Intellectual Property - In All Fairness!

[Hawker]

If you have a nuke, I to protect myself and my family from the risk it will detonate.  I have to kill you and disarm it.  It does not matter whether or not you intend to use it today.  You bought it.  You will use it if I let you live. I have to stop you.  I don't have a choice.

If the situation is reversed, you will kill me without a moment's hesitation.  That is the nature of weapons of mass destruction.  If you don't protect yourself, you are at the mercy of the guy who does have it.

So, I do have the right to stop you.  Even if I don't have the right, I MUST stop you because if I don't, I die.

There are a lot of people you've just asked to take a position in front of your firing squad. Most of your politicians, nuclear engineers, chemical engineers, and explosives experts, etc. are about to get a bullet to the head, it seems. Sounds awful threatening.

Yes! You get it!!  Right now the US President and the Russian President can start a war of oblivion without consulting anyone.  That really bothers me.  Now you know why I don't want Joe the Homeless Drunk to have his own nuke.

I'm glad you finally see the reality of nuclear weapons.

[NghtRppr]

I am not going to take the chance.

You can kill me and I have to stop you before you do kill me.

Then why allow me to have a gun? Charles Whitman didn't phone up anyone either. You're not being logically consistent.

[FredericBastiat]

I am not going to take the chance.  If you have it, you can use it.  If you use it, I die. So I have to stop ou.  You may say that I should wait for you to phone me and tell me that life is horrible, that you have to end it all.  But I don't need to wait.  You can kill me and I have to stop you before you do kill me.

Its worth remembering who I grew up with: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shankill_Butchers  I have no reason to kid myself that life is fair and that good people don't die screaming for mercy.

Right... so we should just start killing people we think might remotely threaten us, just in case. Stalin was one such character. I don't even think some of his family were able to avoid his butchery. Look it up. It was called the 'Great Purge'.

[Hawker]

I am not going to take the chance.

You can kill me and I have to stop you before you do kill me.

Then why allow me to have a gun? Charles Whitman didn't phone up anyone either. You're not being logically consistent.

Guns are not a serious danger.  Nukes are.  I don't care if everyone in the world has a gun that he wears 24/7.  I do care if anyone upwind of me has a nuke.

Why are you asking me to repeat this?  You agree with it don't you?  You personally would not choose to live in a city where everyone has the option to kill the entire city by simply pressing a button.  Or would you?

[Hawker]

I am not going to take the chance.  If you have it, you can use it.  If you use it, I die. So I have to stop ou.  You may say that I should wait for you to phone me and tell me that life is horrible, that you have to end it all.  But I don't need to wait.  You can kill me and I have to stop you before you do kill me.

Its worth remembering who I grew up with: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shankill_Butchers  I have no reason to kid myself that life is fair and that good people don't die screaming for mercy.

Right... so we should just start killing people we think might remotely threaten us, just in case. Stalin was one such character. I don't even think some of his family were able to avoid his butchery. Look it up. It was called the 'Great Purge'.

Yes.  If I were in Russia, Stalin would have been a danger to me and I would have killed him.  Sadly, he would have the same point of view and more likely he would have killed me. 

The important thing is that you now understand human nature.  You can't sit at home hoping for the best if there is someone out there that you fear may kill you. 

[FredericBastiat]

Guns are not a serious danger.  Nukes are.  I don't care if everyone in the world has a gun that he wears 24/7.  I do care if anyone upwind of me has a nuke.

Why are you asking me to repeat this?  You agree with it don't you?  You personally would not choose to live in a city where everyone has the option to kill the entire city by simply pressing a button.  Or would you?

As far as I can tell, I already do. Not everybody has a nuke, but then not everybody has a gun either. I'm unconvinced by your scare tactics. Yes, we could all get blown to heck tomorrow. And the sun could get snuffed out and turn into a black hole and suck us all in. I hate all nuclear stuff, too damn dangerous (sarcasm).

[Hawker]

Guns are not a serious danger.  Nukes are.  I don't care if everyone in the world has a gun that he wears 24/7.  I do care if anyone upwind of me has a nuke.

Why are you asking me to repeat this?  You agree with it don't you?  You personally would not choose to live in a city where everyone has the option to kill the entire city by simply pressing a button.  Or would you?

As far as I can tell, I already do. Not everybody has a nuke, but then not everybody has a gun either. I'm unconvinced by your scare tactics. Yes, we could all get blown to heck tomorrow. And the sun could get snuffed out and turn into a black hole and suck us all in. I hate all nuclear stuff, too damn dangerous (sarcasm).

Really, think before you post. That is just pathetic.

Do try to work out the probability of the sun being snuffed out.  Compare it to the probabity of suicide: 11.3 suicide deaths per 100000 people.  Give those suicides nukes and you have 800 nuclear explosions per year in London.  That's just London!

[AyeYo]

Guns are not a serious danger.  Nukes are.  I don't care if everyone in the world has a gun that he wears 24/7.  I do care if anyone upwind of me has a nuke.

Why are you asking me to repeat this?  You agree with it don't you?  You personally would not choose to live in a city where everyone has the option to kill the entire city by simply pressing a button.  Or would you?

As far as I can tell, I already do. Not everybody has a nuke, but then not everybody has a gun either. I'm unconvinced by your scare tactics. Yes, we could all get blown to heck tomorrow. And the sun could get snuffed out and turn into a black hole and suck us all in. I hate all nuclear stuff, too damn dangerous (sarcasm).

Really, think before you post. That is just pathetic.

Do try to work out the probability of the sun being snuffed out.  Compare it to the probabity of suicide: 11.3 suicide deaths per 100000 people.  Give those suicides nukes and you have 800 nuclear explosions per year in London.  That's just London!

But muh rats.  I have rats and yous can't dem away frum meh!


This idiotic argument has become circular.  You can't argue logic and reason with people that have none.  Anyone that wants to equate a nuke to a kitchen knife and treat them the same way is too stupid to bother having a debate with.

[Hawker]

Guns are not a serious danger.  Nukes are.  I don't care if everyone in the world has a gun that he wears 24/7.  I do care if anyone upwind of me has a nuke.

Why are you asking me to repeat this?  You agree with it don't you?  You personally would not choose to live in a city where everyone has the option to kill the entire city by simply pressing a button.  Or would you?

As far as I can tell, I already do. Not everybody has a nuke, but then not everybody has a gun either. I'm unconvinced by your scare tactics. Yes, we could all get blown to heck tomorrow. And the sun could get snuffed out and turn into a black hole and suck us all in. I hate all nuclear stuff, too damn dangerous (sarcasm).

Really, think before you post. That is just pathetic.

Do try to work out the probability of the sun being snuffed out.  Compare it to the probabity of suicide: 11.3 suicide deaths per 100000 people.  Give those suicides nukes and you have 800 nuclear explosions per year in London.  That's just London!

But muh rats.  I have rats and yous can't dem away frum meh!


This idiotic argument has become circular.  You can't argue logic and reason with people that have none.  Anyone that wants to equate a nuke to a kitchen knife and treat them the same way is too stupid to bother having a debate with.

There is always the chance that they make a rational argument.  Its seeming more and more improbable but I'm not ready to put Fred out there with David Ickes yet.

[FredericBastiat]

Really, think before you post. That is just pathetic.

Do try to work out the probability of the sun being snuffed out.  Compare it to the probabity of suicide: 11.3 suicide deaths per 100000 people.  Give those suicides nukes and you have 800 nuclear explosions per year in London.  That's just London!

You'd also have to assume all of those suicidal individuals must have the wherewithal to purchase one, much less be even given one, despite having loads of money to get it. In addition, they'd have to know how to arm it and then use it. Sounds like the probability is getting smaller if not miniscule.

I'm sure if I were a nuke producer, I'd certainly want to vet the buyer long before I'd even remotely consider selling one to him. You're a scare mongerer.

[Hawker]

Really, think before you post. That is just pathetic.

Do try to work out the probability of the sun being snuffed out.  Compare it to the probabity of suicide: 11.3 suicide deaths per 100000 people.  Give those suicides nukes and you have 800 nuclear explosions per year in London.  That's just London!

You'd also have to assume all of those suicidal individuals must have the wherewithal to purchase one, much less be even given one, despite having loads of money to get it. In addition, they'd have to know how to arm it and then use it. Sounds like the probability is getting smaller if not miniscule.

I'm sure if I were a nuke producer, I'd certainly want to vet the buyer long before I'd even remotely consider selling one to him. You're a scare mongerer.

Um - you are being deliberately stupid.  All it takes is 1 bomb to wipe out London.  And you want to provide that bomb.  Stop pretending to be stupid - make a rational argument please.

And that was a sincere "please".  I'm sure you can make a sensible argument for whatever you believe in.

[FredericBastiat]

Um - you are being deliberately stupid.  All it takes is 1 bomb to wipe out London.  And you want to provide that bomb.  Stop pretending to be stupid - make a rational argument please.

And that was a sincere "please".  I'm sure you can make a sensible argument for whatever you believe in.

And we have thousands of them... What is the point of all of this? Your precious London is still standing.

[Hawker]

Um - you are being deliberately stupid.  All it takes is 1 bomb to wipe out London.  And you want to provide that bomb.  Stop pretending to be stupid - make a rational argument please.

And that was a sincere "please".  I'm sure you can make a sensible argument for whatever you believe in.

And we have thousands of them... What is the point of all of this? Your precious London is still standing.

No we don't.

What is it with you and making stuff up?

Can we agree that everyone has the right to their own opinions but that we have to share facts?  

[NghtRppr]

Guns are not a serious danger.

So says Superman.

[Hawker]

Guns are not a serious danger.

So says Superman.

Fact: Somalia has free access to guns.

Fact: The population of Somalia will double over the next generation as it has done over the last generation.

Guns are not an issue.  Nukes and smallpox are.  I don't care if you have a million pistols.  I cannot accept you having 1 nuke or 1 smallpox vial.  Even it you are 100 miles away, I have to defend myself from the nuke or the germs.

And you would do the same.  You don't strike me as the usual angst ridden "I hate myself and all White people are guilty exploiters of the innocent wilderness" type.  If you found out I was doing something that could kill you, you'd be on my case in a nanosecond.

Am I wrong about you?

So what puzzles me is that you are not disagreeing and you are not engaging in a logical discussion. I know you must have some logical basis for your argument.  Please stop messing about and offer it.

[FredericBastiat]

No we don't.

What is it with you and making stuff up?

Can we agree that everyone has the right to their own opinions but that we have to share facts?  

We, meaning the whole world.

[Hawker]

No we don't.

What is it with you and making stuff up?

Can we agree that everyone has the right to their own opinions but that we have to share facts?  

We, meaning the whole world.

Yes.  Facts are universal but opinions are personal.

You already know this so why are acting confused?

[AyeYo]

No we don't.

What is it with you and making stuff up?

Can we agree that everyone has the right to their own opinions but that we have to share facts?  

We, meaning the whole world.

If by "whole world" you mean a select few governments, then yes.  And when I say "everyone" I actually mean 4-5 people.

[NghtRppr]

Guns are not an issue.

Of course they are. You complain that you could be killed by a nuclear bomb yet guns can kill you just the same. Like I said, you're not being logically consistent. I'm done arguing with you about this though. I've made my point. Let me know if you have anything new to add.

[FredericBastiat]

Yes.  Facts are universal but opinions are personal.

You already know this so why are acting confused?

At the height of the "cold war" Russia had as many as 16,000. The United States had more than that. This doesn't include the French or Israelis. So thousands being a very rounded value, isn't too far off. Why are we so concerned about the numbers again?