Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[mestar]

"Please, tidy up the kitchen, will you?" (Abide by my rules and I'll take your blocks for good.)

"No, I'm going to do the bedroom. The kitches is a remnant from an era when people used to cook for themselves. Now it's catering all over. Bedroom." (I make the rules, I'm the miner.)

Sounds like you are saying that users (other than the miners) have any say in what blocks get accepted, and what blocks get rejected.

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[bitserve]

This Shitcoin Cash experiment teaches that Bitcoin should have a difficulty adjustment enhacement. It might prove usefull in the future.

It might be dangerous, too. It would make it quicker, then easier to orchestrate a 51% attack by swinging the difficulty wildly, progressively retiring miners from BTC and then coming back on full force at attack time. This could be prepared and deployed when the hashrate is dropping for other reasons (some other problem on the BTC network).

Both things could be dangerous but, at the very least, it requires some consideration. The adjustment algorithm could take into account some long timeouts, sorta a failsafe that should never ever activate in ideal conditions but just in case of total failure in producing new blocks for a long time.

[Meuh6879]

Bitcoin is the 69st State (Money Stock M2).  

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/bitcoin/
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2215rank.html

[williamuk]

If 100% of hashpower want bigger blocks, do you think the devs will fold for economic reasons like how the miners folded for segwit?

They'd have to eliminate all blockstream influence in any shape or form, distance themselves from the most virulent members of their group and then admit bitcoin was never theirs to begin with.

Tall order

[d_eddie]

"Please, tidy up the kitchen, will you?" (Abide by my rules and I'll take your blocks for good.)

"No, I'm going to do the bedroom. The kitches is a remnant from an era when people used to cook for themselves. Now it's catering all over. Bedroom." (I make the rules, I'm the miner.)

Sounds like you are saying that users (other than the miners) have any say in what blocks get accepted, and what blocks get rejected.

Nodes do. Financially heavy nodes, more so.

[bitserve]

Large blocks = Gold
Segregated Witness = Fiat

Asia wants gold.
USA wants to print money.

changing bitcoins block size via politicalbattle destroys its gold like property.

So you're admitting segwit destroys bitcoins gold-like properties.

When 100% of hashpower and most actors and participants have agreed that Bitcoin have to have Segwit, then that's Bitcoin and if it doesn't have Segwit, it isn't Bitcoin. If, tomorrow, almost everybody agrees to have bigger blocks, then that will be Bitcoin and smaller blocks won't.

How is that so hard to understand?

That's a good explanation. But what happens if 51% of hashpower want bigger blocks but Core Developers refuse?

51% would be an attack. In fact that how it is defined: "The 51% attack". Consensus is somewhere around 95%. No consensus? No change.

It is undeniable that we have had the utmost consensus on the segwit issue, so: It is Bitcoin.

Miners have power, Core does too, Exchanges too, other major players and users/participants too... If almost everybody except core agree on something then you can be sure Core will be unable to avoid it.

If 100% of hashpower want bigger blocks, do you think the devs will fold for economic reasons like how the miners folded for segwit?

Yes.

But it is a bit more complex than that... You don't even need 100% of miners while you need some more actors besides miners too. That's why I mention CONSENSUS, not only pure hashpower. Segwit2x have been a CLEAR example on how future improvements can and should be made in Bitcoin.... be it Segwit, bigger blocks, or whatever.

[mestar]

When I say 50/50, I mean value wise. So I actually meant "half of the BTCs have been traded for BCH".
At the moment, the number of extant BTC=BCH.

So, you are not aware that in any BTC/BCH trade, the number of both BTC and BCH stays exactly the same?

So, there is no such a thing as "half of the BTCs are traded for BCH". 

[d_eddie]

This Shitcoin Cash experiment teaches that Bitcoin should have a difficulty adjustment enhacement. It might prove usefull in the future.

It might be dangerous, too. It would make it quicker, then easier to orchestrate a 51% attack by swinging the difficulty wildly, progressively retiring miners from BTC and then coming back on full force at attack time. This could be prepared and deployed when the hashrate is dropping for other reasons (some other problem on the BTC network).

Both things could be dangerous but, at the very least, it requires some consideration. The adjustment algorithm could take into account some long timeouts, sorta a failsafe that should never ever activate in ideal conditions but just in case of total failure in producing new blocks for a long time.

I see where you come from and I basically agree. I think it's the same underlying motivation I feel for a variable, liquid PoW schedule that can rule out monolithic mining farms, cartels or trusts.

[Wexlike]

Sold them all ! I am getting fucking drunk now !

THANK YOU ROGER VER!!!!!!!!!!!!

[d_eddie]

When I say 50/50, I mean value wise. So I actually meant "half of the BTCs have been traded for BCH".
At the moment, the number of extant BTC=BCH.

So, you are not aware that in any BTC/BCH trade, the number of both BTC and BCH stays exactly the same?

So, there is no such a thing as "half of the BTCs are traded for BCH". 

You are right. I expressed my thought sloppily.
"Half of the BTC value at the time of the split has been traded..."
Ultimately implying that the mere existence of a new chain does not mean there is actual value stored in it.

[bitserve]

Sold them all ! I am getting fucking drunk now !

THANK YOU ROGER VER!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lucky you. Most of my BCH is still sitting on my ledger and at this rate it will take me long time to trade them all. I don't feel confident enough to send it all to HitBTC before doing partial withdraws, plus they are requiring 5 confirmations now. Well, you can't always get it right.

[mestar]

Sounds like you are saying that users (other than the miners) have any say in what blocks get accepted, and what blocks get rejected.

Nodes do. Financially heavy nodes, more so.

Your node (financially heavy? Say what?) can reject blocks and transactions however it wants, and this will have zero effect on what blocks miners create. 

[bitserve]

Oh! HitBTC has now lowered the requirement to 2 confirmations. So my BCH is already available.... but it is priced half than the last I sold

[Wexlike]

HitBit accepted my shitcoins after only 1 confirmation ! And withdrawal was limitless, got my Btcs just a minute after withdrawal. Best exchange experience ever.

[d_eddie]

Sounds like you are saying that users (other than the miners) have any say in what blocks get accepted, and what blocks get rejected.

Nodes do. Financially heavy nodes, more so.

Your node (financially heavy? Say what?) can reject blocks and transactions however it wants, and this will have zero effect on what blocks miners create. 

Exchanges, on the other hand...

[bitserve]

HitBit accepted my shitcoins after only 1 confirmation ! And withdrawal was limitless, got my Btcs just a minute after withdrawal. Best exchange experience ever.

What price did you sell? I donno if I should wait for the next pump.... It is half than this morning.

[williamuk]

If 100% of hashpower want bigger blocks, do you think the devs will fold for economic reasons like how the miners folded for segwit?

They'd have to eliminate all blockstream influence in any shape or form, distance themselves from the most virulent members of their group and then admit bitcoin was never theirs to begin with.

Tall order

I guess I'll just grab some popcorn, sit back and enjoy the show.  

At $40bn it's become serious, some people's savings are at stake :|

[julian071]

HitBit accepted my shitcoins after only 1 confirmation ! And withdrawal was limitless, got my Btcs just a minute after withdrawal. Best exchange experience ever.

Congrats dude. Still trying to get my profits out of ViaBTC =/

[Wexlike]

HitBit accepted my shitcoins after only 1 confirmation ! And withdrawal was limitless, got my Btcs just a minute after withdrawal. Best exchange experience ever.

What price did you sell? I donno if I should wait for the next pump.... It is half than this morning.

0.15/BTC. This coin is DoA, never expected more than 5% and now I got 15% ! On the other exchanges it's just trader pumping and dumping air to each other. Wait till the flood gates are open and see the price crash. The blockchain is practically frozen. Nevertheless, crazy last 48h hours. I need drinks and/or sleep.

[bitserve]

HitBit accepted my shitcoins after only 1 confirmation ! And withdrawal was limitless, got my Btcs just a minute after withdrawal. Best exchange experience ever.

What price did you sell? I donno if I should wait for the next pump.... It is half than this morning.

0.15/BTC. This coin is DoA, never expected more than 5% and now I got 15% ! On the other exchanges it's just trader pumping and dumping air to each other. Wait till the flood gates are open and see the price crash. The blockchain is practically frozen. Nevertheless, crazy last 48h hours. I need drinks and/or sleep.

Until now I have only sold at Kraken for 175€ each and at HitBTC for a whooping 0.28BTC each!

I never expected much out of it.... but I will try to get the max I can... for more BTC!

Anyway, congrats, relax and celebrate!