[POT]PotCoin - Banking for the Legal Cannabis Industry ✦ ✦ ✦Grow With Us ✦ ✦ ✦

[hcf27]

Potcoin algorithym was changed in June 2014 because it was giving crazy block reward if you considered the value of the coin. This is why it had more than 12 GH directed to mining and dumping potcoin. At the time, I could get more than 1.000 potcoins per day with only 10 mhs of scrypt power, that was a lot of money considering bitcoin was around 600 bucks.

Now, its hardly profitable to mine potcoin, with the same 10mhs you will be getting like 25 potcoins per day, I know because I still mine it, its unprofitable so I think the supply will be cut now and it wasnt cut then because even with the halving mining and dumping was still crazy profitable!

This of course, are only my 2 cents. I reckon demmand could still not be enough and the halving may only slow down the decrease in price, however the block halving its a factor that does help the price increase.

And yes, you are right, you still cant buy cannabis with potcoins, but with what coin can you buy it?.. 1 dispensary that accepts cannacoin that I know of. The weed industry is still young, its still not completly legal in all States. It will take time and patiente for weed coins to be where they deserve to be. Currently you can buy seeds (and lighthers too if you want) in a lot of places with potcoin and that is a big win if you consider the coin is not even 1 year old.

Hold your coins and expect an increase in price and acceptance or sell now for 8 times less your money, thats your choice.

hcf27, within the context of all you've highlighted here, what are the ramifications for continued performance of POT's blockchain? If it's so unprofitable to mine, will the corresponding reduction in difficulty be commensurate with improving returns to see enough miners maintain the network? Or is there are real possibility the network could start failing because there's just not enough miners?

I'm a long term holder of POT and believe the dev team has been honest and reasonably committed, however I take all your points seriously versperwillow and see you're highlighting the major stumbling block of this thing being relevant, let alone successful.

The market will find a new balance. At first less people will mine, you can already see this on the total hashrate of the coin that has descended to around 3ghs... however the cut on supply should bring the price up and those people who mine will get less coins but at a higher price, bringing miners back. Difficulty will also decrease at first and will play its part, but all in all the markets should stabilize after a while, it will be interested to see how it plays out this next few days.

It is important to state that this is in THEORY what should happen, but there are other factors to take into account that are unpredictable: Investors selling their coins, confidence in the dev team, marketing efforts, etc...

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[ny2cafuse]

hcf27, within the context of all you've highlighted here, what are the ramifications for continued performance of POT's blockchain? If it's so unprofitable to mine, will the corresponding reduction in difficulty be commensurate with improving returns to see enough miners maintain the network? Or is there are real possibility the network could start failing because there's just not enough miners?

I'm a long term holder of POT and believe the dev team has been honest and reasonably committed, however I take all your points seriously versperwillow and see you're highlighting the major stumbling block of this thing being relevant, let alone successful.

The market will find a new balance. At first less people will mine, you can already see this on the total hashrate of the coin that has descended to around 3ghs... however the cut on supply should bring the price up and those people who mine will get less coins but at a higher price, bringing miners back. Difficulty will also decrease at first and will play its part, but all in all the markets should stabilize after a while, it will be interested to see how it plays out this next few days.

It is important to state tho that this is in THEORY what should happen, but there are other factors to take into account that are unpredictable: Investors selling their coins, confidence in the dev team, marketing efforts, etc...
[/quote]

The problem though is that this is the theory that put POT in the position it is in now.  Halving the coin didn't increase the price then and it won't now.  Halving the coin won't drive up demand.  As long as there is POT for sale on exchanges, and little to no use for it's intended purpose, there won't be a demand.  At one point people could make money mining POT, so they mined it.  After the first halving, the price needed to double, instead it stayed the same and even went down a bit.  So it was effectively half as profitable to mine.  Then it went down in price again, to around half of what it was after the first halving, and it halved again.  That's yet another decrease in per-block profitability.

Demand can't be increased by halving.  That's the logic that doomed this coin.  Check any coin that radically changed it's block halving/values mid-mining to "increase demand", and see where they are now.  You may find 1 or 2 that are still around, but the rest are dead.  Demand can only be increased by adoption.  Unfortunately, without any legitimate adoption in the markets this coin was conceived for, then this coin will continue to flounder.

And yes, CCN may only have 1 shop that accepts it for MJ sales, but last I checked that was an infinity percent greater adoption rate for MJ purchases than POT.

-Fuse

[vesperwillow]

If people believe in a coin and the value is low, I always say there's nothing wrong with holding and seeing what happens long-term, especially if it's realistically worth more to hold for hopes than to sell at a slamming loss. I have several coins I hold for that reason.

It just boggles my mind, though, when people use hype for hope and declare it (through action) as logical reasoning behind something.

When you reduce supply, you're not stimulating or increasing demand, even synthetically. You're simply making it worth less in the current form, which makes it more expensive to support. Sometimes visuals help people: If you walk past a store that has 10,000 electronic widgets, but you have no interest in them, you don't buy them. If, a month later, half the widgets are gone--but there's still a pile of dust on all of them--has your desire for them increased? No, because you still have no reason to buy them. If you're hyped into buying them based on a mysterious disappearance, then it's likely the snake oil which helped you slide into that hole.

For something like potcoin to become valuable down the road, requires constant efforts. The Potcoin team has done better than most in sticking around, but until it's past the trinket stage it's still very much a gamble for everyone. It's not proper to say "it's halved now, so I bet the value will just magically grow", short of saying you're purely speculating with 0 logic or math to
support the idea. Folks usually do that to try and induce a selling spike (and, I get that).

Until that form of silliness disappears, the crypto world will continue to be crippled by the seas of snake oil and the salesmen who take money from folks who are floating helpless without lifejackets. This, again, is why the rich continue to make money, and the poor have no idea how to save a dime. I'd rather just see a coin take off or flop than to keep it on life support, it's better for the whole.

And, for anyone who wasn't doing the math, this is an example of just how much lost effort there is when coins halve dramatically like potcoin has:

If you take the long-term average value of potcoin (it was around 0.00022000), and today's value, it's a difference of 65. You have to have 65 as much hash now as you did back then, in order to make the same number of potcoins. This isn't even evaluating conversion value to the dollar, which is how it's handled by the merchant. It's far worse for the merchants, because it's 117 times less valuable based on BTC/USD back then vs now. So for you to buy the same t-shirt and bong back then, you have to have 117 times as many potcoins.

10,000pot/day * 2200satoshis = 2.2btc * 450 USD = $990
10,000pot/day * 338 satoshis = 0.338btc * 250 USD = $8.45

(I'm being nice and generous, because in this example you're able to get the same amount of potcoins now as you were back then--mathematically this isn't possible, without adding an additional effort, because the block size is 1/4th of what it was back then. I'm simply excluding this for simplicity)

Another way to look at it: You work 40 hours a week for 800 potcoin. Then, it goes through 2 halvings. Now, you work 40 hours a week for 200 potcoins--you're taking a 600potcoin loss for your donated time. Your paycheck is also worth half of what it used to be, which means you're being paid 8 times less for the same amount of work.

If anything, the cost of mining it at such a tremendous loss, is the one reason people should buy it instead of mining it. It takes 65 times as much power now, to mine the same amount as it did back then. For anyone keeping track, difficulty has hardly changed much between now and then.

Oh, wait, what's that? Difficulty? Wait a second, it has in fact changed. Lots of people stopped mining it when it recently halved again, so now it's more susceptible to forks and takeovers. Sure, it means it's a little easier to pickup some coins, but it's also worth noting that a coin whose nethash drops over time with a correlating loss in value and blocksize, is usually a death-sentence, not a reason for hope.

The only exception to that is Bitcoin, and only because of 2 things: Merchant use for many, many products, and blackmarket use. Potcoin can be used for the same, but it's less secure due to nethash loss, and isn't accepted at nearly as many places as bitcoin.

Again, not knocking the efforts put into the coin--just tired of the same old "halving causes increased value" silliness. As always, best of luck.

[hcf27]

The problem though is that this is the theory that put POT in the position it is in now.  Halving the coin didn't increase the price then and it won't now.  Halving the coin won't drive up demand.

Nobody is saying that cutting supply will increase demand, this is just silly, cutting the supply will just reduce the "offer"... the demmand will stay the same, increase or decrease... it depends on other factors.

[hcf27]

When you reduce supply, you're not stimulating or increasing demand, even synthetically. You're simply making it worth less in the current form, which makes it more expensive to support. Sometimes visuals help people: If you walk past a store that has 10,000 electronic widgets, but you have no interest in them, you don't buy them. If, a month later, half the widgets are gone--but there's still a pile of dust on all of them--has your desire for them increased? No, because you still have no reason to buy them. If you're hyped into buying them based on a mysterious disappearance, then it's likely the snake oil which helped you slide into that hole.

For something like potcoin to become valuable down the road, requires constant efforts. The Potcoin team has done better than most in sticking around, but until it's past the trinket stage it's still very much a gamble for everyone. It's not proper to say "it's halved now, so I bet the value will just magically grow", short of saying you're purely speculating with 0 logic or math to
support the idea. Folks usually do that to try and induce a selling spike (and, I get that).

Until that form of silliness disappears, the crypto world will continue to be crippled by the seas of snake oil and the salesmen who take money from folks who are floating helpless without lifejackets. This, again, is why the rich continue to make money, and the poor have no idea how to save a dime. I'd rather just see a coin take off or flop than to keep it on life support, it's better for the whole.

Ok, I think there is a confusion here. I never said that the coin halving will INCREASE the demmand, the coin halving will just cut the supply by half this is a fact, not an speculation and its simple maths: there was a 210 block reward and now there is a 105 block reward. Will this increase the value, well if the supply is now lower than the demmand YES, if the supply is still higher than the demmand then NO.

I will use your same example to explain myself better:

If you walk past a store that has 10.000 electronic widgets, and people buy 7.000 a month, the merchant will have to reduce price or sell less products (cut the demand - block halving). If, a month later, half the widgets are gone--but there's still a pile of dust on all of them--has your desire for them increased? No, but you will be selling 5.000 electronic widgets and the demand is 7.000. So you can sell your products at a higher price and they will still be bought until a balance is found.

Now, I think what you are trying to say is that the demmand is still too low even after block halving and this could be the case of course, saying there NO demmand at all is just silly, that would mean there is no buy orders at all at the exchanges and no1 has desire for the coin, this is just not true... but I get your point anywayz and if that was true, the example will be something like this:

If you walk past a store that has 10.000 electronic widgets, and people buy 2.000 a month, the merchant will have to reduce price or sell less products (cut the demand - block halving). If, a month later, half the widgets are gone--but there's still a pile of dust on all of them--has your desire for them increased? No, you will be selling 5.000 electronic widgets and the demand is 2.000 so you will still have to reduce prices!

This second scenario could very well be true, only time will tell.

I hope I made my self clear and expressed myself in a more "rational" manner.

[vesperwillow]

If you walk past a store that has 10.000 electronic widgets, and people buy 2.000 a month, the merchant will have to reduce price or sell less products (cut the demand - block halving). If, a month later, half the widgets are gone--but there's still a pile of dust on all of them--has your desire for them increased? No, you will be selling 5.000 electronic widgets and the demand is 2.000 so you will still have to reduce prices!

This second scenario could very well be true, only time will tell.

I hope I made my self clear and expressed myself in a more "rational" manner.

Your explanation is definitely more thorough, but I would argue that halving isn't the same as reducing sales price or overhead, it's the opposite: You're increasing overhead, requiring the prospective buyers to have less buying power, and still expecting some part of this to increase appeal of the product, in some fashion.

I understand what you're saying, I simply disagree based on numerous indicators. Concurrently, I'm not saying that it has no hope to go up down the road, but that it will have nothing to do with supply, just like it has nothing to do with it now. There are endless-supply coins out there which are healthy, whose price/nethash hasn't plummeted, and whose value now is higher than 6 months ago, losing less than half of the value since the Dec-Jan market shock last year.

What's the big difference? Marketability. They're being used, there's tangible value across the web, and their purpose is being fulfilled.

There's still hope, and perhaps with the nethash dropping off of Potcoin (~60% loss since the halving), it will be more valuable in the near-term. The potcoin team, as I've said before, is going to have to make significan political strides in the US to truly make the coin into what it was designed for.

[hcf27]

There's still hope, and perhaps with the nethash dropping off of Potcoin (~60% loss since the halving), it will be more valuable in the near-term. The potcoin team, as I've said before, is going to have to make significan political strides in the US to truly make the coin into what it was designed for.

I get what you mean, but I think is just asking to much, dont think any coin has the power to influence in U.S Politics.... Potcoin and other weedcoins have to ride the cannabis wave of the U.S and Canada, lots of states are legalizing for medical or recreational use... cryptocoins just have to jump on board and benefit from third parties that are actually influencing U.S politics.

I also wanted to post a link to some comments I made on my blog regarding price increase this week: http://potcoiner.info/post/107496627421/we-all-know-potcoin-block-reward-halved-on-monday

Again, just my two cents here.

[vesperwillow]

I get what you mean, but I think is just asking to much, dont think any coin has the power to influence in U.S Politics.... Potcoin and other weedcoins have to ride the cannabis wave of the U.S and Canada, lots of states are legalizing for medical or recreational use... cryptocoins just have to jump on board and benefit from third parties that are actually influencing U.S politics.

The reason I mention politics is because it's illegal at the federal and state level to use any non-approved method to pay for the legalized schedule substance. Essentially the only approved methods are credit cards and certain medical supplementary pay. Crypto is definitely on the ban list. Potcoin's original purpose was to pay for the substance, and they spoke heavily in the beginning of making this happen. This is why there was a big hype to 4-20 last year in Colorado, which largely was a flop IMO. I think it's great that you can get some related items (bongs, shirts, etc) with it, that's cool, but a lot of the original intent has deflated the morale in the coin. With a dead purpose in its founding locality, it has to overcome that somehow, or find mobility in another tangible way.

I can't reach the potcoiner website from where I'm at now, I'll see if I can read it later.

[BITDV]

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[PotCoin]

After the halving Potcoin is up 250%  hit a high on 700 with over 14k in trading in 24 hours and we are above CannabisCoin on coinmarketcap!

https://i.imgur.com/W7FwtvI.png

[darkslash]

After the halving Potcoin is up 250%  hit a high on 700 with over 14k in trading in 24 hours and we are above CannabisCoin on coinmarketcap!

https://i.imgur.com/W7FwtvI.png

goiing to keep going to

[vesperwillow]

Yes, let's actually examine the value of potcoin. Afterall, 1 day of trading sure gives you the accurate picture does it not? Here's a more holistic viewpoint on the matter, the graphic is a bit cludgy but it's all I can do right now. Examining from start to present, we can see several key events on the life of the coin.

Inception -> Feb-2014: The initial value went up, as most coins did, because of interest and hype.
Feb-2014 -> March-2014: Value begins to lower, pump/dump runups are dying, people panic and call for halving
March-2014 -> April-2014: Halving work begins; partial runups and dumps over the 4/20 hype; 4/20 was perceived as a flop, panic selling ensues
May-2014 -> June-2014: Halving schedule announced, more panic selling
June-2014 -> July-2014: Pump/Runs/Dumps, market use actually dies at this time, multipools had a field day
July-2014 -> October-2014: Some  normalization, stagnant market
October-2014 -> Novermber-2014: Someone hits the net and bumps difficulty, a run/dump for a couple of days spiked the price
November-2014 -> January-2015: Continued stagnation, trades continue to die out
January-2015: Second Halving, 2/3rds of the network drops off (likely multipools and heavy supporters) long enough for difficulty to dip, and then they return with additional multipools to take advantage of the dip. This begins another synthetic run-up and sell-off.

I also included a very scaled value graph to illustrate just how the value looks in reality over time. 250% increase? Yeah, if you only examine 1 day of trading difference after people run the price up. Also, notice that the first halving is when things basically just tip out of the canoe. You would've had less trouble from multipools if you hadn't halved, just let the thing crash and they would've left, leaving just the hardcore supporters of the coin to keep it alive. But, this is all in the past.



Expanded charts of recent 3 months, highlighting an example of a pump/run-up/dump. A spike followed by sudden dropoff (chart 2) forced the difficulty to hop up (chart 3), which allowed the perpetrators to stimulate a brief market run for profit, which ended at the beginning of November. This is what's going on now more than likely.



At the same time, I believe the longevity of this coin is truly in a lower value, which is why I say (up above) that it's normalizing itself somewhat. My thoughts on this stem from the fairly steady hashrate. Historically, this coin has never sustained above 10gh for long periods, the fact it hovers between 2 and 7 is good. Bitcoin did this for years until it became tangible. It's still going to need political affluence to gain much ground in the legal market, at which point the value would gain traction.

This is why coins which establish market use prior to launch have faired far better than ones like this which hope market use comes after inception. NLG comes to mind, they've done fairly well over the long term and had market use right from the start.

Still haven't read that link the other person posted, this is just a post in reference to the synthetic hype of a "250%" increase. This is a good time to make short-term profit, but it won't last. Buy on the next dip.

[RenegadeMan]

After the halving Potcoin is up 250%  hit a high on 700 with over 14k in trading in 24 hours and we are above CannabisCoin on coinmarketcap!

https://i.imgur.com/W7FwtvI.png

You're kidding yourself if you think this is some sort of "news" to crow about (and frankly I'm embarrassed for you to be quoting such naive price stats that are only a flash-in-the-pan irregularity). As per versperwillow's detailed "let's actually look at the reality of Potcoin" post, this is but a burst of speculative activity, nothing that gives any long-term credibility to being in Potcoin. For anyone that's been around for a while and realised this thing's going nowhere fast, this sudden increase in price has been an opportunity to exit without too much loss.

[ny2cafuse]

After the halving Potcoin is up 250%  hit a high on 700 with over 14k in trading in 24 hours and we are above CannabisCoin on coinmarketcap!

https://i.imgur.com/W7FwtvI.png

You're kidding yourself if you think this is some sort of "news" to crow about (and frankly I'm embarrassed for you to be quoting such naive price stats that are only a flash-in-the-pan irregularity). As per versperwillow's detailed "let's actually look at the reality of Potcoin" post, this is but a burst of speculative activity, nothing that gives any long-term credibility to being in Potcoin. For anyone that's been around for a while and realised this thing's going nowhere fast, this sudden increase in price has been an opportunity to exit without too much loss.

100% this.

If you don't think so, take a look at the decrease in price again.  I honestly wouldn't be surprised if someone who was pissed about the posts here didn't say, "I'll show them that POT isn't dying", and caused the recent pump.

I wanted so bad for POT to succeed.  I really did.

-Fuse

[dragonseer]

I haven't installed one can anyone comment RE: An android or Win8 Phone wallet? (I don't have iOS)

[vesperwillow]

I wanted so bad for POT to succeed.  I really did.

-Fuse

Exactly. I sound cynical, but I'm simply being critical. I've been around since day 0 and have always supported the coin. I'm simply realistic in my approach. I used to be a large bagholder, but got out when the getting was good. I have a little bit now, but I'm sure it wouldn't buy me anything.

Guess we'll see in the next few years.

[PotCoin]

I get what you mean, but I think is just asking to much, dont think any coin has the power to influence in U.S Politics.... Potcoin and other weedcoins have to ride the cannabis wave of the U.S and Canada, lots of states are legalizing for medical or recreational use... cryptocoins just have to jump on board and benefit from third parties that are actually influencing U.S politics.

The reason I mention politics is because it's illegal at the federal and state level to use any non-approved method to pay for the legalized schedule substance. Essentially the only approved methods are credit cards and certain medical supplementary pay. Crypto is definitely on the ban list. Potcoin's original purpose was to pay for the substance, and they spoke heavily in the beginning of making this happen. This is why there was a big hype to 4-20 last year in Colorado, which largely was a flop IMO. I think it's great that you can get some related items (bongs, shirts, etc) with it, that's cool, but a lot of the original intent has deflated the morale in the coin. With a dead purpose in its founding locality, it has to overcome that somehow, or find mobility in another tangible way.

I can't reach the potcoiner website from where I'm at now, I'll see if I can read it later.

Where are you getting your information from, Id like to know your source?  We have merchants accepting PotCoin for edibles, seeds etc Jp wellness is accepting it for bud.
also look at cannabiscoin they launched their first dispensary a while back.  

also are you talking only about the USA?

http://www.coindesk.com/medical-marijuana-dispensary-canada-first-bitcoin/

what about the rest of the world? its a big place

[cookiemonster7]

It has been obvious that someone and or a group of individuals have been attempting to lower the price of potcoin, in a power grab, and or simply to sap bitcoin value out of the potcoin market. That being said distrust and fear is not the solution, neither is a disproportionate amount of short term greed. The time has come for serious collaboration, Who is coding for potcoin? I have poured many hours of sleepless nights, unanswered calls from my significant other, and much more into supporting potcoin, I feel I should not continue to do so alone and from the shadows. I am reaching out. Let's make something serious happen.

[vesperwillow]

Where are you getting your information from, Id like to know your source?  We have merchants accepting PotCoin for edibles, seeds etc Jp wellness is accepting it for bud.
also look at cannabiscoin they launched their first dispensary a while back.  

also are you talking only about the USA?

http://www.coindesk.com/medical-marijuana-dispensary-canada-first-bitcoin/

what about the rest of the world? its a big place

What source are you talking about? You mean the federal and state governments? If you actually paid attention to my posts you'd see that, yes, with regard to legality, I'm referring to the US--your original launch market, you know, the place you guys blew up youtube and the forums about 4/20 which was seen as a huge flop. Your launch, and for awhile, core market, was the US; specifically Colorado. Your coin is based on the premise that it's the official coin of the green. You/the team even admitted in the past that it would take awhile to become legal to use specifically for marijuana, and your response came as a result of people wondering why they could only buy trinkets and doodads in the shops and not the actual product.

I've already acknowledged in prior posts that globally it has useful application as some countries allow any method of currency to purchase the actual product, but it has no more or less strength than other competing coins globally. Because, why would anyone outside of the US use potcoin when they could just use cash or 10 other forms of payment?  Any coin at that point would work fine, because they all transport value. This is why I've mentioned that if you could make political strides in the US, you'd actually establish yourself as THE official coin and there'd be more serious supporters. Oh, and about 20 other people have made the same remark.

Instead, all that was ever posted here were links to fluff youtube videos and over-hyped stories about random people which were paid to use the word 'potcoin' or some form of marketable phrase about it. Where has that gotten your movement? Can I walk into a market in Denver and offer potcoin for a bag of weed..legally? Would the PotCoin slippers enable me to do that? Last I checked, I couldn't--but I could be wrong, maybe it's changed.

[jheaton]

Pot will be legal someday, may take 10 years but when it is this coin will be golden. Anyone that thinks that pot will never be legalized in the entire US within a period of time is an idiot.

mining since (last) January.