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Author Topic: Placing machines outside on cold winter? -20  (Read 16391 times)
Sweminer777
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September 27, 2015, 07:54:51 PM
 #41

Excatly. So 0.05 CENT are how many dollars?  Kiss

Well sure, electricity cost might go down. But grid-fee or whatever you call it, will go up! At least here in Norway!



Dunno, here in sweden the grid fee and tax is in debate as many complained that it is to high.


Electricity cost like 0.0001c and the grid is around 0.02 and taxes about 0.027c .

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September 29, 2015, 07:19:13 AM
 #42

my electric bill is 0.05 cents kwh

Do you mean $0.05 kwh? I can't imagine such a low price as 0.05 cents kwh. Even $0.05 kwh is pretty low too.


Yeah still quite high for running few mahcines Cheesy.

Global market has statet that Electricity will keep falling down as the usage keeps raising they need to compete whit the global prices.

This is for 2016 the prices would be falling 0.01- 0.02 usd and some more .

0.05$/kwh is very cheap tbh! Prices are gonna go up imo.. ^^

He's picking on your grammar btw, 0.05 cent = 0.00005$, you obviously don't have 0.00005$/kwh prices Cheesy


is not a cent after 0. ? Tongue haha Wink,

But prices will keep falling, i've made some research.

Global comsumption is getting higher.

It don't mean it will go down to almost free from nowehre, it will take some time , specially were it is costly it might even take longer.

Companies always try to get you into contracts because the prices get lowered so if you bind yourself you will be paying 2 - 4 times more than what it should cost at current market price.

Personally I don't think if the Global comsumption is getting higher the prices will become lower. On the contrary, the higher the demand the higher the price. But I know it's not so unnatural to expect some tricks from the economics, so good luck.)

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September 29, 2015, 08:38:17 AM
 #43

My assumption is that standard PC/server is in the principle the same machine. The manufacturer are limiting Operating environment. If I remember well typical figures are:
Temperature operating: 5C - 35C (41F - 95F)
Relative humidity: 8% - 80%

Running in temperature below 0C will for sure increase a chance of damadge.   
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September 29, 2015, 12:50:27 PM
 #44

My assumption is that standard PC/server is in the principle the same machine. The manufacturer are limiting Operating environment. If I remember well typical figures are:
Temperature operating: 5C - 35C (41F - 95F)
Relative humidity: 8% - 80%

Running in temperature below 0C will for sure increase a chance of damadge.   

Part of what makes it tricky is that he want's to run it outside.  I think preventing moisture is going to be hard.  Just if air can flow through I think it's possible for a little moisture to get through.  And even a little would be bad on miiner.

We really will not know for sure until OP does it.   I do suggest he start out with a cheap miner to test what will happen.
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October 01, 2015, 11:57:31 PM
 #45


For about 6 weeks I ran a large rack of miners in what used to be an attached garage. On the East wall there are large windows I left open and on the west wall is where I had the rack and the miners pointed at the open door. The temperatures were not -20 but we were certainly below freezing many days and nights off and on for weeks. I did not have a need to run the furnace because I had strategically placed miners around the home but this was the largest concentration in the attached garage. Even when it was below freezing it would be so hot in the attached garage that I couldn't sleep in there and I can fall asleep anywhere. Once I placed an exhaust fan by the west door sucking-blowing out. To me it was perfect and I could fall asleep if I was working out there.
(It is not uncommon for me to stay awake too much and only get a couple of hours sleep for a few days and then crash anywhere I land at home.)
The miners did need a good cleaning and I broke them all down as far as possible and with a vacuum and low pressure, dry, clean, compressed air they were spotless. There was not any damage. I've seen pictures in the SP20 thread of weather damage. If you want to see some thermal damage roll through that thread. People who had the miner sitting outside their window with just the exhaust sticking inside for the heat.

I live in a humid area. It isn't extremely humid, but it certainly isn't as dry as some places. I live kind of in the same part of the world as sidehack and novac so maybe they could chime in on the humidity %, and it is a bit dryer in the winter here, but I'm certainly not going to claim it is very dry, probably average for most of the Midwest USA.

I know there were some obscene temperature changes because right beside this door where the exhaust went is an open door to the rest of the house and heat poured in from the other miners. It was so hot you could break a sweat if I didn't open the windows sometimes.

There is a difference between -20 c and - 10 c and most nights in the winter are probably average between 4 c to -6 c
Even though it was technically inside a home there was always a great breeze of cross air in the room. Some nights working out there I regulated the temperature by opening or closing a window.  I certainly had temperature swings from day to night. We have huge swings here where you can see 20 to 0 c between day and night.

I wasn't lucky. I cleaned the miners and I continue to do so.
Take one down, pass it around, wash, and repeat. Be meticulous with any buildup.

The exact same miners are running today in a different part of the home and have a filter setup. They are running great and I have added more miners, but the filters did a fantastic job and I clean about half as often. For your outdoor project I would use a fine thin layer mesh and a true filter. Don't restrict the flow much. I would also use double fans. By this I mean I would use the ones on the miner and have another at the exhaust to your structure which is strong enough to continue pulling air across the hashing boards just in case something happened to the other fan(s). I would never let them run fanless due to hotspots. This is the mistake many people make when performing sub zero and N2 experiments. Hit up overclockers.net for some subzero tips if you want, but it is pretty straightforward at this temperature.

AS long as you keep the air flowing and do not allow water to reach the miner I think you will be fine. This is around February and early march of this year and if I were you I would go for it.

As someone advised, run yourself a little test with one miner for a week and check her out. Do a deep checking and completely pull her down. Take a magnifying glass and patiently look at all components paying close attention to the area around the inlet and outlet. If it is even close to as dry as you describe I do not see why you will have issues. People in Michigan, New Hampshire, North Dakota, etc see temps of -20 c easy every year so I do not understand why -20 is exciting so many folks. After all, it is the humidity that is the killer.

Look at the previous years average. What does the temp range do when the sun comes up? Does it stay at -20 or does it blast to +10 in 30 minutes? That can be a reason for concern but otherwise you are good.

Document everything! Take pictures! I didn't and I kick myself for it. If it wasn't so much work I would set it up this way just to take pics, but I have a different plan for this winter. I am going to use the existing ductwork in my home being fed by all the miners in one room. The duct will handle it no problem. I will take pictures Smiley

Transaction fees go to the pools and the pools decide to pay them to the miners. Anything else, including off-chain solutions are stealing and not the way Bitcoin was intended to function.
Make the block size set by the pool. Pool = miners and they get the choice.
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October 02, 2015, 03:42:40 AM
 #46

AS long as you keep the air flowing and do not allow water to reach the miner I think you will be fine. This is around February and early march of this year and if I were you I would go for it.

This is the really hard part I forsee.  OP talks about a box outside in -20.   The miner will heat the inside of the box.  I think getting airflow outside without allowing moisture is going to be a really uphill battle.

I honestly hope OP does it as I have not seen it done outside in -20.  But I sure would start off with a cheap miner nothing nicer then a S3 in that box.  I'm afraid moisture will make it the box of death for a miner.
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October 02, 2015, 10:20:56 AM
 #47

AS long as you keep the air flowing and do not allow water to reach the miner I think you will be fine. This is around February and early march of this year and if I were you I would go for it.

This is the really hard part I forsee.  OP talks about a box outside in -20.   The miner will heat the inside of the box.  I think getting airflow outside without allowing moisture is going to be a really uphill battle.

I honestly hope OP does it as I have not seen it done outside in -20.  But I sure would start off with a cheap miner nothing nicer then a S3 in that box.  I'm afraid moisture will make it the box of death for a miner.


The box might get a li ttle heat, but the idea is to have the fulls fully blowing to get the hot air pushed outside.


I am running one outside atm, and it's 100% cool inside, but the temps are still warm

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October 02, 2015, 08:46:07 PM
 #48

AS long as you keep the air flowing and do not allow water to reach the miner I think you will be fine. This is around February and early march of this year and if I were you I would go for it.

This is the really hard part I forsee.  OP talks about a box outside in -20.   The miner will heat the inside of the box.  I think getting airflow outside without allowing moisture is going to be a really uphill battle.

I honestly hope OP does it as I have not seen it done outside in -20.  But I sure would start off with a cheap miner nothing nicer then a S3 in that box.  I'm afraid moisture will make it the box of death for a miner.


The box might get a li ttle heat, but the idea is to have the fulls fully blowing to get the hot air pushed outside.


I am running one outside atm, and it's 100% cool inside, but the temps are still warm

Can you take some pictures? Is the one outside in a box like you mentioned?

Also what kind of miner did you put out there?
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October 04, 2015, 08:09:25 AM
 #49

AS long as you keep the air flowing and do not allow water to reach the miner I think you will be fine. This is around February and early march of this year and if I were you I would go for it.

This is the really hard part I forsee.  OP talks about a box outside in -20.   The miner will heat the inside of the box.  I think getting airflow outside without allowing moisture is going to be a really uphill battle.

I honestly hope OP does it as I have not seen it done outside in -20.  But I sure would start off with a cheap miner nothing nicer then a S3 in that box.  I'm afraid moisture will make it the box of death for a miner.


The box might get a li ttle heat, but the idea is to have the fulls fully blowing to get the hot air pushed outside.


I am running one outside atm, and it's 100% cool inside, but the temps are still warm

Can you take some pictures? Is the one outside in a box like you mentioned?

Also what kind of miner did you put out there?

Yes, please. I'd like to see some pictures too. How's your progress?

Quote
but the temps are still warm

You mean the temps outside? So no -20 yet?

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October 04, 2015, 10:25:54 PM
 #50

As long as the miner stays on so it generates heat, does not get wet, has air circulation and stays clean I would think it will do fine.

I might be concerned about the wiring getting to brittle if it gets really cold.

+1 but maybe you can help the wires by making sure you connect it only with one cable instead of two (not sure every miner has this option but most miners you can use a stronger PSU and then put only one connection so a lot of power goes thru this one connection and warms itself up...) also if you overclock the hashrate the heat inside should suffice to keep the cables warm...
Sweminer777
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October 05, 2015, 10:55:02 AM
 #51

I will put pictures later tonite.


I have not built a box yet. still considering the materials to be used.



I have sp20 outside, but temps as said before are not so low yet. maybe 0c at night as lowest and around 15c daily.


Fan at 100% still only have the miner on 1650GH/s , asic temps are fine too 2x at 100c and rest 85c.

It is pulling around 1300W from the wall and 2 wires are hot , some plastic melted and burned a week ago, tought was running 2x pcie from 1x wire.

Now each pci-e have it own wire , tought 2x are still running hot but not to a melting point.


Still waiting for colder temps to start something atleast.


I just can't seem to overclock the sp20 it keeps just adjusting automatic even if the temps are low.


Bringing home some S5 miners, will see tonithgt how they perform outside.

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October 05, 2015, 01:20:37 PM
 #52

I will put pictures later tonite.

I have sp20 outside, but temps as said before are not so low yet. maybe 0c at night as lowest and around 15c daily.


Fan at 100% still only have the miner on 1650GH/s , asic temps are fine too 2x at 100c and rest 85c.

It is pulling around 1300W from the wall and 2 wires are hot , some plastic melted and burned a week ago, tought was running 2x pcie from 1x wire.

Now each pci-e have it own wire , tought 2x are still running hot but not to a melting point.

snip

I look forward to seeing the pictures! I have been curious what this project will turn into.

On the wires are you saying at 0c they are still hot?  In 0c the wires should not be hot.  What PSU are you using?  Also are you using a extension cord?
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October 06, 2015, 01:19:07 PM
 #53

I will put pictures later tonite.

I have sp20 outside, but temps as said before are not so low yet. maybe 0c at night as lowest and around 15c daily.


Fan at 100% still only have the miner on 1650GH/s , asic temps are fine too 2x at 100c and rest 85c.

It is pulling around 1300W from the wall and 2 wires are hot , some plastic melted and burned a week ago, tought was running 2x pcie from 1x wire.

Now each pci-e have it own wire , tought 2x are still running hot but not to a melting point.

snip

I look forward to seeing the pictures! I have been curious what this project will turn into.

On the wires are you saying at 0c they are still hot?  In 0c the wires should not be hot.  What PSU are you using?  Also are you using a extension cord?

Yeal ill be updating.

Just had so much crap outside i need to get everything clean to make some room.


sp20 is currently on a server psu. DPS-2000BB , i self made the wires whit home wiring , they are fat Copper cables and should not be so hot actually.

On the night a bit of the "homeMAde" cable is still warm, the other day when 4x pcie were passing trough 1x copper wire , it got RED HOT, and started to burn stuff and melting plastic haha, no dmg too done i got it in time Smiley.




the s5s will sit on a rm1000 together, i am not comfortable to put all the machines on the Server psu and make it fully load.

The burnage happened at half load.


right now i am configuring and making everything clean , have alot of IT work to do from school so kinda prioritizing but ill keep update as much as i can.

Weather is still warm, it got even warmer, but should drop any soon, it should start to snow in some weeks.






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October 06, 2015, 08:55:43 PM
 #54

I will put pictures later tonite.

I have sp20 outside, but temps as said before are not so low yet. maybe 0c at night as lowest and around 15c daily.


Fan at 100% still only have the miner on 1650GH/s , asic temps are fine too 2x at 100c and rest 85c.

It is pulling around 1300W from the wall and 2 wires are hot , some plastic melted and burned a week ago, tought was running 2x pcie from 1x wire.

Now each pci-e have it own wire , tought 2x are still running hot but not to a melting point.

snip

I look forward to seeing the pictures! I have been curious what this project will turn into.

On the wires are you saying at 0c they are still hot?  In 0c the wires should not be hot.  What PSU are you using?  Also are you using a extension cord?

Yeal ill be updating.

Just had so much crap outside i need to get everything clean to make some room.


sp20 is currently on a server psu. DPS-2000BB , i self made the wires whit home wiring , they are fat Copper cables and should not be so hot actually.

On the night a bit of the "homeMAde" cable is still warm, the other day when 4x pcie were passing trough 1x copper wire , it got RED HOT, and started to burn stuff and melting plastic haha, no dmg too done i got it in time Smiley.

snip

I HIGHLY suggest stopping using them and look into better cables.  The hot cable is not good.   4 PCIE cables going through 1 wire?  Can you take a picture of it.

Please show what your doing on 4 though 1 cable as this sounds like something I have not seen before.   Not to mention dangerous.
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October 06, 2015, 10:49:15 PM
 #55

^^Absolutely. With 1300W we are talking about at least 100 amps, so you should use 4 AWG or 35mm2 for your wiring.
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October 06, 2015, 11:30:12 PM
 #56


On the night a bit of the "homeMAde" cable is still warm, the other day when 4x pcie were passing trough 1x copper wire , it got RED HOT, and started to burn stuff and melting plastic haha, no dmg too done i got it in time Smiley.



You need to use some real wires and size them appropriately.  Nothing should be so hot that you cannot touch it.  Something red hot is way way way into the danger zone, you'll end up burning down your neighborhood.

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October 06, 2015, 11:54:13 PM
 #57


On the night a bit of the "homeMAde" cable is still warm, the other day when 4x pcie were passing trough 1x copper wire , it got RED HOT, and started to burn stuff and melting plastic haha, no dmg too done i got it in time Smiley.



You need to use some real wires and size them appropriately.  Nothing should be so hot that you cannot touch it.  Something red hot is way way way into the danger zone, you'll end up burning down your neighborhood.



Are there more pictures of that happening?  I had not seen the first one thank you for posting it.   Different view was interesting.

But yea like I mentioned earlier stop.... honest OP you will thank us.  Heating up and burning stuff is no joke, it's honestly dangerous.
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October 07, 2015, 05:15:03 AM
 #58


Are there more pictures of that happening?  I had not seen the first one thank you for posting it.   Different view was interesting.

But yea like I mentioned earlier stop.... honest OP you will thank us.  Heating up and burning stuff is no joke, it's honestly dangerous.

Just browsing google image search, found these as well, there may be more out there:





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October 07, 2015, 06:43:22 AM
 #59

I feel the urge to bring this up again:


This happend to me, use the right gauge! Tongue
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October 07, 2015, 06:48:20 AM
 #60

I feel the urge to bring this up again:

saving space from pic

This happend to me, use the right gauge! Tongue

Exactly it is scary what electricity can do if not set up proper.  Using crap wire, or cheaper wire.  Cheaper equipment can cause very bad things. 

For OP to seem say "haha" around all those bad things is scary.  I don't think he realizes that it can burn down buildings... scary.  Get a good smoke detector if your messing with stuff like that.
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