ANN-EMC2 Einsteinium FUNDING THE FUTURE WITH THE FUTURE OF CURRENCY KMD-dPoW

[HwM]

I am under the impression that:
1: ASICS will just Bazinga! the KGW making difficulty rise.
2: This rise will decrease the number of coins mined in general by "normal miners"
3: Rise in price <=> profit for the small time miners and better payouts to projects we want to support.

And for the people with only dollar signs in their eyes. Imagine how many blocks will be cracked? a.k.a. halving rate goes much faster and your currently mined coins will be worth more automatically.

I myself just passively mine EMC2 with only 300 K/Hash and buy more whenever possible and let this all just happen. Good things will come for EMC2.

"All roads lead to Rome"

Aaaand your post.. pretty much the same text:

I am under the impression that:
1: ASICS will just Bazinga! the KGW making difficulty rise.
2: This rise will decrease the number of coins mined in general by "normal miners"
3: Rise in price <=> profit for the small time miners and better payouts to projects we want to support.

And for the people with only dollar signs in their eyes. Imagine how many blocks will be cracked? a.k.a. halving rate goes much faster and your currently mined coins will be worth more automatically.

I myself just passively mine EMC2 with only 300 K/Hash and buy more whenever possible and let this all just happen. Good things will come for EMC2.

"All roads lead to Rome"

You just copy what other people write and post them as your own... questionable..

Consider youself pwnd.

[jjj0923]

I disagree with all of the above

[jioy]

no, it simply mean that someone is faster

[SnoopCn]

Hello all. 

This is my first post related to EMC2, but I have been mining it for about a week now and reading through the main forum discussions, so I'm somewhat up to speed on the concerns being voiced about switching away from the scrypt algorithm.  From what I've read so far, it seems that the community is ready to jump to X11.  But what I haven't read, is a detailed technical argument by someone who really understands the difference between the various algorithms available.  Voting is a great way to build consensus and strengthen the community, but it does not always guarantee the best course of action is taken, particularly when the voters have a lack of detailed knowledge on the subject matter.  Let me say right now that I am no expert in the field of crytos or algorithms or computer science at all.  I am a control systems engineer by trade and a supporter of cryptos because I believe their integration into societies will help to create better environments than current monetary systems are providing for 99% of the worlds population.  That out of the way, I would like to suggest that this decision not be made in haste by the developers, and that the community discussing this switch understand and agree WHY the switch is being made before deciding WHAT to switch to.

From what I've read on the EMC2 forums thus far, it appears that almost everyone agrees that ASICs are bad news for the future of this coin and most scrypt coins in general.  I agree with this sentiment from both a miners perspective, and a 'historical' perspective.  That is, scrypt was an alternative algorithm to SHA-256 initially implemented to prevent (or at least resist) the ASIC generated potential of centralizing a blockchain network.  It goes without saying that blockchain networks must remain distributed to preserve the trust-less encryption protocol that is their genius.  The instant that a 51% condition arises, is the instant that a blockchain network becomes incapable of performing its primary function as a trust-less verification system.  Thus preventing a 51% condition via integration of ASICs into the network becomes the single most important reason to switch algorithms now that ASICs are on the horizon.  Thus to me it seems, whatever algorithm the developers decide to switch to, should be the one that is most resistant to ASICs.  If multiple algos have near identical ASIC resistivity, then and only then, should features such as power consumption be considered.

So the question then becomes, which algorithm is the most ASIC resistant?  And just as important, who is qualified to answer that question?  I don't feel comfortable voting on this topic because I have no idea what the answer is.  I could search around the internet and read article after article and become more informed, but then I'm dependent upon the authors presentation of the information, which may or may not be completely accurate.  I could read white papers by the developers of different algos, but when I tried reading the Bitcoin white paper, I had to skim it because I lack the vocabulary to understand the details presented.  I could invest some serious time and fully educate myself on encryption algorithms, why RAM is necessary and how its circumvented, and how it all relates to blockchains, but there's no need for me to do that when people with that knowledge already exist.  So the duty of the Einsteinium development team then becomes to seek out the experts on this subject and get first hand information so that they increase the likelihood of choosing the best course of action.  From my understanding, experts on this subject are very forthcoming with their knowledge, as evidenced by the plethora of open source code they release, and can be readily found drinking spiked punch at Bitcoin conventions and crypto Meet-ups.

I know it feels like time is pressing and a decision must be made now, but this coin has a purpose based in love and a strong supporting community, it will survive a few ASIC whales long enough to allow the necessary time to gather quality information and make an informed decision.

I'm happy to have found this coin and look forward to becoming a part of the community.

Quoted just so everyone can read this super comment.
Thumbsup!

You really think this is a concern? I mean X11 is the best algo out there at the moment, or the second best, depending on how Blake 256 will turn out. It's ultra secure, faster and more efficient. Im quite sure that asic's for X11 will exist at some point in the future but first it would just proove that X11 is a good algo and secondly it's going to take years of development. Every asic producer will try to focus their research on the best and most promising algo out their, but I think it will take quite a long time until this gets a problem.
Would like to hear some opinions on this please

[Urban Dressing]

Nice to see bounties being put in place here.

[jjj0923]

I'm going to keep my observations brief and succinct.

Those among you who are complaining are getting exactly what you asked for and now you don't like it.

YOU are the ones who begged people to vote to get this coin listed on exchanges and now you're complaining about the attention you're being given as a coin.

You could limit this coin to only being mined by dilythium crystals and still creative developers would some how find a way to circumvent your road blocks and utilize technology to get a leg up on the mining competition. Change and advancement are inevitable are like a runaway train - can never be stopped.

You wanted a monetary value set on your coins and now the people who make their business leveraging the monetary value of literally anything are set to pounce with newer and faster technology and you don't like it - so you're solution is to go back to the stone age... I think Albert Einstein would be sadly disappointed.

You can resist change or you can embrace and exploit it when it comes - SO WHAT if people can mine your coin faster. Are you coin hogs afraid that it will drive down the value of your nest eggs or are you really altruistic and protecting the coin?

I have a solution for you. If you are really as altruistic as you profess to be then pursue will all possible diligence having the coin removed from all exchanges then mining will only be done by those truly interested in the coin for it's implied value and not it's monetary value - but as long as you stay listed on exchanges, the coin will posses a monetary value and be mined as quickly as possible by those who can for it's value - so it's simple - remove it's value and they asic whales will simply ignore you.

my humble .00000002

[bitminton]

Btw. can you please disable the top wordpress-bar for non-admin/legitimate users (which are only registered for the votings) at the foundation website.

@functions.php

Code:

if(!current_user_can('manage_options')) 
{
    add_filter('show_admin_bar', '__return_false');
}

Have you figured out how to transfer the fund to the winner? If there are any news, please also update the twitter account so that we all can spread (or retweet ) the word. It's too quiet there...

[Timespace]

I agree. It isn't about being the most ASIC resistant. It is more about mitigating a potential threat that is coming down the pipeline in the near future. This threat being true, powerful, game changing scrypt ASICs. Many will say that the threat isn't real because there isn't yet hard evidence of a scrypt ASIC besides the gridseeds and dual miners. Those hardly wipe out GPUs.

Someone posted some preorder numbers for the now 250 MH/s units and it is over 2 million dollars. That is why the issue needs to be addressed now. We can hold our hats and hope no ill minded folks would ever attack such a noble coin, or that the ASICs are further away than predicted.  In my opinion, that is fool hearted in this new Wild West. It is better to set the wheels in motion sooner than later and the devs have done just that. It may seem sudden and rash, but ultimately it is all for the best, and not taken lightly.

This change, if and when it happens is to protect the coin in its most vulnerable phase. Once the coin has gained a bigger base, the threat won't exist in the same way. Maybe Bitcoin is going through some kind of change because of ASICs. Read recently about KNC, same manufacturer releasing the 250 MH/s scrypt ASIC, mining/dumping $460,000 worth of Bitcoins everyday. That isn't too surprising other than the potential price reducing implications of such an operation. Maybe Bitcoin could have better thwarted this kind of thing if it strived to be ASIC resistant. That is a maybe though. It isn't a certainty. If that kind of thing really rattles your bones there are coins that protect against it.  EMC2 needs the best shot at surviving whatever is happening in this new frontier right now.

I like x11 because I have tested it out. Power cost is down, usability of my computer is up, heat is down and ease of use getting it working is still there. I don't think it offers strong if any true ASIC resistance other than being different and new. It's more about timing than anything. A year out we may see the same thing happening to x11 and that would be a great thing in my opinion.

I have tried Vertcoin and it just didn't work with common settings. Sure it may be ASIC resistant but it seems to be Timespace resistant too. It is not appealing to the masses when you can't easily get it up and running. Fine tuning and tweaking will always be a thing for advanced users. I am saying that it should be as easy or easier than scrypt mining to get it to work initially. This is conducive with higher adoption rates.  It should also be popular enough to have strong community support. X11 ticks those boxes easily. If anyone has examples of other algos that can fulfill those needs then I am open to being swayed.

@einsteinium Thank you for the kind words. I spent enough time on the forums/phone to agitate my wife. Whoops! Oh, and thank you for doing very well at listening and respecting the community. Great work so far!

[etoque]

I'm going to keep my observations brief and succinct.

Those among you who are complaining are getting exactly what you asked for and now you don't like it.

YOU are the ones who begged people to vote to get this coin listed on exchanges and now you're complaining about the attention you're being given as a coin.

You could limit this coin to only being mined by dilythium crystals and still creative developers would some how find a way to circumvent your road blocks and utilize technology to get a leg up on the mining competition. Change and advancement are inevitable are like a runaway train - can never be stopped.

You wanted a monetary value set on your coins and now the people who make their business leveraging the monetary value of literally anything are set to pounce with newer and faster technology and you don't like it - so you're solution is to go back to the stone age... I think Albert Einstein would be sadly disappointed.

You can resist change or you can embrace and exploit it when it comes - SO WHAT if people can mine your coin faster. Are you coin hogs afraid that it will drive down the value of your nest eggs or are you really altruistic and protecting the coin?

I have a solution for you. If you are really as altruistic as you profess to be then pursue will all possible diligence having the coin removed from all exchanges then mining will only be done by those truly interested in the coin for it's implied value and not it's monetary value - but as long as you stay listed on exchanges, the coin will posses a monetary value and be mined as quickly as possible by those who can for it's value - so it's simple - remove it's value and they asic whales will simply ignore you.

my humble .00000002

No monetary value equal no raising found, equal no more emc2,cause its is first goal,raise found for science ! So,it need to be valuable in term !

[jjj0923]

not true - establish your own private exchange and have the exchange set a value. simple as that.

[Timespace]

That is misleading. ASICs were not created because of EMC2. They were created because of the popularity of scrypt. I think all the attention EMC2 has received is positive. Thinking about it, that's a first for me. Seems like every coin I am interested in has something bad happen in the first month. It is the norm with cryptos. Okay now I have jinxed it. Seriously though, I don't see a lot of complaining here. It is more of a discussion relevant to the times. I know if I had plunked down 10k or a 100k on some ASICs I would be on a campaign to get as many coins as I could staying with scrypt. That way I can jump around more for profit.

[etoque]

not true - establish your own private exchange and have the exchange set a value. simple as that.

I think is not fair at all,is not this game in cryptoworld,we need to grow,raising found,having fun and just need some time.

[Timespace]

Basically we should centralize the price of EMC2? Would not work very well in crypto land.

[jjj0923]

Basically we should centralize the price of EMC2? Would not work very well in crypto land.

well then - you can't have your cake and eat it to....


I think what many of you fail to recognize is that these expensive mining rigs add ligitimacy to the world of virtual currency mining and you folks and this industry will stopped being viewed as a bunch of social hermits hovering in their basements over mining rigs.

People and companies sit up and take notice when intelligent people plop down $15k for a serious mining rig and a rising tide raises all ships. These new rigs will raise the value of all coins, not diminish the value because they coins just like bitcoin will become harder and harder to mine.

my .0000003 this time.

[sunny168]

Nice to see bounties being put in place here. Where are you guys getting the funds tho? Your own personal stash? Good leadership

[derbrause]

Keep it coming guys - The whole team is reading every single post very interested!
We waited for the time when the discussion will take place so please dont let it die... discuss the x11 pro's and con's.

A little fuel:
We looked up the code and were able to see that the current 'power savings' are just temporary as the algo itself is very bad in shape so its not properly configured which leads to less work for the card. So if its 'optimized' ( which is something bad in this case :-) ) in the future that energy saving 'feature' will fall apart but the hashrate will rise because of optimiziation.
Furthermore all algos used in x11 are optimized for ASICs :-)

--
Bounties:
The bountys are out of personal stash and - Please dont forget this: There is still .5% in the funding wallet dedicated for marketing purpose. Currently we are pinning a list internally with stuff what an urgent todo is and could be 'outsourced' :-).

[etoque]

Basically we should centralize the price of EMC2? Would not work very well in crypto land.

well then - you can't have your cake and eat it to....

Patience... Take a time off computer,enjoy the life and think about you do something very nice ! Mining again cancer,and next month other good move for all of us

[etoque]

Keep it coming guys - The whole team is reading every single post very interested!
We waited for the time when the discussion will take place so please dont let it die... discuss the x11 pro's and con's.

A little fuel:
We looked up the code and were able to see that the current 'power savings' are just temporary as the algo itself is very bad in shape so its not properly configured which leads to less work for the card. So if its 'optimized' ( which is something bad in this case :-) ) in the future that energy saving 'feature' will fall apart but the hashrate will rise because of optimiziation.
Furthermore all algos used in x11 are optimized for ASICs :-)

That a nice thing ! Future are very good with this coin

[HwM]

I'm going to keep my observations brief and succinct.

Those among you who are complaining are getting exactly what you asked for and now you don't like it.

YOU are the ones who begged people to vote to get this coin listed on exchanges and now you're complaining about the attention you're being given as a coin.

You could limit this coin to only being mined by dilythium crystals and still creative developers would some how find a way to circumvent your road blocks and utilize technology to get a leg up on the mining competition. Change and advancement are inevitable are like a runaway train - can never be stopped.

You wanted a monetary value set on your coins and now the people who make their business leveraging the monetary value of literally anything are set to pounce with newer and faster technology and you don't like it - so you're solution is to go back to the stone age... I think Albert Einstein would be sadly disappointed.

You can resist change or you can embrace and exploit it when it comes - SO WHAT if people can mine your coin faster. Are you coin hogs afraid that it will drive down the value of your nest eggs or are you really altruistic and protecting the coin?

I have a solution for you. If you are really as altruistic as you profess to be then pursue will all possible diligence having the coin removed from all exchanges then mining will only be done by those truly interested in the coin for it's implied value and not it's monetary value - but as long as you stay listed on exchanges, the coin will posses a monetary value and be mined as quickly as possible by those who can for it's value - so it's simple - remove it's value and they asic whales will simply ignore you.

my humble .00000002

ASIC miner yourself right? Haha, so obvious. You don't even try to come up with real arguments.

[jjj0923]

20 gridseeds and a rig with 5 MSI R9 280x's

a little of both - though I prefer the rig - it's fun - the gridseeds are just brainless pods. No fun but they pay the electric bill for the GPU's : LOL!

and my argument are real and legitimate - some folks here just refuse to acknowledge reality and want it both ways...and sorry - you can't have it both ways - sure you can go way of Ultracoin which no one is interested in and it's lack of value or evidence to that fact. I wouldn't waste one watt mining it. I'd rather burn a light all night - at least with the light bulb - I get something in return: LIGHT!