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Author Topic: [ANN] Expanse (EXP) - 1st Stable fork of Ethereum  (Read 895976 times)
baga105
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December 10, 2017, 06:14:53 PM
 #6341

Are there any improvements made in last couple of months? Or is there any link i could read about it/them?

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December 11, 2017, 12:04:33 PM
 #6342

Are there any improvements made in last couple of months? Or is there any link i could read about it/them?

Not really, the team is all over the place. Tokenlab, website redesign, DAO, EXP.Pay, EXP.Life, VoteLock, whitepaper, marketing, EXR.... Honestly i'm losing track of all the things they are attempting.

NONE of these things are finished. Note that most of these products were announced in the beginning of this year, and NOTHING has been delivered, except EXR. Most of them haven't even started yet!
I've tried talking to them about it but they get frustrated and don't want to listen, and eventually kicked me out of the slack.

A good project has a clear roadmap and clear goals. The Expanse team tries to do everything at the same time and as a result everything is half-assed.

They were supposed to launch a roadmap in June. After half a year not even a draft has been released. How do you even operate without a roadmap???

There is just a complete lack of direction - there is no capable CEO is able to oversee the big picture and prioritize the steps needed to get to the goal.

I used to like this project but it turned out to be the biggest disappointment of all my investments, nothing substantially happened after giving them a year to accomplish something, and i know nothing's going to change because they make the same mistakes again and again.


Some things have happened and there are some ICO's lined up, so things are slowly progressing, but man it could have been so much more, and so much better. The product i expected when i invested initially was and is still great, but i have little confidence it will ever get there. At some point someone will get a similar idea and execute it better, and Expanse will be lost. Like NXT was lost to NEM.

Honestly they are not scammers, they mean well but they are just completely incapable of managing a project. Let alone something of this magnitude.



Then why am i writing this? Well this message has 2 purposes:
1) To point investors in the right direction - which things to look at when they have invested.
2) To hope that the team gets their shit together: Understand what you're doing, why you are doing it, and prioritize. Figure out, in detail, what the hell you want to build and how it will work. Then make a step by step plan with SMART goals to get there.



Now in response to this message they are going to say: He is a shill, paid by Ubiq or whatever. But they will not look at their process and try to figure out what they're doing wrong. They dropped 200 spots on CMC and still think it's because "BTC is doing so well", or "People are paid to make us look bad".
I'm not a shill, i'm not paid by anyone - my account is almost 4 year old. I'm just terribly, terribly disappointed.
Victorio
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December 11, 2017, 12:23:45 PM
 #6343

Pffrt,
I agree with you on every point.
2 months ago I did some research on Expanse progress and many planned deliverables have been delayed for 2-3-4 months.
The roadmap and information about infrastructure dApps were moved to less transparent locations. It is unclear whether identity and social networking dApps will be ever released by Expanse.
TokenLab platform already misses the deadline for Nov-Dec, no ICOs are on sight and hopefully that will not change.
I also asked sensitive questions and the reaction was the same - going on personal attacks rather than answering the technical details I was interested in.

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December 11, 2017, 12:27:56 PM
 #6344

Pffrt,
I agree with you on every point.
2 months ago I did some research on Expanse progress and many planned deliverables have been delayed for 2-3-4 months.
The roadmap and information about infrastructure dApps were moved to less transparent locations. It is unclear whether identity and social networking dApps will be ever released by Expanse.
TokenLab platform already misses the deadline for Nov-Dec, no ICOs are on sight and hopefully that will not change.
I also asked sensitive questions and the reaction was the same - going on personal attacks rather than answering the technical details I was interested in.

Wow i'm so glad i'm not the only one, thanks!
Sniar
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December 11, 2017, 12:45:32 PM
 #6345

It is so weird. In April I've put Expanse in one line with Lisk. And thought the EXP have more chances to the Moon than LSK. But... Why EXPANCE not in one line with LISK now?

China's decision to ban ICOs affected Tokenlab pretty hard.

True that. But I think that ban isn't constant, they're going to open the market for cryptocurrency in nearest future. Let's cross the fingers anyway. Tongue

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coolkudos
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December 11, 2017, 10:26:16 PM
 #6346

Prrrrft is just salty he got banned from the slack for concern trolling. This is literally all he has ever done in the expanse slack. Atleast a few times a week he would do this. Ask anyone from the EXP chat.
coolkudos
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December 11, 2017, 10:29:28 PM
 #6347

Pffrt,
I agree with you on every point.
2 months ago I did some research on Expanse progress and many planned deliverables have been delayed for 2-3-4 months.
The roadmap and information about infrastructure dApps were moved to less transparent locations. It is unclear whether identity and social networking dApps will be ever released by Expanse.
TokenLab platform already misses the deadline for Nov-Dec, no ICOs are on sight and hopefully that will not change.
I also asked sensitive questions and the reaction was the same - going on personal attacks rather than answering the technical details I was interested in.

I have never ever seen you in any expanse community channel and i'm in all of them.
scottii
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December 11, 2017, 10:59:29 PM
 #6348

Are there any improvements made in last couple of months? Or is there any link i could read about it/them?

Not really, the team is all over the place. Tokenlab, website redesign, DAO, EXP.Pay, EXP.Life, VoteLock, whitepaper, marketing, EXR.... Honestly i'm losing track of all the things they are attempting.

NONE of these things are finished. Note that most of these products were announced in the beginning of this year, and NOTHING has been delivered, except EXR. Most of them haven't even started yet!
I've tried talking to them about it but they get frustrated and don't want to listen, and eventually kicked me out of the slack.

A good project has a clear roadmap and clear goals. The Expanse team tries to do everything at the same time and as a result everything is half-assed.

They were supposed to launch a roadmap in June. After half a year not even a draft has been released. How do you even operate without a roadmap???

There is just a complete lack of direction - there is no capable CEO is able to oversee the big picture and prioritize the steps needed to get to the goal.

I used to like this project but it turned out to be the biggest disappointment of all my investments, nothing substantially happened after giving them a year to accomplish something, and i know nothing's going to change because they make the same mistakes again and again.


Some things have happened and there are some ICO's lined up, so things are slowly progressing, but man it could have been so much more, and so much better. The product i expected when i invested initially was and is still great, but i have little confidence it will ever get there. At some point someone will get a similar idea and execute it better, and Expanse will be lost. Like NXT was lost to NEM.

Honestly they are not scammers, they mean well but they are just completely incapable of managing a project. Let alone something of this magnitude.



Then why am i writing this? Well this message has 2 purposes:
1) To point investors in the right direction - which things to look at when they have invested.
2) To hope that the team gets their shit together: Understand what you're doing, why you are doing it, and prioritize. Figure out, in detail, what the hell you want to build and how it will work. Then make a step by step plan with SMART goals to get there.



Now in response to this message they are going to say: He is a shill, paid by Ubiq or whatever. But they will not look at their process and try to figure out what they're doing wrong. They dropped 200 spots on CMC and still think it's because "BTC is doing so well", or "People are paid to make us look bad".
I'm not a shill, i'm not paid by anyone - my account is almost 4 year old. I'm just terribly, terribly disappointed.
I recalling banning you from Slack just because you were always toxic.  Every single time we posted news, made a small accomplishment, or updated the community on, you were extremely critical.  Even on tasks that were "completed", the criticism did not stop.  So yeah, I would definitely call you FUD because a logical investor does not remain a critic when something is completed.
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December 11, 2017, 11:00:09 PM
 #6349

Pffrt,
I agree with you on every point.
2 months ago I did some research on Expanse progress and many planned deliverables have been delayed for 2-3-4 months.
The roadmap and information about infrastructure dApps were moved to less transparent locations. It is unclear whether identity and social networking dApps will be ever released by Expanse.
TokenLab platform already misses the deadline for Nov-Dec, no ICOs are on sight and hopefully that will not change.
I also asked sensitive questions and the reaction was the same - going on personal attacks rather than answering the technical details I was interested in.
the only thing that was announced 2-3 months ago was Tokenlab.  Phase 1 has been completed and the project is on target.
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December 11, 2017, 11:01:23 PM
 #6350

It is so weird. In April I've put Expanse in one line with Lisk. And thought the EXP have more chances to the Moon than LSK. But... Why EXPANCE not in one line with LISK now?

China's decision to ban ICOs affected Tokenlab pretty hard.

True that. But I think that ban isn't constant, they're going to open the market for cryptocurrency in nearest future. Let's cross the fingers anyway. Tongue
Agree.  China has banned cryptocurrency more than once.  Each ban has only held them back, which is very hypocritical for them to do being one of the world largest crypto miners.
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December 11, 2017, 11:03:25 PM
 #6351

Prrrrft is just salty he got banned from the slack for concern trolling. This is literally all he has ever done in the expanse slack. Atleast a few times a week he would do this. Ask anyone from the EXP chat.

Check it.  I specifically remember when Chris was talking about doing a charity event for Borderless Charity to give back to the homeless  center, or maybe it was a woman's center.  Anyhow, Prfft went on for about 3 hours saying that what we were doing was wrong.

Who the hell bashes on a charity???
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December 12, 2017, 09:24:56 AM
 #6352

Are there any improvements made in last couple of months? Or is there any link i could read about it/them?

Not really, the team is all over the place. Tokenlab, website redesign, DAO, EXP.Pay, EXP.Life, VoteLock, whitepaper, marketing, EXR.... Honestly i'm losing track of all the things they are attempting.

NONE of these things are finished. Note that most of these products were announced in the beginning of this year, and NOTHING has been delivered, except EXR. Most of them haven't even started yet!
I've tried talking to them about it but they get frustrated and don't want to listen, and eventually kicked me out of the slack.

A good project has a clear roadmap and clear goals. The Expanse team tries to do everything at the same time and as a result everything is half-assed.

They were supposed to launch a roadmap in June. After half a year not even a draft has been released. How do you even operate without a roadmap???

There is just a complete lack of direction - there is no capable CEO is able to oversee the big picture and prioritize the steps needed to get to the goal.

I used to like this project but it turned out to be the biggest disappointment of all my investments, nothing substantially happened after giving them a year to accomplish something, and i know nothing's going to change because they make the same mistakes again and again.


Some things have happened and there are some ICO's lined up, so things are slowly progressing, but man it could have been so much more, and so much better. The product i expected when i invested initially was and is still great, but i have little confidence it will ever get there. At some point someone will get a similar idea and execute it better, and Expanse will be lost. Like NXT was lost to NEM.

Honestly they are not scammers, they mean well but they are just completely incapable of managing a project. Let alone something of this magnitude.



Then why am i writing this? Well this message has 2 purposes:
1) To point investors in the right direction - which things to look at when they have invested.
2) To hope that the team gets their shit together: Understand what you're doing, why you are doing it, and prioritize. Figure out, in detail, what the hell you want to build and how it will work. Then make a step by step plan with SMART goals to get there.



Now in response to this message they are going to say: He is a shill, paid by Ubiq or whatever. But they will not look at their process and try to figure out what they're doing wrong. They dropped 200 spots on CMC and still think it's because "BTC is doing so well", or "People are paid to make us look bad".
I'm not a shill, i'm not paid by anyone - my account is almost 4 year old. I'm just terribly, terribly disappointed.
I recalling banning you from Slack just because you were always toxic.  Every single time we posted news, made a small accomplishment, or updated the community on, you were extremely critical.  Even on tasks that were "completed", the criticism did not stop.  So yeah, I would definitely call you FUD because a logical investor does not remain a critic when something is completed.

I sure as hell wasn't toxic, i even vouched for and defended the project a lot in Q2, until i got just extremely frustrated by the team's behavior towards criticism and lack of direction.
I even offered to help you out, several times, because i was seeing what was going wrong, but the team rejected my help.
Of course i get more and more critical when every even slightly sensitive question is met by avoidance and personal attacks.

Of course i'm not going to hype tiny accomplishments because i'm a long term investor - i don't care if you accomplish something which is not relevant for the big picture. If anything, it makes me more frustrated because the team treats it as some massive accomplishment (so many times overhyped), while i already know in a month it'll be forgotten and we're still at square 1.

You expect your investors to jump on your bandwagon and if anybody does otherwise the team feels attacked and feels like these people are toxic. Guess what? That's a shitty attitude for a team. Investors have real concerns and when they voice them there are only 2 options:
-The concern is unjustified so you can explain it away
-The concern IS justified and you should process the feedback.

And if it turns out you are unsuccessful in explaining the concern away, you probably missed something because you either didn't understand the concern correctly or your answer is not sufficient.

I can't believe i have to explain stuff like this, it's elementary.

Take your reaction to my post as a text book example of what's wrong with the Expanse team. Instead of addressing my points one by one and showing you actually do have a plan and know what you're doing, you AGAIN respond by calling my reaction FUD.
I'm a disappointed investor and this forum is the only way to vent my frustration, which is something completely different because you sure as hell fucked up to get me to this point.

N.B.: when i say you fucked up i mean that the team has a complete inability to handle criticism, a bad attitude where they treat people with genuine concerns as toxic, and very poor self-reflections skills. Only the worst of attitudes will get my this worked up.

For the record, i was holding up to 100k EXP for the better part of this year and lost about 30BTC, and i'm not even talking about missed profits. That's my bad, because i invested in a bad team, lesson learned. But maybe that helps to get it through your head why i feel a need to vent here. You treated one of your biggest investors like shit.
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December 12, 2017, 10:58:19 AM
 #6353

Prrrrft is just salty he got banned from the slack for concern trolling. This is literally all he has ever done in the expanse slack. Atleast a few times a week he would do this. Ask anyone from the EXP chat.

Check it.  I specifically remember when Chris was talking about doing a charity event for Borderless Charity to give back to the homeless  center, or maybe it was a woman's center.  Anyhow, Prfft went on for about 3 hours saying that what we were doing was wrong.

Who the hell bashes on a charity???

Now you're just making stuff up, post a screenshot. For the record i always thought the charity was a nice thing and if i did anything to attack it i apologize.

Why are you even trying to discredit me anyway. I haven't said anything that isn't either true or my honest opinion and now i'm being accused of 'concern trolling' and attacking a charity?

That's low man, really low. If anything is toxic in the community it's this right here.
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December 12, 2017, 01:17:07 PM
 #6354

I remember when you trolled about the charity also. You were always toxic as hell in expanse slack. "I offered to help" no you didnt, anytime you would show up all you did was NEG the devs for hours and then be like "but i can help". No wonder they would brush you off and eventually banned you. You are saying the team cant take criticism but you cant take being ignored. Look at how worked up you are because no one takes your "help" serious but why would anyone? Maybe you need to evaluate your approach for the next project you decide to "help".

A typical prrfft encounter on slack.

"you suck you suck you suck you suck, but dont get defensive why are you getting defensive, you suck you suck, but I can help!"  Roll Eyes

I sincerely doubt you ever owned a single EXP let alone 100k. But you can prove it.
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December 12, 2017, 01:20:39 PM
 #6355

I also recall the devs saying they would feel more comfortable with letting you help if you would just drop your whole anon sockpuppet thing. And I dont blame them, because I wouldnt want to work with someone who is constantly negging me and I dont know who they are either. But thats just me.
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December 12, 2017, 01:44:08 PM
 #6356

Negging is an act of emotional manipulation whereby a person makes a deliberate backhanded compliment or other remark to another person to undermine their confidence and increase their need of the manipulator's approval.
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December 12, 2017, 02:49:47 PM
 #6357

Prrrrft is just salty he got banned from the slack for concern trolling. This is literally all he has ever done in the expanse slack. Atleast a few times a week he would do this. Ask anyone from the EXP chat.

Check it.  I specifically remember when Chris was talking about doing a charity event for Borderless Charity to give back to the homeless  center, or maybe it was a woman's center.  Anyhow, Prfft went on for about 3 hours saying that what we were doing was wrong.

Who the hell bashes on a charity???

Now you're just making stuff up, post a screenshot. For the record i always thought the charity was a nice thing and if i did anything to attack it i apologize.

Why are you even trying to discredit me anyway. I haven't said anything that isn't either true or my honest opinion and now i'm being accused of 'concern trolling' and attacking a charity?

That's low man, really low. If anything is toxic in the community it's this right here.


I'm not making stuff up.  Maybe you forgot the scenario, but the definition of being toxic is exactly why you were banned.

We get suggestions and open ideas all the time.  They are very much welcome. 
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December 12, 2017, 02:58:13 PM
 #6358

Franko, how many people are currently active in the EXP team??


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December 12, 2017, 03:23:15 PM
 #6359

Prrrrft is just salty he got banned from the slack for concern trolling. This is literally all he has ever done in the expanse slack. Atleast a few times a week he would do this. Ask anyone from the EXP chat.

Check it.  I specifically remember when Chris was talking about doing a charity event for Borderless Charity to give back to the homeless  center, or maybe it was a woman's center.  Anyhow, Prfft went on for about 3 hours saying that what we were doing was wrong.

Who the hell bashes on a charity???

Now you're just making stuff up, post a screenshot. For the record i always thought the charity was a nice thing and if i did anything to attack it i apologize.

Why are you even trying to discredit me anyway. I haven't said anything that isn't either true or my honest opinion and now i'm being accused of 'concern trolling' and attacking a charity?

That's low man, really low. If anything is toxic in the community it's this right here.


I'm not making stuff up.  Maybe you forgot the scenario, but the definition of being toxic is exactly why you were banned.

We get suggestions and open ideas all the time.  They are very much welcome.  

As i said, show me exactly how this happened. I'm not a person to bash a charity and again if i said anything to undermine the charity i apologize. Whatever way my comments came across i can assure you i didn't mean to badmouth the charity.

You think you're open to ideas but in reality you're not, i saw it on the slack all the time. Someone says something and team member will say 'great feedback, we're going to do that!'. And then nothing happens with it. Then if people start to ask further questions you get more and more annoyed.
Or in that case, maybe you are open to ideas, but you don't process them, and then get annoyed when people are still asking for it.

Another thing that often happens is someone asks you a question, you give a partial answer which doesn't really answer the question, they keep asking and the team gets annoyed. As a result the conversation gets more bitter with each response. The person asking the question doesn't feel understood and the team members feel attacked (somehow).

Now i'm the kind of person who will not let something like that go and i'll keep bringing it up until something actually happens or until i get an actual answer, and that's how i frustrated you. I never meant to do or say anything bad or particularly critical but the team's constant avoiding reaction steered the conversation that way.

I'm part of many communities and nowhere do i have a problem like this, most are very friendly and positive. There's something wrong with the way you handle certain community members - if you handle it well a situation like this can at all times be avoided. You can say it's my responsibility to keep the peace but it really isn't, its yours because it's mainly in your interest.

I mean, it isn't just me. I've seen team members be horrible to other members on the slack too. It's always the people who ask sensitive questions though. You have to find a way to deal with that. As a dev team you can't allow yourself to feel attacked that easily.

Maybe you should take a look at how other dev teams deal with community feedback/questions/concerns.
scottii
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December 12, 2017, 04:23:01 PM
 #6360

Franko, how many people are currently active in the EXP team??

Chris Franko, James Clayton, Ahmad S., Terry M., Omar (can't remember his last name), David Drake, Marcia M., Asim Ashfaq, and myself.  Asim has a team of developers that works under him, but I don't know their names specifically.  There also a 3 more people that work under me to do social media stuff.  In addition, a maybe 3-4 more who do a variety of things upon request - Dennis (DINC) is one of them.
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