CryptoKingdom Uncensored

[generalizethis]

May be interested in this. I am assuming any death is only in this game? We don't die in Ultima or anything?

What happens in the grid, stays in the grid

[Vigens]

From what date afterwards will be deposits refunded if the game will stop?
I deposited 100xmr during this crash.

I see that you deposited XMR (M3) and sold it for M. The M3 amount that exists in-game represents the balance of XMR deposited, so only M3 can be withdrawn for XMR.

Code:

452015	Buy	M3	2,496	Vigens (1092)	Ezra (1055)	ASK_110374	28.04.17 (08:18)	0	View
452013	Buy	M3	2,500	Vigens (1092)	Ezra (1055)	ASK_110375	28.04.17 (08:18)	0	View
452011	Buy	M3	2,500	Vigens (1092)	Ezra (1055)	ASK_110376	28.04.17 (08:18)	0	View
452009	Buy	M3	2,500	Vigens (1092)	Ezra (1055)	ASK_110377	28.04.17 (08:18)	0	View
451765	Create	M3	9,996	New (5)	Vigens (1092)		28.04.17 (06:33)	deposit

Ok cheers! Makes sense yes. I just saw from some earlier post that deposits will be refunded.

[generalizethis]

20,000 CKG Bounty

--20,000 CKG to create and manage a CKG asset and get that asset listed on a reputable exchange.

[boomboom]

20,000 CKG Bounty

--20,000 CKG to create and manage a CKG asset and get that asset listed on a reputable exchange.

Why not use 'M' instead of CKG, that way all problems with deposit shares and depositories would be done away with, players deposit/withdrawal through the reputable exchange.

[kidjim]

We would like to have 4 players to start, additional players will be charged 100mil entrance fee. Fees will be added to bag of M.

Game Board:

10x10 grid with one portal and 1 bag of M.

I'm in! 

[generalizethis]

20,000 CKG Bounty

--20,000 CKG to create and manage a CKG asset and get that asset listed on a reputable exchange.

Why not use 'M' instead of CKG, that way all problems with deposit shares and depositories would be done away with, players deposit/withdrawal through the reputable exchange.

Because: "Golden Rule"

You are more than welcome to make a bounty for M as a exchange asset--though I have a few arguments as to why that is a bad idea. Namely when there is a huge run to the exchange and prices spiral downward due to deflation. All the sudden the house you spent 10mil on is worth 100,000. The reverse could also happen as fast, because you are increasing the volatility by adding money supply changes into the game mechanics.

[boomboom]

20,000 CKG Bounty

--20,000 CKG to create and manage a CKG asset and get that asset listed on a reputable exchange.

Why not use 'M' instead of CKG, that way all problems with deposit shares and depositories would be done away with, players deposit/withdrawal through the reputable exchange.

Because: "Golden Rule"

You are more than welcome to make a bounty for M as a exchange asset--though I have a few arguments as to why that is a bad idea. Namely when there is a huge run to the exchange and prices spiral downward due to deflation. All the sudden the house you spent 10mil on is worth 100,000. The reverse could also happen as fast, because you are increasing the volatility by adding money supply changes into the game mechanics.

What's the relevance of the 'Golden Rule'  , "treat others as you would have them treat you" ... I don't understand that reference?

If you put M on a blockchain there would be a one-time movement of money out of the CK DB into the exchange(s), then you'd have a setup where:

money supply = cash + exchange deposits

and that would still be fixed, so I don't think the valuation effects you anticipate would happen, the ratio of 'cash' to 'exchange deposits' would settle down eventually, as it does for most other traded crypto tokens.

Looks like there is trouble finding someone to escrow depository deposits now, and putting 'M' on a blockchain would solve that, and it wouldn't slow down CK Agora trading, so user experience would feel the same as using a regular exchange - make a 'slow' deposit, trade as fast as the trading engine can handle, make a slow withdrawal.

If you put CKG on a blockchain, you've got dividend problem to deal with, and you haven't solved the lack of entry/exit ramps problem.

edit: I would:
- revalue 'M' down to 1Billion
- change the name to 'CK dollars'
- take a snapshot of balances
- create the blockchain genesis block
- destroy old markka balances
- setup interface between CK and blockchain
- open deposits/withdrawals back into CK for 'CK dollars'
- list 'CK dollars' on a regular exchange

edit 2: if you used NXT monetary system for the blockchain solution you do away with anyone needing to run blockchain software, players just use a NXT wallet for cold storage if they want, but that would be optional. Most would use CK + exchange, some would use CK only, speculators would use exchange and/or NXT cold storage -- lots of flexibility, and many exchanges already list loads of NXT MS tokens, so getting listed on exchanges would be trivial.

edit 3: if you did the above CK money supply would become:

money supply = cash in CK + exchange deposits + blockchain balances

and money supply is fixed, and relative proportions between the three would settle down, and to the extent that they would change ... well, that would mimic the 'real world' and adds to the 'fun', volatility between CK cash/exchange deposits/blockchain balances adds realism, and opportunities for the bold & brave etc etc

[generalizethis]

Golden Rule: He who has the gold makes the rules.

Also, CKG would have entry/exit point as gold would be burned/created as it exited/entered the game. BUT you wouldn't see the money supply get jacked up or down based on exchange demand.

But feel free to create your own bounty, based on your own opinions of what's best.

[boomboom]

Golden Rule: He who has the gold makes the rules.

Ok, understood. What I outlined is a major restructure, so couldn't be done unless the gold holders voted on it, so a bounty isn't possible unless CKG holders voted in favour first.

[boomboom]

BUT you wouldn't see the money supply get jacked up or down based on exchange demand.

Money supply is fixed, and unless risto does another revaluation it would presumably stay that way. What you're alluding to is possible liquidity implications if players moved 'money' around in large volumes at the same time which changed the relative proportions of the components of the FIXED money supply. I actually see that as a good thing, it's more realistic, and it adds opportunities for better risk:reward game play.

[generalizethis]

BUT you wouldn't see the money supply get jacked up or down based on exchange demand.

Money supply is fixed, and unless risto does another revaluation it would presumably stay that way. What you're alluding to is possible liquidity implications if players moved 'money' around in large volumes at the same time which changed the relative proportions of the components of the FIXED money supply. I actually see that as a good thing, it's more realistic, and it adds opportunities for better risk:reward game play.

I don't want my game money volatile, the same way I don't want my cash or debit card going wonky (have you ever been paid a wage in crypto--it sucks having to wait for the market to rebound so you can pay rent)--nations crumble with this economic model--so better to have volatility in assets than in the money supply. There's a reason no one would base an economy on Microsoft shares.

And if risto came back, after paying his debts (of course), yes, he would likely start playing with the money supply and ruining the exchange asset the same way he did last time one was created based on the ck asset.

You're free to disagree, but I have heard these arguments before and created the bounty based on what I believe is best for the game. Namely, a way to protect gold from an army just ripping it out of your hands like I just did to risto.

[boomboom]

BUT you wouldn't see the money supply get jacked up or down based on exchange demand.

Money supply is fixed, and unless risto does another revaluation it would presumably stay that way. What you're alluding to is possible liquidity implications if players moved 'money' around in large volumes at the same time which changed the relative proportions of the components of the FIXED money supply. I actually see that as a good thing, it's more realistic, and it adds opportunities for better risk:reward game play.

I don't want my game money volatile, the same way I don't want my cash or debit card going wonky (have you ever been paid a wage in crypto--it sucks having to wait for the market to rebound so you can pay rent)--nations crumble with this economic model--so better to have volatility in assets than in the money supply. There's a reason no one would base an economy on Microsoft shares.

And if risto came back, after paying his debts (of course), yes, he would likely start playing with the money supply and ruining the exchange asset the same way he did last time one was created based on the ck asset.

You're free to disagree, but I have heard these arguments before and created the bounty based on what I believe is best for the game. Namely, a way to protect gold from an army just ripping it out of your hands like I just did to risto.

The money supply is FIXED, any volatility would be in asset prices like CKG, real estate, and commodities like CAN, food, wine, and that's how real life works, and that presents opportunities for trading, and risk:reward.

Getting paid in crypto is a bad example because the problem you're referring too happens because you earn in one currency and spend in another. If you put M on the blockchain you earn in M and spend in M, just like most people now earn in fiat and spend in fiat. My national fiat currency has lost 25% of value in the last 3 years against the USD, but nobody notices because a loaf of bread and carton of milk is the same price in our local fiat currency, so who cares that a loaf of bread in USD is more expensive (i.e I don't have to buy more expensive USD to buy bread, I pay in my local currency), we don't use USD.

If the currency of CK is M, there will be no volatility in the Game currency itself, only 'liquidity' changes, and that's GOOD lol

The game needs a working on/off ramp more than anything else, and putting M on the blockchain instantly solves that, and if you think logically about the consequences there is a one-off change that alters liquidity (i.e. 100% of M is not in cash only, some will be on exchanges, some on the blockchain), then it settles down, and subsequent volatility in prices of assets/commodities due to liquidity changes becomes part of the ecosystem that attracts players.


But, as you rightly point out it's the CKG holders who should decide what to do from here to save the game.

[generalizethis]

You're free to hit up Loaf to create an M exchange asset as that's been his dream for some time, BUT be prepared for a big dose of "I told you so" if that plan ever comes to fruition.

And no, no where in the rules does it say that the M money supply is fixed. Risto's doubling events are active proof of this fact.

[generalizethis]

20,000 CKG Bounty

--20,000 CKG to create and manage a CKG asset and get that asset listed on a reputable exchange.

^This is a bounty, not an argument.

Anyone is free to create their own bounties, rather than argue the formation of mine.

I created this bounty as I want my assets, like ckg, to have an optional security measure of being burnt to a wallet--though I also think that CKG will make a good exchange asset.

[boomboom]

I ask the CKG holders to consider having a vote on my plan below:

- revalue 'M' down to 1Billion
- change the name to 'CK dollars'
- take a snapshot of balances
- create the blockchain genesis block
- destroy old markka balances
- setup interface between CK and blockchain
- open deposits/withdrawals back into CK for 'CK dollars'
- list 'CK dollars' on a regular exchange

If the vote was successful, then I would try and raise a bounty from donations (suggest a small tax on all M balances), but as this is a major structural change to the game, it can't be done independently by way of a private bounty, like HMC's CKG/blockchain proposal.

I'm not looking for an argument, more trying to offer suggestions for a constructive debate on how to save CK. If' it's possible, have a vote.

[generalizethis]

We would like to have 4 players to start, additional players will be charged 100mil entrance fee. Fees will be added to bag of M.

Game Board:

10x10 grid with one portal and 1 bag of M.

I'm in! 

That's two, tombot and kidjim--we have two more free spots open.

[Scrotum]

I ask the CKG holders to consider having a vote on my plan below:

- revalue 'M' down to 1Billion
- change the name to 'CK dollars'
- take a snapshot of balances
- create the blockchain genesis block
- destroy old markka balances
- setup interface between CK and blockchain
- open deposits/withdrawals back into CK for 'CK dollars'
- list 'CK dollars' on a regular exchange

If the vote was successful, then I would try and raise a bounty from donations (suggest a small tax on all M balances), but as this is a major structural change to the game, it can't be done independently by way of a private bounty, like HMC's CKG/blockchain proposal.

I'm not looking for an argument, more trying to offer suggestions for a constructive debate on how to save CK. If' it's possible, have a vote.

Your plan might be a good one, but not likely to succeed if a vote is required, too many vested interests now. A better option is using CKG as the on/off ramp and doing away with depo shares entirely.

[boomboom]

I ask the CKG holders to consider having a vote on my plan below:

- revalue 'M' down to 1Billion
- change the name to 'CK dollars'
- take a snapshot of balances
- create the blockchain genesis block
- destroy old markka balances
- setup interface between CK and blockchain
- open deposits/withdrawals back into CK for 'CK dollars'
- list 'CK dollars' on a regular exchange

If the vote was successful, then I would try and raise a bounty from donations (suggest a small tax on all M balances), but as this is a major structural change to the game, it can't be done independently by way of a private bounty, like HMC's CKG/blockchain proposal.

I'm not looking for an argument, more trying to offer suggestions for a constructive debate on how to save CK. If' it's possible, have a vote.

Your plan might be a good one, but not likely to succeed if a vote is required, too many vested interests now. A better option is using CKG as the on/off ramp and doing away with depo shares entirely.

Yes, you just have to look at eth and bitcoin prices to see the price effect on the 'ramp tokens' for ICO and alt coin markets generally, so if HMC's CKG bounty is successful you'd expect the price of CKG would benefit, but I'd argue there's less distortion if that valuation effect travelled through the game currency M.

I do concede that a CKG blockchain asset traded on a reputable exchange might make depo shares redundant, so if HMC's bounty is successful it would be unambiguously better than the current situation.

[bv68bot]

I do concede that a CKG blockchain asset traded on a reputable exchange might make depo shares redundant, so if HMC's bounty is successful it would be unambiguously better than the current situation.

There's nothing wrong with having both depo shares AND CKG traded on external exchanges at the same time, the thing is to get any on/off ramp up and running before people lose interest in CK all together.

Depo shares maybe forever tainted by risto's actions, so a blockchain asset is probably more acceptable now IMO, and CKG comes with a bounty that doesn't require taxing people, or changing any rules, so it looks the best candidate.

[Scrotum]

Depo shares maybe forever tainted by risto's actions, so a blockchain asset is probably more acceptable now IMO, and CKG comes with a bounty that doesn't require taxing people, or changing any rules, so it looks the best candidate.

+1
Concentrate resources and effort on getting CKG listed on an exchange, if HMC/KING is in favour and prepared to pay a bounty to see it happen it's the way to go, depository shares require committed escrow which isn't available anyway.

I really want to invest in CK, and would be happy to buy CKG on an exchange.