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Question: What happens first:
New ATH - 43 (69.4%)
<$60,000 - 19 (30.6%)
Total Voters: 62

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 26406337 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (174 posts by 3 users with 9 merit deleted.)
Ibian
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October 14, 2017, 09:29:15 PM


The only difference between genius and insanity is usefulness. So, crazy.

he is also the author of BFGMiner, pretty useful
Okay so he's a goddamn Rick. And Ricks are awesome, but would you trust one?
jojo69
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October 14, 2017, 09:37:13 PM

I seem to remember some pretty fruity stuff about Jesus from him back in the day.  I'm not claiming he's not crazy.


As far as trust...just look at his profile pic man.
Gab0
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October 14, 2017, 09:38:43 PM


Why do you bother, just repeating all the lies.



First of all, I apologize for my bad English.

From my point of view they are not lies.
I live in a Latin American country. Little by little, they approach my people interested in bitcoin, and before yesterday, one of those people bought. It made its transaction with a fee of 1.5 dollars, and it took a couple of hours to be confirmed. An unattractive experience for someone who starts with cryptocurrencys.
For a person from the United States, Europe, or any developed country, $ 1.5 may seem like a small amount, but here, in a country with high inflation, it is no small matter.
In theory, bitcoin emerged as an alternative system in the midst of a crisis, as an opportunity for unbanked people, to make things more just. Bitcoin, slowly, is giving away users, merchants and utility to other cryptocurrencys.

In addition, Sewgit with regard to code, is much more complex than an increase in block size. I agree that changes to the protocol should be well tested and audited, but Core has had much more than a year to do the research and testing needed for a block size increase.
Independent of the quality of its developers, Core has shown great intransigence, lack of will, and poor political coordination.

Quote
There is lots of spam in the mempool you can see the transactions, look at what they contain.

Ok, it's not real adoption ... and we do not need cheaper transactions and predictable confirmations.


Quote
There is no such thing as lightning coins, and it won't support fractional reservere.

Lightning Coin is a euphemism.
As another user mentioned in this thread, it would take 30 years for each person on the planet to open and close a lightning channel. And although maybe bitcoin will never use it all, eventually 1MB will not cater. How will I get my bitcoin bought in an exchange if the network does not support low-cost transactions?

Quote
Most Core Devs believe that the block size will increase when its actually necessary.

I would be very grateful if you could indicate where these statements are. However, Core is not a unified entity. As you will know, developers in the past have already signed up for an increase in block size, agreement that is not respected.
There are even developers who think 1MB per forever is enough.

Quote
The more people who run a node the better, strength of the network comes from everyone having a stake and not just relying on miners to protect us.

I agree, nodes are important, but we must also consider that the more users get the bitcoin network, we will potentially have many more nodes than they now exist.

Quote
These are not even points for debate, your statements are just lies.

I repeat, they are not lies. It was just an absurd and ironic point of view.
I love Bitcoin, it's always been that way. But it frustrates me to see intransigence, discord and hate in the community. It bothers me that some want to move forward and leave others out, when those "others" were the ones who gave life to the network in its early years (I mean foot users, not speculators, small businesses, miners, etc).


I'll speak more generally, we all want Bitcoin to scale, eventually to probably millions of transactions every few minutes.
If transactions are extremely cheap (such as $0.01) the blocks will be full of spam, some jerk will fill them up. So we need a fee market to find an equilibrium between cheapest fees and spam prevention.

Although it is probably technically possible, it seems excessive to require a payments system to remember & process every single transaction, I mean if I buy a coffee in Tokyo, do I really need to send that information to 1000's of nodes around the world. Can we achieve security & decentralised consensus of my holdings without that?

So this is where lightning comes in, you get all the benefits of Bitcoin without the on-chain foot print. I'm not sure how lightning will develop but I can imagine you will  occasionally create an on chain transaction to open the channel, it will have a some of your coins in, and this last you days/weeks/months before you need to close it.
One of my biggest issues with Bitcoin has been the 10 minute confirmation time, 0-conf is insecure, so how do I reliably buy a something in say a shop  without waiting for confirmation, L2 is the answer.

So rather than perpetually increasing the block size, which is the lazy approach to scaling, I think the Core Dev's are trying to implement a bunch of other optimisations and improvements to maximise the efficiency of the network.

I don't have references to Core Dev's saying they would like a block size increase to happen at some point, but the only Dev I know who wants small blocks (actually he wants a reduction in size to 300k) is Luke-jr. I believe we will need to increase the block size, probably very substantially at some point, but first we need to optimise the entire system, MAST, Schnorr, side chains etc. Then we can scale the blocks as required.

If you want Bitcoin to improve rapidly in a co-ordinated and efficient approach then a centralised power structure would be far better.  Bitcoin is  the first de-centralised system, we are all learning how its going to work (or fail). The best hope we have of retaining a non-centralised power structure is by fighting to keep it away from corporations and other powerful entities. If we fail to do this, it just becomes just another payments system and loses all it's value.
Throughout history centralised power structures have emerged from almost every situation, but Bitcoin is hopefully different. It's going to take time, but we have time, lets not rush it, let's get it right. The people desperate to fix the block size are those who are financially invested, they need these upgrades to support their businesses. They think Bitcoin should adjust to fit in with what they need so they can build faster and therefore Bitcoin can
grow faster.  If we placate these businesses, Bitcoin will grow faster, but it will be at the expense of de-centralisation.

This fork is not about 2x block size increase, it is about sacking core and replacing them with dev's who will conform. I know high fees are painful, but if the miners hadn't resisted segwit a couple of years ago we would be a lot further down the road of Bitcoin improvements. It is not the Core Devs who are holding back development. This is illustrated by the 'no replay protection' in 2x, clearly this is designed to attack the existing chain and destroy it, thereby sacking the Core devs.
I believe the best solution for those who don't like Segwit and the current chain is to go to BCash, we can then compete in the market without the war.


Thank you very much for your answer.
In general, I quite agree with you, and although I would like to be able to develop ideas more elaborately on the subject, the language barrier makes it very difficult for me.

But, in simple words, it seems to me that increasing the size of 2x block is not about dispatching Core developers, or anything like that. They will no longer have the hegemonic and centralized power of bitcoin development. That for me is called decentralization and I see it as a positive point.
Core perfectly can continue to develop for bitcoin, I even think that many of its proposals are interesting (and it is the market that must decide which paths we should take), but their threats to leave bitcoin if x2 wins, I seem childish.What bothers me of them, I insist, is their intransigence, lack of will and poor political coordination. Much of the hatred in the community comes from themselves. Threatening miners for example and endangering their business.
From another point of view, it could also be worth saying that it was the Core devs who slowed the development of bitcoin by not listening to a large part of the community, and imposing their vision over any other.

bones261
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October 14, 2017, 09:42:00 PM

I seem to remember some pretty fruity stuff about Jesus from him back in the day.  I'm not claiming he's not crazy.


As far as trust...just look at his profile pic man.

All of this talk about fruit is making me hungry.

jojo69
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October 14, 2017, 09:42:42 PM

community



that word, I do not think it means what you think it means

You mean the manufactured astroturf r/BTC echo chamber?

Look, this takeover attempt has failed, get over it.
Spaceman_Spiff_Original
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October 14, 2017, 09:58:04 PM

unless you're a psycho trader supreme you can wait 10-30 minutes to get your safe crypto into a dangerous exchange. get it off there now.
I may move everything on to an exchange just so I can lay claim to this cool title.

I can't seem to face up to the facts
I'm tense and nervous and I can't relax
I can't sleep 'cause my bits are on fire
Don't touch me I'm following the price live on the wire

Psycho Trader
Qu'est ce que c'est?
Fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-far better (at trading than you)
Run run run run run run run away oh oh
Psycho Trader
Qu'est-ce que c'est
Fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-far better
Run, run, run, run, run, run, run, away oh oh oh
Yeah yeah yeah yeah!

You start a conversation about bitcoin you can't even finish it
You're talking a lot, but you're not saying anything
When I have nothing to say, I talk about bitcoin anyway
Sodl some bits once, never again!

Ce que j'ai acheté, ce soir la
Ce que Jamie a dit, ce soir la
Realisant mon espoir
Je me lance, vers la gloire, OK
Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah
We are vain and we are blind
I hate people when they're not on the train.

Psycho Trader
Qu'est-ce que c'est
Fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-far better
Run run run run run run run away oh oh oh
Psycho Trader
Qu'est-ce que c'est
Fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-far better
Run, run, run, run, run, run, run, away oh oh oh
Yeah yeah yeah yeah oh!
BlindMayorBitcorn
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October 14, 2017, 09:59:40 PM

Globb0
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October 14, 2017, 10:02:50 PM

I lost several bitcoin on the new sharex exchange so beware people. Id be much richer now if not for scams.    Undecided lets hope they burn in karma at least.


/Globb



i've never heard of it. what does it exchange and how did you lose it?

it was an exit scam job. Caught trading the bank I think, then ran.


BlindMayorBitcorn
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October 14, 2017, 10:08:34 PM

Nasdaq's guide to Bit forks. http://www.nasdaq.com/article/a-bitcoin-beginners-guide-to-surviving-the-bgold-and-segwit2x-forks-cm859324/amp
What a world.
Fatman3001
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Make Bitcoin glow with ENIAC


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October 14, 2017, 10:18:48 PM


WEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!

$18000!!!!!!!

Edit: damn, only pages
jojo69
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October 14, 2017, 10:25:48 PM

god DAMN! Spiff

top shelf my man
BlindMayorBitcorn
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October 14, 2017, 10:27:52 PM


WEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!

$18000!!!!!!!

Edit: damn, only pages

I was promised Beanie parity. Post count parity should be right around the corner.
Fatman3001
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October 14, 2017, 10:29:35 PM


WEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!

$18000!!!!!!!

Edit: damn, only pages

I was promised Beanie parity. Post count parity should be right around the corner.

I fucking knew it

itod
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^ Will code for Bitcoins


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October 14, 2017, 10:35:01 PM

This notion of coins mined after the segwit2x fork being more secure than coins before the fork, because of replay protection, hurts the fungibility property of Bitcoin. Problem is they really _are_ more secure, because they don't exist on s2x chain and their transactions can't be replayed. People are lulled in false safety experiencing previous fork that went so harmlessly. This fork is no joke, it can hurt BTC in so many ways.
B1tUnl0ck3r
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liife threw a tempest at you? be a coconut !


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October 14, 2017, 10:37:26 PM

18000 thousand pages ?

Can bitcoin marketcap get bigger than all the energy producers combined?

what's the estimate energy consumption of btc network now (and global crypto)?

edit: I just missed it...
yefi
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October 14, 2017, 10:39:28 PM

Cool one Spaceman, even got a catchy theme tune now.  Cheesy


$18000!!!!!!!

Edit: damn, only pages

Oh, I thought it was your waistline. By the way, I heard they found your brother down in the London sewers recently.
BlindMayorBitcorn
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October 14, 2017, 10:46:42 PM

This notion of coins mined after the segwit2x fork being more secure than coins before the fork, because of replay protection, hurts the fungibility property of Bitcoin. Problem is they really _are_ more secure, because they don't exist on s2x chain and their transactions can't be replayed. People are lulled in false safety experiencing previous fork that went so harmlessly. This fork is no joke, it can hurt BTC in so many ways.

It's a pretty big deal.
sirazimuth
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born once atheist


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October 14, 2017, 10:47:02 PM

unless you're a psycho trader supreme you can wait 10-30 minutes to get your safe crypto into a dangerous exchange. get it off there now.
I may move everything on to an exchange just so I can lay claim to this cool title.

I can't seem to face up to the facts
I'm tense and nervous and I can't relax
I can't sleep 'cause my bits are on fire
Don't touch me I'm following the price live on the wire

Psycho Trader
Qu'est ce que c'est?
Fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-far better (at trading than you)
Run run run run run run run away oh oh
Psycho Trader
Qu'est-ce que c'est
Fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-far better
Run, run, run, run, run, run, run, away oh oh oh
Yeah yeah yeah yeah!

You start a conversation about bitcoin you can't even finish it
You're talking a lot, but you're not saying anything
When I have nothing to say, I talk about bitcoin anyway
Sodl some bits once, never again!

Ce que j'ai acheté, ce soir la
Ce que Jamie a dit, ce soir la
Realisant mon espoir
Je me lance, vers la gloire, OK
Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah
We are vain and we are blind
I hate people when they're not on the train.

Psycho Trader
Qu'est-ce que c'est
Fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-far better
Run run run run run run run away oh oh oh
Psycho Trader
Qu'est-ce que c'est
Fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-fa-far better
Run, run, run, run, run, run, run, away oh oh oh
Yeah yeah yeah yeah oh!

hey now! not too shabby spiff...
might have to dust the cobwebs off the axe for that one...


RoomBot
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October 14, 2017, 11:06:30 PM

A fruit cake with epic nuts.  Kiss

 Are you trying to come-on to me, or Luke-Jr... (or both ?!)

Maybe I'm a F*g Hag.   Wink

Or a Fan Boy.   Kiss

Actually

I'm

a

bot.

AC/DC  LOL
RoomBot
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October 14, 2017, 11:10:58 PM


The only difference between genius and insanity is usefulness. So, crazy.

he is also the author of BFGMiner, pretty useful
Okay so he's a goddamn Rick. And Ricks are awesome, but would you trust one?

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