Bugala
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July 01, 2020, 11:19:41 AM |
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@unrealandy
Recapping here some things as I have understood them and giving answers to you.
Stealing of coins:
As far as I have understood, there have been two stealing issues you have been talking of. Stake Grinding, and Phantom Nodes.
Stake Grinding I agree with you, that it is actually stealing since stake grinding gives more stake rewards to its users than they should be getting and some of them are away from someone else.
However, as I have mentioned before, this is still a somewhat minor issue in total, since only 10 percent of rewards come from staking, and it seems to me that loads of legitimate stakers are getting staking rewards too, so there can't be too many stake grinder rewards left for them, Just from head, I could imagine it could go somewhere like 1 million at highest, which isn't a small amount, but not that big either (about 10 thousand euros distributed to probably more than one stake grinder).
What comes to Phantom Nodes in which it seems to me that your main claim is based upon it seems to me your proofs are trying to prove that someone is using a Phantom Node. Now in this view, I disagree. I don't see them really stealing those coins, since if they had done it legitimately, they would have received the same amount of node rewards, as they had using Phantom Node, and those are not away from anyone.
They still had to buy the coins for their phantom node, so they didn't have any advantage in that. Only benefit they get is that they don't need to pay server hosting costs, which is maybe 5 Euros a month at max of advantage and this is not a loss for Telos, but for hosting providers.
The harm they cause is that Phantom Nodes don't benefit the network since they don't participate in keeping it up, but from a pure reward point of view, they don't really affect anything.
Similarly, they don't cause others to lose their rewards either, except perhaps indirectly. Because if we look at saving 5 euros a month from hosting, sure, they might be willing to keep hosting their nodes longer than rest, since when others make 2 euros a month, they still make 7 euros a month due to hosting cost saving.
However, considering that especially after Stake Grinding has been found, we have pretty much been on the situation of 100k nodes only making sense, and those costing 1 000 euros a month, I don't think possible 5 euro saving (not to mention there are hosting even around 1 Euro a month) really affects their decision much if they plan on setting up another phantom node or not.
So when you keep talking of someone stealing, was it 25 million your last claim, keep in mind that this stealing happens based upon your definition of stealing.
I believe most would disagree with your definition of someone having stolen 25 million Telos.
Someone is cheating the system, that I agree, but saying that someone is actually stealing them in traditional sense using phantom nodes, and even more, accusing they are stealing from other legitimate node runners, that is a bit of a stretch in my mind.
Another important distinction, since I have noticed that you seem to be using words bit liberally and you also seem to have difficulty in noticing distinctions between things. That basically when you take your proof, they are logical and make sense, as long as you don't try to figure out what was really meant or said by those things you use as proofs. It is always important trying to figure out what other one is trying to say, before making accusations.
Pascal threatened that he will change Telos into just a token, and once again rightfully you asked, where is the voting about it. Indeed, Telos is a democratic coin, etc. that is right, and your question was legitimate, but you missed what Pascal was actually saying, which is actually hard to see without having followed what Pascal has said before mainly in Discord I think.
Pascal created Telos and gave it to the community, and he has honored that deal and worked to provide technicalities to get the fork to reflect the changes upon which community voted for Telos.
However, you have to now understand that Pascal is not Telos. But in practice, Pascal is the driving force behind Telos.
As Pascal has many times pointed out, he has decided to provide he's services against Telos. He could provide he's services against Bitcoin or any other coin out there, but he has chosen to provide them against Telos.
What Pascal does with his business, is not up to community vote, but it is solely Pascals decision. If Pascal one day decides to stop selling anything against Telos, or decides that no more Telos nodes can be run on Blueboxes for example, that is not a community decision, but that is a decision solely resting on Pascals shoulders which he can do or decide not to do, and there is nothing anyone else has a say about it.
So when he says he will make telos a token, he doesn't mean he is going to change the current telos to be a token, but what he means (or my guess is what he means) is that he is going to make a fork from telos, in which the current telos supply becomes just tokens, and then he will stop offering any business against the current Telos, but will only accept this new forked telos tokens for his business.
While current Telos would stay with community, as that is not Pascals decision to make anymore after he has given it to the community, he can practically get Telos killed by not supporting it anymore, since if Pascal doesn't accept Telos as payment for his services etc. then what does Telos have left then anymore? Not much.
So while you thought that he was thinking of changing Telos against community wishes, that is not what he said. What he meant is that he is going to make he's own fork of Telos, which anyone is allowed to do, and then he would focus on that new fork that is based upon he's own sole decisions instead of community decisions.
You can say that would surely be against communitys wishes, but it would still be completely legit, since he wouldn't be changing the current Telos, but simply abandoning it for the community and making another fork instead.
What comes to Bluephones, Aeguanas etc.
You are right with your examples that long, long ago these have already been announced and many of us, me included, expected many of them to be out by now.
However, multiple times in Discord Pascal have mentioned about the way he works, and it has came up also when talking of white papers.
You probably yourself too remember that Pascal have been bit reluctant on making White Papers since as he have himself said, he sees no point in it due to the way he works with projects.
Many times he has said that he keeps working on several projects in parallel, and sometimes he focuses on one, and then switches to another again, depending upon the situation, like if there is something he needs to wait that he can't do anything about it, he simply switches to one where he can get forward.
You can see a good example in Cryptomages game. As far as I understood, close to Christmas it was already close to release, and now we haven't heard about it for a while. So what happened?
Well, this is just my guess, but my guess is Pascal told Allanon to work on something more critical and Allanon hasn't had time to focus on getting Cryptomages forward enough after that.
So yes, there are lots of projects that have been announced and that haven't happened, and perhaps some of them even never will happen, like the Bluephone seems a bit like the original idea have bit ran out of time already. But there are even more projects that have been announced and happened. And yes, some of those have not took off much, but this to my understanding is the google approach that Pascal is doing.
Google basically does a whole bunch of things all the time, they throw them in the open and see how it goes. If it seems to start taking off, they focus on it, if it doesn't, they likely kill it. I believe this is the same approach that Pascal is taking. He makes multiple projects, launches them, and sees how it goes. If it goes well, he makes more to it, if it doesn't seem to take off, then he lets it be for now and perhaps at some point in future does a relaunch with adding something new to it to see if it works better then.
I don't think it is fair to take single projects and point them out, but you have to look at the whole picture, and also understand the picture. You can make same blame on Google, and even more so since more of Googles projects end up dead than succeed. At least Pascals projects haven't died, although many of them haven't succeeded either, but there is nothing unusual about it when using Google strategy.
I meant to write more, but this already took long enough, and this is something you need to take into consideration too. Answering to questions takes time, especially if you start answering to ones like yours where your accusations are mainly based upon misunderstandings or views that only you share. Like you using word Stealing in such a way that others don't agree with it. It is double the effort to answer when you first have to point out that others view on for example "stealing" is not the norm understanding of that word, so I can easily see why Pascal hasn't answered you properly, especially taken into consideration also his nature.
Yes, I fully agree it would be nice if Pascal would be nice and courteous all the time and not hot-headed at all, but I think the same reason that makes him like that, is also the reason why he is able to make so many projects, and even at the same time. Telos is unique in this that we get like one new use case a month or something. Other coins struggle to get that one use case in 3 years, while Pascal spits them out once a month.
So if I have to choose between nice and courteous one use case guy, or hot-headed Pascal with use case a month, I definitely pick Pascal.
If you can find Pascal V2 from whom the hot head bug has been fixed, I will be glad to replace him with the current one, but I don't think one like that exists. It is a whole package deal. Pascal comes with extreme efficiency, but with a nasty bug included, and this is what you need to take into consideration when dealing with him and looking at his comments. He doesn't carefully think every comment he makes. Sometimes we Mods discuss a lot about what did he actually mean with he's latest Announcement, since they are often not clear at all.
This same you need to take into consideration when you keep quoting from him, like the one where he said he makes telos into token. If taken literally, yes, it sounds like he is about to do something he shouldn't, but when you have learned to interpret Pascals language, you understand that is not what he said, but you need to take his sentence in the context of his other comments he has made all around the world, which is, of course, difficult, but just pointing out, keep your mind open that what Pascal's text seems like, might not be what he actually meant, but there might might be loads of text missing from the explanation that would have made it much more clear.
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