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Author Topic: BetSoft Non-Payment of Jackpot  (Read 17062 times)
TwitchySeal
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August 24, 2016, 01:24:54 AM
 #241

Oh.  You should really read this thread where they discuss the details of how they figured out the Betsoft Jackpots are rigged.

Thats where the data is posted.

You are lying....I read that and it does not demonstrate that over 100 jackpots were won while nobody was playing.  You are lying again.

I am not lying.  I haven't claimed it demonstrated that.  Again, I am not lying.

No?

Cj, How do you explain the smaller jackpot (the one nobody is choosing) getting hit over 100 times while not a single person wins the big jackpot that everyone picks?
That is very strange, indeed, if nobody picks it, yet it is won over 100 times!  It doesn't seem like it it should be won at all if it wasn't played....Something's obviously wrong with that data too.


Do you think there's any possibility that these two graphs are accurate or no?





^^^^^^^
Couldn't delete this one?
The graph does not demonstrate that over 100 jackpots were won while nobody was playing - and I didn't claim it did.
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August 24, 2016, 01:26:17 AM
 #242

Pehaps you should ask Ed to explain it to you...again.
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August 24, 2016, 01:32:13 AM
 #243

Oh.  You should really read this thread where they discuss the details of how they figured out the Betsoft Jackpots are rigged.

Yes please do. If you do you'll see I was initially skeptical.

In fact reading it back now to my eternal shame I sounded a bit like cjmoles at the time. How embarrassing! Embarrassed  Cry
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August 24, 2016, 01:33:20 AM
 #244

But, to answer your questions: Betcoin changed their terms...
You are lying...

Betcoin has no legally binding agreement, as I already explained to you several times!

Betcoin has also no Terms of Service, because the contract partners and the applicable jurisdiction is missing.


...to comply with the terms that Betsoft clarified
You are lying...

Betsoft has no terms, there are no terms stated at their website.


to negate future misinterpretations....
You are lying...

There are no misinterpretations possible!

It is clearly stated:
Quote
betsoft.com

Features: 5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!


...they didn't have to give you anything.
You are lying...

They owe him the jackpot!


Should they have not clarified the rules so others could fall subject to the same conflict?
Rules of a slot have to be stated directly at the paytable of that game. Stating rules of a certain game in the juridical not valid general Terms of Service section is not in accordance with consumer protection laws.


Your claim was that you should've won the jackpot on the "freespin" because they never said that it wasn't possible.  The "real" question here is whether or not a "freespin" can be interpreted as "maximum bet spin."
You are lying...

The only relevant question is, was it 5 jackpot symbols on max bet?


It is obvious that "freespin" wasn't intended to imply "max bet spin" because it wasn't coded into the software or the jackpot would've dropped.
You are lying...

There is nothing stated that implies that "freespin" max bets would be not considered as max bets!

If you interact with anonymous criminals, a jackpot not dropping means nothing at all.    


Your problem was with the interpretation of the rules....not that you had won the jackpot and they didn't pay you.
You are lying...

The rules are clearly stated: 5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!

He 100% sure and clear won the jackpot. There is no way Betcoin or Betsoft would win this case at a court.


Betcoin has to comply with the rules of the Betsoft game; they don't have the power to change Betsoft's rules, even if they wanted to change them.  
This is correct. The rules of the game are stated in the paytable and as the Betsoft games are running on the Betsoft servers, Betcoin can not change them, even if they wanted to change them.


You didn't win the jackpot...
You are lying...

He 100% sure and clear won the jackpot. See above...


...but they paid you something out of their own pocket because of the confusion.
Ahh, good to know that Betcoin or Betsoft pay something out of their pocket, as soon as there is confusion. So instead of trying to win, simple create confusion to fill your pockets. LMAO  Cheesy  


That jackpot is not the casino's to give away, it belongs to the players who contributed to it...
You are lying...

As soon as a player made the bet, he is no longer the owner of the contribution. If, according to your lie, the contributions would still belong to them, then they could demand them back at any time...


...and it would've been wrong for them to give it to you because everybody else who contributed to it, and played by the rules, would've been wronged and could've made their own claim.
It is wrong to give the jackpot to the winner? But it is correct to put the jackpot into the pockets of the criminal operators, right?


There are numerous reasons why "freespin" and "max bet spin" have different meanings
You are lying...

The paytable did not differentiate between max bet and "freespin" max bet!


One has to do with the contributions the two add to the jackpot,...
How much do "freespin" max bets add to the jackpot? And where is the proof of how much they contribute?

 
...another has to do with how taxes are kept and reported, and so forth.
You are lying...

Anonymous criminals do not pay taxes, especially Bitcoin only sites. LMAO  Cheesy


Should non-contributing spins qualify....etc.
Where is it stated that "freespin" max bets do not contribute?  


All of these factors must be taken into account when deciding if the term "free" is synonymous with the term "maximum."
Yes, If you won max bets, then they are synonymous with the term "maximum".


The rules clearly stated that only "max bet spins" qualify....and "freespin" does not fall under the definition of a "max bet spin."
You are lying...

Max bet "freespins" of course fall under the definition of "max bet spin". They are "free" for you because you won them, but they are still max bets, obviously.


Yes, I can see how it can be confusing because the "freespin" was triggered as the result of a "max bet spin" and that's why they clarified the language, but considering all the factors involved in differentiating the two terms, it's obvious that "freespin" was never meant to be interpreted as a "max bet spin."
You are lying...

The rules are clearly stated: 5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!

And there was no differentiation of the kind of the max bets.  Roll Eyes


I would not deposit one cent to a site that pays liars to lie!

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August 24, 2016, 05:48:33 AM
 #245

But, to answer your questions: Betcoin changed their terms...
You are lying...

Betcoin has no legally binding agreement, as I already explained to you several times!

Betcoin has also no Terms of Service, because the contract partners and the applicable jurisdiction is missing.


...to comply with the terms that Betsoft clarified
You are lying...

Betsoft has no terms, there are no terms stated at their website.


to negate future misinterpretations....
You are lying...

There are no misinterpretations possible!

It is clearly stated:
Quote
betsoft.com

Features: 5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!


...they didn't have to give you anything.
You are lying...

They owe him the jackpot!


Should they have not clarified the rules so others could fall subject to the same conflict?
Rules of a slot have to be stated directly at the paytable of that game. Stating rules of a certain game in the juridical not valid general Terms of Service section is not in accordance with consumer protection laws.


Your claim was that you should've won the jackpot on the "freespin" because they never said that it wasn't possible.  The "real" question here is whether or not a "freespin" can be interpreted as "maximum bet spin."
You are lying...

The only relevant question is, was it 5 jackpot symbols on max bet?


It is obvious that "freespin" wasn't intended to imply "max bet spin" because it wasn't coded into the software or the jackpot would've dropped.
You are lying...

There is nothing stated that implies that "freespin" max bets would be not considered as max bets!

If you interact with anonymous criminals, a jackpot not dropping means nothing at all.    


Your problem was with the interpretation of the rules....not that you had won the jackpot and they didn't pay you.
You are lying...

The rules are clearly stated: 5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!

He 100% sure and clear won the jackpot. There is no way Betcoin or Betsoft would win this case at a court.


Betcoin has to comply with the rules of the Betsoft game; they don't have the power to change Betsoft's rules, even if they wanted to change them.  
This is correct. The rules of the game are stated in the paytable and as the Betsoft games are running on the Betsoft servers, Betcoin can not change them, even if they wanted to change them.


You didn't win the jackpot...
You are lying...

He 100% sure and clear won the jackpot. See above...


...but they paid you something out of their own pocket because of the confusion.
Ahh, good to know that Betcoin or Betsoft pay something out of their pocket, as soon as there is confusion. So instead of trying to win, simple create confusion to fill your pockets. LMAO  Cheesy  


That jackpot is not the casino's to give away, it belongs to the players who contributed to it...
You are lying...

As soon as a player made the bet, he is no longer the owner of the contribution. If, according to your lie, the contributions would still belong to them, then they could demand them back at any time...


...and it would've been wrong for them to give it to you because everybody else who contributed to it, and played by the rules, would've been wronged and could've made their own claim.
It is wrong to give the jackpot to the winner? But it is correct to put the jackpot into the pockets of the criminal operators, right?


There are numerous reasons why "freespin" and "max bet spin" have different meanings
You are lying...

The paytable did not differentiate between max bet and "freespin" max bet!


One has to do with the contributions the two add to the jackpot,...
How much do "freespin" max bets add to the jackpot? And where is the proof of how much they contribute?

 
...another has to do with how taxes are kept and reported, and so forth.
You are lying...

Anonymous criminals do not pay taxes, especially Bitcoin only sites. LMAO  Cheesy


Should non-contributing spins qualify....etc.
Where is it stated that "freespin" max bets do not contribute?  


All of these factors must be taken into account when deciding if the term "free" is synonymous with the term "maximum."
Yes, If you won max bets, then they are synonymous with the term "maximum".


The rules clearly stated that only "max bet spins" qualify....and "freespin" does not fall under the definition of a "max bet spin."
You are lying...

Max bet "freespins" of course fall under the definition of "max bet spin". They are "free" for you because you won them, but they are still max bets, obviously.


Yes, I can see how it can be confusing because the "freespin" was triggered as the result of a "max bet spin" and that's why they clarified the language, but considering all the factors involved in differentiating the two terms, it's obvious that "freespin" was never meant to be interpreted as a "max bet spin."
You are lying...

The rules are clearly stated: 5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!

And there was no differentiation of the kind of the max bets.  Roll Eyes


I would not deposit one cent to a site that pays liars to lie!

Dude, you're a thief and liar....nobody would want to play with you anyway.  And, if your university taught you that "max" and "free" were synonyms, then I'd start thinking about suing them instead of burning honest people out of their income.

"The rules are clearly stated: '5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!'"  <--- where does that clearly state that 5 jackpot symbols on a freespin wins the jackpot?  I think that it states that "5 yachts on a max bet spin wins the jackpot."  So, who's lying?  "Free" does not have the same meaning as "maximum."

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August 24, 2016, 12:45:42 PM
 #246

Dude, you're a thief and liar....
How much I have stolen and from whom?


nobody would want to play with you anyway.
I do not offer to play with me. You probably meant nobody want to play with the Betcoin scam...


And, if your university taught you that "max" and "free" were synonyms, then I'd start thinking about suing them instead of burning honest people out of their income.
The contract laws taught me that a max bet is either a direct bet or a won bet.

LMAO, please explain how you could sue an anonymous operator like Betcoin?


"The rules are clearly stated: '5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!'"  <--- where does that clearly state that 5 jackpot symbols on a freespin wins the jackpot?
Nowhere! Because it is irrelevant...

The key point is 5 yachts on a "max bet" and this totally independant of whether you won the "max bet" or you paid the "max bet" directly.

But as you lie about "freespin", you obviously do not speak about the game "the Glam Life", because there it is called:
Quote
Features: "the Glam Life"

3 or more Match bonus symbols on an active payline awards the on-reels bonus game


I think that it states that "5 yachts on a max bet spin wins the jackpot."  So, who's lying?  "Free" does not have the same meaning as "maximum."
It does not play any role what liars think, however, the word spin and the word "Free" are not mentioned:

Quote
Features: "the Glam Life"

5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!
-> your creation of "max bet spin is a lie, as well as your creation of "Free" a lie is  Roll Eyes


What a shame of a site that has to pay liars to lie, in an attempt to draw customers in!

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August 24, 2016, 05:36:18 PM
 #247

Dude, you're a thief and liar....
How much I have stolen and from whom?


nobody would want to play with you anyway.
I do not offer to play with me. You probably meant nobody want to play with the Betcoin scam...


And, if your university taught you that "max" and "free" were synonyms, then I'd start thinking about suing them instead of burning honest people out of their income.
The contract laws taught me that a max bet is either a direct bet or a won bet.

LMAO, please explain how you could sue an anonymous operator like Betcoin?


"The rules are clearly stated: '5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!'"  <--- where does that clearly state that 5 jackpot symbols on a freespin wins the jackpot?
Nowhere! Because it is irrelevant...

The key point is 5 yachts on a "max bet" and this totally independant of whether you won the "max bet" or you paid the "max bet" directy.

But as you lie about "freespin", you obviously do not speak about the game "the Glam Life", because there it is called:
Quote
Features: "the Glam Life"

3 or more Match bonus symbols on an active payline awards the on-reels bonus game


I think that it states that "5 yachts on a max bet spin wins the jackpot."  So, who's lying?  "Free" does not have the same meaning as "maximum."
It does not play any role what liars think, however, the word spin and the word "Free" are not mentioned:

Quote
Features: "the Glam Life"

5 jackpot symbols on max bet wins the JACKPOT!
-> your creation of "max bet spin is a lie, as well as your creation of "Free" a lie is  Roll Eyes


What a shame of a site that has to pay liars to lie, in an attempt to draw customers in!

How could anybody take anything you say seriously.....you are about as dumb as a box of rocks!  You aren't educated dude....STFU....LOL

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August 24, 2016, 11:07:30 PM
 #248

Jasonort didn't win the jackpot....jasonort's claim was that he should have won the jackpot because it wasn't clarified anywhere that "freespin" wasn't equivalent to "maxbet spin" on a bonus round.  If the jackpot was won, it would have dropped....it didn't because "freespin" does not equal "max bet" in the coding.  Claiming that he did win it is a misrepresentation of the facts because the argument was that he should have won it because it wasn't explained that "freespins" didn't qualify as a "max bet."  Try to think about this objectively: what if there was a similar instance in one of the games at moneypot where a player claimed he should have won the jackpot because the rules were ambiguous....should the investors pay the player anyway based on the player's subjective interpretation, even though the event wasn't coded into the software?  If the terms were ambiguous enough to create conflict, should the moneypot investors request the terms be clarified to avoid similar conflicts in the future?  Either way one slices it...."free" and "maximum" are antonyms and not synonyms....so the interpretation was more of a reach than not.

I disagree with most of the things you wrote there. I could go through and reply line by line but I've seen others attempt to do that and it doesn't work out well.

I'll dip my toe in the water with your most obvious incorrect statement:

> "free" and "maximum" are antonyms

The antonym of "maximum" is "minimum". You really cannot believe that those two words are antonyms. Can you?

Twitchy misrepresented the facts by mixing terms associated with other games (Greedy Goblins) into the argument with the game in question (The Glam Life)....that's deception.  He also photo-shops images....that's also deception....he consistently trolls and manipulates the facts to meet his agenda.  Are we trying to be truthful and objective here or are we bandwagoning to suit our interests?

I don't think Twitchy ever claimed that the rules for one game were the rules for another game. If he did, perhaps you could quote the post where he did so. Making all these accusations with nothing to back them up adds nothing to the argument. You say he multi-accounts, he says "only to chat and post", you let the thread drop, but go back to accusing him of multi-accounting. It's the same with each of your accusations. You accuse, he defends, you ignore his defense and go back to step 1. Try harder.

I've had good experiences with betcoin. I'm something like 10 BTC up there and didn't have any trouble withdrawing my winnings.

I've also had bad experiences with betcoin. Their customer support is among the worst I have ever experienced. Tickets go ignored for months at a time.
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August 29, 2016, 10:10:26 PM
 #249

https://www.betcoin.ag/files/betcoin/assets/video/trailer.mp4

The video that now runs full window backround on betcoin.ag homepage^^^
(it's a bunch of clips from BetsoftGaming slots with hype music)https://www.betcoin.ag/

Saw everything from all the games except the yacht symbol.
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October 17, 2016, 08:29:55 PM
 #250

So I noticed Betcoin recently added a new game to their collection.  For some reason they didn't spam the big news like they normally would...I wonder why?

Oh, maybe because it's basically just glam life part 2.

MEGA GLAMLIFE!


In this game you can win a big jackpot in a bonus round, even if it's triggered by free-spins.

Come out Cjmoles.  You've been hiding long enough.


Come out Cjmoles.  You've been hiding long enough.
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October 18, 2016, 12:07:58 AM
 #251

So I noticed Betcoin recently added a new game to their collection.  For some reason they didn't spam the big news like they normally would...I wonder why?

Oh, maybe because it's basically just glam life part 2.

MEGA GLAMLIFE!


In this game you can win a big jackpot in a bonus round, even if it's triggered by free-spins.

[img]

Come out Cjmoles.  You've been hiding long enough.

What's likely to happen is that the response would be, "they are different games so they must have different rules" and then there would just be nonstop ad hominem and character attacks that lead to nothing but more payments for him...

That is, if he were to come back and argue for Betcoin. I doubt it, though. Unfortunately, people still play at Betsoft even now because of the entertainment value... even though slots are the worst games to play, and doubly so when they're run by scammers.



Regardless, wasn't it already defined that Betcoin had lied about the ToS update date, changed the rules, and Betsoft had the game rules changed as well just to avoid paying out? There's nothing more to discuss, apart from trying to convince people to stop advertising the website.

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December 20, 2016, 12:43:45 AM
 #252

Who owes the jackpot?

A) betcoin.ag crystal clear owe the jackpot, because

1) The operator of betcoin.ag is the contract partner of the players

2) Player logged in and played with the betcoin.ag casino client

3) Jackpot winner deposited money to betcoin.ag

4) The juridical not valid Terms of Service on betcoin.ag website do not state one word about that Betsoft scam collect the jackpot contributions and is responsible for payment

B) The Betsoft scam also owe the jackpot, because

1) They cooperate with the publicly proven betcoin.ag scam = criminal offense. And when you cooperate with criminals, then you are liable for the damage occured

2) Progressive jackpots usually run in all online casinos connected to Betsoft scam gaming software. Hence Betsoft collect the “the Glam Life” jackpot contributions from all connected casinos. If the jackpot hit in casino XY, then Betsoft send the money to XY and XY give the money to the winner.

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February 13, 2017, 07:54:36 AM
 #253

ThePogg declared the exorted and juridical not existing "settlement" as a resolved case. I informed them, with all relevant info, that this case is not resolved, but they did not publicise my post and they did not use my info to rework their statement. Sad

http://thepogg.com/complaint/betcoin-ag-progressive-jackpot-was-not-paid-for-winning-spin/

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August 27, 2017, 05:32:06 PM
 #254

I just want to share my experience with playing at Betcoin.ag I was playing live roulette and bet a little over 1 BTC on BLACK and the ball landed on BLACK but I lost and when I told support about it they said everything was fine and basically ignored me, I asked for proof but didn't give me any and shortly after this they took down live casinos and later on brought them back...

I still cannot believe something like this actually happened very disappointed they owe me 2+btc
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August 27, 2017, 11:28:28 PM
 #255

It's true, Jackpots cannot be multiplied in online casinos which is kind of obvious for the simple fact that you can't benefit from 2 promotions at the same time. I ran into the same issue while playing this Novomatic slot https://www.play-book-of-ra-online.com/book-of-ra-deluxe-jackpot-edition/



As you can see, an active payline is not required to win the JACKPOT!

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