Wardrick account hacked---trust abuse resolution in sight (finally)

[Quickseller]

Go ahead and leave a negative rating if you feel that is what is correct. I won't be around to argue for your removal from DT. I can say that you will likely be excluded though.

Are you threatening him?

You are kidding right? First of all I specifically said that I would not be around.

You yourself said that you have acted as escrow for yourself (via JD escrow), so you really can't say that part is a scam.

Kind of offtopic, but kind of related:

People often appear in the Just-Dice chat asking if I have CLAM for sale for BTC. I often do. Instead of telling them "send X btc to address Y" I'll use the built-in escrow system. It will tell them the amount and address, and hold my CLAMs in escrow until they send the BTC. In a sense I'm escrowing my own deal since I own JD and by extension its escrow system. But there's no fee, they are willing to send first anyway, and I don't think anyone has the expectation that JD is a neutral third party.

There was never any kind of disputes, so you can't really say that I incorrectly mediated a dispute in my favor. In fact, I can say that for all disputes I have ever handled as escrow, it was extremely clear cut as to which side was in the right from the very beginning - I would go through the motions of asking both sides for evidence, soliciting any counterpoints to evidence provided (and obviously not telling either side that I believed them) - and nothing really changed except for the amount of evidence I was in possession of. There is the issue of the fee, however refunds were offered, and processed in the single case of a request, so there is no money lost, although I did explain here how having my trading partner pay the fee (when the escrow charges a fee as I do) is the most fair way to handle the trade. An intelligent trader is not going to care where his money goes, all he will care about is how much money goes in his pocket after selling his widget.

If it is not a scam, and someone who is on your trust list leaves a negative trust rating, then why would you leave them on your trust list after they leave such rating?

Plus it would be hypocritical for you to leave one for me and not your level 1 sponsor considering that he uses himself to escrow for his alts as well.....

Are you talking about me? Vod has two level 1 sponsors (TC and me) but I don't have any alts that have ever traded.

No.

Maybe Doog can explain how he is not escrowing for himself. I'm going to assume he still owns JD and has access to the escrow code, so is it really an independent party? Must be missing something because I doubt he would make those comment when he's doing the same thing.

He wouldn't need to access the "escrow code", the private keys to the funds are in/on the JD servers (or are offline in doog's possession), so he could just take the money if that is what he decided to do

[xetsr]

He wouldn't need to access the "escrow code", the private keys to the funds are in/on the JD servers (or are offline in doog's possession), so he could just take the money if that is what he decided to do

Looks like that had less to do with escrow and more of speeding up the process to get their CLAMs, kind of automating things. Why else would someone use escrow when they know the escrow is dooglus or JD, unless they didn't now that would be a different story. That's what I'm reading, dooglus could answer this best though.

[Quickseller]

He wouldn't need to access the "escrow code", the private keys to the funds are in/on the JD servers (or are offline in doog's possession), so he could just take the money if that is what he decided to do

Looks like that had less to do with escrow and more of speeding up the process to get their CLAMs, kind of automating things. Why else would someone use escrow when they know the escrow is dooglus or JD, unless they didn't now that would be a different story. That's what I'm reading, dooglus could answer this best though.

Well dooglus could easily give the person a BTC address to send to, and then tip/credit their account.

[tspacepilot]

It would be nice if you guys could discuss Quickseller's self-escrow scheme over here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1171059.0

And leave this thread for QS and Wardrick (and others?) to work on explaining their motivations in using the trust system to damage my reputation.  QS has made his personal animus quite clear using several accounts now (see the post histories of ACCTSeller, Panthers52, FunFunnyFan and of course QS).  It's unclear what Wardrick's motivation is here.  So far he's just shouted a bit about how he thinks I'm an unscientific guy.  Okay.  But is everyone who thinks I'm "unscientific" supposted to leave me a negative rating in the spirit of TradeFortress?  Or is there something more here than just more bullies vs. tspacepilot on bitcointalk?

[alani123]

I think that Quickseller's conflict with tspacepilot was taken to ridiculus lengths. My views on it however still haven't changed.

It's obvious that Quickseller abused his position in default trust. As he claims, tspacepilot was trolling him constantly, so he searched back on his past and found the only offense worthy of a negative trust comment. Close to two years later after the event taking place, he left tspacepilot this comment in an attempt to defame him. Obviously Quickseller had no insight on the event himself so he bases his claims to the saying of one of the most irresponsible and arrogant users that ever used this forum. TradeFortress is undoubtedly a liar, manipulator, involved in serious theft/irresponsible handling of user funds and trolls the forum to this day.

To this day, Quickseller keeps defending this idiocy.

[Bardman]

It would be nice if you guys could discuss Quickseller's self-escrow scheme over here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1171059.0

And leave this thread for QS and Wardrick (and others?) to work on explaining their motivations in using the trust system to damage my reputation.  QS has made his personal animus quite clear using several accounts now (see the post histories of ACCTSeller, Panthers52, FunFunnyFan and of course QS).  It's unclear what Wardrick's motivation is here.  So far he's just shouted a bit about how he thinks I'm an unscientific guy.  Okay.  But is everyone who thinks I'm "unscientific" supposted to leave me a negative rating in the spirit of TradeFortress?  Or is there something more here than just more bullies vs. tspacepilot on bitcointalk?

I dont know, its kind of weird that wardrick decided to give you a negative trust rating when no other dt member has given you any negative rating since qs did, it really makes yuo think they are the same person but im pretty sure they are not, i still dont understand wardrick motivation to give you negative trust when other trusted members have trusted you.

[redsn0w]

I think (even) if he wants to come back and regret... he can't, because the 'shame' will be enormous.

This part seems true, and it is unfortunate.  I tried to get QS to resolve this with me quietly nearly two months ago via PM.  The idea was that perhaps if we talked in private we could figure out how to get along and he could remove his attacks without "losing face", as the expression goes.  Unfortunately, he merely restarted his false accusations in his usual inimitable style "you are a scammer, I know this".  And then wouldn't reply when I asked him to explain to me, in private, how it is that he thinks he knows so much about a situation he wasn't even present for.  After waiting a week and a half for a reply, I had to go back to the only other recourse, asking in public.

I really never expected him to keep doubling-down on the stakes like this.  It really seems like each time he's backed into a corner with people saying "QS, why don't you drop this", he brings in a new account to sockpuppet and distract.  He's sorta going crazy with it at the moment, you can see that he's posted nearly two pages quoted walls of nonsense, off-topic, randomness into this thread using at least three accounts ("QS_banned"?  what is that about?!) in just the last 24 hours.

I also would have never predicted that he would involve the alts that he's using for his escrow-scam-trading into this clearly personal grudge.  That is, it seems that no one would have ever known that panthers52 was his alt, and the was trading with it using himself as escrow if he hadn't pulled it into this wild-ass saga.  Alas, what do we do now?  I admit, I find it hard to believe that he's trusted by anyone with a reasonable head on their shoulders after all these stunts.

As redsn0w says, it seems he's intent on "going down with the ship" like some sorta old sea captain.  QS, I know it would be hard, but it would demonstrate actual character at this point, you could go ahead and right your wrongs here rather than continuing to double-down.  You can remove the sockpuppet ratings from troll account FunFunnyFan, you can delete your negative feedback on me which is merely an echo of long-discredited scammer TradeFortress and then go about trying to repair your reputation with respect to your shady trading practices.  When the house is on fire, it's time to leave the house, don't keep throwing wood on it.

So at the end he doesn't want to change or remove the negative trust and 'clarify' everything, why? Because the shame will be enormous... like I said previously (and I don't know if the community will 'trust' Quickseller again).

[ndnh]

It would be nice if you guys could discuss Quickseller's self-escrow scheme over here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1171059.0

And leave this thread for QS and Wardrick (and others?) to work on explaining their motivations in using the trust system to damage my reputation.  QS has made his personal animus quite clear using several accounts now (see the post histories of ACCTSeller, Panthers52, FunFunnyFan and of course QS).  It's unclear what Wardrick's motivation is here.  So far he's just shouted a bit about how he thinks I'm an unscientific guy.  Okay.  But is everyone who thinks I'm "unscientific" supposted to leave me a negative rating in the spirit of TradeFortress?  Or is there something more here than just more bullies vs. tspacepilot on bitcointalk?

I dont know, its kind of weird that wardrick decided to give you a negative trust rating when no other dt member has given you any negative rating since qs did, it really makes yuo think they are the same person but im pretty sure they are not, i still dont understand wardrick motivation to give you negative trust when other trusted members have trusted you.

Just that you know, Wardrick also removed a positive trust (to do with a 1 year old loan. totally unrelated, lol) he had on my account. He is acting like a 5 year old at the moment.  

Edit: I am still waiting for him to give me the honest reason than lying about it.

[xetsr]

I think (even) if he wants to come back and regret... he can't, because the 'shame' will be enormous.

This part seems true, and it is unfortunate.  I tried to get QS to resolve this with me quietly nearly two months ago via PM.  The idea was that perhaps if we talked in private we could figure out how to get along and he could remove his attacks without "losing face", as the expression goes.  Unfortunately, he merely restarted his false accusations in his usual inimitable style "you are a scammer, I know this".  And then wouldn't reply when I asked him to explain to me, in private, how it is that he thinks he knows so much about a situation he wasn't even present for.  After waiting a week and a half for a reply, I had to go back to the only other recourse, asking in public.

I really never expected him to keep doubling-down on the stakes like this.  It really seems like each time he's backed into a corner with people saying "QS, why don't you drop this", he brings in a new account to sockpuppet and distract.  He's sorta going crazy with it at the moment, you can see that he's posted nearly two pages quoted walls of nonsense, off-topic, randomness into this thread using at least three accounts ("QS_banned"?  what is that about?!) in just the last 24 hours.

I also would have never predicted that he would involve the alts that he's using for his escrow-scam-trading into this clearly personal grudge.  That is, it seems that no one would have ever known that panthers52 was his alt, and the was trading with it using himself as escrow if he hadn't pulled it into this wild-ass saga.  Alas, what do we do now?  I admit, I find it hard to believe that he's trusted by anyone with a reasonable head on their shoulders after all these stunts.

As redsn0w says, it seems he's intent on "going down with the ship" like some sorta old sea captain.  QS, I know it would be hard, but it would demonstrate actual character at this point, you could go ahead and right your wrongs here rather than continuing to double-down.  You can remove the sockpuppet ratings from troll account FunFunnyFan, you can delete your negative feedback on me which is merely an echo of long-discredited scammer TradeFortress and then go about trying to repair your reputation with respect to your shady trading practices.  When the house is on fire, it's time to leave the house, don't keep throwing wood on it.

So at the end he doesn't want to change or remove the negative trust and 'clarify' everything, why? Because the shame will be enormous... like I said previously (and I don't know if the community will 'trust' Quickseller again).

Maybe because he still believes that TSP is a scammer. How does Panthers coming out as QS make the negative feedback any different? It happened before the shady behavior by QS was in the spotlight.

You believe someone is a scammer, you mark them as a scammer. For all we know (and only QS would know this), TSP trolled, QS looked for a reason to troll back and found TSP scammed (I'm not saying he scammed or didn't scam) so decided to leave negative feedback, not for trolling but because of shady activity. I know, I know... this may be hard for some of you to believe but you have to still consider it as a possibility.

Once again, not taking sides but only pointing what out could have happened. Just like how I pointed how why dooglus might have escrowed for himself when QS brought it up.

[redsn0w]

I think (even) if he wants to come back and regret... he can't, because the 'shame' will be enormous.

This part seems true, and it is unfortunate.  I tried to get QS to resolve this with me quietly nearly two months ago via PM.  The idea was that perhaps if we talked in private we could figure out how to get along and he could remove his attacks without "losing face", as the expression goes.  Unfortunately, he merely restarted his false accusations in his usual inimitable style "you are a scammer, I know this".  And then wouldn't reply when I asked him to explain to me, in private, how it is that he thinks he knows so much about a situation he wasn't even present for.  After waiting a week and a half for a reply, I had to go back to the only other recourse, asking in public.

I really never expected him to keep doubling-down on the stakes like this.  It really seems like each time he's backed into a corner with people saying "QS, why don't you drop this", he brings in a new account to sockpuppet and distract.  He's sorta going crazy with it at the moment, you can see that he's posted nearly two pages quoted walls of nonsense, off-topic, randomness into this thread using at least three accounts ("QS_banned"?  what is that about?!) in just the last 24 hours.

I also would have never predicted that he would involve the alts that he's using for his escrow-scam-trading into this clearly personal grudge.  That is, it seems that no one would have ever known that panthers52 was his alt, and the was trading with it using himself as escrow if he hadn't pulled it into this wild-ass saga.  Alas, what do we do now?  I admit, I find it hard to believe that he's trusted by anyone with a reasonable head on their shoulders after all these stunts.

As redsn0w says, it seems he's intent on "going down with the ship" like some sorta old sea captain.  QS, I know it would be hard, but it would demonstrate actual character at this point, you could go ahead and right your wrongs here rather than continuing to double-down.  You can remove the sockpuppet ratings from troll account FunFunnyFan, you can delete your negative feedback on me which is merely an echo of long-discredited scammer TradeFortress and then go about trying to repair your reputation with respect to your shady trading practices.  When the house is on fire, it's time to leave the house, don't keep throwing wood on it.

So at the end he doesn't want to change or remove the negative trust and 'clarify' everything, why? Because the shame will be enormous... like I said previously (and I don't know if the community will 'trust' Quickseller again).

Maybe because he still believes that TSP is a scammer. How does Panthers coming out as QS make the negative feedback any different? It happened before the shady behavior by QS was in the spotlight.

You believe someone is a scammer, you mark them as a scammer. For all we know (and only QS would know this), TSP trolled, QS looked for a reason to troll back and found TSP scammed (I'm not saying he scammed or didn't scam) so decided to leave negative feedback, not for trolling but because of shady activity. I know, I know... this may be hard for some of you to believe but you have to still consider it as a possibility.

Once again, not taking sides but only pointing what out could have happened. Just like how I pointed how why dooglus might have escrowed for himself when QS bought it up.

I understand what you wanted to say, but another valid question is:

Why did Quickseller stage his fake ban? It was not necessary in my opinion, and for this reason I can't trust him.

[xetsr]

I understand what you wanted to say, but another valid question is:

Why Quickseller staged his fake ban? It was not necessary in my opinion, and for this reason I can't trust him.

Who confirmed the fake ban? I'm not trolling or anything, it's just that I asked before and nobody answered back with a confirmation from someone who has the ability to ban. Is that just being based on the fact Panthers wasn't banned because I doubt QS used the same IP across all of his accounts.

There are a couple of threads and many posts (trolling and sig spamming included) so I probably missed something here.

[dooglus]

He wouldn't need to access the "escrow code", the private keys to the funds are in/on the JD servers (or are offline in doog's possession), so he could just take the money if that is what he decided to do

Looks like that had less to do with escrow and more of speeding up the process to get their CLAMs, kind of automating things. Why else would someone use escrow when they know the escrow is dooglus or JD, unless they didn't now that would be a different story. That's what I'm reading, dooglus could answer this best though.

I use the escrow service because it is more convenient than handling things "manually". The escrow service logs both sides of the transaction so that it appears in the users' histories. It usually goes like this:

user: hey, can I buy 100 CLAMs at 0.006?
doog: sure
user: send me a bitcoin address
doog: /escrow <user> 100 0.6 BTC [xBTCaddr]
system: dooglus has escrowed 100 CLAMs for you; send 0.6 BTC to [xBTCaddr] to release the escrow
user: cool, I didn't know you had an escrow feature [sends coins]
doog: /release <user>
user: thanks!

I think it's pretty clear that I'm not an independent third party in the escrow, and that's what makes this quite different than Panthers suggesting QS as a fee-charging escrow, while trying hard to make it look like he's not the same person (without ever going quite as far as to explicitly deny it).

[redsn0w]

I understand what you wanted to say, but another valid question is:

Why Quickseller staged his fake ban? It was not necessary in my opinion, and for this reason I can't trust him.

Who confirmed the fake ban? I'm not trolling or anything, it's just that I asked before and nobody answered back with a confirmation from someone who has the ability to ban. Is that just being based on the fact Panthers wasn't banned because I doubt QS used the same IP across all of his accounts.

There are a couple of threads and many posts (trolling and sig spamming included) so I probably missed something here.

I removed Quickseller because he was acting to deceive people, and I can't, and won't, be a part of that (he wasn't banned) if I know about it. I don't think he had bad intentions, or is a bad person, just maybe didn't think it all the way through.

Escrowing for yourself...on the one hand if someone is using Quickseller as an escrow, then they are using him because they trust him, or at the very least because they think his reputation is worth more than what they are trading. Him being part of the trade doesn't change that, and it still provides the peace of mind that an escrow can provide.

On the other hand, an escrow is supposed to be an impartial mediator in the event of disputes, which would be very difficult to do when being part of the trade. Even if he knew or thought he wouldn't do anything wrong in the process of the transaction, disputes can still arise when neither party has done anything wrong. That and taking additional fees isn't really the right thing to do. It's probably something one should avoid.

I don't have a strong stance on tspacepilot's feedback, or turtlehurricane's. I probably wouldn't leave the negative feedback myself, but I don't strongly disagree with it either.

[xetsr]

I understand what you wanted to say, but another valid question is:

Why Quickseller staged his fake ban? It was not necessary in my opinion, and for this reason I can't trust him.

Who confirmed the fake ban? I'm not trolling or anything, it's just that I asked before and nobody answered back with a confirmation from someone who has the ability to ban. Is that just being based on the fact Panthers wasn't banned because I doubt QS used the same IP across all of his accounts.

There are a couple of threads and many posts (trolling and sig spamming included) so I probably missed something here.

I removed Quickseller because he was acting to deceive people, and I can't, and won't, be a part of that (he wasn't banned) if I know about it. I don't think he had bad intentions, or is a bad person, just maybe didn't think it all the way through.

Escrowing for yourself...on the one hand if someone is using Quickseller as an escrow, then they are using him because they trust him, or at the very least because they think his reputation is worth more than what they are trading. Him being part of the trade doesn't change that, and it still provides the peace of mind that an escrow can provide.

On the other hand, an escrow is supposed to be an impartial mediator in the event of disputes, which would be very difficult to do when being part of the trade. Even if he knew or thought he wouldn't do anything wrong in the process of the transaction, disputes can still arise when neither party has done anything wrong. That and taking additional fees isn't really the right thing to do. It's probably something one should avoid.

I don't have a strong stance on tspacepilot's feedback, or turtlehurricane's. I probably wouldn't leave the negative feedback myself, but I don't strongly disagree with it either.

Thanks, didn't see that. Also interested in hearing from QS himself why he faked a ban. He just made it way to obvious he was Panthers.. I just didn't believe that was his alt based on how obvious he made things, thought it was trolling or something and not QS coming out.

[tspacepilot]

I don't know how credible or relevant this is, but on the Wardrick appearace topic (which is actually related to the topic of this thread):

The other thing wardrick has done since relogging in besides picking up the tradefortress-->quickseller mantle seems to be talking shop about pedophiles or something or another in this thread:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1169069.msg12364388#msg12364388

Upthread in there someone in there suggests that he's actually Tradefortress.

Aren't you https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=67058
?

So you read my posts and the first thought you had was that you must attack me by attempting to dox me? and people asked me why I was leaving the forum

Post proof here pls.

http://www.sythe.org/dispute-forum-archive/1628892-wrongful-twc.html

I have no idea about this sythe forum or what it has to do with Tradefortress, but if Tradefortress is Wardick, it would explain his interest in this matter.  We could make it Tradefortress-->Quickseller-->Tradefortress.  Who knows?

[xetsr]

I don't know how credible or relevant this is, but on the Wardrick appearace topic (which is actually related to the topic of this thread):

The other thing wardrick has done since relogging in besides picking up the tradefortress-->quickseller mantle seems to be talking shop about pedophiles or something or another in this thread:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1169069.msg12364388#msg12364388

Upthread in there someone in there suggests that he's actually Tradefortress.

Aren't you https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=67058
?

So you read my posts and the first thought you had was that you must attack me by attempting to dox me? and people asked me why I was leaving the forum

Post proof here pls.

http://www.sythe.org/dispute-forum-archive/1628892-wrongful-twc.html

I have no idea about this sythe forum or what it has to do with Tradefortress, but if Tradefortress is Wardick, it would explain his interest in this matter.  We could make it Tradefortress-->Quickseller-->Tradefortress.  Who knows?

If the last part is the true, QS would have known and had more proof against you, no? I'm talking about logs and all that from when you used your bot to cheat him (or so he was basically was trying to say) out of BTC. He would have been able to gather more evidence or even manipulate it to try and prove his point. Then again, people would see right through that and start trying to link him to TF so who really knows.

[Wardrick]

I have no idea about this sythe forum or what it has to do with Tradefortress, but if Tradefortress is Wardick, it would explain his interest in this matter.  We could make it Tradefortress-->Quickseller-->Tradefortress.  Who knows?

Lol. I will publicly state that i am not TF or QS, and there is a thread about the TF thing already if you care to read about it. My interest in the matter is that someone I know to be a scammer ddidn't have negative trust. I am simply using the trust system to reflect my position, how is that so difficult to understand?

If I was TF I would've posted the chatlogs of wikib0t a long long time ago.

[TheButterZone]

TradeFortress>Wardrick circumstantial evidence (or, "birds of a feather..."): https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=858730.msg9579253#msg9579253

[tspacepilot]

Lol. I will publicly state that i am not TF or QS, and there is a thread about the TF thing already if you care to read about it.

I'll take your word for it.  It seems relevant that the only things that have happened since you've been back have been at least obliquely linked to him.

My interest in the matter is that someone I know to be a scammer ddidn't have negative trust. I am simply using the trust system to reflect my position, how is that so difficult to understand?

Maybe your position is one of truth-bending omniscience.  I was there at the time of these alleged coinchat incidents and I don't have any evidence that the accusations are true.  In fact, since I was there, I have some really strong evidence in the form of my own personal experience that they aren't true.

It seems to me like we have a fork in the road:

1) You're TF, or his close friend, or something like that.
2) You're not TF.

In the case of (1), we at least know where your motivation is and what the nature of your legacy is.  I guess in that case you and I can go back to where we left things 2.5 years ago before your were completely discredited.  Also in that case, it seems like you would get removed from default trust as presumably default trust doesn't want an alt of TF any more than they want TF himself.

In the case of (2), we have to ask you what evidence that you have to accuse me with?  TF's word isn't so credible anymore.  QS's clear personal vendetta against me is, in theory, irrelevant.  What's your case?  If you don't have one beyond the unsupported gripes of TF and the ravings of Quicktemper, that doesn't look so strong to me.

[P-Funk]

Your option 2 is pointless considering the thread you linked above http://www.sythe.org/dispute-forum-archive/1628892-wrongful-twc.html Archive.is mirror: https://archive.is/bahPr

Where an account on Sythe by the name of TradeFortress explicitly says he's using an alt named Wardrick and provides proof in the form of screenshots of him logged into bitcointalk. Imgur mirror: https://i.imgur.com/CpZDckR.png

Any more scammer alts want to out themselves today?