Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[pfrtlpfmpf]

Guys, i´m completely lost, i sit the whole day in front of my laptop, and click on lending at polo. my spouse tells me to go fck myself. Is there a selfhelp group somewhere ?

 self-help for self-fck or the polo clicking thing?

Don´t know, i told you, i´m lost. I´ll take what ever is available  

No, seriously, i have a polo clicking tick. There, did it again ! It´s hopeless.

[1714750626]

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[1714750626]

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[savetherainforest]

Bcash cost of production (difficulty) is now being slashed by 20% per block for the next 6 blocks. Expect miners to follow cost of production slavishly. Forking guys have no idea what they have unleashed ... it will become apparent soon now.

Yes, the existence BCC will destabilize BCT mining.  

So you have been a part of knowingly destabilising bitcoin mining? Neither chain will be stable, the 'hard-fork now!' camp have just stupidly devalued any investment they had in bitcoin (BTC or BCH) ... unless of course you actually work for govvy agents or other actors aiming to do exactly that which you admit to.

Merged-mining is one way BCH can gracefully admit their gargantuan fuck-up and save face (seems they spend a lot of time doing that). You weren't around when we already tried these 'experiments', it's not a pretty outcome. Bitcoin will survive but the credibility of the idiot  loud-mouth crowd doesn't stand much chance (not that they had a lot). Enjoy your forking euphoria, your ultimate downfall has now been sealed.

Big blockers blame small blockers for the fork; small blockers blame big blockers.  I think a split was inevitable given the two distinct visions for Bitcoin's future.

Regarding destabilizing mining, I think what this means is that in the medium term, only one chain will survive (at least with any real value).  The miners will eventually see their incentive to kill off one of the chains. 

The question is which one. 

They both stay alive as long as there is something to trade/gamble on.

[mestar]

Bcash cost of production (difficulty) is now being slashed by 20% per block for the next 6 blocks. Expect miners to follow cost of production slavishly. Forking guys have no idea what they have unleashed ... it will become apparent soon now.

Yes, the existence BCC will destabilize BCT mining.  

Everyone knows that at equilibrium, if BCC has 1/10th the value of BTC, that the hash power mining BCC will be 1/10th that mining BTC.  

What is less obvious what happens when the system is not in equilibrium. Imagine that the market reprices BCC 100% higher and BTC 10% lower.  What is the expected distribution of hash power now assuming short-term profit-maximizing miners?  

The answer is "most of it will be mining BCC." Because the difficulty adjusts only very slowly (every 2016 blocks) BCC becomes twice as profitable to mine as BTC.  Hash-per-hash miners would earn double by mining BCC.  This continues until the difficulty reset comes when BCC would go "limit up" (4X), when most miners would leave BCC back for BTC.  BCC's difficulty would slowly ratchet back down due to its fast difficulty adjustment and the process would later repeat.  

What this suggest is that at times when BCC is more profitable to mine and the hash rate migrates to BCC, the average block time for BTC will increase significantly and BTC's already slow and expensive transactions will become much more so.  

Excellent analysis.  You have just proven that with maximally exploitative mining strategy, you can't have two parallel coins that would work smoothly.   Since 100% of miners would switch to the more profitable one, the other would be paused.

It would not be the slow adjusting difficulty, but the more frequently updated exchange prices that would govern this process.

[mestar]

What this suggest is that at times when BCC is more profitable to mine and the hash rate migrates to BCC, the average block time for BTC will increase significantly and BTC's already slow and expensive transactions will become much more so.  

"Profitable to mine" means you have to have buyers. If you haven't noticed, everyone is trying to dump their BCC (BCH? whatever) at any price and trade for more BTC.

Having a price on an exchange implies there is somebody willing to buy.  Your argument is invalid, nice try.

[mestar]

Bcash cost of production (difficulty) is now being slashed by 20% per block for the next 6 blocks. Expect miners to follow cost of production slavishly. Forking guys have no idea what they have unleashed ... it will become apparent soon now.

Yes, the existence BCC will destabilize BCT mining.  

Everyone knows that at equilibrium, if BCC has 1/10th the value of BTC, that the hash power mining BCC will be 1/10th that mining BTC.  

What is less obvious what happens when the system is not in equilibrium. Imagine that the market reprices BCC 100% higher and BTC 10% lower.  What is the expected distribution of hash power now assuming short-term profit-maximizing miners?  

The answer is "most of it will be mining BCC." Because the difficulty adjusts only very slowly (every 2016 blocks) BCC becomes twice as profitable to mine as BTC.  Hash-per-hash miners would earn double by mining BCC.  This continues until the difficulty reset comes when BCC would go "limit up" (4X), when most miners would leave BCC back for BTC.  BCC's difficulty would slowly ratchet back down due to its fast difficulty adjustment and the process would later repeat.  

What this suggest is that at times when BCC is more profitable to mine and the hash rate migrates to BCC, the average block time for BTC will increase significantly and BTC's already slow and expensive transactions will become much more so.  

Umm..what?

How is 25 BCC (at 10% the value of BTC) mined per day more profitable than 300 BTC per day?

So, you are incapable of imagining:  "Imagine that the market reprices BCC 100% higher and BTC 10% lower.  What is the expected distribution of hash power now assuming short-term profit-maximizing miners?"

[savetherainforest]

Bcash cost of production (difficulty) is now being slashed by 20% per block for the next 6 blocks. Expect miners to follow cost of production slavishly. Forking guys have no idea what they have unleashed ... it will become apparent soon now.

Yes, the existence BCC will destabilize BCT mining.  

Everyone knows that at equilibrium, if BCC has 1/10th the value of BTC, that the hash power mining BCC will be 1/10th that mining BTC.  

What is less obvious what happens when the system is not in equilibrium. Imagine that the market reprices BCC 100% higher and BTC 10% lower.  What is the expected distribution of hash power now assuming short-term profit-maximizing miners?  

The answer is "most of it will be mining BCC." Because the difficulty adjusts only very slowly (every 2016 blocks) BCC becomes twice as profitable to mine as BTC.  Hash-per-hash miners would earn double by mining BCC.  This continues until the difficulty reset comes when BCC would go "limit up" (4X), when most miners would leave BCC back for BTC.  BCC's difficulty would slowly ratchet back down due to its fast difficulty adjustment and the process would later repeat.  

What this suggest is that at times when BCC is more profitable to mine and the hash rate migrates to BCC, the average block time for BTC will increase significantly and BTC's already slow and expensive transactions will become much more so.  

Excellent analysis.  You have just proven that with maximally exploitative mining strategy, you can't have two parallel coins that would work smoothly.   Since 100% of miners would switch to the more profitable one, the other would be paused.

It would not be the slow adjusting difficulty, but the more frequently updated exchange prices that would govern this process.

WE ARE GOING TO THE MOON!!!

[HanvanBitcoin]

Goodmourning everyone,

Looks like the whales are accumulating BTC again! $2823 at Kraken at the moment of writing. Where will this bring us today? Are we going to retest the $3000 barrier?  Happy trading!

[pinger]

I have joined a Telegram Pump group that is going to pump a Cryptopia exchange (no idea who they are), less than 4 hours left, so yes we are probably up

[r0ach]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-08-02/bitcoin-etf-approval-odds-are-way-analyst-says

It wouldn't be good if an ETF was approved IMO.  

Do you really want a bunch of 90 year old retired people having their life savings tied up in this nonsense that can crash to 0 at any second of the day?  Yea, it would be a good exit scheme for you, but a disaster for everyone else. Kinda like how if I bought a used car from some old senile guy and paid him with silver I would feel it's a fair trade, but if I paid him in bitcoin I would feel like I scammed him since the coins have no real value and can implode to nothingness at any moment.  

Bitcoin should really only be used by crackdealers attempting regulatory arbitrage or crimelord money launderers like JayJuanGee and not normal humans which are served better with real and non-imaginary assets.

[Last of the V8s]

https://www.cyberscoop.com/wannacry-monero-bitcoin/
shapeshift blacklist some shitcoins

When you say "blacklist some shitcoins" do you mean BTC?  Because it's BTC addresses being blacklisted here...

"As of today, we have taken measures to blacklist all addresses associated with the WannaCry attackers that are known to the ShapeShift team, as is our policy for any transactions we deem breach our terms of service. We are closely watching the situation as it continues to unfold as to block any further addresses associated.”

You are quite right to point out my schoolboy error. The shitcoins are irrelevant.

[empowering]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-08-02/bitcoin-etf-approval-odds-are-way-analyst-says

twaddle

You are hilarious...

[HanvanBitcoin]

[r0ach]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-08-02/bitcoin-etf-approval-odds-are-way-analyst-says

It wouldn't be good if an ETF was approved IMO.  

Do you really want a bunch of 90 year old retired people having their life savings tied up in this nonsense that can crash to 0 at any second of the day?  Yea, it would be a good exit scheme for you, but a disaster for everyone else. Kinda like how if I bought a used car from some old senile guy and paid him with silver I would feel it's a fair trade, but if I paid him in bitcoin I would feel like I scammed him since the coins have no real value and can implode to nothingness at any moment.  

Bitcoin should really only be used by crackdealers attempting regulatory arbitrage or crimelord money launderers like JayJuanGee and not normal humans which are served better with real and non-imaginary assets.

You are hilarious...

It's bad enough pensions require 8% yearly returns from stocks to not implode and cause massive civil unrest.  The last thing they need to do is add a BTC ETF into that mix and have the value bounce up and down 50% per day or implode to 0 from some type of security problem or other issue.  The ETF will inevitably just be used to create fractional reserve BTC anyways to suppress price and direct people back to the dollar.  

The only people who actually benefit from it are a few large holders like the Winklevoss or Digital Currency Group attempting to liquidate their overpriced coins on clueless and geriatric baby boomers while they would have problems finding liquidity to do it without one.  So all the ETF really is is just an exit scheme.  

Do you really think old people and retirees should be investing in this stuff?  I sure as fuck don't.  Gold and silver are the Schelling point for money when the dollar goes south, NOT cryptocurrency, so geriatric people shouldn't be diverting a cent to this stuff and eventually having it blow up in their faces.

[Last of the V8s]

... sleazy shilling dressed up as logic ...

This is great news for bitcoin.
You know they're getting desperate when they wheel out Peter R.

[rjclarke2000]

I'm not excited yet. Seen this before.

Friday pumpy, weekend dumpy.

But of course I'm still bullish!


Edit. To be honest we need to go up a lot more before I class this as a pump. % terms this is nothing

[r0ach]

... sleazy shilling dressed up as logic ...

This is great news for bitcoin.
You know they're getting desperate when they send for Peter R.

He was right, though.  The fact that BCH has fast difficulty adjustment and bitcoin doesn't while the Chinese control most of the hash power is gonna be mega-problems for BTC.  I imagine all BCH has to do is NOT DIE and it will cause Luke Jr to be forced to fork BTC to change difficulty adjustment.  Since BTC is now forced to fork, people will probably want a bunch of other changes like PoW algo change as well.  It's a real can of worms here.

Having said that, I vew any chain with a fixed blocksize and low scalability being nothing more than an extortion, rent seeking usury system.  If you're promoting the whole planet pile into a 1 MB blocksize coin, all you're doing is promoting usury.  The only way to fix that paradigm is use a scaling blocksize like Monero.

[williamuk]

... sleazy shilling dressed up as logic ...

This is great news for bitcoin.
You know they're getting desperate when they send for Peter R.

He was right, though.  The fact that BCH has fast difficulty adjustment and bitcoin doesn't while the Chinese control most of the hash power is gonna be mega-problems for BTC.  I imagine all BCH has to do is NOT DIE and it will cause Luke Jr to be forced to fork BTC to change difficulty adjustment.  Since BTC is now forced to fork, people will probably want a bunch of other changes like PoW algo change as well.  It's a real can of worms here.

Please not another fork 

[fluidjax]

Lastest bcc block 

478617   22 minutes ago   0x20000000   Unknown   M6Y q$/Fuck BitcoinCash - bcc.suprnova.cc/   1,999.20

[Last of the V8s]

@sovereignmonkey

[Elwar]

I just want to go with whichever chain allows me to buy a coffee now...and when I am an old man looking back 50 years from now I can point to that transaction and say "that was my transaction...it was a coffee and it was delicious".