Bitcoin Forum
June 19, 2024, 10:33:27 AM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 27.0 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Poll
Question: What happens first:
New ATH - 43 (69.4%)
<$60,000 - 19 (30.6%)
Total Voters: 62

Pages: « 1 ... 18654 18655 18656 18657 18658 18659 18660 18661 18662 18663 18664 18665 18666 18667 18668 18669 18670 18671 18672 18673 18674 18675 18676 18677 18678 18679 18680 18681 18682 18683 18684 18685 18686 18687 18688 18689 18690 18691 18692 18693 18694 18695 18696 18697 18698 18699 18700 18701 18702 18703 [18704] 18705 18706 18707 18708 18709 18710 18711 18712 18713 18714 18715 18716 18717 18718 18719 18720 18721 18722 18723 18724 18725 18726 18727 18728 18729 18730 18731 18732 18733 18734 18735 18736 18737 18738 18739 18740 18741 18742 18743 18744 18745 18746 18747 18748 18749 18750 18751 18752 18753 18754 ... 33460 »
  Print  
Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 26403077 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (174 posts by 3 users with 9 merit deleted.)
gentlemand
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2590
Merit: 3014


Welt Am Draht


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 10:50:34 PM


Actually a house is not really yours. It belongs to the State. If you dont pay your taxes, they just take it and throw you out, like in a rent.

What you pay when you think you are buying a house, is a permission from the State to reside there.



Head to Nevada, baby. Certain bits have allodial title.
jojo69
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3206
Merit: 4386


diamond-handed zealot


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 10:57:10 PM

Head to Nevada, baby. Certain bits have allodial title.

non transferable except for heirs

I try talking to normals about this shit and they look at me like I have mushrooms growing out of my head.
bitserve
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1820
Merit: 1464


Self made HODLER ✓


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:01:27 PM


Actually a house is not really yours. It belongs to the State. If you dont pay your taxes, they just take it and throw you out, like in a rent.

What you pay when you think you are buying a house, is a permission from the State to reside there.



Head to Nevada, baby. Certain bits have allodial title.

This is very interesting... Never heard about it before. It is like this in many countries or is it just a USA thing?
gentlemand
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2590
Merit: 3014


Welt Am Draht


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:03:26 PM

This is very interesting... Never heard about it before. It is like this in many countries or is it just a USA thing?

It's super, super rare. Just in small patches with legal quirks. I think some Indian reservations in the US have it too. Also some Aboriginal land in Australia. Other than that there's no way governments would permit it.
rolling
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 824
Merit: 712


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:11:19 PM

CME is live:

http://www.cmegroup.com/trading/equity-index/us-index/bitcoin.html
gentlemand
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2590
Merit: 3014


Welt Am Draht


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:14:26 PM


I have not sensed a party in my pants. When can I expect it to begin?
HairyMaclairy
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1414
Merit: 2174


Degenerate bull hatter & Bitcoin monotheist


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:15:16 PM

Jan 2018: $20310.  

Seems reasonable enough
bones261
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1806
Merit: 1827



View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:15:24 PM


Meh. Not sure what the fuss is about these future markets. It only seems to be people gambling for or against the bitcoin price in the future with fiat and settling with fiat. No BTC is ever acquired or sold at all.
petahashminer
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1890
Merit: 1037


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:15:44 PM

it seems they are opening long position

which is bullish ??
TERA2
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 266
Merit: 222


Deb Rah Von Doom


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:16:49 PM

This on the other hand finally looks like it could be the beginning of a crash

And someone was right about BCH not rallying
milkshock100
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 242
Merit: 14


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:19:53 PM

Big dump
d_eddie
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2534
Merit: 3118



View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:21:00 PM

A potential flaw in Lightning is the cost to open and close a channel. The fees are high enough that the average user might find it difficult to get onto payment channels. ALso the motivation to do so by the time they roll it out might not be there.
Indeed, that is the crux with lightning: the cost to open/close a channel. Or equivalently, the blockchain space.
However, channels can be kept open indefinitely. No need to close them if you don't have to cash out and just re-use those new incoming btc for new expenses. The way things are now, re-funding a channel also involves a blockchain transaction.

However, and it's a big however IMO, this kind of issues is already being addressed. I am aware of at least one possible solution that allows multiple channels to be opened together, with one single transactions (and closed too? I'm not sure about that, gotta find the source again). Of course the opening wouldn't be immediate, as the system must find the required number of participants to share the blockchain fee. It's a  mechanism akin to coinjoin, with extra crypto to secure the joining/unjoining steps.

The bottom line is: once L2 really starts working and gets acceptance, there are several technical tricks that can be played to squeeze utility out of it, significantly limiting recourse to L1 (the base blockchain). Ideally, such L1 transactions would only be used in special cases, when really necessary.

Enduring transaction costs such as the current ones hurts. It hurts me too, to the point that I chose traditional banking over bitcoin for some of my smaller recent transactions. However, after some research, I am an informed optimist.
sirazimuth
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 3402
Merit: 3516


born once atheist


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:22:16 PM

Gentlemen I sense an ath in the air...

About as common as one of my guffs these days.

guff... lol...now that's a term I haven't heard in awhile.
mine are quite common the morning after a good indian vindy, much to my wifes displeasure I might add...
BancoBFC
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 14
Merit: 0


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:22:38 PM

Smoothie, how come you are so fast to answer everywhere? I am starting to wonder if you have hired people or scripted bots to make your replies. You tend to write a new answer faster than I read the new posts in the interesting threads. Respect. Tongue
Spaceman_Spiff_Original
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 417
Merit: 220



View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:25:01 PM


Meh. Not sure what the fuss is about these future markets. It only seems to be people gambling for or against the bitcoin price in the future with fiat and settling with fiat. No BTC is ever acquired or sold at all.
Because the settlement price is based on the BTC prices on exchanges, this allows arbitrage, so they are somewhat communicating vessels.

I really hate 10 min delayed data though.  That's what I like about regular bitcoin trading, most of the data is open to everybody.
svdleer
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 112
Merit: 10


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:32:50 PM

big dump ...
petahashminer
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1890
Merit: 1037


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:34:55 PM

lol so big  Grin
nikauforest
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 298
Merit: 149



View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:36:51 PM

A potential flaw in Lightning is the cost to open and close a channel. The fees are high enough that the average user might find it difficult to get onto payment channels. ALso the motivation to do so by the time they roll it out might not be there.
Indeed, that is the crux with lightning: the cost to open/close a channel. Or equivalently, the blockchain space.
However, channels can be kept open indefinitely. No need to close them if you don't have to cash out and just re-use those new incoming btc for new expenses. The way things are now, re-funding a channel also involves a blockchain transaction.

However, and it's a big however IMO, this kind of issues is already being addressed. I am aware of at least one possible solution that allows multiple channels to be opened together, with one single transactions (and closed too? I'm not sure about that, gotta find the source again). Of course the opening wouldn't be immediate, as the system must find the required number of participants to share the blockchain fee. It's a  mechanism akin to coinjoin, with extra crypto to secure the joining/unjoining steps.

The bottom line is: once L2 really starts working and gets acceptance, there are several technical tricks that can be played to squeeze utility out of it, significantly limiting recourse to L1 (the base blockchain). Ideally, such L1 transactions would only be used in special cases, when really necessary.

Enduring transaction costs such as the current ones hurts. It hurts me too, to the point that I chose traditional banking over bitcoin for some of my smaller recent transactions. However, after some research, I am an informed optimist.

Hey thanks for that post. I want be an informed optimist too. I need to do more research like you have done.
orpington
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 784
Merit: 512



View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:36:55 PM

lol so big  Grin

yeah

I'm so scared Cheesy
realr0ach
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 924
Merit: 311


#TheGoyimKnow


View Profile
December 17, 2017, 11:37:39 PM

Fees are too expensive already.

Pages: « 1 ... 18654 18655 18656 18657 18658 18659 18660 18661 18662 18663 18664 18665 18666 18667 18668 18669 18670 18671 18672 18673 18674 18675 18676 18677 18678 18679 18680 18681 18682 18683 18684 18685 18686 18687 18688 18689 18690 18691 18692 18693 18694 18695 18696 18697 18698 18699 18700 18701 18702 18703 [18704] 18705 18706 18707 18708 18709 18710 18711 18712 18713 18714 18715 18716 18717 18718 18719 18720 18721 18722 18723 18724 18725 18726 18727 18728 18729 18730 18731 18732 18733 18734 18735 18736 18737 18738 18739 18740 18741 18742 18743 18744 18745 18746 18747 18748 18749 18750 18751 18752 18753 18754 ... 33460 »
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!