[ANN] [DC] Dark Clam |BOUNTY ->| We need more developers. | J-D wager |

[andulolika]

Ha, I wish more people wanted that.

"darkclams will make you a better person. (maybe) ""
hehe ima get me some

You want to become a better person?

I doubt money can make you a better person unless you use it to help people but +1.

[EGStrategies]

 

we need a dice site for these 

[andulolika]

we need a dice site for these  

Indeed, SWIM shall make it!.

[andulolika]

Guys, we still want more developers.

[gordob]

Guys, we still want more developers.

Hey Andu, what's shaking with this project?

Need to find a way to kickstart this project without further huge developments.

1. I see pharesim from steemit has created a gambling bot on steemit - maybe chat to him about some collaboration, maybe an option to create a web front end and allow the current dark clam investors to make profits based on share equity.

Something else to consider is to move to an asset than develop tech for coin (enough of those) and move to Nxt/ardor platform.

Food for thought )

[andulolika]

Guys, we still want more developers.

Hey Andu, what's shaking with this project?

Need to find a way to kickstart this project without further huge developments.

1. I see pharesim from steemit has created a gambling bot on steemit - maybe chat to him about some collaboration, maybe an option to create a web front end and allow the current dark clam investors to make profits based on share equity.

Something else to consider is to move to an asset than develop tech for coin (enough of those) and move to Nxt/ardor platform.

Food for thought )

Edit: going to launch a simple wallet soon.

[marilyn4325]

I discussed a novel coin idea with andu. We didn't hear anything for some time now from the other programmer, googleplex, so I'll start to implement it, if DC holders like it.

TL;DR: a new coin, based on some Dash ideas with one minute transaction time, anonymous transactions, and a built-in fast Dice (max. 4 seconds delay), implemented as a trustless system (no central server needed) and provably fair.

First some background information. Dash uses a system of a few thousand Masternodes, see the Dash whitepaper for details. It allows advanced concepts like instant payment, with transaction times of less than 4 seconds (but normal transactions are fast, too, because the average block time is one minute). It does this with a random quorum of Masternode servers. Same concept is used for Darksend, for sending coins anonymously. Both ideas makes it a good base for Darkclam, because of the stated goals (see first post in this thread).

Now the novel idea I propose is to use the network itself as a Dice service. There is no investor. If you win a bet, new coins are created and if you lose a bet, coins are destroyed. On average the supply should stay the same, if the bets are not too big, e.g. a whale bets half of all supply and loses, but even then it would just half or increase by a factor of 1.5. Less than some normal fluctuations for some coins at exchanges.

One way to implement this is to use an external random source and to use the blockchain to record bets. After a draw of the external random source, the coins are created or destroyed and every node can verify it. Chancecoin uses this system. The coin seems to be dead now, because the developers disappeared, but it was listed for some time even at Poloniex.

I propose a new way how to handle bets: with the Dash quorum system. n random masternodes are selected (of course, the select algorithm has to be safe and random, too, otherwise you could select all your own servers) and each masternode creates a server seed and sends back the hash to the client. Then the client creates a random seed (or the user enters it), which is then sent to all selected masternodes. The idea is that you can't trust one server, but you can trust the quorum. All masternodes send back their server seed, which can be verified by all other masternodes and a roll is generated with an algorithm as used by just-dice, but all server seeds and the client seed are concatenated. This is the provably fair part. Needs to be thought in detail, and messages needs to be signed etc., but it should work similarly to the instant payment concept of Dash.

There will be no proof-of-stake or proof-of-work when creating new blocks. But a bet will have a small fee, which will prevent spamming the network as well (and normal transactions will have a fee as well), and a randomly selected masternode creates a block and gets the fee (maybe as in NXT and WAVES: the more DC the masternode owns, the higher the probability that it creates a block).

My plan to implement this: first I will implement Dash with the Scorex framework, which is written in Scala (WAVES already uses this framework and is currently tested a lot, with bug-bounties, and I guess will be at Poloniex soon, so a good code base). This will help me to understand the concepts of Dash in detail, and it will help the crypto community as well, because it is so much easier to test or change things in Scala than in C++, which is currently used for Dash. The Scorex framework provides a lot of common functions, so that the actual implementation of Dash shouldn't be that difficult, and would be mostly translating the existing C++ code to Scala. More advantages of Scala compared to C++: bugs like buffer overflows are impossible, the code runs without recompiling on Windows, Mac and Linux (because it is compiled to Java JVM classes), and it is much more compact, easier to write, and easier to read than C++.

After this I will implement the Darkclam coin, with the Scorex framework, based on some parts of Dash. There will be an integrated web browser (already part of the Scorex framework with Akka), which will provide the usual transfer and wallet functions (I suggest a decentralized wallet on the network, like in counterparty), and additionally the Dice game. You can connect to some official server on the internet, or run your own server locally on your computer. There is no way that the Dice game can get shut down by shutting down one server.

Then there will be a testnet for some time, until everyone agrees that it is stable and we can release the mainnet. The counterparty DC coins then will be transferred to the new coins on the mainnet. One way would be proof-of-burn, but maybe there are other ways possible with the counterparty API.

That's all a lot of work, and more developers are welcome. I'll do this all for free, because I believe in Darkclam, and hopefully can sell a bit later on Poloniex I guess it could need a year until it is all done, if I do it all by myself.

[gordob]

I discussed a novel coin idea with andu. We didn't hear anything for some time now from the other programmer, googleplex, so I'll start to implement it, if DC holders like it.

TL;DR: a new coin, based on some Dash ideas with one minute transaction time, anonymous transactions, and a built-in fast Dice (max. 4 seconds delay), implemented as a trustless system (no central server needed) and provably fair.

First some background information. Dash uses a system of a few thousand Masternodes, see the Dash whitepaper for details. It allows advanced concepts like instant payment, with transaction times of less than 4 seconds (but normal transactions are fast, too, because the average block time is one minute). It does this with a random quorum of Masternode servers. Same concept is used for Darksend, for sending coins anonymously. Both ideas makes it a good base for Darkclam, because of the stated goals (see first post in this thread).

Now the novel idea I propose is to use the network itself as a Dice service. There is no investor. If you win a bet, new coins are created and if you lose a bet, coins are destroyed. On average the supply should stay the same, if the bets are not too big, e.g. a whale bets half of all supply and loses, but even then it would just half or increase by a factor of 1.5. Less than some normal fluctuations for some coins at exchanges.

One way to implement this is to use an external random source and to use the blockchain to record bets. After a draw of the external random source, the coins are created or destroyed and every node can verify it. Chancecoin uses this system. The coin seems to be dead now, because the developers disappeared, but it was listed for some time even at Poloniex.

I propose a new way how to handle bets: with the Dash quorum system. n random masternodes are selected (of course, the select algorithm has to be safe and random, too, otherwise you could select all your own servers) and each masternode creates a server seed and sends back the hash to the client. Then the client creates a random seed (or the user enters it), which is then sent to all selected masternodes. The idea is that you can't trust one server, but you can trust the quorum. All masternodes send back their server seed, which can be verified by all other masternodes and a roll is generated with an algorithm as used by just-dice, but all server seeds and the client seed are concatenated. This is the provably fair part. Needs to be thought in detail, and messages needs to be signed etc., but it should work similarly to the instant payment concept of Dash.

There will be no proof-of-stake or proof-of-work when creating new blocks. But a bet will have a small fee, which will prevent spamming the network as well (and normal transactions will have a fee as well), and a randomly selected masternode creates a block and gets the fee (maybe as in NXT and WAVES: the more DC the masternode owns, the higher the probability that it creates a block).

My plan to implement this: first I will implement Dash with the Scorex framework, which is written in Scala (WAVES already uses this framework and is currently tested a lot, with bug-bounties, and I guess will be at Poloniex soon, so a good code base). This will help me to understand the concepts of Dash in detail, and it will help the crypto community as well, because it is so much easier to test or change things in Scala than in C++, which is currently used for Dash. The Scorex framework provides a lot of common functions, so that the actual implementation of Dash shouldn't be that difficult, and would be mostly translating the existing C++ code to Scala. More advantages of Scala compared to C++: bugs like buffer overflows are impossible, the code runs without recompiling on Windows, Mac and Linux (because it is compiled to Java JVM classes), and it is much more compact, easier to write, and easier to read than C++.

After this I will implement the Darkclam coin, with the Scorex framework, based on some parts of Dash. There will be an integrated web browser (already part of the Scorex framework with Akka), which will provide the usual transfer and wallet functions (I suggest a decentralized wallet on the network, like in counterparty), and additionally the Dice game. You can connect to some official server on the internet, or run your own server locally on your computer. There is no way that the Dice game can get shut down by shutting down one server.

Then there will be a testnet for some time, until everyone agrees that it is stable and we can release the mainnet. The counterparty DC coins then will be transferred to the new coins on the mainnet. One way would be proof-of-burn, but maybe there are other ways possible with the counterparty API.

That's all a lot of work, and more developers are welcome. I'll do this all for free, because I believe in Darkclam, and hopefully can sell a bit later on Poloniex I guess it could need a year until it is all done, if I do it all by myself.

Sounds like a good idea

[andulolika]

I discussed a novel coin idea with andu. We didn't hear anything for some time now from the other programmer, googleplex, so I'll start to implement it, if DC holders like it.

TL;DR: a new coin, based on some Dash ideas with one minute transaction time, anonymous transactions, and a built-in fast Dice (max. 4 seconds delay), implemented as a trustless system (no central server needed) and provably fair.

First some background information. Dash uses a system of a few thousand Masternodes, see the Dash whitepaper for details. It allows advanced concepts like instant payment, with transaction times of less than 4 seconds (but normal transactions are fast, too, because the average block time is one minute). It does this with a random quorum of Masternode servers. Same concept is used for Darksend, for sending coins anonymously. Both ideas makes it a good base for Darkclam, because of the stated goals (see first post in this thread).

Now the novel idea I propose is to use the network itself as a Dice service. There is no investor. If you win a bet, new coins are created and if you lose a bet, coins are destroyed. On average the supply should stay the same, if the bets are not too big, e.g. a whale bets half of all supply and loses, but even then it would just half or increase by a factor of 1.5. Less than some normal fluctuations for some coins at exchanges.

One way to implement this is to use an external random source and to use the blockchain to record bets. After a draw of the external random source, the coins are created or destroyed and every node can verify it. Chancecoin uses this system. The coin seems to be dead now, because the developers disappeared, but it was listed for some time even at Poloniex.

I propose a new way how to handle bets: with the Dash quorum system. n random masternodes are selected (of course, the select algorithm has to be safe and random, too, otherwise you could select all your own servers) and each masternode creates a server seed and sends back the hash to the client. Then the client creates a random seed (or the user enters it), which is then sent to all selected masternodes. The idea is that you can't trust one server, but you can trust the quorum. All masternodes send back their server seed, which can be verified by all other masternodes and a roll is generated with an algorithm as used by just-dice, but all server seeds and the client seed are concatenated. This is the provably fair part. Needs to be thought in detail, and messages needs to be signed etc., but it should work similarly to the instant payment concept of Dash.

There will be no proof-of-stake or proof-of-work when creating new blocks. But a bet will have a small fee, which will prevent spamming the network as well (and normal transactions will have a fee as well), and a randomly selected masternode creates a block and gets the fee (maybe as in NXT and WAVES: the more DC the masternode owns, the higher the probability that it creates a block).

My plan to implement this: first I will implement Dash with the Scorex framework, which is written in Scala (WAVES already uses this framework and is currently tested a lot, with bug-bounties, and I guess will be at Poloniex soon, so a good code base). This will help me to understand the concepts of Dash in detail, and it will help the crypto community as well, because it is so much easier to test or change things in Scala than in C++, which is currently used for Dash. The Scorex framework provides a lot of common functions, so that the actual implementation of Dash shouldn't be that difficult, and would be mostly translating the existing C++ code to Scala. More advantages of Scala compared to C++: bugs like buffer overflows are impossible, the code runs without recompiling on Windows, Mac and Linux (because it is compiled to Java JVM classes), and it is much more compact, easier to write, and easier to read than C++.

After this I will implement the Darkclam coin, with the Scorex framework, based on some parts of Dash. There will be an integrated web browser (already part of the Scorex framework with Akka), which will provide the usual transfer and wallet functions (I suggest a decentralized wallet on the network, like in counterparty), and additionally the Dice game. You can connect to some official server on the internet, or run your own server locally on your computer. There is no way that the Dice game can get shut down by shutting down one server.

Then there will be a testnet for some time, until everyone agrees that it is stable and we can release the mainnet. The counterparty DC coins then will be transferred to the new coins on the mainnet. One way would be proof-of-burn, but maybe there are other ways possible with the counterparty API.

That's all a lot of work, and more developers are welcome. I'll do this all for free, because I believe in Darkclam, and hopefully can sell a bit later on Poloniex I guess it could need a year until it is all done, if I do it all by myself.

Sounds like a good idea

It's lovely ,  I hope plex gets to come around and it gets a speedup, remember that if anyone wants can send thru pm mail so I send invitation to slack

[gordob]

I discussed a novel coin idea with andu. We didn't hear anything for some time now from the other programmer, googleplex, so I'll start to implement it, if DC holders like it.

TL;DR: a new coin, based on some Dash ideas with one minute transaction time, anonymous transactions, and a built-in fast Dice (max. 4 seconds delay), implemented as a trustless system (no central server needed) and provably fair.

First some background information. Dash uses a system of a few thousand Masternodes, see the Dash whitepaper for details. It allows advanced concepts like instant payment, with transaction times of less than 4 seconds (but normal transactions are fast, too, because the average block time is one minute). It does this with a random quorum of Masternode servers. Same concept is used for Darksend, for sending coins anonymously. Both ideas makes it a good base for Darkclam, because of the stated goals (see first post in this thread).

Now the novel idea I propose is to use the network itself as a Dice service. There is no investor. If you win a bet, new coins are created and if you lose a bet, coins are destroyed. On average the supply should stay the same, if the bets are not too big, e.g. a whale bets half of all supply and loses, but even then it would just half or increase by a factor of 1.5. Less than some normal fluctuations for some coins at exchanges.

One way to implement this is to use an external random source and to use the blockchain to record bets. After a draw of the external random source, the coins are created or destroyed and every node can verify it. Chancecoin uses this system. The coin seems to be dead now, because the developers disappeared, but it was listed for some time even at Poloniex.

I propose a new way how to handle bets: with the Dash quorum system. n random masternodes are selected (of course, the select algorithm has to be safe and random, too, otherwise you could select all your own servers) and each masternode creates a server seed and sends back the hash to the client. Then the client creates a random seed (or the user enters it), which is then sent to all selected masternodes. The idea is that you can't trust one server, but you can trust the quorum. All masternodes send back their server seed, which can be verified by all other masternodes and a roll is generated with an algorithm as used by just-dice, but all server seeds and the client seed are concatenated. This is the provably fair part. Needs to be thought in detail, and messages needs to be signed etc., but it should work similarly to the instant payment concept of Dash.

There will be no proof-of-stake or proof-of-work when creating new blocks. But a bet will have a small fee, which will prevent spamming the network as well (and normal transactions will have a fee as well), and a randomly selected masternode creates a block and gets the fee (maybe as in NXT and WAVES: the more DC the masternode owns, the higher the probability that it creates a block).

My plan to implement this: first I will implement Dash with the Scorex framework, which is written in Scala (WAVES already uses this framework and is currently tested a lot, with bug-bounties, and I guess will be at Poloniex soon, so a good code base). This will help me to understand the concepts of Dash in detail, and it will help the crypto community as well, because it is so much easier to test or change things in Scala than in C++, which is currently used for Dash. The Scorex framework provides a lot of common functions, so that the actual implementation of Dash shouldn't be that difficult, and would be mostly translating the existing C++ code to Scala. More advantages of Scala compared to C++: bugs like buffer overflows are impossible, the code runs without recompiling on Windows, Mac and Linux (because it is compiled to Java JVM classes), and it is much more compact, easier to write, and easier to read than C++.

After this I will implement the Darkclam coin, with the Scorex framework, based on some parts of Dash. There will be an integrated web browser (already part of the Scorex framework with Akka), which will provide the usual transfer and wallet functions (I suggest a decentralized wallet on the network, like in counterparty), and additionally the Dice game. You can connect to some official server on the internet, or run your own server locally on your computer. There is no way that the Dice game can get shut down by shutting down one server.

Then there will be a testnet for some time, until everyone agrees that it is stable and we can release the mainnet. The counterparty DC coins then will be transferred to the new coins on the mainnet. One way would be proof-of-burn, but maybe there are other ways possible with the counterparty API.

That's all a lot of work, and more developers are welcome. I'll do this all for free, because I believe in Darkclam, and hopefully can sell a bit later on Poloniex I guess it could need a year until it is all done, if I do it all by myself.

Sounds like a good idea

It's lovely ,  I hope plex gets to come around and it gets a speedup, remember that if anyone wants can send thru pm mail so I send invitation to slack

I will put some of my DarkClam towards this - good luck guys - lets rock n roll )

[navaman]

The MS issue can be substantial.  Clam will take a hit when somebody wins big on JD.  What about a constant MS increase with an automatic sterilization mechanism for large wins and losses.  It can also be adjust for velocity, too.

[Glucose]

So what's the plan on how to transition from being an XCP asset?  Are you using the same list on the darkclam site to make a brand new genesis block, or is there gonna be some kind of exchange?  Asking cause I made a total noob mistake; I threw away the paper that had my 12 word passphrase on it.  I'd completely forgotten about it when I was tidying my desk drawers.  Oops.

Sorry my phone is broken and I cannot check things properly thru the day. You are not the only one, probably you will be able to recover your funds if you have proof of ownership, I promise I'll come with news soon. Ah, shit happens, I've lost a bit myself with similar stuff.

Same here. But I can prove ownership of the JD account.

I hope I'll be able to get my Darkclams

EDIT : I just joined Slack. So I guess you can perhaps help me from there

[marilyn4325]

The MS issue can be substantial.  Clam will take a hit when somebody wins big on JD.  What about a constant MS increase with an automatic sterilization mechanism for large wins and losses.  It can also be adjust for velocity, too.

What is "MS"?

Plans have changed a bit. Andu wants to have a normal Dice fast, so I think a good idea is if I start with cloning WAVES (because it has nice and clean code, and I know it already from the WAVES bug bounty program). This means we will have one minute transaction time from the beginning, but no anonymous transactions. I'll read how Dash implemented it and will reserve some bytes or type flags or whatever in the blockchain transactions for it, if necessary, so that it can be implemented later. And I really like the ClamSpeech feature, which I will add to the WAVES clone, that's easy. This will include the Clamour voting system, which will help later for deciding what new features should be implemented, like my realtime network based Dice idea with masternodes and the network itself as the investor. The first clone with ClamSpeech should be possible for me to do in a few weeks instead of a year for a full port of Dash.

I suggest that the DC coins from Counterparty can be transferred later by signing a message with your Counterparty address, and then a website allows to transfer the real DarkClam from the genesis account to a new DarkClam address, with the signature proving that you own the Counterparty DC asset. This avoids additional Bitcoin transfer costs for the Counterparty assets, e.g. for a proof-of-burn concept. But if you lost your Counterparty account and you can prove that you own the JustDice account, we can transfer it manually, too (if the Counterparty asset for this associated JustDice account was not already sold of course).

[Glucose]

But if you lost your Counterparty account and you can prove that you own the JustDice account, we can transfer it manually, too (if the Counterparty asset for this associated JustDice account was not already sold of course).

That's really great Marilyn. Thank you very much for the work you're doing.

[andulolika]

But if you lost your Counterparty account and you can prove that you own the JustDice account, we can transfer it manually, too (if the Counterparty asset for this associated JustDice account was not already sold of course).

That's really great Marilyn. Thank you very much for the work you're doing.

It is, there is a bunch of users that will be really happy when they hear they will be able to recover their DCs.

[CjMapope]

But if you lost your Counterparty account and you can prove that you own the JustDice account, we can transfer it manually, too (if the Counterparty asset for this associated JustDice account was not already sold of course).

That's really great Marilyn. Thank you very much for the work you're doing.

It is, there is a bunch of users that will be really happy when they hear they will be able to recover their DCs.

i still have mine ;p   sadly noone has posted any cheap on counterparty for a while :/

i will always like this project, it just needs some TLC ;p

on that note : If someone wants a few satoshis to throw around i would like to buy a few DC, cheap like 5 sat each, just a dump price if anyone wants

[andulolika]

Guys Dochouse is trying to sell his stash, he has 1.5M if anyone is interested can let me know.

[matsud2]

How much we can get this coin from wager?
Example if we wagered 1k clam how much dark clam we will earn

[andulolika]

How much we can get this coin from wager?
Example if we wagered 1k clam how much dark clam we will earn

The distribution is locked, it used to be 1:1 on wager.

[len01]

Wtf this coin alive, the good news is i lost my jd account
btw sup andu, been long time