[BitFunder] IceDrill.ASIC IPO (235 Thash Mining Operation powered by HashFast)

[Vycid]

However, dependent on the risk/reward schemes the difference between 0.0015 and 0.0016 can be a significant difference for private shareholders, while it is less than 10% for public shareholders. Unfortunately only DeaDTerra and team members can evaluate the fairness of such an adjustment without disclosing more information about the funding structure.

Are we really entertaining the notion that there is any situation in which the breach of terms in a good-faith contract is more "fair" than the execution of those terms? (barring the good-faith agreement of all parties involved)

The private shareholders are not inherently entitled to any particular profits. They are entitled to what was specified in the IPO contract. The relative magnitude of the effect on public shareholders is not relevant. What kind of precedent is being set here?

[1715535680]

1715535680

[Jutarul]

The private shareholders are not inherently entitled to any particular profits. They are entitled to what was specified in the IPO contract. The relative magnitude of the effect on public shareholders is not relevant. What kind of precedent is being set here?

There is nothing wrong with adjusting the contract as long as everybody agrees. However, the unilateral nature of this change is not justified and there doesn't seem to be consensus. DeaDTerra needs to have a stronger case to propose a change like that. Otherwise this indeed sets a terrible precedent of fudging the contract and undermines the trust in this security.

[molecular]

I too made purchases and calculations specifically with the promise of 0.0016 in mind.

I bet those were pretty advanced calculations.

People talk about "promise" and "guarantee"... what kind of mindset is this? We're all taking a huge risk. Investing here is basically a gamble. Not because the operators could change the contract slightly, but because the delivery schedule and difficulty development carry so much uncertainty.

My guess is that in the end, it wont matter much wether it's 0.0015 or 0.0016... one way or the other.

Also to defend the change a bit: Private investors were taking a larger risk already and now they have to skip on the lions share of the potential profits? Cut them some slack. They might've bought the shares for much lower than the initial IPO price of 0.0014, but they more likely than not have sunk their money into a hole where it's not going to come back out for either ever or a long time.

[DeaDTerra]

We will take all your feedback into consideration as per usual.
I am sure we can work through this so that both public and private share holders are happy

//DeaDTerra

[bittymitty]

Does this mean that the private investors are not so confident of getting their money back?  What do they know that the public does not?

[iCEBREAKER]

I too made purchases and calculations specifically with the promise of 0.0016 in mind.

I bet those were pretty advanced calculations.

Zing!  Lol molecular, remind me to tread lightly if I ever find you and myself not agreeing.  

I like how people are acting stupid and pretending to not understand the obvious valid points on both sides, preferring to babble about "spirits" in general instead of what's reasonable in this particular dilemma.

If IceDrill has hurt your feelings, by daring to propose a change which may be interpreted as an entailment of previous other changes, please sell your shares before mean, terrible IceDrill strikes again!

[sparky999]

You made the clause not us.

All we did was calculate the risk/reward and decide if this is a good investment.

For some people that 6% difference would have been the difference between them buying and not buying.

Personally I bought because I was guaranteed a profit before the private shares got any $$$, not because I thought I was gonna make my money back.


This is how business deals work-

1. contract is outlined and clauses are detailed

2. investors make an analysis of given information

3. they decide to invest or not invest


Did you notice there is no number 4.?? that's because you don't renege on things you promise or you lose credibility. If the spirit of the offer was to ensure money back for investors you should have said that but you didn't you said you will get 0.0016 and everyone got excited cos they were guaranteed a profit and started buying shares.

[iCEBREAKER]

There is a #4, whether sparky999 likes it or not.  Even more devastating to his naivete, there's also a #5!   

4.  Plans come into contact with reality, rubber meets road, shit may hit fan to some degree

5.  Plans are adjusted to eschew invalid assumptions and compensate for actual vs anticipated conditions


If you can't handle that, sell all your IceDrill shares and buy US Savings bonds.

[will]

Hi all

Just to be clear. I was the one who suggested the change from 0.0016 down to 0.0015, not DT. Ludvig actually warned me strongly against very probable backlash, regardless of the size of the change.

In my opinion it was a fair change to make the payback goal slightly more attainable, short term. The spirit of the clause was "gauranteed ROI", not "guaranteed profit" before private shares attain value.

As I represent all investors (public and private) it is my job to make the goals for both sides attainable. We agree that the unilateral change to 0.0015 is wrong contractually, and the "spirit" of it has nothing to do with it.

Following public feedback, the change has been cancelled. The payback clause remains as it was originally: 0.0016 BTC to be paid in dividends (per share) before private shares enter the market.

As it stands, we will suggest further initiatives to make the payback clause more attainable. These will be presented as options to public investors, not unilateral contract changes as with this (now defunct) change.

[Pompobit]

Hello,

I'm planning to invest some in Icedrill.

I read that the deploy of about 300TH/s is supposed to be achieved in last quarter of 2013, presumably in november. Is this currently on schedule or we have to expect some delay to december?

[Dexter770221]

Hello,

I'm planning to invest some in Icedrill.

I read that the deploy of about 300TH/s is supposed to be achieved in last quarter of 2013, presumably in november. Is this currently on schedule or we have to expect some delay to december?

No one knows since HashFast don't have working unit.

[rtt]

DT & will, thanks for listening.

Now.. this also was a thought in the back of my mind as I began the conversation:

Does this mean that the private investors are not so confident of getting their money back?  What do they know that the public does not?

Can the two of you please comment?
Something happened with your calculations that made you concerned about your ROI?

[molecular]

DT & will, thanks for listening.

Now.. this also was a thought in the back of my mind as I began the conversation:

Does this mean that the private investors are not so confident of getting their money back?  What do they know that the public does not?

Can the two of you please comment?
Something happened with your calculations that made you concerned about your ROI?

maybe guaranteeing 0.0016 BTC per share to public investors is the reason?

[will]

Hello,

I'm planning to invest some in Icedrill.

I read that the deploy of about 300TH/s is supposed to be achieved in last quarter of 2013, presumably in november. Is this currently on schedule or we have to expect some delay to december?

Welcome aboard

We're still on target to start mining in November. See: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=269216.msg3267500#msg3267500 for the final numbers. If all goes according to plan we'll start with around 235 Th/s.

[cryptojoe]

Thank you!!!!

[fattypig]

Sorry to say but I don't think this securities is giving out good ROI anymore. The KnC has started to mass produce and ship the KnC Jupiter (576ghs).

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1nhwcw/knc_jupiter_has_begun_shipping_576_ghs/

[zumzero]

KnC's ability to turn orders round very speedily and within the month spells trouble for startups like this unless they can get their act together like, yesterday.

[floatyfish]

Could you guys comment on this KnC development? KnC has obviously over delivered, and could really hurt future profits for you guys. How will Icedrill deal with this increased hash rate? Do you know something about the BabyJets that we don't, for example maybe they will also be closer to 500 GH/S?

[QuiveringGibbage]

<QG> hey DeaDTerra, would you happen to have an insight on what is IceDrill.ASIC's future  deployment strategy after Serria Batch 1 has been fully deployed?

Thanks,
QG

[hd060053]

Can you give us your thoughts on BitFunder.com's closing of U.S. accounts?

Icedrill is not affacted becuase the price was alredy so low before. Also the 355k wall prevented the crash.