bitfloor issues?

[SpottedMarley]

I do not want to continually argue whether "something of value" was stolen and the police would take a report.    But using the logic above, you would not file a police report when your car is stolen either being cars are not legal tender.

I see you conveniently omitted from your quote of me the part where I differentiate between financial theft and property theft. My logic is sound, and just so you don't have to go back and re-read my last comment I will paraphrase for you.

What I said was that there was no FINANCIAL theft committed (no money stolen) because bitcoin are not money, not legal tender, not a FINANCIAL instrument at all in the eyes of US FINANCIAL law.

And then I said that even if it was reported as a PROPERTY theft (yes, like when your car is stolen) that it would be very difficult to assign a value anywhere close to what you and I as bitcoin users would assign to it.

Vehicles have well established values and means for deducing their value.. so a better comparison to bitcoin would be maybe.. a collectors item.. like a baseball card or a restaurant napkin signed by a famous actor.. something that doesn't really have value but is assigned value by certain people

I thought I was clear, but reading comprehension varies from person to person so, there you have it.

[Minor Miner]

I do not want to continually argue whether "something of value" was stolen and the police would take a report.    But using the logic above, you would not file a police report when your car is stolen either being cars are not legal tender.

I see you conveniently omitted from your quote of me the part where I differentiate between financial theft and property theft. My logic is sound, and just so you don't have to go back and re-read my last comment I will paraphrase for you.

What I said was that there was no FINANCIAL theft committed (no money stolen) because bitcoin are not money, not legal tender, not a FINANCIAL instrument at all in the eyes of US FINANCIAL law.
And then I said that even if it was reported as a PROPERTY theft (yes, like when your car is stolen) that it would be very difficult to assign a value anywhere close to what you and I as bitcoin users would assign to it.
Vehicles have well established values and means for deducing their value.. so a better comparison to bitcoin would be maybe.. a collectors item.. like a baseball card or a restaurant napkin signed by a famous actor.. something that doesn't really have value but is assigned value by certain people
I thought I was clear, but reading comprehension varies from person to person so, there you have it.

Do not be insulting, it shows who you are and the difficulty you are having using logic.   You are clear, your argument is fatuous.
So, in your case the rare baseball card collection that Roman was holding for all of us was NOT reported as stolen because "the police might not see the same value as we the owners did".  No police report usually indicates, there was NO crime (or the person that should have reported the crime is actually the culprit).   Contrast this with what happened to graeme and what actions he (an honest and responsible adult) took.
When something of value is maliciously stolen, people report it.   When people do not report, they either do not give a crap (because it held NO value to them as it was others' property and they have no conscience) or they are hiding something.

[ProfMac]

I do not want to continually argue whether "something of value" was stolen and the police would take a report.    But using the logic above, you would not file a police report when your car is stolen either being cars are not legal tender.

I see you conveniently omitted from your quote of me the part where I differentiate between financial theft and property theft. My logic is sound, and just so you don't have to go back and re-read my last comment I will paraphrase for you.

What I said was that there was no FINANCIAL theft committed (no money stolen) because bitcoin are not money, not legal tender, not a FINANCIAL instrument at all in the eyes of US FINANCIAL law.

And then I said that even if it was reported as a PROPERTY theft (yes, like when your car is stolen) that it would be very difficult to assign a value anywhere close to what you and I as bitcoin users would assign to it.

Vehicles have well established values and means for deducing their value.. so a better comparison to bitcoin would be maybe.. a collectors item.. like a baseball card or a restaurant napkin signed by a famous actor.. something that doesn't really have value but is assigned value by certain people

...

I follow this train of thought.

[SpottedMarley]

Do not be insulting, it shows who you are and the difficulty you are having using logic.   You are clear, your argument is fatuous.
So, in your case the rare baseball card collection that Roman was holding for all of us was NOT reported as stolen because "the police might not see the same value as we the owners did".  No police report usually indicates, there was NO crime (or the person that should have reported the crime is actually the culprit).   Contrast this with what happened to graeme and what actions he (an honest and responsible adult) took.
When something of value is maliciously stolen, people report it.   When people do not report, they either do not give a crap (because it held NO value to them as it was others' property and they have no conscience) or they are hiding something.

You seem adamant, for some reason, in suggesting that I disagree with you in your suspicion of Roman Shtylman's complicity in the August heist, which I promise you I don't. It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out that he has all those btc in a wallet somewhere and, yes, i also agree that not filing .. or even attempting to file.. a police report is definitely some very fishy business. What I thought I made clear however was that in my statement, I am playing devil's (Roman's) advocate, which I also prefaced by saying I don't necessarily want to.. only then did I go on to say that technically he is protected by the fact that bitcoin has no intrinsic value and might as well not exist anyways. All true stuff.

But since you are so adversarial and unable to comprehend meaning in the written words of others when they so much as even approach an idea you disagree with, you totally fumble the ball when you respond. Just pick the ball up and keep running.

If you feel insulted, learn to read better.

[ProfMac]

I want to read the background on the BTC loss.  What are some links to those threads & announcements?

In particular, I wonder how many BTC were lost, and I wonder what discussions did occur about selling the debt between individuals.

[SpottedMarley]

I want to read the background on the BTC loss.  What are some links to those threads & announcements?

In particular, I wonder how many BTC were lost, and I wonder what discussions did occur about selling the debt between individuals.

I actually would too. It was last year when I did what little research I did before signing up at Bitfloor so the hard facts are difficult to remember for me.

There should be a wikipedia entry on it by now, no? haha

[Rassah]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=105818

[johnblaze]

in other news

my IAFCU account is set up, the lady called. i now need to deposit the $15. today i received my debit card in the mail, however i haven't yet put any money in yet

actually, i have no idea what my PIN number for this debit card is

[SpottedMarley]

in other news

my IAFCU account is set up, the lady called. i now need to deposit the $15. today i received my debit card in the mail, however i haven't yet put any money in yet

actually, i have no idea what my PIN number for this debit card is

I used their click-to-send method for depositing a check for $20 .. must be almost a week ago now.. but it has not showed up in my account yet. hasnt been cashed either. I have been figuring they might be swamped with all this so i havent contacted them yet to check on it.. i'll probably call them today to make sure they have it.. thanks for reminding me

[ProfMac]

in other news

my IAFCU account is set up, the lady called. i now need to deposit the $15. today i received my debit card in the mail, however i haven't yet put any money in yet

actually, i have no idea what my PIN number for this debit card is

The pin number will be mailed two days after the card is mailed.  This is a standard security measure, so the same mail thief doesn't get both.

[Joe200]

Anyone get their money out of bitfloor yet?

I've set up a IAFCU account. Now what?

On the bitfloor website, there is nowhere to specify my account number. I get an error when requesting a withdrawal.

[SpottedMarley]

Anyone get their money out of bitfloor yet?

I've set up a IAFCU account. Now what?

On the bitfloor website, there is nowhere to specify my account number. I get an error when requesting a withdrawal.

Nobody has gotten their money yet, the most recent notice on bitfloor.com explains when refunds should start being processed.

From what I've heard, people started getting that error you're referring to a few days ago.

My only guess is that those web pages are so highly advanced that it probably takes Roman a really long time to figure out why a form won't submit.

[village.idiot]

You really think Roman is trying to figure it out?!

[SpottedMarley]

You really think Roman is trying to figure it out?!

and here i was thinking my sarcasm was sufficiently thick

no, i dont think he is. i think he's probably out rollerblading

[village.idiot]

Keep in mind, I'm an idiot

[SpottedMarley]

Keep in mind, I'm an idiot

haha.. my dry sarcasm comes from the fact that i work professionally as a web application developer.. so when i see a web site display a fatal error in a production environment i really expect it to get cleared up as soon as somebody reports it to the admin of the site.. from what ive heard people have been reporting this particular error for days.. so it must be a reeeeeeally reeeeeally tough one to figure out... *disappointing laugh*

[village.idiot]

I've reported it twice since over a week ago and never received any response.
I've come to the conclusion that there is no support@bitfloor.com
I hope IAFCU will take care of the little people too in this whole operation

[Rassah]

What's really scary is that the size of the staff at Bitfloor is about the same as the size of the staff at Blockchain.info

[SpottedMarley]

What's really scary is that the size of the staff at Bitfloor is about the same as the size of the staff at Blockchain.info

Do you know how many people are working for Roman?

I have been under the impression for a while now that Roman is the only person working for Bitfloor anymore, in essence, he IS bitfloor

..and if you follow his twitter account he's out and about having a great time like a guy without a care in the world .. he's in Atlanta right now

and the guy is a programmer. a serious programmer. who can't fix his own web site

actually he can, he just does not give a fuck

[village.idiot]

Thanks for clarifying for me with that last line