Buy the DIP, and HODL!

[Wind_FURY]

I never “proclaimed” anything, it was you who kept on posting that DCA is superior, and everything else is inferior. I was merely saying that waiting, and buying low by buying the DIP has its advantages too, than blindly buying every week/month/quarter at any price.

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[1714585078]

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[JayJuanGee]

I never “proclaimed” anything, it was you who kept on posting that DCA is superior, and everything else is inferior. I was merely saying that waiting, and buying low by buying the DIP has its advantages too, than blindly buying every week/month/quarter at any price.

Have we beaten this horse to death including discussions of the various considerations that cause various methods to have a lot more benefits?  

In the end, individuals need to plug those considerations into their own situation, so for example if they have a cashflow or lump sum available and how close are they to their targets including that if we are frequently discussion the situations of newbies who have little information about bitcoin versus someone who has been in the space for a while.  

Likely some other factors too that cause the various methods to be better or worse, including that there might not need to be all or nothing, either in terms of chosen method or a combination of methods.. but if there is all or nothing, then DCA tends to be recognized to check off a lot more considerations in terms of newbies and just getting started with any investment (bitcoin of course)... and of course, works with other investments too, even though our focus in this thread is bitcoin specifically.

[Wind_FURY]

I never “proclaimed” anything, it was you who kept on posting that DCA is superior, and everything else is inferior. I was merely saying that waiting, and buying low by buying the DIP has its advantages too, than blindly buying every week/month/quarter at any price.

Have we beaten this horse to death including discussions of the various considerations that cause various methods to have a lot more benefits?  

It’s you who have been beating that horse to death. I’m merely here just encouraging everyone, especially plebs like me, to Buy the DIP, and HODL, because it’s what I have been doing since I opened this topic.

[Wind_FURY]

I have been debating, playing devil’s advocate against JayJuanGee about bull cycles. I believe a good hypothesis for JJG’s debate for a longer cycle for the current bull market is illustrated in this image. HODLers.

[JayJuanGee]

I have been debating trolling, playing devil’s advocate against JayJuanGee about bull cycles. I believe a good hypothesis for JJG’s debate for a longer cycle for the current bull market is illustrated in this image. HODLers.

FTFY

I am not even saying longer cycles, except to say this particular cycle could drag out as late as 3rd quarter..

Here's my attempt to answer the question regarding how high of a probability for the top of this cycle dragging out until 3rd quarter of 2022.

Here's my attempt to not even get into the weeds of talking about what I had already assigned as a 5% probability that the top for this cycle could end up dragging out past the third quarter of 2022.

[Wind_FURY]

I have been debating trolling, playing devil’s advocate against JayJuanGee about bull cycles. I believe a good hypothesis for JJG’s debate for a longer cycle for the current bull market is illustrated in this image. HODLers.

FTFY

I am not even saying longer cycles, except to say this particular cycle could drag out as late as 3rd quarter..

Here's my attempt to answer the question regarding how high of a probability for the top of this cycle dragging out until 3rd quarter of 2022.

Here's my attempt to not even get into the weeds of talking about what I had already assigned as a 5% probability that the top for this cycle could end up dragging out past the third quarter of 2022.

Am I trolling? I have my own topic that I opened debating that the current cycle WILL be longer because of inflation, https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5319233.0

I truly believe it because none of whoever will take over as the Fed Chairman will be a person like who Volker was. They will say they will “taper” and increase rates, but they will never do it in my opinion.

[Wind_FURY]

The Bitcoin sign guy was telling everyone to Buy Bitcoin. I believe this was during July 2017? The people who listened, and actually HODLed have made an evidently good investment.

[Wind_FURY]

“Perspective” by Bitcoiner JCastros posted in Twitter.



Bitcoin, and its value, is not a consequence of one market cycle, or all of the cycles of its past. As a multi-generational protocol, there will be more market cycles, with price discovery lasting DECADES.

[StreakW]

Cryptocurrency investment, especially bitcoin, is now increasingly popular with many people to adopt it. Bitcoin's future growth is even higher. this can be seen from the growth in the price of bitcoin which continues to soar from year to year. Therefore, even though the current bitcoin price is high, we can still buy and hold for the long term. Keep in mind that bitcoin's fundamentals are very strong and investing in the long term will be very profitable.

[Wind_FURY]

Cryptocurrency investment, especially bitcoin, is now increasingly popular with many people to adopt it. Bitcoin's future growth is even higher. this can be seen from the growth in the price of bitcoin which continues to soar from year to year. Therefore, even though the current bitcoin price is high, we can still buy and hold for the long term. Keep in mind that bitcoin's fundamentals are very strong and investing in the long term will be very profitable.

Haha. An “investment”? I believe the longer we HODL, it would no longer be considered as merely an “investment”. It would start to be considered an actual transition from fiat to Bitcoin. Because then why are we here?

[leea-1334]

Haha. An “investment”? I believe the longer we HODL, it would no longer be considered as merely an “investment”. It would start to be considered an actual transition from fiat to Bitcoin. Because then why are we here?

I have to agree with you,,, speaking for myself and those I know who seriously hodl Bitcoin, it is already passed the point of investment but reached to the point of transitioning. Of course still we cannot spend it as much as we would like but already I gamble and pay close friends in crypto whenever possible because who wants to hold on to fiat that keeps losing value?

Then again,,, many other people I know do see BTC as investment, with no plans of hodling too long and exiting as soon as they see a profit they like.

[Wind_FURY]

Haha. An “investment”? I believe the longer we HODL, it would no longer be considered as merely an “investment”. It would start to be considered an actual transition from fiat to Bitcoin. Because then why are we here?

I have to agree with you,,, speaking for myself and those I know who seriously hodl Bitcoin, it is already passed the point of investment but reached to the point of transitioning. Of course still we cannot spend it as much as we would like but already I gamble and pay close friends in crypto whenever possible because who wants to hold on to fiat that keeps losing value?

Then again,,, many other people I know do see BTC as investment, with no plans of hodling too long and exiting as soon as they see a profit they like.

That’s very understandable, and they should trade according to their nature. But we also have the Forex traders, they too invest, or trade from one fiat currency to another. I believe Bitcoin will merely become one of those currencies.

[JayJuanGee]

Haha. An “investment”? I believe the longer we HODL, it would no longer be considered as merely an “investment”. It would start to be considered an actual transition from fiat to Bitcoin. Because then why are we here?

I have to agree with you,,, speaking for myself and those I know who seriously hodl Bitcoin, it is already passed the point of investment but reached to the point of transitioning. Of course still we cannot spend it as much as we would like but already I gamble and pay close friends in crypto whenever possible because who wants to hold on to fiat that keeps losing value?

Then again,,, many other people I know do see BTC as investment, with no plans of hodling too long and exiting as soon as they see a profit they like.

That’s very understandable, and they should trade according to their nature. But we also have the Forex traders, they too invest, or trade from one fiat currency to another. I believe Bitcoin will merely become one of those currencies.

It seems to be confusing to be engaged in a process of convoluting various kinds of investments and suggesting that you are doing something more profound than investing.  There is nothing wrong with investing and many times people do consider various allocations and also ways to consider how long they want to stay in an investment - 4 years or longer is good for a starting point consideration.  I also find a more meaningful distinction to be made between investing and gambling.. and sure there are different kinds of trading too.., so if there is a lot of playing around with large portions of a stash, then there would likely be a lot of gambling involved, but some traders in bitcoin will also ONLY trade with a small portion of their stash and/or they might only trade larger swings... We are getting some of the traders from Forex markets coming over to bitcoin, so yeah if there are those large in and outs of bitcoin, then it would be harder to consider those guys as having longer term investments into bitcoin.

Another thing would be that presumptively the longer that any of us are in bitcoin, we would be building our bitcoin stash - but depending on where we are at we may discontinue building the quantity of bitcoin, even if the value of the bitcoin would be going up in terms of the dollar amounts.  So, there do be benefits in setting goals that might be measured in either quantity of bitcoin or dollar value or even utilization of both of those unit of accounts to assess both where a BTC investor is at and how s/he intends to play his/her bitcoin stash. 

For example, if there might be a goal to get to $2 million valuation based on 208-week moving average (which is currently around $17,500), then there would be a need to get up to 114.3 BTC, but the 208-week moving average is continuing to move up at a pretty rapid rate, so the quantity of BTC needed to reach such $2 million valuation target is moving down, and with uncertainties of times, there may be some feeling that no one really wants to prematurely pull the fuck you lever, so even if s/he is using a conservative way to measure BTC value, there might be some desires to reach some level that is higher than one's own established fuck you entry-level, and to get higher quantities before feeling sufficiently comfortable to pull the fuck you lever.

Part of my point is that managing where you are at in your Bitcoin journey can make a pretty big difference in terms of how you consider treating your bitcoin holdings, so if you are in BTC accumulation mode, you are going to treat your BTC strategy differently from someone who may be getting close to reaching accumulation targets and then transitioning into a maintenance mode, a liquidation mode and of course, there can be combinations of such modes, too.

[Wind_FURY]

The stupidity in “blockchain technology” land. But this is very BULLISH for Bitcoin. Headlines like this is an example that more dumb money will go to shitcoins, then Bitcoin. Buy the DIP, and HODL.

[Wind_FURY]

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/culture/hillary-clinton-fears-bitcoin-will-undermine-dollar-as-world-reserve-currency

Former democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton spoke about Bitcoin and crypto’s ability to weaken governments during a video panel discussion at the Bloomberg New Economy Forum in Singapore on Friday.

Hillary warned, “What looks like a very interesting and somewhat exotic effort to literally mine new coins in order to trade with them has the potential for undermining currencies, for undermining the role of the dollar as the reserve currency, for destabilizing nations, perhaps starting with small ones but going much larger.”

Few understand, and it includes Hillary Clinton.

BUT her blame, I believe, is wrong. Instead of blaming Bitcoin, she should blame the people behind the current banking/fiat/financial system on why Bitcoin can potentially undermine the U.S. Dollar as the reserve currency.



Buy the DIP, and HODL!

[Wind_FURY]

Who is underming the the current financial system. It’s not just happening in the United States, it is global as well. Don’t be scammed by their narratives that it’s an external entity causing the destabilization. It’s internal, caused by their own BRRRRR-money printing.

[Wind_FURY]

Again we have been reading some bearish posts, and bearish expectations. How fast does the mood change? We can be sure that those who sold would also be the first to FOMO back in Bitcoin.  It’s always the same for some people, sell low, buy high.

[JayJuanGee]

One of the simple things is that if someone buys crypto from the dip and hold it , he must be able to make a good profit, otherwise if he cannot buy from the dip, the percentage will be reduced. Especially if the newcomers are doing this job i.e. bypassing the dip and then selling it then they will definitely be able to make good profit.

We are not talking about buying crypto here.. that would be dumb.

We are talking about buying bitcoin.

We are also not talking about selling...

So if you have some long term imagination or even enough a timeline that is 4-10 years into the future, ongoing buying is good and buying on dips is good to supplement your long term plans to accumulate BTC.. and maybe after 4- 10 years, you might reconsider if you still want to continue to buy or just hold or maybe consider if you might want to sell some.. later down the road.. not fucking around with short-term profits.. but hoping for longer term accumulation of a large enough BTC stash in order to feel like it was a good investment...

[Wind_FURY]

One of the simple things is that if someone buys crypto from the dip and hold it , he must be able to make a good profit, otherwise if he cannot buy from the dip, the percentage will be reduced. Especially if the newcomers are doing this job i.e. bypassing the dip and then selling it then they will definitely be able to make good profit.

We are not talking about buying crypto here.. that would be dumb.

We are talking about buying bitcoin.

We are also not talking about selling...

So if you have some long term imagination or even enough a timeline that is 4-10 years into the future, ongoing buying is good and buying on dips is good to supplement your long term plans to accumulate BTC.. and maybe after 4- 10 years, you might reconsider if you still want to continue to buy or just hold or maybe consider if you might want to sell some.. later down the road.. not fucking around with short-term profits.. but hoping for longer term accumulation of a large enough BTC stash in order to feel like it was a good investment...

Because we are not merely “investing”, and if you ask me, HODLing Bitcoin is something every individual should do “just in case” you need to utilize Bitcoin’s main value proposition. Censorship-resistance. It is something you think you might not need, until you are forced in a situation that you might need it.

[JayJuanGee]

One of the simple things is that if someone buys crypto from the dip and hold it , he must be able to make a good profit, otherwise if he cannot buy from the dip, the percentage will be reduced. Especially if the newcomers are doing this job i.e. bypassing the dip and then selling it then they will definitely be able to make good profit.

We are not talking about buying crypto here.. that would be dumb.

We are talking about buying bitcoin.

We are also not talking about selling...

So if you have some long term imagination or even enough a timeline that is 4-10 years into the future, ongoing buying is good and buying on dips is good to supplement your long term plans to accumulate BTC.. and maybe after 4- 10 years, you might reconsider if you still want to continue to buy or just hold or maybe consider if you might want to sell some.. later down the road.. not fucking around with short-term profits.. but hoping for longer term accumulation of a large enough BTC stash in order to feel like it was a good investment...

Because we are not merely “investing”, and if you ask me, HODLing Bitcoin is something every individual should do “just in case” you need to utilize Bitcoin’s main value proposition. Censorship-resistance. It is something you think you might not need, until you are forced in a situation that you might need it.

Well like you mentioned, you can call what you are doing what you would like to call it.  You can also establish whatever timeline that you would like, which would also influence your thinking about the matter and your approach  If you are into bitcoin for possible value appreciation or you believe that bitcoin gives you choices/options that you might not otherwise have, then those are your own choices regarding framing of the matter, too.

Of course getting into bitcoin does seem to provide a lot more options, and with the passage of time, part of the seeming value proposition of bitcoin continues to be that its likelihood of down or going to zero becomes less and less the longer that it is in existence - but as an individual, even if you create a 1, 2, 4, 10 year or longer timeline for yourself to be into bitcoin, you have the power to override your earlier decision, change your mind abandon the investment or whatever you would like to do.   

So, yes surely one of the reasons to be into bitcoin would be seeming to have more options, and of course, the better that you play your investment into bitcoin, the seeming likelihood that your options will expand even more.. so part of the reason that I had emphasized the longer term way of attempting to consider the matter - even though surely people are free to just consider bitcoin in some kind of a shorter-term time frame - but seems to me that even the premise of the title of this thread (even though you might not have even been clear about some of the underlying implications upon the creation of the thread) is that it considers bitcoin in a kind of  longer time frame.. that is why you at least used the term "HODL" within the title.

At some point weren't you even considering changing the title of the thread to something more specific and weird that would try to particularize what you individually think about when and how to buy on dips and maybe not always to buy on dips or some other nonsense like that - because 1) you seemed to be trying to get away from my ongoing refrain about the preferability of DCA in terms of when it doubt buy rather then getting caught up about how much of a dip and if the dip is maximized and all those kinds of difficult to actually carry out in practices, and 2) you were worried that sometimes buying on dips could cause the running out of money if buying too soon - especially if we were to prematurely go into a bear market? 

Furthermore, you were also going through a kind of adamant and stubborn phase of NOT wanting to tell newbies to buy BTC or to even go so far as to tell them not to buy (was that occurring for most of 2021, and maybe even ramped up in the May/June/July time... and I am not even saying that you had not been doing that at various times in 2020 too), which I also spent a lot of time battling those kinds of emphasis on HODL and wait ideas, including my considerations that it was advise that was probably more hurtful rather than helpful... and our subsequent BTC price performance has largely been showing that ongoing buying of BTC probably remains as the best of strategies, even if psychologically it can feel better to have some supplemental strategies to attempt to buy on dips, too... and then just HODL when running out of money.. which also can sometimes happen.. and even no matter how long any of us are into BTC, it is ongoingly difficult to know exactly what mistakes people are going to make or even the reality of the difficulties to both determine the extent of any dip or how long such dips are going to last... even if there are a variety of structural ways that people (even newbies) can attempt to plan in advance so that they are not too likely to run out of money for buying, even if the BTC price dips lower than expected and longer than expected.