keeps trading, it is just an chance for those that want to get into the selling of equipment to get into VMC. But then VMC does not own 100% of AMC. It doesn't have to. The more it owns the better, but I don't see any reason it would have to own 100%. Over time as it makes money it could purchase more and more of AMC shares. Do this make since? AMC owns the IP. |
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Ok, I create a VMC offering, AMC shareholder can exchange 1 share of AMC for 1 share of VMC. After the exchange period VMC will continue when
possible to purchase AMC shares on the open market until it has acquired all of AMC's shares. How does that sound?
Sounds like an opportunity to game the system. What happens to the hold-outs who don't convert? No problem, they stay in AMC as long as they want. We do not force anyone to move their shares to VMC. AMC keeps trading, it is just an chance for those that want to get into the selling of equipment to get into VMC. But then VMC does not own 100% of AMC. |
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Ok, I create a VMC offering, AMC shareholder can exchange 1 share of AMC for 1 share of VMC. After the exchange period VMC will continue when
possible to purchase AMC shares on the open market until it has acquired all of AMC's shares. How does that sound?
Sounds like an opportunity to game the system. What happens to the hold-outs who don't convert? |
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I officially nominate Bitcoin Megastore as the hardest working person in show business. Move over James Brown. Look at the posting times. That guy only needs 5 hours of sleep a day, the rest of the time he is hard at work.  |
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but for me it is all proof I've ever need.
Case Closed!  |
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"Mr. Carolus is a recent subscriber to Magic New Zealand"
Guy comes to this forum today, makes an account, scams me for some coins and log off. An example. You wanna tell me you will trust him?
Your example is nonsense. How can you claim Mr. Carolus is a scammer without any shred of proof and still retain any form of self respect? |
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