[CRYPTOSTOCKS] Labcoin Official Thread - Self-Moderated

[MikeyVeez]

Investigation means we goto first prove a scam.  Once deemed illegal, collectors will ensure the funds are returned to us ALL but that's unclear on how I will achieve this.  Collectors fee's are high so its pointless collecting a small amount just from me.

This is still a long way off.  I will discuss collection and how much it costs at a later date.

So to answer your questions.  NO, I have no intention of claiming all the funds for myself or something stupid like that.  That's not legal.  This is a legal approach but not the pussy debt collection avenue.

PS.  I have no obligation to please you guys at all as I have pumped allot into Labcoin and need some back.  That said, its better to claim it all back for all share holders as the costs are reduced and more support is achieved.  We shall discuss this later.

Then this all shareholders can approve of. We'll wait for what your investigation finds.

[1714916521]

1714916521

[MikeyVeez]

This moron is probably waiting for another batch to come in. Just don't understand why he can't just post that instead of waiting how ever long it takes and create chaos like always lol.

[NineLives]

Get a clue. *ALL* those bitcoin denominated securities are illegal. Even asicminer. This has been argued and proven ad nauseam in the relevant stock exchange threads. You dont need any kind of investigation to establish that, the fact they were selling unregistered securities to unsophisticated investors makes it a violation of security regulation in just about any civilized country on this planet, regardless of where labcoin is headquartered (if anywhere) and regardless of where the exchange operates from.

You are correct but bitcoin as a digital product is NOT illegal yet..  Deception and to per-mediate a scam is illegal no matter what the goods are.  I've already looked into this. 

[NineLives]

http://eligius.st/~wizkid057/newstats/userstats.php/17psAW21J4twanAFWmbcd5WdX2pKeX3trm

is back.

[Puppet]

Get a clue. *ALL* those bitcoin denominated securities are illegal. Even asicminer. This has been argued and proven ad nauseam in the relevant stock exchange threads. You dont need any kind of investigation to establish that, the fact they were selling unregistered securities to unsophisticated investors makes it a violation of security regulation in just about any civilized country on this planet, regardless of where labcoin is headquartered (if anywhere) and regardless of where the exchange operates from.

You are correct but bitcoin as a digital product is NOT illegal yet..  Deception and to per-mediate a scam is illegal no matter what the goods are.  I've already looked into this.  

Duh. No one said bitcoin is illegal. But the fact securities are traded for bitcoin instead of dollar, euro's, gold or oil is irrelevant.  The fist thing the SFC will look at is not how labcoin (ab)used the funds, but how they raised them. And they clearly did it in breach of laws all over the world.

BTW. "per-mediating a scam". ROFL.

[crumbs]

Get a clue. *ALL* those bitcoin denominated securities are illegal. Even asicminer. This has been argued and proven ad nauseam in the relevant stock exchange threads. You dont need any kind of investigation to establish that, the fact they were selling unregistered securities to unsophisticated investors makes it a violation of security regulation in just about any civilized country on this planet, regardless of where labcoin is headquartered (if anywhere) and regardless of where the exchange operates from.

You are correct but bitcoin as a digital product is NOT illegal yet..  Deception and to per-mediate a scam is illegal no matter what the goods are.  I've already looked into this. 

It's slightly more complicated.  Unregistered securities & unlicensed exchanges ARE illegal in US, so an analogy would be you buying dope & getting ripped off.  Sort-a a gray area...

[virtualspade]

http://eligius.st/~wizkid057/newstats/userstats.php/17psAW21J4twanAFWmbcd5WdX2pKeX3trm

is back.

yes since yesterday and making 1 BTC/24h when it should be 20Th/s and 37 BTC/24h and sam is paying divs from IPO money.. I just dont see how this can go on any longer.

SAM you need to explain why IPO coins are used for div payments, this was not in the IPO agreement.

[MikeyVeez]

Get a clue. *ALL* those bitcoin denominated securities are illegal. Even asicminer. This has been argued and proven ad nauseam in the relevant stock exchange threads. You dont need any kind of investigation to establish that, the fact they were selling unregistered securities to unsophisticated investors makes it a violation of security regulation in just about any civilized country on this planet, regardless of where labcoin is headquartered (if anywhere) and regardless of where the exchange operates from.

You are correct but bitcoin as a digital product is NOT illegal yet..  Deception and to per-mediate a scam is illegal no matter what the goods are.  I've already looked into this. 

It's slightly more complicated.  Unregistered securities & unlicensed exchanges ARE illegal in US, so an analogy would be you buying dope & getting ripped off.  Sort-a a gray area...

No not a gray area its illegal, the end. 

[JohnyBigs]

I think the course of Action should be wait for Nine's investigation to complete, upon review of the results, these should be the outcomes.

1. There are Labcoin chips and hashers.

     Sam/Fabrizio would immediately be required to post identity and disclose all project information, for it to even be given a thought of continuing.

2. If there is no hardware, or if he fails to disclose all information about the project. Then he must refund all remaining BTC.

These are the only two options, given his track record, I think he has lost all trust of being competent enough to execute such a task, so in reality it seems like we have only one option.

That is a refund of the remaining BTC.

[SebastianJu]

Get a clue. *ALL* those bitcoin denominated securities are illegal. Even asicminer. This has been argued and proven ad nauseam in the relevant stock exchange threads. You dont need any kind of investigation to establish that, the fact they were selling unregistered securities to unsophisticated investors makes it a violation of security regulation in just about any civilized country on this planet, regardless of where labcoin is headquartered (if anywhere) and regardless of where the exchange operates from.

Asicminer is not illegal anymore in china since they paid the investments back.

SAM

could you please explain why 6.233902 BTC from the IPO money was used to pay part of the last divs?

http://blockchain.info/tx/c49f2aa40f15417de3d37c8cf4c3584feb3f1bce739f93b4928a2eb197def239

the money came from same address that was used to pay 2 BTC registration fee at cryptostocks on 2013-10-14 13:20:29

http://blockchain.info/tx/eb30104bbfeda5f73b485d92d43fb12b7421c957b63a13f82047bde7244008e2

SAM why dont you talk to us any more???

I wondered all the time why divs are so similar. Hashing was built slowly over days, it was spiky in the days, had even a day more in between but it was always nearly the same. That strongly looks to me like "made dividends". So this might be one address he paid them from. Though there is the possibility that mining income landed at this address and was paid from there then.

[Puppet]

Asicminer is not illegal anymore in china since they paid the investments back.

Yeah because we all know selling unregistered securities is legal when they are profitable and illegal when they are not. Thats what the law says.

[Alphi]

Get a clue. *ALL* those bitcoin denominated securities are illegal. Even asicminer. This has been argued and proven ad nauseam in the relevant stock exchange threads. You dont need any kind of investigation to establish that, the fact they were selling unregistered securities to unsophisticated investors makes it a violation of security regulation in just about any civilized country on this planet, regardless of where labcoin is headquartered (if anywhere) and regardless of where the exchange operates from.

You are correct but bitcoin as a digital product is NOT illegal yet..  Deception and to per-mediate a scam is illegal no matter what the goods are.  I've already looked into this.  

It's slightly more complicated.  Unregistered securities & unlicensed exchanges ARE illegal in US, so an analogy would be you buying dope & getting ripped off.  Sort-a a gray area...

not really .. in the case of Trendon shavers pyramid scheme.. the SEC put out a warrant on him because there was an expectation from participants that they were investing real money. even though everybody paid using bitcoins. I doubt the hongkong investment laws would be any different.. a scam is a scam is a scam .. regardless of whether they are trading in virtual goods, fake goods.. or real goods some retail investors will suffer real financial hardship therefore causing the the case to fall under the jurisdiction of the relevant securities authority.
 
I would be really worried if I was a foreign business man scamming people from china. If the law doesn't catch up with you the underworld will.. BTCGarden had to pull their IPO and Avalon have had real difficulties with pressure from corrupt business people using underhanded tactics.

[Bitcycle]

Again, a refund of "remaining" BTC is not sufficient.

We have no record whatsoever of any money being spent, so the the only safe assumption is that any "missing" money has merely been relocated to another wallet under Fabrzio's control.

Thus the only satisfactory refund would be of all 7000 BTC.

As we also have no record indicating the company has been transfered to a "Sam Noi", it's still Fabrizio Tatti who is responsible for this 7000 BTC sum.

[Bitcycle]

I'll be posting a guest account for ghash.io soon.  We have switched to daily dividends and the next will be out as soon as the transaction gets 6 confirmations on cryptostocks.

[Bitcycle]

We will have 5 TH/s up and running later today, 8 TH/s online by saturday and will reach 11-12 on tuesday according to our estimates.

[superduh]

ya it's almost the end of october. we were promised real things by sam. he needs to deliver, prove it and communicate. i think patience is about to run out for most people

[auto2nr1]

ya it's almost the end of october. we were promised real things by sam. he needs to deliver, prove it and communicate. i think patience is about to run out for most people

+1

I think we have run out of patience already. Let's move forward and take some kind of action.

[crumbs]

Get a clue. *ALL* those bitcoin denominated securities are illegal. Even asicminer. This has been argued and proven ad nauseam in the relevant stock exchange threads. You dont need any kind of investigation to establish that, the fact they were selling unregistered securities to unsophisticated investors makes it a violation of security regulation in just about any civilized country on this planet, regardless of where labcoin is headquartered (if anywhere) and regardless of where the exchange operates from.

You are correct but bitcoin as a digital product is NOT illegal yet..  Deception and to per-mediate a scam is illegal no matter what the goods are.  I've already looked into this.  

It's slightly more complicated.  Unregistered securities & unlicensed exchanges ARE illegal in US, so an analogy would be you buying dope & getting ripped off.  Sort-a a gray area...

not really .. in the case of Trendon shavers pyramid scheme.. the SEC put out a warrant on him because there was an expectation from participants that they were investing real money. even though everybody paid using bitcoins. I doubt the hongkong investment laws would be any different.. a scam is a scam is a scam .. regardless of whether they are trading in virtual goods, fake goods.. or real goods some retail investors will suffer real financial hardship therefore causing the the case to fall under the jurisdiction of the relevant securities authority.

Yeah.  My drug deal analogy holds.  The dealer gets to ride in the party van, but the buyer still doesn't get his money back. Or, rather, he may or may not, depending on the mood of the clowns in the van.

The clowns are capricious, picking and choosing amongst the multitude of laws which are simultaneously run afoul of here.  They often wish to chat with the parties involved, and peruse their financials -- something which may not be attractive to everyone.  Something along those lines.

[MikeyVeez]

Again, a refund of "remaining" BTC is not sufficient.

We have no record whatsoever of any money being spent, so the the only safe assumption is that any "missing" money has merely been relocated to another wallet under Fabrzio's control.

Thus the only satisfactory refund would be of all 7000 BTC.

As we also have no record indicating the company has been transfered to a "Sam Noi", it's still Fabrizio Tatti who is responsible for this 7000 BTC sum.

Remaining accounted for BTC. They have to show documented amounts that were spent and on what, if they cant then the full amount. At least my understanding. But they will never be able to refund 7000btc if they spent some already.

[Bitcycle]

This thread is reserved for official communication only. We want to avoid the noise. If you want to rant, please do so in the other thread as usual.

Silence and/or vague promises is no longer an effective strategy, Sam.

The only hope of recovering this situation is to produce a full and open account of exactly where things stand, and to do so immediately.


A detailed response of where every BTC has gone, proof of your ID, photos of the hashers, and an exact, detailed roadmap forward.

This is not something where a few sentences with promises for more in the future is going to work.  If you need to take time off from your day job, then do it.  This is pretty much the last chance to save this operation.

I know you were hoping that paying dividends would silence your critics.  It hasn't worked.  That strategy is no long a possibility.

The only successful path forward involves full openness.