Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[stcramto]

the king is dead

long live the king 

[toknormal]

I fought for Bitcoin till now but i am tired now.

ETH does everything which bitcoin can't. It doesn't have malicious greedy piece of shits like Jihan BU and Roger ver in the first place. ETH don't have ASICs. Mining power is greatly distributed among people because people mine with GPU's.

No stupid scaling debates. The only thing keeps me moving from btc to eth is that i feel like it is too late now. I feel like shit. We will lose the market cap to ETH...

Whether that's true or not, it doesn't change a few things which make ETH a very risky investment when it gets expensive.

 • For a start, ETH is basically a technology asset, not a monetary one which gives it a much shorter time to obsolescence than bitcoin.

 • Secondly, it suffers from the "airgap" problem which Bitcoin doesn't. That is to say, there's a financial airgap between the base token and the equity that's being built on top of it.

 • Thirdly, it's already forked. So that kind of kills it anyway as far as any kind of long term store of value is concerned.

 • Fourthly, it's bug ridden. As I say, that's not so bad for a technology asset as long as it can successfully support the meta tokens that represent the business models it carried.

 • Fifthly, buying the ETH token itself (as opposed to say Golem, wetrust or Aragon meta tokens) you're effectively buying a chunk of a profit and loss account rather than a balance sheet. Not many people realise that, hence the FOMO, and they may never realise it. But the implication is that you're investing in the reproducible part that depends on monetary velocity as opposed to the unique part that is the equity layer. Hence its value is at the mercy of the same forces that drive GDP in a regular economy. i.e. the exact OPPOSITE of a safe haven store of value.

 • Sixthly, we are currently at "Peak Ethereum". It's about to get buried of a tsunami of competing smart contract blockchains, many of which are more advanced technologically having observed the issues Ethereum encountered. With monetary assets, being an original to market is an advantage. With technology assets it's the other way around - everyone that comes after you has the edge.

Should be enough for starters

[Torque]

and whatever happens bitcoiners should let go of the idea of bitcoin being it.

it's a big old world with more ideas and agendas than we can guess at.

Completely, and totally disagree. For the world to have a universally accepted form of money that crosses borders, it would need to ideally consolidate on one. The world will never universally accept 1000 different forms of payment (money) as all being equally valuable. If all special snowflakes are special, then none of them are universally special.

[European Central Bank]

Completely, and totally disagree. For the world to have a universally accepted form of money that crosses borders, it would need to ideally consolidate on one. The world will never universally accept 1000 different forms of payment (money) as all being equally valuable. If all special snowflakes are special, then none of them are universally special.

i think ethereum's creators themselves would be the first to say that it's not money.

what people are getting worked up about is the present pool of speculator and trader money being allocated to different things. this isn't a cryptocurrency bubble, it's now a crypto technology bubble.  

if there's more profit to be made elsewhere then they're agnostic enough to look elsewhere. most people are only in this for the dollars. they don't care about the future beyond the next five minutes.

if bitcoin has what it takes then none of this matters in the short term. new generations will appreciate what it truly means. there's a lot of theology to untangle and we haven't even started yet.

[Torque]

i think ethereum's creators themselves would be the first to say that it's not money.

what people are getting worked up about is trader money being allocated to different things. this isn't a cryptocurrency bubble, it's now a crypto technology bubble.  

if there's more profit to be made elsewhere then they're agnostic enough to look elsewhere. most people are only in this for the dollars. they don't care about the future beyond the next five minutes.

Then what do these traders think that they are buying, and what greater fool are they going to sell to in the future?

Last time I checked, Ethereum wasn't a company, and ETH isn't a stock. They have no CEO and make no profit. And the tech is free, open source, and easily copied.

[European Central Bank]

Then what do these traders think that they are buying, and what greater fool are they going to sell to in the future?

i don't think they know or care. they're buying a chunk of the future that might pay off. if they find a greater fool who values that chunk higher at the right price then they'll sell and run.

[toknormal]

Then what do these traders think that they are buying, and what greater fool are they going to sell to in the future?

They think they're buying the "next bitcoin" and as long as it's below BTC's marketcap then it's a buy.

[sirazimuth]

 looks like its dropping a tad. must be because i just bought...never fails..

[Fatman3001]

Ethereum, brought to you by the incompetence of Bitcoin Core!

[Meuh6879]

the king is dead

long live the king 

[Elwar]

[...] For some of my bitcoins I recently purchased some crypto-steel and stored some bitcoins on those. I just moved from Afghanistan to Korea spending a few weeks in Thailand, Cambodia, Vietnam and French Polynesia. By moving, that meant bringing my crypto-steel with me (not trusting it to some post office). So here I am traveling with these metal squares through various security. I spent about 15 minutes in Dubai trying to explain my crypto-steel to security (I had them wrapped in metalic tape to ensure nobody tampered with them). I finally had to unwrap one enough to show what was inside (I also had full chemical gear so that was part of the inquisition as well....long story). I ended up checking my bag in with the crypto-steel from there on out and was paranoid every minute that they were not in my possession. Every hotel I went to had to have a safe. I ended up in one hotel without a safe and I only left briefly to eat. I ended up using a bus instead of going on airplanes when I traveled due to the difficulty. Flying from Vietnam to French Polynesia I decided to keep the crypto-steel with me to avoid the worry I had before. I had to explain to a Vietnamese security guard what they were, I used pictures on my phone and was ok after 5 minutes (I was surprised when he said "oh, Bitcoin!").
[...]

Thanks for sharing your experience Elwar. Had a similar one explaining a few Casascius coins.

I am wondering though why you carry the cryptosteel around. Just remember a 12 word Electrum seed and you have no explaining to do crossing borders, and no worries of being robbed when away from 'home'. Still each time I punch in those 12 words from memory to cold sign a transaction, it feels like magic internet money. It makes me again experience how powerful and independent Bitcoin really is.

I don't just carry my cryptosteel around with me when I travel. I was moving from one country to another so I brought with me the most valueable stuff (I have 2 suitcases sitting in a storage space in Afghanistan waiting for my buddies to get around to shipping them to me).
I have 2 separate backups that I was able to leave with family (split amongs several members) when I was in the US.
And I did mix the keys up so they are in the raw form but only I know the pattern.
I would not rely on SD card as that can get corrupted or burned or fried. I do not keep all of my bitcoins in one address so memorizing each one would be faulty.

Hopefully I will only be moving to a new country a few more times and I can securely hide my cryptosteel on my property.

Which, like I said, I would be able to store gold once settled somewhere. But Bitcoin is a ton more easy to transfer country to country than several pounds of gold bars.

[toknormal]

Another time-bomb that Ethereum has:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNGzhWODF2s&t=1146

[JayJuanGee]

I wish I could forget the bitcoin price and look in 5 years or so.

I don't trade so I don't need to look yet I check constantly.

I need help.

I think every one of us here does that 😕

I tell myself that I am not going to look - and the next thing you know, I am looking. 

I have little to no will power.   

[European Central Bank]

Another time-bomb that Ethereum has:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNGzhWODF2s&t=1146

this one is the monster. and no proof of vitalik can get past that. they've all been way too casual about paying attention to securities regulations, somehow thinking it doesn't apply to them. it does, and it will.

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

I'm looking forward to the change to proof of stake. What could possibly go wrong?

[JayJuanGee]

Ethereum, brought to you by the incompetence of Bitcoin Core!

That is ridiculous, but it is the ongoing story line...

Go figure.

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

Ethereum, brought to you by the incompetence of Bitcoin Core!

That is ridiculous, but it is the ongoing story line...

Go figure.

If smart guys like Fatty insist on a fork, we'll get one. I agree with Simon Dixon on this: if I have to explain 2 versions of Bitcon for more than a few months, I'm out.

[Bitcoinaire]

A rising tide lifts all boats.
The crypto currency scene is in the beginning stages of going supernova with alts.

Edit: I see lots of posts are getting deleted too, interesting change.....

[Torque]

We need to step up our wall observations, all our posts are being deleted. We're all going to die.

Unless I'm misunderstanding, it seems to targeted towards funny images and memes. I guess this thread will become dull and humorless now.  

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

We need to step up our wall observations, all our posts are being deleted. We're all going to die.

Unless I'm misunderstanding, it seems to targeted towards funny images and memes. I guess this thread will become dull and humorless now.