BPMC Launch BF1 USB miner - probably the fastest USB miner in the World

[joeventura]

wow 2.1btc?! for 2.5GH?....um....
Can get 11GH for 4btc....

DUH really?

[1714813929]

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[ASIC-K]

sigh....i had high hopes for this one. unwatch.

[jeroenn13]

sigh....i had high hopes for this one. unwatch.

Unwatch and IMO delete topic for disk space.

[Fiyasko]

My gosh
After watching the video, I was seriously, literally, right in the middle of calling my buddy on skype and saying "Hey dude look at this!, we could buy these!" and as it was loading i decided to flip over to the ending page where i saw a few displeased comments, I went to find out why, and the reason is that 5pc minimum, And a 2.1btc price tag.

You cant make a better deal? Nobody will buy these at that rate and the reasons are simple, If anyone had $1400, They wouldnt be buying a USB Stick miner, let alone FIVE of them, anyone would simply order a Much better deal from a differant competitor.

We cant buy ONE, wich is what Majority of USB Stick hashing unit buyers can afford, and the price for one of them is too high in itself.

Im not even intrested anymore.

[joeventura]

Read the stuff in between.

These are first run prototypes.

[console_cowboy]

Well I'm glad the miners look great, shame about the pricing. I can completely understand not being able to purchase a large reel at those higher prices, just to save $30. I also get where you guys are coming from about competition. I'm very hopeful your next batch will be significantly cheaper so I can still get a few to play with. I really enjoy seeing a variety of hardware. Hopefully you can mine with them and make back some BTC to get the next run going! I'm also looking forward to your USB hub plans. That could be quite cool to own even without mining.

yes I guess the only thing I would have done differently is not hype it.

If you knew the price was to be over $100 a GH just say that you offering to sell prototypes at close to cost and for me,
the best way to get rid of these is a deal where I buy them at this price and in October I get a special price on an equal amount at a much better price.


For example, I'd buy 5 @ BTC2.1 each today and you commit to producing more in October and sell me 5 more at BTC0.25 each.

This guy speaks some serious truth. The hyping is what really brought the anger out in people. If you had let it be known they were prototypes with prototype pricing, nobody would have had the expectations they did. I know I was really excited about it, until I saw the price. I am still excited that they will be cheaper in the future. I've ordered a good bit from Barntech, so I don't mind waiting for your miners.

The part about presetting a price for future usb miners is a great idea. If you could offer something like this, I would be much more interested in jumping on your buy. It really depends on if you could make some sort of deal that was really appealing. While I understand your first run pricing, I think there are a few things you can do to make these miners much more palatable.

[coldbreeze16]

lol! The Block Erupter runs .33 Gh/s and now costs .15BTC (considering the max in a GB- AND most importantly people are lining up for those suckers). 8*0.33=2.64GH/s @ 8*0.15=1.2BTC  
And you price these 2.1BTC! And that too at a minimum order of 5. At 10.5BTC I could buy 2 Blades for 8-8.5BTC and 15 Block Erupters. That'll give me more than 25GH/s, plus ASICminer has got local resellers=cheap shipping.

[n01d3x]

Only in the asic world do businesses plan on making their investment back so quickly. In the real world if your business is making money in 2 or 3 years you're doing good. This seems to be accepted in this industry, this has always fascinated me.

[crazyearner]

wow 2.1btc?! for 2.5GH?....um....
Can get 11GH for 4btc....

DUH really?

ya rly Blades 10 to 12 GH for 4BTC

[bobsag3]

I say well done to Big Picture Mining Cooperative for producing this product in the timescale they did. I am quite comfortable with the idea of letting BPMC mine rather than sell. Now they have shown it is possible, I look forward to seeing a second run at (hopefully) a lower price. I don't expect an extreme ROI but a price closer to break even (for us) would be easier to contemplate.

Alas, this thread also shows how easily disappointment can turn to anger.

The reason is that everyone is waiting for a reasonably priced piece of hardware that is ready to ship.  Pricing out of the ballpark for anyone who is reasonable leads to anger because everyone wants to get into the game but doesn't want to get ripped off in the process.  What people said a little ways up is true, you could easily unload every last piece at a price reasonable to market price of BTC as well as ROI expectations.  Selling these at an absurd premium means you'll have less chance of selling them later and can only rely on what mining profit they will provide.

People are angry because at every turn there are opportunities for people to sell hardware for a fair price, however everyone in the BTC hardware sales side of things seems to value their own greed over anything else.  And there is a sucker born every minute, so people will buy with no chance of making their money back.  May as well ask people to send me $100 and I'll send you back $80 once the funds clear, that's about the offer here, except you get hardware alongside it.

That's not the offer here.

My guess is that at BTC2.1 each they are just breaking even on their costs.

It's sort of like the pharmaceutical industry, when you develop a new medication, the first pill costs 1 billion dollars and the second one is 8 cents.

Same here. They had to buy chips at a very expensive price, they did a short run of boards, which means they were probably 10 bucks each and then they had to be assembled.  Circuit design, components, etc it all adds up.

Clearly you can't charge BTC90 for the first one and BTC0.75 for the next one, the cost has to be spread across all of them.

These folks are not flush in cash to where they can have long term vision and plan to build thousands of them and spread the cost across future sales, they have to spread it across what they have in hand. There are no lost leaders, you have to at least break even.


There is no long term vision in Bitcoins, and that is because Bitcoins change daily.

Well in a bushiness you have to spend money to make money. If selling the first (small) batch at a loss enabled them to sell more later for a profit, then that would be taking the long term view.

[bigbeninlondon]

Only in the asic world do businesses plan on making their investment back so quickly. In the real world if your business is making money in 2 or 3 years you're doing good. This seems to be accepted in this industry, this has always fascinated me.

The problem with asics is in a few months they'll be worthless.  So you have to make back your money now or it's never.

[Syke]

You can fix that miscalculation... Sell all your inventory right now at 1BTC. You'll have cash-in-hand again to manufacture the next run. 

Time value of money is important as well. If you mine with all the hardware it will take months to generate income.  You can sell it all now at 1BTC and have capital again to fund the next run.

I think this is the best idea. The cost of the chips is a sunk cost. Maximize your revenue asap. If you mine with them for a few months, you might generate .5 BTC. Sell them immediately for 1 BTC and you'll generate far more revenue. Then buy the new chips at the new lower price and you'll have a profitable product.

[n01d3x]

Only in the asic world do businesses plan on making their investment back so quickly. In the real world if your business is making money in 2 or 3 years you're doing good. This seems to be accepted in this industry, this has always fascinated me.

The problem with asics is in a few months they'll be worthless.  So you have to make back your money now or it's never.

Maybe on that one design, but then you get better cheaper chips and move on. Yes the companies need to make profit, but so do customers. They are selling a product that is meant to make a profit. If that never happens they won't have customers for long.

[easynote]

2.1 btc? you are crazy

[BigJon901]

Someone has to buy some...I mean, people are buying ASICS that will never profit. It's funny to see people buy tons of asicminer USBs thinking that just because they have more than 1 it changes the ROI  .

[nachius]

I just sat and ready EVERY page and EVERY comment on this thread.  It appears a WHOLE lot of individuals did not.

BPMC stated their price, their requirements, and were up front with everything asked of them.

Will this product ROI at 2.1 BTC?  Probably not, Will a BE ROI at .15 BTC?  Probably not.  ROI is a concern to most miners, but not the argument here in my mind, but execution and as of the post stating they are ready to ship they have executed.

They have taken an idea to market in a very short time.  To do so has it's costs and they have READY TO SHIP PROOF that their COOP can execute.  Many may not like the price, but at the end of the day they did something MANY other companies have not even been able to do is bring a product to market that is ready to ship when they say it is without preorders.  The product from a USB perspective is a far superior product to anything currently readily available on the market so comparing it to a BE which is what is being done is only partially fair.

I own a handful of BEs.  I paid around $150 each for my first 3, I paid $50 for my 4th, and my next 7 will be here tomorrow for around $130 combined.  Will those ever ROI I doubt it and understand that fact.  Everyone buying BEs today should realize that even with free power, shipping, and a cost of .1 BTC or under there is a slim chance if any to break even if you had the device in hand tomorrow.  I am excited to see more products come to market and continue to support Bitcoin and the community as a whole.  I can't afford to purchase these now, but I don't understand everyone hating on an organization so much?  If you don't want to buy at this price don't it's really simple to understand.  They already said they will mine with them if they don't sell, great that helps us all keeping a distributed secure network that will continue to grow.

If you want to throw some math into the observation VERY QUICK NUMBERS:
1 BF1 - 2.1 BTC shipped each (minimum order does not matter as this could be group purchased etc.)  This uses 1 port in a USB hub at 2.5 GHash
8 BEs - around 1.27 BTC shipped at around .15 each, requirement of 8 ports at around .031 BTC cost per port (Dlink 7 port/6 useable at $26ish each) or an additional cost of .25 BTC total: 1.52 BTC

Is the electricity cost and port density on your hub worth the additional .5-.6 BTC?  That's for you to decide, but it has it's benefits and in the grand scheme of taking everything into consideration of setup and configuration 1 USB is easier to operate, setup, and maintain than 8.  Overall it is a better product at a higher price tag for the FIRST RUN of the product.  We can only assume the price will come down as the component cost comes down, but as we all know the Bitcoin game is a rat race with ever increasing difficulty recently that is difficult for the average person mining to stay ahead of.  I mine and participate because I fully support the idea and really enjoy Bitcoin and the people for the most part they are in general very helpful.  I do take into consideration ROI in hopes that I don't completely throw all my money away, but at the end of the day I enjoy it and will continue to participate as much as I can.  I know many are in the same boat, but there are different levels.

Those that are in it JUST to make money
Those that are in it to SUPPORT and secure the network
Those that are in it to SUPPORT it as a currency
Those that are in it to make a quick buck
Those that are just curious and want to see what it is about
Those that are combinations of all or some of the above

Recap, price announced, reasons given and defended with alternative to not selling.  I may not like the price, but I'm not going to bash a group that appears to be doing good things for the community and is actually able to deliver products to us that is superior to anything comparable on the market today.

/end rant

[miter_myles]

::word vomit::

/end rant

Which is all fine and dandy.. however, this product was sort of "hyped" to a very "blunt" community and with that don't be surprised when said community provides comments and feedback on it - positive AND negative..

[xstr8guy]

wow 2.1btc?! for 2.5GH?....um....
Can get 11GH for 4btc....

DUH really?

ya rly Blades 10 to 12 GH for 4BTC

And the Blades use about 10 times the electricity that the Bitfury chips use.

[nachius]

::word vomit::

/end rant

Which is all fine and dandy.. however, this product was sort of "hyped" to a very "blunt" community and with that don't be surprised when said community provides comments and feedback on it - positive AND negative..

I understand that and everyone is entitled to say what they want, this was a hyped product, am I disappointed about the price sure.  This community is a great one that speaks their minds that of a primarily very intelligent group of individuals.  For those that come and post their arguments with supporting thoughts and facts that is great and I fully support that.  There is a smaller subset of individuals that I notice that just come and bitch and complain,  This is the internet so their will always be trolls feedback is great for EVERYONE and every company, but the comments I don't think help anyone are the ones like YOU SUCK!

IF I made a comment stating I am disappointed your hyped product was released at what I feel is too high of a price for me to justify buying it because...........(insert justification for opinion here)

I'm not asking everyone to do that nor do I expect that,  I was just stating that some people just come and complain because they can is all with no foundation to their complaints or if they had foundation they didn't state it and it just looks like they are pissed off posting on an internet forum!  

[cdogster]

Recap, price announced, reasons given and defended with alternative to not selling.  I may not like the price, but I'm not going to bash a group that appears to be doing good things for the community and is actually able to deliver products to us that is superior to anything comparable on the market today.

Well said.  I completely agree.

Forums tend to bring out the worst in people.