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Author Topic: Bitfury: "16nm... sales to public start shortly"  (Read 108372 times)
Mr. Kashif
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February 09, 2016, 07:16:32 AM
 #441

Between I got a mail from bitfury.



Have a look.
RichBC
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February 09, 2016, 07:21:46 AM
 #442

Between I got a mail from bitfury.

Have a look.


Good to see and there always has to be the possibility that a big purchaser can also be a Distributor. Much as I like the idea of an own design ASIC I feel buying chips has got to be the way froward.

Rich

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Mr. Kashif
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February 09, 2016, 07:23:00 AM
 #443

Between I got a mail from bitfury.

Have a look.


Good to see and there always has to be the possibility that a big purchaser can also be a Distributor. Much as I like the idea of an own design ASIC I feel buying chips has got to be the way froward.

Rich

You bet. Wink
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February 09, 2016, 07:23:31 AM
 #444

Anyone have an online class they recommend for designing chips?
You need to learn prerequisites first:

1) digital logic design (combinatorial and sequential logic, synchronous and asynchronous circuits, automata theory, etc.)

2) elements of circuit theory (nodal analysis, mesh analysis, you'll need to understand what SPICE will do for you and what it won't do)

Only after some understanding of the above you will be able to comprehend the CMOS ASIC design textbooks.

For somebody who is a self-starter the best way is to get some low end FPGA kit from e.g. Digilent or Avnet or Terasic. Low-end because those are supported by the free editions of the respective design toolchains. This is the main objective: to actually understand the methodology and limitations. When FPGA's were competitive for Bitcoin mining several members of this forum learned everything from scratch in about 3 months.

The classroom environment becomes important only later. You want to choose a school that has access to the https://www.mosis.com/ prototype fabrication service.

Bitfury actually did his first chip in partnership with some Polish research institute when I pointed to him that he will then qualify for http://www.europractice-ic.com/ which is an European equivalent of USA's MOSIS.



Please comment, critique, criticize or ridicule BIP 2112: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=54382.0
Long-term mining prognosis: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=91101.0
dmwardjr
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February 09, 2016, 07:50:33 AM
 #445

Anyone have an online class they recommend for designing chips?
You need to learn prerequisites first:

1) digital logic design (combinatorial and sequential logic, synchronous and asynchronous circuits, automata theory, etc.)

2) elements of circuit theory (nodal analysis, mesh analysis, you'll need to understand what SPICE will do for you and what it won't do)

Only after some understanding of the above you will be able to comprehend the CMOS ASIC design textbooks.

For somebody who is a self-starter the best way is to get some low end FPGA kit from e.g. Digilent or Avnet or Terasic. Low-end because those are supported by the free editions of the respective design toolchains. This is the main objective: to actually understand the methodology and limitations. When FPGA's were competitive for Bitcoin mining several members of this forum learned everything from scratch in about 3 months.

The classroom environment becomes important only later. You want to choose a school that has access to the https://www.mosis.com/ prototype fabrication service.

Bitfury actually did his first chip in partnership with some Polish research institute when I pointed to him that he will then qualify for http://www.europractice-ic.com/ which is an European equivalent of USA's MOSIS.

Thanks for the info and recommendations.

I teach telephone technicians how to use their meter to identify and locate troubles on wire line telephone service; not wireless.  I also teach transmission trouble shooting and some outside plant engineering design.  ADSL is asynchronous but I'm very limited on my knowledge of it.  My training focuses more on maintaining the wire and/or fiber [In the middle] connecting networks together rather than each end of the network with its equipment.  

Telephony training in the telephone industry has taken a hit lately with the economy being so terrible.  When the stocks of CenturyLink and AT&T take a hit, one of the first things to go in their budget cuts is training.  I used to be on the road 42 to 45 weeks annually.  Now, I'm fortunate to get 6 to 10 weeks of training classes annually after more than 18 years in training.  So, i turned to mining to supplement income I had lost from less training.  

Now, it looks like I might have to open up some e-cig stores to supplement my income from training.  I've been thinking about opening up six to ten e-ciggerette stores in my area.  I may end up going that route to make the funds.  It's quite possible to clear $5K+ monthly from each store after taxes and expenses.  A buddy of mine does this on average from each of his 14 stores scattered over about a 40 mile radius.

I'll take your advice to heart, weigh my options and decide what to do with my time.  Obtaining the funds is the biggest obstacle in my opinion.  I don't see where it profits me much to learn the stuff if I don't have the funds to use it.  I may end up continuing the way I'm going with buying the best gear I can get my hands on when it's available.  The block halving approaching doesn't help at the moment either.

So, more than likely, I'll go the e-cig route to obtain more funds to have more options when it comes to mining.  If a 0.06 watts per GH/s rig comes on the market, I'm quite certain it would be able to mine with profits for quite a while.  Maybe for the lifetime of the rig.  I hope someone comes out with one soon that's available to us all.  I'm not giving up on mining.  That's for sure.  I'm now in wait and see mode regarding mining.

Thanks again for your recommendations.

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alh
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February 09, 2016, 07:56:00 AM
 #446

Between I got a mail from bitfury.



Have a look.

Thanks for making this available! It's unfortunate he doesn't indicate how many chips you get if you put up $1M.

Do you get 100, 1000, 500,000, what?

Nice way of saying "Don't talk to us unless you have serious money". Not a surprise.....
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February 09, 2016, 08:18:40 AM
 #447

Between I got a mail from bitfury.



Have a look.

Thanks for making this available! It's unfortunate he doesn't indicate how many chips you get if you put up $1M.

Do you get 100, 1000, 500,000, what?

Nice way of saying "Don't talk to us unless you have serious money". Not a surprise.....

Punin himself stated exactly that in the russian part of the forum.
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February 09, 2016, 04:44:11 PM
 #448

I am under NDA .
So just take my word for it.


How much do you think a board would cost to run 20 chips per board?  Subtract the price of the BF chips so I am just talking about the board.

20 chips should run 2TH at .11w/gh so 220W per board.  How big would the board need to be? 10" X 10"?

Qty 500 boards.

I am just curious as to the cost of the board in qty. 

I don't have a ballpark price on hand but that's not too far from what we're looking to build. A pair of my boards would do 2TH/220W in approximately 6"x9" of PCB and screw onto an S1 heatsink.

If you make one of those 2T at  220w I will buy that for sure.
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February 09, 2016, 04:56:49 PM
 #449

Between I got a mail from bitfury.



Have a look.

Thanks for making this available! It's unfortunate he doesn't indicate how many chips you get if you put up $1M.

Do you get 100, 1000, 500,000, what?

Nice way of saying "Don't talk to us unless you have serious money". Not a surprise.....

Punin himself stated exactly that in the russian part of the forum.

The picture is a good read on it. Everyone would LOVE to get their hands on these miners.  But that picture of email basically was a really nice way of saying if you don't have a million to spend your wasting your time.

Someone could make a bundle buying in huge bulk and reselling miners at a markup.  Not sure if anyone will do this, but we can hope.  Or hope some other way comes up to buy them.
Redrose
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February 09, 2016, 05:01:27 PM
 #450

I am under NDA .
So just take my word for it.


How much do you think a board would cost to run 20 chips per board?  Subtract the price of the BF chips so I am just talking about the board.

20 chips should run 2TH at .11w/gh so 220W per board.  How big would the board need to be? 10" X 10"?

Qty 500 boards.

I am just curious as to the cost of the board in qty. 

I don't have a ballpark price on hand but that's not too far from what we're looking to build. A pair of my boards would do 2TH/220W in approximately 6"x9" of PCB and screw onto an S1 heatsink.

If you make one of those 2T at  220w I will buy that for sure.

So we have the specifications ? That's true that 2 Th/s for a 220W consumption is really really interesting. If I buy or not will depend on the price.
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February 09, 2016, 07:45:04 PM
 #451

So we have the specifications ? That's true that 2 Th/s for a 220W consumption is really really interesting. If I buy or not will depend on the price.

Personally I don't believe that we will see any of the miners on sell for the open market. Anyone with a half of brain will simply buy the chips and mine for themselves. Their latest announcement is pure PR bullshit and lies, but we will not see them in the wild as it should happen. Thanks Bitfury for the constant stream of lies! Whatever brings the money, right?

dogie (OP)
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February 09, 2016, 08:15:00 PM
 #452

Whatever brings the money, right?

Holy shit can you stop shilling already. Its very clear from 3rd party reports that they are selling to the [rich] public and we will see 16nm based devices in the wild.

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February 09, 2016, 08:27:11 PM
 #453

So we have the specifications ? That's true that 2 Th/s for a 220W consumption is really really interesting. If I buy or not will depend on the price.

Personally I don't believe that we will see any of the miners on sell for the open market. Anyone with a half of brain will simply buy the chips and mine for themselves. Their latest announcement is pure PR bullshit and lies, but we will not see them in the wild as it should happen. Thanks Bitfury for the constant stream of lies! Whatever brings the money, right?

Holy shit can you stop shilling already. Its very clear from 3rd party reports that they are selling to the [rich] public and we will see 16nm based devices in the wild.

please be so fair and quote all.

yes, but then they are overpriced. count one and one together and you will understand how the future will look like. every link in the chain will add a margin for themselves.

this is how the old world works but Bitcoin (or people behind) claimed in the beginning they will change the world. NOTHING HAS CHANGED AT ALL!

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February 09, 2016, 08:46:13 PM
 #454

Whatever brings the money, right?

Holy shit can you stop shilling already. Its very clear from 3rd party reports that they are selling to the [rich] public and we will see 16nm based devices in the wild.

Let's agree on a number of devices to be available to the open market in order to define "in the wild". I think that if we see less than 1k devices we can't call them "in the wild". Agree on this number?

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February 09, 2016, 09:14:06 PM
 #455

Whatever brings the money, right?

Holy shit can you stop shilling already. Its very clear from 3rd party reports that they are selling to the [rich] public and we will see 16nm based devices in the wild.

Let's agree on a number of devices to be available to the open market in order to define "in the wild". I think that if we see less than 1k devices we can't call them "in the wild". Agree on this number?

In the same way that people try and assess failure rates via a forum, no. Bitfury, the $X00,000,000 multinational corporation has nothing to prove to you.

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February 09, 2016, 09:39:05 PM
 #456

Whatever brings the money, right?

Holy shit can you stop shilling already. Its very clear from 3rd party reports that they are selling to the [rich] public and we will see 16nm based devices in the wild.

Let's agree on a number of devices to be available to the open market in order to define "in the wild". I think that if we see less than 1k devices we can't call them "in the wild". Agree on this number?

I don't understand what info you're basing your opinionated statements on. We have seen great interest from integrators to our 16nm chip and are confident mining devices based on our chip will be available to public very soon. Possibly as early as end of march.


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RoadStress
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February 09, 2016, 10:54:08 PM
 #457

In the same way that people try and assess failure rates via a forum, no. Bitfury, the $X00,000,000 multinational corporation has nothing to prove to you.

Not to me, but to everyone else that read their announcement.

I don't understand what info you're basing your opinionated statements on. We have seen great interest from integrators to our 16nm chip and are confident mining devices based on our chip will be available to public very soon. Possibly as early as end of march.

I don't have any info. It's just my educated guess. I can't wait to be wrong!

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February 10, 2016, 12:19:00 AM
 #458

I don't understand what info you're basing your opinionated statements on. We have seen great interest from integrators to our 16nm chip and are confident mining devices based on our chip will be available to public very soon. Possibly as early as end of march.

Good stuff, where will these "official" Bitfury integrators be posted?

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February 10, 2016, 12:38:16 AM
 #459



Personally I don't believe that we will see any of the miners on sell for the open market. Anyone with a half of brain will simply buy the chips and mine for themselves. Their latest announcement is pure PR bullshit and lies, but we will not see them in the wild as it should happen. Thanks Bitfury for the constant stream of lies! Whatever brings the money, right?

Meh "Whatever brings the money" is right - and that goes for all ASIC manufacturers!  I'm not sure why everyone is bitchy about BitFury's stance on this, even BitMain proved with the S7 its all about the money!  I don't think we need another "S7 launch"-priced ASIC.  Ripoff the customers by severely overpricing in the beginning, then drop the price like a rock to move even more volume when you cause difficulty to skyrocket.

Really its been this way since Avalon launched the first ASIC.  Even with jumping through all the manufacturer/group buy hoops to obtain ASICs at the lowest possible price for the BCT forum members, actually obtaining ROI on an ASIC is a crapshoot even when you do the homework!  What is this, fool me 37 times?  You pretty much need to be in bed with the ASIC supplier to have any real chance!
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February 10, 2016, 12:43:21 AM
 #460

I don't understand what info you're basing your opinionated statements on. We have seen great interest from integrators to our 16nm chip and are confident mining devices based on our chip will be available to public very soon. Possibly as early as end of march.

Good stuff, where will these "official" Bitfury integrators be posted?

They are still building relationships now, I suspect you will see real movement in the coming weeks from some integrators..

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