Presidential debates

[ololajulo]

Eh I don't know about him only having the first 30 mins to do so. Most people won't even end up watching the debate, they'll just watch the highlights. But I understand where you're coming from here.

Totally agree with Theymos here though, Trump TRULY has to make Biden fuck up a ton and continue the line of 'Biden is mentally unable to be the President' while not making himself look crazy in the process. It's going to be much harder to paint him as horribly corrupt because ya know, Biden is NOT Clinton. Though Trump can point to the fact that Biden has been in government for the past 40 something yrs and nothing has changed.

30 mins folks!

Keep in mind, most people have already made up their mind on who they're going to vote for so they don't need the entire debate to make up their mind. So first impressions are going to matter. Also consider, itt's a Tuesday night and middle working class people that spend their day hard at work are going to have a short attention span. These are working people, family people, that aren't going to spend their evenings glued to the screen for an hour and a half.

These are also the people that don't bother with highlights. The average American hardly cares about politics, frankly. And I don't think the highlight reals will highlight Joe Biden's slurred speech or incoherent statements if he makes them, so that's another hurdle for Trump. He needs to make his case early and hope Joe Biden messed up early.

Well said, the debate is changing no ones mind on choice in election. The latest Trump illness will play sympathy from few more but the other party is trying not to play politics with it. News and TV media have been restless with the illness and I dont think play any disaster in the poll if the health condition of the president deteriorate.

[vapourminer]

Yeah I think filing deadlines for a good amount of states have passed at this point. Not fully sure if someone could replace Trump (or Biden) on the ticket at this point. That's not even thinking about the fact that TONS of people have already voted by mail, and those votes can not be changed even if the candidate has died or has become incapacitated in some way up to this point.

I suppose Congress could delay the election, but we're too deadlocked to even let that happen. You'd need both sides of congress to agree on that, and the GOP controls the Senate while the DNC controls the House.

In summary: If one of them dies, the other will most likely win and that'll be the end of the election.

pretty sure that the rules are that if trump is incapacitated or croaks before the election is settled any existing vote for him goes to whoever republican candidate is then picked by the republican party. so pense i assume, and a new vp is chosen by the republican party. so previously cast votes get counted for the same party no matter who drops out. its up to the party itself to pick a replacement.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Electoral_College

[PrimeNumber7]

Yeah I think filing deadlines for a good amount of states have passed at this point. Not fully sure if someone could replace Trump (or Biden) on the ticket at this point. That's not even thinking about the fact that TONS of people have already voted by mail, and those votes can not be changed even if the candidate has died or has become incapacitated in some way up to this point.

I suppose Congress could delay the election, but we're too deadlocked to even let that happen. You'd need both sides of congress to agree on that, and the GOP controls the Senate while the DNC controls the House.

In summary: If one of them dies, the other will most likely win and that'll be the end of the election.

IMO if either Trump or Biden drops out of the race, their party will likely try to prevent the other side from being able get 270 electorial college votes so that Congress will get to decide who becomes President for the next term.

If Congress decides the next election, each state will get to cast one vote, based on their delegation at the next congress.  Currently Republicans have at least 26 votes, and it is unclear how many Democrats would have.

I would expect Democrats to try to hold up state elections in court through when the electrical college must meet according to the constitution. They will also likely try to hold up congressional elections in states of which would vote Republican based on their delegation.

If Congress cannot decide who will become the next President, it will be as if both the President and Vice President died, and whoever is in line after the VP to become President will become President. According to statute, this would be Speak of the House, Nancy Pelosi, then Senator Chuck Grassley, then Secretary of State Mike Pompeo (it doesn't matter after this point). The Constitution says that no person can be both President and a member of the legleslative branch (a congressmen or Senator) at the same time, so in order for Pelosi or Grassley to be eligible to be president, they would need to resign from Congress/Senate, however if they resign from the legleslature, they would no longer hold the position that makes them to be in line to be President per statute. This means Secretary of State Mike Pompeo has a decent chance of being President early next year.

[squatz1]

Yeah I think filing deadlines for a good amount of states have passed at this point. Not fully sure if someone could replace Trump (or Biden) on the ticket at this point. That's not even thinking about the fact that TONS of people have already voted by mail, and those votes can not be changed even if the candidate has died or has become incapacitated in some way up to this point.

I suppose Congress could delay the election, but we're too deadlocked to even let that happen. You'd need both sides of congress to agree on that, and the GOP controls the Senate while the DNC controls the House.

In summary: If one of them dies, the other will most likely win and that'll be the end of the election.

pretty sure that the rules are that if trump is incapacitated or croaks before the election is settled any existing vote for him goes to whoever republican candidate is then picked by the republican party. so pense i assume, and a new vp is chosen by the republican party. so previously cast votes get counted for the same party no matter who drops out. its up to the party itself to pick a replacement.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Electoral_College

Well this more of the case regarding if they died after the election but before the electoral college went and voted.

I'm talking about if one of the candidates were to die in the next few days or a week or so -- a lot of people have already voted by mail, and those votes would already be allocated. Not sure how state rules relate to wanting to change your vote once it's been sent in to the board of elections.

Yeah I think filing deadlines for a good amount of states have passed at this point. Not fully sure if someone could replace Trump (or Biden) on the ticket at this point. That's not even thinking about the fact that TONS of people have already voted by mail, and those votes can not be changed even if the candidate has died or has become incapacitated in some way up to this point.

I suppose Congress could delay the election, but we're too deadlocked to even let that happen. You'd need both sides of congress to agree on that, and the GOP controls the Senate while the DNC controls the House.

In summary: If one of them dies, the other will most likely win and that'll be the end of the election.

IMO if either Trump or Biden drops out of the race, their party will likely try to prevent the other side from being able get 270 electorial college votes so that Congress will get to decide who becomes President for the next term.

If Congress decides the next election, each state will get to cast one vote, based on their delegation at the next congress.  Currently Republicans have at least 26 votes, and it is unclear how many Democrats would have.

I would expect Democrats to try to hold up state elections in court through when the electrical college must meet according to the constitution. They will also likely try to hold up congressional elections in states of which would vote Republican based on their delegation.

If Congress cannot decide who will become the next President, it will be as if both the President and Vice President died, and whoever is in line after the VP to become President will become President. According to statute, this would be Speak of the House, Nancy Pelosi, then Senator Chuck Grassley, then Secretary of State Mike Pompeo (it doesn't matter after this point). The Constitution says that no person can be both President and a member of the legleslative branch (a congressmen or Senator) at the same time, so in order for Pelosi or Grassley to be eligible to be president, they would need to resign from Congress/Senate, however if they resign from the legleslature, they would no longer hold the position that makes them to be in line to be President per statute. This means Secretary of State Mike Pompeo has a decent chance of being President early next year.

The tough part is ya know -- not letting the other person get to 270 if one person is dead. Hard to get to that point, lol.

[Gyfts]

Post debate poll - https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/7221894-200781-NBCWSJ-October-Post-Debate-Poll-1b.html

800 Registered voters, Biden 53, Trump 39; (+14 Biden).

This is before Trump's COVID-19 diagnosis too, Trump is getting clobbered... Looking back on the debate, I don't even think on policy Trump lost at all. If he wasn't a dumb ass and stopped interrupting, I think he could have won. Biden doesn't need much help to slur his words so it was such a bizarre and useless strategy to keep interrupting that bit him in the ass. Trump went so aggressive, which Biden pretty much took the bait on and also went a bit unhinged, which made nobody change their mind that night, causing Trump to suffer a net loss. MAYBE, the silver lining is that the poll is registered voters and not likely voters but I'm not optimistic. If he loses, oh well. 3 SCOTUS picks would be great if Amy Barrett can get confirmed.

[suchmoon]

3 SCOTUS picks would be great if Amy Barrett can get confirmed.

Trump - being a genius that he is - managed to complicate that as well by infecting 3 GOP senators... and no, I'm not saying he personally licked them and gave them the virus but the idiotic lack of social distancing, masks, etc at White House events and other Trump-related gatherings seems to be where it spread. Now some other dumbass (Tom Cotton?) is saying that they should just bring the sick senators to vote if needed. So what if some fossils catch it and die... you get your judge, that's all that matters.

[TwitchySeal]

3 SCOTUS picks would be great if Amy Barrett can get confirmed.

Trump being a genius that he is managed to complicate that as well by infecting 3 GOP senators... and no, I'm not saying he personally licked them and gave them the virus but the idiotic lack of social distancing, masks, etc at White House events and other Trump-related gatherings seems to be where it spread. Now some other dumbass (Tom Cotton?) is saying that they should just bring the sick senators to vote if needed. So what if some fossils catch it and die... you get your judge, that's all that matters.

here come the murdered baby comments!

[Philipma1957cellphone]

Well looks like Trump team Is hoping to get Trump out of the hospital and debate Biden.

UNLESS Biden is afraid of doing it. I HEARD four Republicans say Trump is getting well and wants to show you can push through the illness.

[theymos]

I HEARD four Republicans say Trump is getting well and wants to show you can push through the illness.

If he personally tries to risk his life on this, then I respect his determination, but I hope that he doesn't try to send a general message of "coronavirus is harmless, look at me!". I hate that he's allowed "not wearing a mask" to become some sort of political statement. I'm opposed to mandatory closures and mask mandates, but not wearing a mask just for the sake of tribalism is completely braindead, and a leader encouraging this is just hurting his own faction. It's like Trump mailing all registered Republicans coupons for sky diving, hard liquor, and cigarettes, and telling them that real patriots aren't pussies.

[TwitchySeal]

It's like Trump mailing all registered Republicans coupons for sky diving, hard liquor, and cigarettes, and telling them that real patriots aren't pussies.

Or just the republican Senators the day before the SCOTUS confirmation vote.

[nutildah]

I hate that he's allowed "not wearing a mask" to become some sort of political statement. I'm opposed to mandatory closures and mask mandates, but not wearing a mask just for the sake of tribalism is completely braindead, and a leader encouraging this is just hurting his own faction.

Now's a great chance for Trump to demonstrate that he is capable of humility. Now that the virus has personally affected him, maybe his outlook on it will change and he will be a bit more sensitive toward the problem. I notice he's already stopped calling it the "China virus" which is a good first step forward.

[Spendulus]

I hate that he's allowed "not wearing a mask" to become some sort of political statement. I'm opposed to mandatory closures and mask mandates, but not wearing a mask just for the sake of tribalism is completely braindead, and a leader encouraging this is just hurting his own faction.

Now's a great chance for Trump to demonstrate that he is capable of humility. Now that the virus has personally affected him, maybe his outlook on it will change and he will be a bit more sensitive toward the problem. I notice he's already stopped calling it the "China virus" which is a good first step forward.

I knew all along that MAGA was positively infectious.

(a joke)

Covid doesn't seem that dangerous, according to WHO.

https://twitter.com/AlexBerenson/status/1312180625412038656

[TwitchySeal]

Trump campaign communications director on Fox:

"The President has experience, now, fighting the coronavirus as an individual. Those firsthand experiences, Joe Biden, he doesn’t have those."

I hope that he doesn't try to send a general message of "coronavirus is harmless, look at me!".

Sorry to disappoint.

[JayJuanGee]

Trump campaign communications director on Fox:

"The President has experience, now, fighting the coronavirus as an individual. Those firsthand experiences, Joe Biden, he doesn’t have those."

Do these experiences also cause Trump to be able to empathize with any other human besides his lil selfie?

I would suspect that one of the qualifications of any person holding a public office or seeking to hold a public office should be to attempt to represent the interests and needs of people, and seems a bit difficult if the only people that such purported representative is capable of representing is his lil selfie. 

Sure, indirectly, Trump may well end up representing some American peeps that happen to be similarly situated to himself, but seems to me that the needs and aspirations of America is much more diverse than the profile of one person, even if such person happens to be a perfect person, such as we all recognize the red-headed self-absorbed dweeb to be.

[BADecker]

I saw a sign today that said:

               
    Any     
               
   Adult   
               
               
    2020   
               

Trump and Biden Squabble While America Burns

In one of the evening's few substantive exchanges, President Trump rightly criticized Vice President Biden for saying he would listen to the "scientists" in determining whether to lock down the country. President Trump also acknowledged that the lockdowns were a harmful over-reaction that needs to end.

Unfortunately, President Trump once again pledged that Covid vaccines would soon be available. This raises the specter of a repeat of the swine flu debacle where a vaccine rushed into production for political purposes caused more deaths than the swine flu itself. President Trump also raised concerns about mandatory Covid vaccinations by suggesting the military would be in charge of vaccine distribution.

Vice President Biden vehemently denied he was a socialist, while championing increased spending, taxes, regulations, expanded Obamacare, and a modified "Green New Deal." Biden may not consider himself a socialist, but if his economic plans were implemented it would take America further down the road to socialism — and serfdom.

President Trump also denounced socialism, while bragging about his own big government policies such as tariffs, massive spending increases, and plans to maintain the "popular" provisions of Obamacare.

[theymos]

Sorry to disappoint.

Damn it... That isn't even good politics by any stretch of the imagination. It maybe appeals to some of his base, but it turns off a lot of people.

I agree that people shouldn't "live in fear"; a lot of the lockdown actions have gone way too far. But it's like driving (which is also quite dangerous!): you shouldn't live in fear or let the risk control your life, but you should also wear a seatbelt and drive carefully.

It's looking like Trump is going to get destroyed in this election, in large part because he just can't get beyond his own irrationality, narcissism, and tribalism. It's frustrating to watch, since Biden is a terrible candidate who represents an awful ideology. I think we're all kind of expecting due to 2016 that things will at least shift somewhat in Trump's favor, but with current polling Biden is on track to win in a historic landslide. And it's even possible that polls will be wrong in Biden's favor this time around, especially since pollsters might well have over-compensated after 2016: margins of error go both ways.

[suchmoon]

Well looks like Trump team Is hoping to get Trump out of the hospital and debate Biden.

UNLESS Biden is afraid of doing it. I HEARD four Republicans say Trump is getting well and wants to show you can push through the illness.

Biden has already said that he's ready to debate if experts advise of a safe way to do it. Trump in a hazmat suit could be good for TV ratings, the only thing he genuinely cares about.

[Spendulus]

...President Trump rightly criticized Vice President Biden for saying he would listen to the "scientists" in determining whether to lock down the country. President Trump also acknowledged that the lockdowns were a harmful over-reaction that needs to end.....

One lockdown policy for the wilds of Montana, the New Mexico desert, and the crowded, dirty slums of New York?

I think Trump has it pretty much right in leaving such policy decisions to the states.

[Gyfts]

3 SCOTUS picks would be great if Amy Barrett can get confirmed.

Trump - being a genius that he is - managed to complicate that as well by infecting 3 GOP senators... and no, I'm not saying he personally licked them and gave them the virus but the idiotic lack of social distancing, masks, etc at White House events and other Trump-related gatherings seems to be where it spread. Now some other dumbass (Tom Cotton?) is saying that they should just bring the sick senators to vote if needed. So what if some fossils catch it and die... you get your judge, that's all that matters.

I didn't know which senators tested positive, but ofc health and safety come first. If they're asymptomatic, a virtual confirmation hearing would be fine as long as they feel physically okay. Under no circumstances should someone test positive for COVID and then show up to vote.

[Spendulus]

....Under no circumstances should someone test positive for COVID and then show up to vote.

Sure they can. They don't have to show up in the crowded room, they can go into the Senate room empty at night and in a spacesuit and post their vote.