Marketplace trust

[theymos]

Now that people are starting to get green trust, in a week or two I will make it so people with 0 trust have yellow trust text instead of black.

If you don't want yellow/red trust, you need to get people to rate you positively now. It takes a month for your first positive rating to give you any trust.

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[Matthew N. Wright]

Now that people are starting to get green trust, in a week or two I will make it so people with 0 trust have yellow trust text instead of black.

If you don't want yellow/red trust, you need to get people to rate you positively now. It takes a month for your first positive rating to give you any trust.

That's cute and all, but when does the real reputation/trust system go live? You know, the one with in-line rebuttals to spam and libel by sockpuppets and blackmailers that people continue to take seriously despite your short sighted opinion?

[TomUnderSea]

Now that people are starting to get green trust, in a week or two I will make it so people with 0 trust have yellow trust text instead of black.

If you don't want yellow/red trust, you need to get people to rate you positively now. It takes a month for your first positive rating to give you any trust.

Wait, what?  At the least, I would expect a 0 trust rating to be neutral in value, not negative.

So now, in order to not be viewed with distrust I need to go around and beg folks to rate me?  Should I set up arbitrary exchanges of coin so that I can gain positive ratings?  

I would sooner post a bond with John K. than run around doing a collection of small transactions to build a trust rating.  I would be suspicious of someone who does a series of small transactions with the goal of gaining trust ratings.  I definitely expect anyone else would be suspicious of such activity.  It basically is the leading edge of a con or scam to create trust with small transactions before pulling the big scam.

[Rawted]

I primarily do all of my deals through otc, and thus use the wot, however i figured i would test out the new trust system with a recent deal i did here on the forums. I had a gentleman buy a gpu off me. I added my trust rating for him and it immediately showed the +1 on his profile, however when he left his trust for me, nothing  but the trust comment shows up. Did we mess something up?

[TomUnderSea]

I primarily do all of my deals through otc, and thus use the wot, however i figured i would test out the new trust system with a recent deal i did here on the forums. I had a gentleman buy a gpu off me. I added my trust rating for him and it immediately showed the +1 on his profile, however when he left his trust for me, nothing  but the trust comment shows up. Did we mess something up?

You have to add him to your trust list.

[Rawted]

I primarily do all of my deals through otc, and thus use the wot, however i figured i would test out the new trust system with a recent deal i did here on the forums. I had a gentleman buy a gpu off me. I added my trust rating for him and it immediately showed the +1 on his profile, however when he left his trust for me, nothing  but the trust comment shows up. Did we mess something up?

You have to add him to your trust list.

thank you. I was just coming back to post that i figured it out. For some reason the mechanism that displays the list and the field to add your own wasnt showing on my note 10.

[theymos]

Wait, what?  At the least, I would expect a 0 trust rating to be neutral in value, not negative.

No. People who haven't done any trades (as far as the trust system knows) are dangerous.

[bernard75]

Wait, what?  At the least, I would expect a 0 trust rating to be neutral in value, not negative.

+1 Why would you put everybody under general suspicion?

People who haven't done any trades (as far as the trust system knows) are dangerous.

Tafuq? Must be an American thing.

[TomUnderSea]

Wait, what?  At the least, I would expect a 0 trust rating to be neutral in value, not negative.

No. People who haven't done any trades (as far as the trust system knows) are dangerous.

These seems like a really effective way to grow the bitcoin market.

</sarcasm>

[theymos]

Why would you put everybody under general suspicion?

General suspicion the proper attitude if you don't want to get scammed.

[TomUnderSea]

Wait, what?  At the least, I would expect a 0 trust rating to be neutral in value, not negative.

+1 Why would you put everybody under general suspicion?

People who haven't done any trades (as far as the trust system knows) are dangerous.

Tafuq? Must be an American thing.

No.  Looks like a theymos thing. 

This American does not agree with the no trades == dangerous idea.

[bernard75]

General suspicion the proper attitude if you don't want to get scammed.

Sure, but not everybody comes here to trade.
And they are labeled as scammers by default by you.

[TomUnderSea]

Why would you put everybody under general suspicion?

General suspicion the proper attitude if you don't want to get scammed.

So you are attempting to claim that your Trust system will prevent people from getting scammed?

Given what I have seen of it so far, I think it has a horrible Signal to Noise ratio.

You have a default trust list that includes some rather disreputable individuals.  You don't allow any method of rebuttal for a negative trust rating.  Now you are branding anyone who has not traded as "suspicious".

At this point, I'm less than thrilled with your experiment.  I don't mind having to prove who I am to someone I intend to trade with.  I take great offense at your arbitrary and totally unwarranted branding of me as "suspicious" for no reason what so ever.

enough said

[Rawted]

General suspicion the proper attitude if you don't want to get scammed.

Sure, but not everybody comes here to trade.
And they are labeled as scammers by default by you.

They are not being labeled as scammers at all. Yellow means caution and signals that you should be apprehensive about trading with them, as they dont have any verifiable trades. It also means they havent done any bad trades or scams either.

[Korbman]

Why would you put everybody under general suspicion?

General suspicion the proper attitude if you don't want to get scammed.

Unfortunately I agree, at least in the case of Bitcoin. You're quite a bit better off being suspicious of users until they can prove themselves "trustworthy" (and reaching that point is different for everyone).

Now that people are starting to get green trust, in a week or two I will make it so people with 0 trust have yellow trust text instead of black.

If you don't want yellow/red trust, you need to get people to rate you positively now. It takes a month for your first positive rating to give you any trust.

Quick question(s) on this (and maybe it's been answered): Anyone without a 'trusted' rating will automatically be 'yellow' from my perspective?
For example, CanaryInTheMine has numerous successful trades ..but should I see his account, it would still show 'yellow' simply because I haven't trusted the same set of users?

[theymos]

Quick question(s) on this (and maybe it's been answered): Anyone without a 'trusted' rating will automatically be 'yellow' from my perspective?
For example, CanaryInTheMine has numerous successful trades ..but should I see his account, it would still show 'yellow' simply because I haven't trusted the same set of users?

It'll be yellow if his trust score ("Trust: 0") is 0. This is calculated based on the number and type of trusted ratings (from your perspective) as well as time.

[Korbman]

Quick question(s) on this (and maybe it's been answered): Anyone without a 'trusted' rating will automatically be 'yellow' from my perspective?
For example, CanaryInTheMine has numerous successful trades ..but should I see his account, it would still show 'yellow' simply because I haven't trusted the same set of users?

It'll be yellow if his trust score ("Trust: 0") is 0. This is calculated based on the number and type of trusted ratings (from your perspective) as well as time.

Ah, that's what I figured. Thanks for the clarification.

[Matthew N. Wright]

Why would you put everybody under general suspicion?

General suspicion the proper attitude if you don't want to get scammed.

Unfortunately I agree, at least in the case of Bitcoin. You're quite a bit better off being suspicious of users until they can prove themselves "trustworthy" (and reaching that point is different for everyone).

Now that people are starting to get green trust, in a week or two I will make it so people with 0 trust have yellow trust text instead of black.

If you don't want yellow/red trust, you need to get people to rate you positively now. It takes a month for your first positive rating to give you any trust.

Quick question(s) on this (and maybe it's been answered): Anyone without a 'trusted' rating will automatically be 'yellow' from my perspective?
For example, CanaryInTheMine has numerous successful trades ..but should I see his account, it would still show 'yellow' simply because I haven't trusted the same set of users?

Rather than bark at you for being absolutely wrong, I'll simply explain the difference of rational fear, common sense and safe trading precautions versus assumption of distrust. Theymos is intending to create a society here of even *more* distrust than we already have all while claiming that we, the people, are irrational. Seems like the same tactics governments use to confuse us against each other and ignore what's happening in the background. If Theymos had a shred of integrity, he would not create a reputation system that doesn't allow a person the right to respond to accusations. I don't even need to warn people of what awful direction this leads us to, all I have to say is I'm not supporting it at all.

[TomUnderSea]

So....

I am using the "Trust" system to indicate who I trust and who I don't trust. 

If I have a fiduciary dealing with them, I put feedback on their page.

If I trust them, they go on my "Trust List".  I vary the depth of that list from 0 to 3 to see who they trust. 

If I don't trust them, I put feedback on their page with a link to the post(s) and a note as to why I do not trust them.


This, of course, is visible to everyone else.  It has, of course, started to generate reciprocal feedback.



What a wonderful system this "Trust" thing is.

/sarcasm

[Chuck]

I like that untrusted feedback is hidden,

but please make "Show ratings" stick out more - when you skim the page, it is too easy to miss. Perhaps a button widget would be better?