First BFL ASIC!

[PuertoLibre]

BLAH BLAH BLAH

---------------------------

BLAH BLAH BLAH


Fact: BLAH

Fact: BLAH

Fact: BLAH

Fact: BLAH

------------------------

Conclusion: I'm a troll.

Conlusion, yes you are a troll. But a special troll. The kind that opens new accounts simply to respond to legitimate points under a pseudonym. You are Joshin' me right?

Fact: You have been informed already that Josh/BFL has agreed that they lost the bet and will be donating 1000BTC to a charity.. multiple times

Dummy!

This is about a different bet. This has nothing to do with that bet!

Learn to read and comprehend. Or in your filtered reading ability. Blah...Blah.

...you are beyond the definition of Ultra-troll.  I always thought BFL made a SUPER stupid mistake by hiring a little immature brat like Josh to be the frontman to their operation here.. but you are certainly the very essence of the word "troll".

I cannot hold a candle to my brother Josh.

None, no not one, can match his Joshin'. (See this thread and others as a reference)

  How people just let you go on and on and on with your bullshit is beyond me.   It's really not hard to make BFL look stupid.. and when you try SOOOO damn hard it just makes you look like a jackass.  They should temp-ban all the people who's ignore button is as colorful as yours.

That is funny.

I am just voicing the obvious. So what?

Are you for them winning the bet on this slippery and sliding scam?

The guy says he left his "machine" at BFL when he went home. He states that it was delivered to him in his hands @ BFL....

Then, he says he wants it shipped to "his home" in another "foreign nation". Can you say contradictions?

This shows he never had any intent to keep it at BFL. This much is evident. We don't even know if he has even accepted that "prototype" as his. For all we know, Luke is expecting a corrected PCB with his order. The kind that consumes alot less than 180watts.

All we do know is that Josh does not consider the device functional or ready to be shipped. That is the case. (someone link to BFL's youtube account where Josh explicitly admits this.)

Then, there is the issue of Josh taking the photo for him (apparently) and Luke pretending it was him taking the photo. That requires an actual intention to deceive BetsofBitcoin. One small mistake made the situation complicated in that [assumed] lie.
--------------------

To add insult to injury, (and I respect Luke as a fellow Christian) the guy seems to be helping them stretch the truth to it's limits. I don't know what the reasoning is or what the idea is behind that. But I have to call BS.

That sir, is the truest form of BS.

Both Josh and Luke admit the device isn't complete, that shipping is slated for the future. Yet at the same time, they want to claim a bet for which the stipulation(s) are not met. Lets be serious about this. They never shipped. It even comes out of their own mouths (Before/During/After).

If Logic offends you, don't come to BitCoinTalk. Go to....BFL forums. I guarantee you, you will see logic being defied every day.

[1715008643]

1715008643

[1715008643]

1715008643

[nathanrees19]

That sir, is the truest form of BS.

Ummm...

Warning: BFL has failed to deliver for > 140+ Days. It could be a scam!
BFL started taking pre order money in June 2012, but have not shipped a single ASIC device up until April 2013. There's no evidence they even have a working prototype.

Right.

Who's the one spouting bullshit now?

[smracer]

$statement = "The title of the bid";
$condition1 = "The first condition";
$condition2 = "The second condition";

#The bet states:

if ($condition1==true)&&($condition2=true);{
$statement=false;
}
else{
$statement=true;
}

If both of the conditions are true then the statement is conditionally set to false.

The statement is the title.

[PuertoLibre]

That sir, is the truest form of BS.

Ummm...

Warning: BFL has failed to deliver for > 140+ Days. It could be a scam!
BFL started taking pre order money in June 2012, but have not shipped a single ASIC device up until April 2013. There's no evidence they even have a working prototype.

Right.

Who's the one spouting bullshit now?

Sorry Nathan (A known BFL supporter), I'll update it right now. I haven't been around in these last few days.

One quick second.

Moving my counter up a bit...

[SgtSpike]

$statement = "The title of the bid";
$condition1 = "The first condition";
$condition2 = "The second condition";

#The bet states:

if ($condition1==true)&&($condition2=true);{
$statement=false;
}
else{
$statement=true;
}

If both of the conditions are true then the statement is conditionally set to false.

The statement is the title.

Looking at it that way though, you're essentially stating that false = true.  The title was most certainly correct that BFL didn't ship anything, but the conditions, if not met, contradict the title.

[jermwerty]

My vote is this is an engineering sample.  This is not "shipped" to customer.  "Shipped" indicates a full working unit in the customers hands at the customer premesis.  Clearly this is not.


"at least one BFL customer" - debatable as this occured at BFL's location, the device is not actually with the customer
"with a bitcointalk.org forum account established prior to the bet's opening date" - OK
"shall post detailed and credible photos of the device on the forum" - OK
"including photos of it operating, and report its hashrate." - OK
"This customer cannot be a BFL employee." - debatable at this point

As for 75% of advertised hashrate, the answer is NO.

"Advertised" was 60Ghash.  Just because they revised it to 30GH at the last second doesn't meet the definition when the bets were placed.  23GH is 76% of 30GH.

GRASPING.  AT.  STRAWS.

[nathanrees19]

Sorry Nathan (A known BFL supporter), I'll update it right now. I haven't been around in these last few days.

One quick second.

Moving

Warning: BFL has failed to deliver for > 165+ Days. It could be a scam!
BFL started taking pre order money in June 2012, but have not shipped a single ASIC device up until April 2013. There are power problems with their prototype!

That's better, but saying "it could be a scam" due to the lack of shipping, when you know why they aren't shipping (they fucked up the power) is laughably stupid.

Sorry Nathan (A known BFL supporter)

You say that like I'm the enemy

[pikeadz]

My vote is this is an engineering sample.  This is not "shipped" to customer.  "Shipped" indicates a full working unit in the customers hands at the customer premesis.  Clearly this is not.


"at least one BFL customer" - debatable as this occured at BFL's location, the device is not actually with the customer
"with a bitcointalk.org forum account established prior to the bet's opening date" - OK
"shall post detailed and credible photos of the device on the forum" - OK
"including photos of it operating, and report its hashrate." - OK
"This customer cannot be a BFL employee." - debatable at this point

As for 75% of advertised hashrate, the answer is NO.

"Advertised" was 60Ghash.  Just because they revised it to 30GH at the last second doesn't meet the definition when the bets were placed.  23GH is 76% of 30GH.

GRASPING.  AT.  STRAWS.

Right.  Even when Avalon shipped to jgarzik, it was a final product.  It was shipped.  BFL is trying to pass thiss off as shipping and hoping nobody catches them with their pants down.  We caught them.

[Minor Miner]

Sorry Nathan (A known BFL supporter), I'll update it right now. I haven't been around in these last few days.

One quick second.

Moving

Warning: BFL has failed to deliver for > 165+ Days. It could be a scam!
BFL started taking pre order money in June 2012, but have not shipped a single ASIC device up until April 2013. There are power problems with their prototype!

That's better, but saying "it could be a scam" due to the lack of shipping, when you know why they aren't shipping (they fucked up the power) is laughably stupid.

Sorry Nathan (A known BFL supporter)

You say that like I'm the enemy

I do not think anyone truly knows why they are not shipping.  It would appear that they are not shipping because they have no idea what they are doing.  BUT, in their own words (profanity really), they have constantly stated how brilliant they are and how stupid everyone else is.   It was only a day ago that Josh was again denigrating Avalon so one would assume that Josh and BFL are superior engineers to avalon.   If we take BFL at their word, that means they ARE NOT INCOMPETENT so why are they not shipping?   What say you Nathan?

[nathanrees19]

I do not think anyone truly knows why they are not shipping.  It would appear that they are not shipping because they have no idea what they are doing.  BUT, in their own words (profanity really), they have constantly stated how brilliant they are and how stupid everyone else is.   It was only a day ago that Josh was again denigrating Avalon so one would assume that Josh and BFL are superior engineers to avalon.   If we take BFL at their word

lol

, that means they ARE NOT INCOMPETENT so why are they not shipping?   What say you Nathan?

You haven't really raised any points for me to reply to.

[Minor Miner]

I do not think anyone truly knows why they are not shipping.  It would appear that they are not shipping because they have no idea what they are doing.  BUT, in their own words (profanity really), they have constantly stated how brilliant they are and how stupid everyone else is.   It was only a day ago that Josh was again denigrating Avalon so one would assume that Josh and BFL are superior engineers to avalon.   If we take BFL at their word

lol

, that means they ARE NOT INCOMPETENT so why are they not shipping?   What say you Nathan?

You haven't really raised any points for me to reply to.

Interesting that is the way you perceive it.   That is what is great about a market, it takes buyers and sellers or bulls and bears or believers and non-believers to have one.

[Gator-hex]

Not only did the ASIC not leave the BFL lab, so was never shipped anywhere

but also this..

This customer cannot be a BFL employee.

Luke Jr was flown in on BLFs dollar to code their software so is an employee!

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/blogs/luke-jr/97-preparing-my-trip-bfl.html

How many other "customers" where flown in at BFL's expense?

[FreshJR]

I don't mind taking time to judge bets, but this one is pretty clear.  I do not trust betsofbitco.in anymore.  See my opinion below.  If this was credible their wouldn't be a 15 page argument.

Butterfly Labs will not ship ASIC-based Bitforce SC products before April 2013 if units were shipped to regular customers, at least 1 other person should receive their(s) sometime soon.  If not, this is a prototype, in-house model.  

This bet concerns the 3 Butterfly Labs Bitforce SC products announced here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=87934.msg966886#msg966886

For this statement to be false, both of the two following conditions must be met:

-Before April 1st 2013, Eastern time was listed in the conditions below:  The OP was 1:36 AM April First (EST)
-at least one BFL customer Is this what the rest of the customers are getting, a prototype?
-with a bitcointalk.org forum account established prior to the bet's opening date true
-shall post detailed and credible photos of the device on the forum, Credible?? What is the device in the picture? I see two heatsinks. I know for a fact that natural convection heat transfer will not dissipate ~176W throughout either 1 or both those without incurring >100*C operating temps
-including photos of it operating, Whatever I am looking at, something is operating
-and report its hashrate. Is this the hash rate the other customers are going to get?
-This customer cannot be a BFL employee. regular customers do not program or affiliate with BFL past purchasing

• The device must achieve at least 75% of its advertised hashrate. originally 60Gh/s.  Yahoo article from the bet link mentioned 40 Gh/s ( 25/40 = 62.5% )

I do have a small stake in this bet.  

If anything, withhold the bets until other customers get their units and see if the numbers are the same as this one (only with a case). This will allow other customers to get 30Gh/s at 176w units by motivating BFL to get it working to this standard.

This unit is sitting at BFL with the photo taken by josh..............


http://news.yahoo.com/butterfly-labs-announces-next-generation-asic-lineup-054626776.html

[dbasql]

I did not bet anything on this but this is fucking classic. 

[tbd]

I found the following edits to the Wiki page interesting:
https://en.bitcoin.it/w/index.php?title=Mining_hardware_comparison&action=historysubmit&diff=36551&oldid=36497

[coinjedi]

We have carefully examined both sides of the argument. First of all, on our site title is definitely part of the agreement. We do not count the current status as BFL "shipping" the products, therefore other bets are still open. On the other hand the conditions in the description are met. Unfortunately the statement description, as it is written, can be interpreted as complementary conditions to shipping for more clear evidence or the definition of shipping. As much as we would like to settle the bet on one side (as we would earn a significant commission) we do not think that the situation is unambiguous under these circumstances which would be very hard to foresee at the time of statement initiation. As we have been doing before, we will continue to call a draw if there is a such an ambiguity. All the bets will be refunded without any commission.

[Micon]

We have carefully examined both sides of the argument. First of all, on our site title is definitely part of the agreement. We do not count the current status as BFL "shipping" the products, therefore other bets are still open. On the other hand the conditions in the description are met. Unfortunately the statement description, as it is written, can be interpreted as complementary conditions to shipping for more clear evidence or the definition of shipping. As much as we would like to settle the bet on one side (as we would earn a significant commission) we do not think that the situation is unambiguous under these circumstances which would be very hard to foresee at the time of statement initiation. As we have been doing before, we will continue to call a draw if there is a such an ambiguity. All the bets will be refunded without any commission.

I will launch internet marketing jihad upon your site if you call it a draw.  I will label you personally a scammer and many others will as well.

With this statement alone your site is done.  If you do the right thing the outrage will not be so great.

pay the BFL don'ts, take the line.  It is super, duper 100% clear.  Take a poll, although you clearly ignored the vast majority of these posters the first time...

[Minor Miner]

We have carefully examined both sides of the argument. First of all, on our site title is definitely part of the agreement. We do not count the current status as BFL "shipping" the products, therefore other bets are still open. On the other hand the conditions in the description are met. Unfortunately the statement description, as it is written, can be interpreted as complementary conditions to shipping for more clear evidence or the definition of shipping. As much as we would like to settle the bet on one side (as we would earn a significant commission) we do not think that the situation is unambiguous under these circumstances which would be very hard to foresee at the time of statement initiation. As we have been doing before, we will continue to call a draw if there is a such an ambiguity. All the bets will be refunded without any commission.

Making a decision is worth something and I think a quick decision is wise also.
I, however, will not use your betting site as, IMO, you have allowed someone to clearly welch on a bet.   It was poorly written but it is pretty clear that this company is NOT shipping.

[Bogart]

Pictures were not posted until April.  Bet outcome should be true.

Very disappointed to see this after BoB specially solicited feedback, and the feedback being pretty much overwhelmingly in support of the true outcome.

What, did it have to be unanimous?  What was the point?

[dbasql]

We have carefully examined both sides of the argument. First of all, on our site title is definitely part of the agreement. We do not count the current status as BFL "shipping" the products, therefore other bets are still open. On the other hand the conditions in the description are met. Unfortunately the statement description, as it is written, can be interpreted as complementary conditions to shipping for more clear evidence or the definition of shipping. As much as we would like to settle the bet on one side (as we would earn a significant commission) we do not think that the situation is unambiguous under these circumstances which would be very hard to foresee at the time of statement initiation. As we have been doing before, we will continue to call a draw if there is a such an ambiguity. All the bets will be refunded without any commission.

At worst this should be a push. However the right wager was the wager on no and should prevail.
Also let's hope this was a learning experience the wager description was complete rubbish.