Bitcoin Forum
December 09, 2016, 01:57:56 AM *
News: To be able to use the next phase of the beta forum software, please ensure that your email address is correct/functional.
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 [16] 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 »
  Print  
Author Topic: Bitcoinica - Advanced Bitcoin Trading Platform  (Read 46966 times)
tvbcof
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1988


View Profile
November 22, 2011, 05:34:01 PM
 #301

The saga continues.  For others who might want to play around with Bitcoinica, here's some details.

After deciding that I didn't need Bitcoinica at this time, I withdrew most of my BTC, but left a token amount in with the intent of losing it playing around with leverage.  That has not happened yet, but it seems that I am on my way with nothing I can do about it.

I had 8 BTC.  I decided to try to bet that the price would go up to 2.29 (from current 2.19 or something).  I put in a 'limit sell' at 2.29 for 25 BTC which I thought would execute if the price hit 2.29.  What I thought was happening is that I was borrowing Bitcoinica funds (25 - 8 BTC) and that if the price fell a small amount, I would lose ?? but if I bet right ant the price went up, I would win ??.  The experiment was to see what the ?? would be.

What happened was that somehow the 'order' was there, but I had no 'position'.  I was not sure if this was normal or what.  I waited for the lower number of the spread to exceed my target (the bet happened to be going in my favor) but when it did, nothing happened.

Oh well.  I canceled the order.  To what would have been my horror had I not been trying to lose my money, canceling an order turns it into a 'position' it seems.  Now I have a 'position' on the books with an immediate 1% loss.  Every time I try to 'liquidate' the position, I lose another chunk of money and need to settle, but it says I have 'insufficient funds' to actually liquidate.

I guess what I will do now is just sit on things until my goal is met (that is, until I've lost all my money.)  Any attempt to do otherwise seems to simply expedite that process.


Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
1481248676
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1481248676

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1481248676
Reply with quote  #2

1481248676
Report to moderator
btc_artist
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 154


Bitcoin!


View Profile WWW
November 22, 2011, 06:44:27 PM
 #302

@tvbcof  You are not the only one who has these problems. Smiley

BTC: 1CDCLDBHbAzHyYUkk1wYHPYmrtDZNhk8zf
LTC: LMS7SqZJnqzxo76iDSEua33WCyYZdjaQoE
BitMagic
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 98


View Profile
November 22, 2011, 08:05:37 PM
 #303

The saga continues.  For others who might want to play around with Bitcoinica, here's some details.

After deciding that I didn't need Bitcoinica at this time, I withdrew most of my BTC, but left a token amount in with the intent of losing it playing around with leverage.  That has not happened yet, but it seems that I am on my way with nothing I can do about it.

I had 8 BTC.  I decided to try to bet that the price would go up to 2.29 (from current 2.19 or something).  I put in a 'limit sell' at 2.29 for 25 BTC which I thought would execute if the price hit 2.29.  What I thought was happening is that I was borrowing Bitcoinica funds (25 - 8 BTC) and that if the price fell a small amount, I would lose ?? but if I bet right ant the price went up, I would win ??.  The experiment was to see what the ?? would be.

What happened was that somehow the 'order' was there, but I had no 'position'.  I was not sure if this was normal or what.  I waited for the lower number of the spread to exceed my target (the bet happened to be going in my favor) but when it did, nothing happened.

Oh well.  I canceled the order.  To what would have been my horror had I not been trying to lose my money, canceling an order turns it into a 'position' it seems.  Now I have a 'position' on the books with an immediate 1% loss.  Every time I try to 'liquidate' the position, I lose another chunk of money and need to settle, but it says I have 'insufficient funds' to actually liquidate.

I guess what I will do now is just sit on things until my goal is met (that is, until I've lost all my money.)  Any attempt to do otherwise seems to simply expedite that process.



This sounds like an actual problem, and not a misunderstanding of a feature. You should post your order placement history for Z to look at and make sure it's not a bug.

Please give me your money, because I am a shameless libertarian elite who deserves your money more than you do: 9Hkao8U82WWDp6SQGn4k7ad9gT1LWeL5s3
tvbcof
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1988


View Profile
November 22, 2011, 09:07:18 PM
 #304

The saga continues.  For others who might want to play around with Bitcoinica, here's some details.

After deciding that I didn't need Bitcoinica at this time, I withdrew most of my BTC, but left a token amount in with the intent of losing it playing around with leverage.  That has not happened yet, but it seems that I am on my way with nothing I can do about it.

I had 8 BTC.  I decided to try to bet that the price would go up to 2.29 (from current 2.19 or something).  I put in a 'limit sell' at 2.29 for 25 BTC which I thought would execute if the price hit 2.29.  What I thought was happening is that I was borrowing Bitcoinica funds (25 - 8 BTC) and that if the price fell a small amount, I would lose ?? but if I bet right ant the price went up, I would win ??.  The experiment was to see what the ?? would be.

What happened was that somehow the 'order' was there, but I had no 'position'.  I was not sure if this was normal or what.  I waited for the lower number of the spread to exceed my target (the bet happened to be going in my favor) but when it did, nothing happened.

Oh well.  I canceled the order.  To what would have been my horror had I not been trying to lose my money, canceling an order turns it into a 'position' it seems.  Now I have a 'position' on the books with an immediate 1% loss.  Every time I try to 'liquidate' the position, I lose another chunk of money and need to settle, but it says I have 'insufficient funds' to actually liquidate.

I guess what I will do now is just sit on things until my goal is met (that is, until I've lost all my money.)  Any attempt to do otherwise seems to simply expedite that process.



This sounds like an actual problem, and not a misunderstanding of a feature. You should post your order placement history for Z to look at and make sure it's not a bug.

OK.  If anyone is interested, here is the result of my hammering on various buttons as outlined in my message.  I guess there is not UI way to get a history so I use the API.

curl....oinica.com/api/orders.json?n=10" --basic | sed -e 's/{/\n/g
...
"amount":-25.0,"created_at":"2011-11-22T10:08:45-07:00","id":70352,"pair":"BTCUSD","price":null,"status":"INSUFFICIENT MARGIN","type":"MARKET","updated_at":"2011-11-22T10:08:52-07:00","user_id":1380},
"amount":-25.0,"created_at":"2011-11-22T10:08:05-07:00","id":70351,"pair":"BTCUSD","price":null,"status":"EXECUTED @ 2.3142","type":"MARKET","updated_at":"2011-11-22T10:08:16-07:00","user_id":1380},
"amount":-25.0,"created_at":"2011-11-22T10:07:44-07:00","id":70350,"pair":"BTCUSD","price":null,"status":"EXECUTED @ 2.3142","type":"MARKET","updated_at":"2011-11-22T10:07:51-07:00","user_id":1380},
"amount":25.0,"created_at":"2011-11-22T10:07:02-07:00","id":70349,"pair":"BTCUSD","price":null,"status":"EXECUTED @ 2.3537","type":"MARKET","updated_at":"2011-11-22T10:07:07-07:00","user_id":1380},
"amount":25.0,"created_at":"2011-11-22T10:06:38-07:00","id":70348,"pair":"BTCUSD","price":null,"status":"EXECUTED @ 2.3537","type":"MARKET","updated_at":"2011-11-22T10:06:53-07:00","user_id":1380},
"amount":-25.0,"created_at":"2011-11-21T00:42:07-07:00","id":69432,"pair":"BTCUSD","price":2.2952,"status":"EXECUTED @ 2.3144","type":"LIMIT","updated_at":"2011-11-21T19:31:17-07:00","user_id":1380}

Looking at the outputs and timings, I wonder if I didn't 'execute' correctly.  Seems like when I put the order in, at least one annoying box popped up. which I had to 'ok' or something.  It was unclear what that was, but in a typical UI, one only needs to be annoyed at most once by such a thing before an action is taken.



ineededausername
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 784


bitcoin hundred-aire


View Profile
November 22, 2011, 10:01:33 PM
 #305


(BFL)^2 < 0
tvbcof
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1988


View Profile
November 22, 2011, 10:54:26 PM
 #306



What's your point?  Funny looking black people look funny?


tvbcof
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1988


View Profile
November 23, 2011, 02:30:55 AM
 #307

..

This sounds like an actual problem, and not a misunderstanding of a feature. You should post your order placement history for Z to look at and make sure it's not a bug.

OK.  If anyone is interested, here is the result of my hammering on various buttons as outlined in my message.  I guess there is not UI way to get a history so I use the API.

 - snip -


OK, now I have no idea what's going on and think maybe there is a bug or something (though the strongest hypothesis to me is remains that I am misunderstanding the system.)

I logged on from work, and hurray, I'm no up by $0.16.  The lower end of the spread was above the 'base price' of my single outstanding 'position' (the one I cannot get rid of.)  At least I am pretty sure they were, but not %100.

The window was open for a few hours and the spread display dutifully changed up and down, but my position is mysteriously static.  Wondering if perhaps only the spread display was AJAX, I hit the refresh.  It seems to be the case that the display on the page is generally not dynamic.  Although both elements of the spread are still above my 'base price', I am now _down_ by $1.04 and I didn't touch a damn thing.

Another thing that I thought was funny was that the lower value of the spread sat at my 'base price' exactly to 4 decimal places for some time.  I would not expect this unless the spread was particular to me, or unless my piddly little bet was a noticeable fraction of Bitcoinica's books.


BTCurious
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 714


^SEM img of Si wafer edge, scanned 2012-3-12.


View Profile
November 23, 2011, 08:26:38 AM
 #308

Wondering if perhaps only the spread display was AJAX, I hit the refresh.  It seems to be the case that the display on the page is generally not dynamic.
I don't know what's going on with the rest of your situation, but this at least I can confirm. The position info doesn't update automatically, you have to manually refresh.

caston
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 720



View Profile WWW
November 29, 2011, 07:49:14 AM
 #309

Looks like the new bitcoinica UI is up!

18jL18iH96BBhwUCQn27FQp7ocodSxvJAB
netrin
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
November 29, 2011, 05:52:25 PM
 #310

What's quick pick? Is that just quick UI input or does it execute?

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
December 03, 2011, 02:19:21 PM
 #311

Zhou, your site appears to be down.

EDIT: Well others have confirmed 'works for me'... I can not even ping bitcoinica.com from any of my local machines. Anyone have a tip? (I'm clearly on the net)

EDIT2: https://50.56.4.62/ (works for me)

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
phorensic
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 630



View Profile
December 04, 2011, 12:37:34 AM
 #312

Change your DNS settings to use http://www.opendns.com/.
netrin
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
December 04, 2011, 03:07:33 AM
 #313

Thanks, I'll look into it.

BTW, Zhou. The new Bitcoinica is amazing. A few of the buttons confused me for no more than a minute, but wow. Excellent. The only thing I have left to complain about is having nothing left to complain about. Damn! I think you've implemented every single one of our suggestions ^2. Make'n money's never been so easy. Tusind tak skal du have!

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
netrin
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
December 04, 2011, 06:50:12 PM
 #314

Hi again Zhou, I managed to find three things to complain about.

Sorting by price exhibits odd behavior. For example (descending): 2.90, 2.94, 2.92, 2.80, 2.88, 2.86, 2.84, 2.82, 2.70, 2.78, 2.76, ...

Refresh kills sort/filter: If I choose to sort by amount or by price ascending, within seconds (AJAX refresh) my preference is ignored and the orders will be sorted by price descending.

Limit order history updates: I very much appreciate seeing the active orders listed by price. Excellent default behavior! However, when viewing order history, unexecuted limit orders should not be updated. If I have set a limit order to buy at $1, I should not continually see "updated less than a minute ago". From a historical perspective it is only interesting to know when I set the order and when it is canceled or executed. As for trailing stops I might want to know more than you show (when I set, at what price, last updated, current execution price).

But these are minor complaints. I keep missing max/minimas because I rely on Mt. Gox charts despite your larger spreads. But otherwise, the site is great and helps me sleep at night. Thank you.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
BTCurious
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 714


^SEM img of Si wafer edge, scanned 2012-3-12.


View Profile
December 04, 2011, 07:07:01 PM
 #315

Sorting by price exhibits odd behavior. For example (descending): 2.90, 2.94, 2.92, 2.80, 2.88, 2.86, 2.84, 2.82, 2.70, 2.78, 2.76, ...
I suspect it is sorting alphabetically somewhere, and "2.80" is represented at "2.8". That would generate described behaviour.

netrin
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
December 05, 2011, 01:20:58 PM
 #316

Suppose I am short and would like to set a stop to be triggered iff the Mt. Gox price rises above $3. If I expect a $0.1 spread on Bitcoinica, where should I set my stop? $2.95, $3.00, $3.05, or.... ?

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
BTCurious
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 714


^SEM img of Si wafer edge, scanned 2012-3-12.


View Profile
December 05, 2011, 02:01:24 PM
 #317

As far as I know, the stop triggers when the bitcoinica price crosses it. So when MtGox is at $3 you want to buy bitcoins, which means you use the buy value of bitcoinica. Assuming a $0.1 spread, you should set your stop to $3.05.

If someone could verify this, it would be nice, but I believe this is how it works.

phorensic
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 630



View Profile
December 05, 2011, 04:29:28 PM
 #318

If you short sell at 2.90, and the spread is 0.1 (very common), then the buy price is going to be ~3.00.  Therefore you need to set a stop above that, such as 3.05.
BitMagic
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 98


View Profile
December 06, 2011, 08:59:03 PM
 #319

Suppose I am short and would like to set a stop to be triggered iff the Mt. Gox price rises above $3. If I expect a $0.1 spread on Bitcoinica, where should I set my stop? $2.95, $3.00, $3.05, or.... ?

It's a mistake to think in terms of Mt. Gox price, because the spread is not static, it changes with trade volume and other factors. You should think only in terms of the bid/ask prices you are comfortable with, because those are at least real values that can affect your trades.

Please give me your money, because I am a shameless libertarian elite who deserves your money more than you do: 9Hkao8U82WWDp6SQGn4k7ad9gT1LWeL5s3
netrin
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 322


FirstBits: 168Bc


View Profile
December 06, 2011, 10:16:03 PM
 #320

Thank you, Dad. I can see patterns in Mt. Gox charts but can not short nor set stops on Mt. Gox. I would like to understand Bitcoinica's behavior. Is it executing my BUY-STOP when the BID is greater than my BUY-STOP, or the BID/ASK mean, or what?

$3.05 STOP for a Mt. Gox $3 and $0.1 Bitcoinica spread were useful answers, but I'd prefer it confirmed by Zhou.

Greenlandic tupilak. Hand carved, traditional cursed bone figures. Sorry, polar bear, walrus and human remains not available for export.
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 [16] 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 »
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!