Christians genocide in Nigeria.

[Crytohillss]

I had to carefully read through your entry and from what I see happening even if this whole things appears to be a form of Christian genocide happening in Nigeria I feel like it's beyond the way we see everything and I also feel like this things are sponsored propaganda but then my worry is how do people become so careless about human life and for whatever reason and or whatever interest put out another persons life as a result of trying to prove a point.

Also the federal government of Nigeria has never at any of the different times put in certain measures to either stop or reduce the rate of this killings and what this only tells me is that in the mist of all of this, the government still doesn't care about her citizens.

Of course, genocide is happening in Nigeria but i don't think that it is being targeted at Christians alone. Even the Muslims are also facing genocide because you can't tell me that the massacre that happened in a community in Jos Plateau state was targeted on Christians. I don't believe that these killings happening is being sponsored, it's just aggrieved bandits and herders that are causing this mayhem because of their rifts between local farmers.
   I don't know why the Nigerian government has been unable to address the issues of herds men and local communities. They better find a lasting solution to these killings if not a time will come when some communities will also equip themselves with rifles and ammunitions in order to fight back.

What's happening in places like Nigeria is not just tribes fighting each other  I think that's a very way of simplified way of demonstrating complex issues like colonial era also government is not something people can just copy from the US or UK and expect it to work the same way those systems develop over centuries through theirs own conflict, mistakes and specific historical conditions there is already so many intelligent people and policy makers in Africa working on these problems the issue is not that individuals can't think normal , it's that the challenges are truly deeply rooted and require help from other foriegn country.

[Johnlomape]

Of course, genocide is happening in Nigeria but i don't think that it is being targeted at Christians alone. Even the Muslims are also facing genocide because you can't tell me that the massacre that happened in a community in Jos Plateau state was targeted on Christians. I don't believe that these killings happening is being sponsored, it's just aggrieved bandits and herders that are causing this mayhem because of their rifts between local farmers.
   I don't know why the Nigerian government has been unable to address the issues of herds men and local communities. They better find a lasting solution to these killings if not a time will come when some communities will also equip themselves with rifles and ammunitions in order to fight back.

What's happening in places like Nigeria is not just tribes fighting each other  I think that's a very way of simplified way of demonstrating complex issues like colonial era also government is not something people can just copy from the US or UK and expect it to work the same way those systems develop over centuries through theirs own conflict, mistakes and specific historical conditions there is already so many intelligent people and policy makers in Africa working on these problems the issue is not that individuals can't think normal , it's that the challenges are truly deeply rooted and require help from other foriegn country.

Most of what you have mentioned are not the main reason why their is genocide in Nigeria that had been leading to ethnic fighting and bandits killing innocent people. The main problem here is corruption. Corruption had been one reason there had been continue regional conflicts in Nigeria. Some ethnic leaders would never want to support peace and all they care about is to their own self and their families. They sponsor kidnapping and regional wars to create probems so that they can use that means to get more allocation from the government for security budget. If these bad people are still in government, it is not going to help at all and conflicts will continue among different regions.

[BADecker]

Nobody seems to realize that killing true Christians is really releasing them to God, Paradise, and eternal life in the Resurrection.

The killers are the ones that will be eternally damned when they die, if they have not become Christians by then.

After all, life only lasts here for less than 100 years, usually. But the coming Resurrection decision lasts forever.

That’s true, the killers might actually be doing the true believers a favour, because the world isn't all that sweet and rosy for everyone. But my real concern goes to those who have not really truly repented of their sins and given their lives to Christ. Well only God knows what would happen to them in the afterlife, who am I to say who gets to be saved and who doesn’t 🤷‍♂️

Watch the 2005 movie Sahara. Some things have gotten worse, and many things have gotten better. BUT, it all shows the crime that is going on in Nigeria.

In addition, consider reading about "Tippoo Tibb," also known as "Tippu Tip" and several other names. His biography was written by a guy named Heinrich Brode in 1874.

Tippoo Tibb may not have done much of anything in Nigeria, but he was the example of much of what Islam did across Africa.

[Oluwa-btc]

The REAL question is, why would Nigerian Christians not get into the Bible and the understanding of God so that God would really help them? Faith Comes By Hearing would gladly send audio versions of the Bible to Nigerian Christians so they could spend their whole day listening to God's Word... even while they are at work.

These questions are bizarre and confusing same time funny.
We have issues with terrorism, we do not need the bible to have it solved. What we need are good leaders who are not going to sleep until every terrorist and repentant terrorist have been successfully sent to reunite with their maker. You keep making your unnecessary jest,  this is far from that, this has to do with human lives.

[BADecker]

The REAL question is, why would Nigerian Christians not get into the Bible and the understanding of God so that God would really help them? Faith Comes By Hearing would gladly send audio versions of the Bible to Nigerian Christians so they could spend their whole day listening to God's Word... even while they are at work.

These questions are bizarre and confusing same time funny.
We have issues with terrorism, we do not need the bible to have it solved. What we need are good leaders who are not going to sleep until every terrorist and repentant terrorist have been successfully sent to reunite with their maker. You keep making your unnecessary jest,  this is far from that, this has to do with human lives.

The Bible shows that it is itself Jesus-God, in written form. Since Christians are first Jesus, and only after, human understanding, why would they not get Jesus into themselves so that they can get help from Heaven?

[Onyeeze]

Of course, genocide is happening in Nigeria but i don't think that it is being targeted at Christians alone. Even the Muslims are also facing genocide because you can't tell me that the massacre that happened in a community in Jos Plateau state was targeted on Christians. I don't believe that these killings happening is being sponsored, it's just aggrieved bandits and herders that are causing this mayhem because of their rifts between local farmers.
   I don't know why the Nigerian government has been unable to address the issues of herds men and local communities. They better find a lasting solution to these killings if not a time will come when some communities will also equip themselves with rifles and ammunitions in order to fight back.

What's happening in places like Nigeria is not just tribes fighting each other  I think that's a very way of simplified way of demonstrating complex issues like colonial era also government is not something people can just copy from the US or UK and expect it to work the same way those systems develop over centuries through theirs own conflict, mistakes and specific historical conditions there is already so many intelligent people and policy makers in Africa working on these problems the issue is not that individuals can't think normal , it's that the challenges are truly deeply rooted and require help from other foriegn country.

Most of what you have mentioned are not the main reason why their is genocide in Nigeria that had been leading to ethnic fighting and bandits killing innocent people. The main problem here is corruption. Corruption had been one reason there had been continue regional conflicts in Nigeria. Some ethnic leaders would never want to support peace and all they care about is to their own self and their families. They sponsor kidnapping and regional wars to create probems so that they can use that means to get more allocation from the government for security budget. If these bad people are still in government, it is not going to help at all and conflicts will continue among different regions.

The major reason why theirs genocide in Nigerian is too much killing, and it's been used as politics, the opposition of political parties are using it to fight the current government of Nigerian to unseat them and take over government of Nigerian, secondly the current government is not even interested to protect the lives of citizens knowing that opposition are the caused of genocide in Nigeria, assuming the government is working to protect the citizens the massive killing of Christians won't have be in Nigerian, so I'm of the suggestions that genocide happening in Nigeria is caused by massive killing of Christians

[Princess Leah]

Most of what you have mentioned are not the main reason why their is genocide in Nigeria that had been leading to ethnic fighting and bandits killing innocent people. The main problem here is corruption. Corruption had been one reason there had been continue regional conflicts in Nigeria. Some ethnic leaders would never want to support peace and all they care about is to their own self and their families. They sponsor kidnapping and regional wars to create probems so that they can use that means to get more allocation from the government for security budget. If these bad people are still in government, it is not going to help at all and conflicts will continue among different regions.

The major reason why theirs genocide in Nigerian is too much killing, and it's been used as politics, the opposition of political parties are using it to fight the current government of Nigerian to unseat them and take over government of Nigerian, secondly the current government is not even interested to protect the lives of citizens knowing that opposition are the caused of genocide in Nigeria, assuming the government is working to protect the citizens the massive killing of Christians won't have be in Nigerian, so I'm of the suggestions that genocide happening in Nigeria is caused by massive killing of Christians

That's never true, if you think ADC or PDP is using terrorism as a tool to unsit APC, then you must be joking cause it was the same APC regime that collaborated with the western regime leadership of Barrack Obama to fund terrorism and unsit the then PDP administration of Goodluck E Jonathan. I don't know where you got your info from but you're wrong.

 The evil that the APC regime used to unsit PDP is now backfiring cause same Islamic terrorists groups they used to get into power are not using the arms given to them to terrorise other religions and anyone that's against their beliefs including people of same faith that feel what they're doing is bad, which is why they don't go after Christians alone but some Muslim communities too. Also the government (evil APC regime) is benefiting from terror through aids from western countries, illegal minings and so.

 Do you think they'll counter terrorism and stop those financial benefits? They're just so selfish and evil they only think of themselves and their families and don't mind if the masses suffer, you can tell from how they react to ongoing killings. Too bad that the military allowed themselves to be used by evil politicians, so the innocent ones are receiving the hit for the actions of what our people call their oga at the top (superiors).

[brother brother]

No one can actually say the truth or have the fact on killing agenda in especially North East part of Nigeria insecurity and killing of the innocent. But how on earth it has not been easy and possible for the Nigerian government to tackle this social problem, either they are aware and interested in the game or it sponsored by foreign countries, I know and believe it has caused harm to every individual, personality, physically, mentally and socially damage to everyone. Now is even coming to the top leaders.

Nigeria country can have a solution to this problem because it has reached more than 16 years of such rootless killing is coming from?, or by who were they sponsored by?

Remember some foreign country was invited and the political leaders did not allow them to do any operations, so they believe is known to the government. Now presently both the poor and rich, both Christians and Muslims are killed everyday by unknown gunmen.

[BADecker]

Any killing in Nigeria or anywhere is based in two things:
1. Greed of the killers;
2. Islam, which states right in the Koran and Hadiths that everybody who will not convert to Islam is to be killed - https://www.thereligionofpeace.com/.

[Berry2d]

I think the uncontrollable killing in Nigeria now has gone beyond greedy mindset and hatred to Christians by bandits to an islamization process,  although this was designed by Nigeria leaders to destroy the good works of opposition leaders and was also used as a campaigning topic to convince citizens just for there supports with promises of controlling it at last, but after achieving it all,  it then become very difficult controlling them and now there attentions have now been channelled to an islamization process which if not controlled that plans may come to reality because they are operating with a very high power and may be very difficult to stopped.

[Agathamay]

I have said this a billion times and I will repeat the same here tonight, there's no Christian Genocide ongoing in Nigeria. These are just agenda's and propaganda pushed by the western media mainly sponsored by isreal after the vice president of Nigeria talked about the ongoing Genocide in Gaza and Palestine.

And if we're to talk about these Christians dying, I will go on to say that they are not being killed by Muslims by terrorist sponsored by the US aid. It's never a religious war between Muslims and Christians, and the same way Christians die,  Muslims are also targeted. Don't believe all you see online,  the Federal government of Nigeria have also disregarded these claims of Christians Genocide in Nigeria.

Finally,  don't be surprised when you see them funding and also sponsoring the main Christian Genocide they talk about. Are they not know for funding and supporting such previously? Don't be fooled and let them turn Nigeria into another war zones. They don't care about Nigeria, if they do, they'll be talking about countries like South Sudan, Congo and Palestine in a worse a d detrimental situation than Nigeria.

Read your post and I wept and at some points felt you weren't even Nigerian but your name already spoke for itself.
Yes I understand all you've said including the facts that not just Christian's are been targeted but also Muslims but then I also purse to compare how many mosques have been attacked as compared to the churches been attacked.

Haven't you seen videos and recent pictures of live shootings in churches?

No doubts about Muslims are been attacked but let me give you a little assignment, please hep me compare the statistics of churches attacked to mosques, so we can have a clearer picture.

I don't like engaging in political talks about politicians and their selfish desires but when all of these things are now involving innocent lives especially those going to worship be it Muslim or Christian, then we shouldn't politicize the talks especially when we are not directly affected.

[Dreadboost]

I have said this a billion times and I will repeat the same here tonight, there's no Christian Genocide ongoing in Nigeria. These are just agenda's and propaganda pushed by the western media mainly sponsored by isreal after the vice president of Nigeria talked about the ongoing Genocide in Gaza and Palestine.

And if we're to talk about these Christians dying, I will go on to say that they are not being killed by Muslims by terrorist sponsored by the US aid. It's never a religious war between Muslims and Christians, and the same way Christians die,  Muslims are also targeted. Don't believe all you see online,  the Federal government of Nigeria have also disregarded these claims of Christians Genocide in Nigeria.

Finally,  don't be surprised when you see them funding and also sponsoring the main Christian Genocide they talk about. Are they not know for funding and supporting such previously? Don't be fooled and let them turn Nigeria into another war zones. They don't care about Nigeria, if they do, they'll be talking about countries like South Sudan, Congo and Palestine in a worse a d detrimental situation than Nigeria.

Read your post and I wept and at some points felt you weren't even Nigerian but your name already spoke for itself.
Yes I understand all you've said including the facts that not just Christian's are been targeted but also Muslims but then I also purse to compare how many mosques have been attacked as compared to the churches been attacked.

Haven't you seen videos and recent pictures of live shootings in churches?

No doubts about Muslims are been attacked but let me give you a little assignment, please hep me compare the statistics of churches attacked to mosques, so we can have a clearer picture.

I don't like engaging in political talks about politicians and their selfish desires but when all of these things are now involving innocent lives especially those going to worship be it Muslim or Christian, then we shouldn't politicize the talks especially when we are not directly affected.

Churches are easy targets because Christians hold worship more often compared to Muslims. Christians sometimes have 7 days of worship, fasting, and prayers almost all the days of the week have one event going on in the church, which is why Christians are an easy target for these bandits. The attack is indeed on both the Muslims and the Christians. There is also news of Muslims being attacked on their way back from the mosque. This year alone, most attacks have been in the Northern state of Nigeria. 

Recent shootings and videos have happened in the Northern part of the country. Although the last one happened on Palm Sunday, a lot of Muslims were the victims of the shooting. Meaning the target was not on Christians alone.

[VivaMan]

This is really a situation that's affecting everyone in the country, especially the Christian. It's very bad. Nigerian has been experiencing this serious violence attack for years now , including killings of both old and young citizens of the country.
A so called group, called ht boko haram which means Islamists extremist groups has target killing of innocent Nigeria's both Christians and Muslims, including entering churches, mosque to Carry out their mission.
This has made farmers limit there planting products because of fear, because there hide out is in the Bush. This really have to stop because it has affected the economic and everyone at large.Nigeria is really facing difficulty financially as a result of this issue.fears and willingness to scale through is no longer there.

[Agbamoni]

These questions are bizarre and confusing same time funny.
We have issues with terrorism, we do not need the bible to have it solved. What we need are good leaders who are not going to sleep until every terrorist and repentant terrorist have been successfully sent to reunite with their maker. You keep making your unnecessary jest,  this is far from that, this has to do with human lives.

When has religion ever solved a global or economic problem? Never have we seen anything like it. If it were so, the United States is a Christian nation, with the teachings from the bible, they have to forgive others, right? Why are they not obeying the word of God and stopping the war for good? Honestly, I wont blame those who believe the bible is just another law made by the rulers to keep the masses in check. While the leaders do not follow those laws because the laws are meant to deceive the masses.

[Agathamay]

edited out..

Read your post and I wept and at some points felt you weren't even Nigerian but your name already spoke for itself.
Yes I understand all you've said including the facts that not just Christian's are been targeted but also Muslims but then I also purse to compare how many mosques have been attacked as compared to the churches been attacked.

Haven't you seen videos and recent pictures of live shootings in churches?

No doubts about Muslims are been attacked but let me give you a little assignment, please hep me compare the statistics of churches attacked to mosques, so we can have a clearer picture.

I don't like engaging in political talks about politicians and their selfish desires but when all of these things are now involving innocent lives especially those going to worship be it Muslim or Christian, then we shouldn't politicize the talks especially when we are not directly affected.

Churches are easy targets because Christians hold worship more often compared to Muslims. Christians sometimes have 7 days of worship, fasting, and prayers almost all the days of the week have one event going on in the church, which is why Christians are an easy target for these bandits. The attack is indeed on both the Muslims and the Christians. There is also news of Muslims being attacked on their way back from the mosque. This year alone, most attacks have been in the Northern state of Nigeria.  

Recent shootings and videos have happened in the Northern part of the country. Although the last one happened on Palm Sunday, a lot of Muslims were the victims of the shooting. Meaning the target was not on Christians alone.

i truly didn't want to respond to you because i see this post more like trying to seek attention which isn't right  and please also reread your post, especially the bold text and tell me if you did a thorough research before writing this because least i know, the Muslim community always hold prayers and gathering in the most everything especially around 1pm Nigeria time, which means Muslims do more gatherings than the christian community.
we shouldn't shit from the topic and i still believe there is a christian genocide in Nigeria.

These questions are bizarre and confusing same time funny.
We have issues with terrorism, we do not need the bible to have it solved. What we need are good leaders who are not going to sleep until every terrorist and repentant terrorist have been successfully sent to reunite with their maker. You keep making your unnecessary jest,  this is far from that, this has to do with human lives.

When has religion ever solved a global or economic problem? Never have we seen anything like it. If it were so, the United States is a Christian nation, with the teachings from the bible, they have to forgive others, right? Why are they not obeying the word of God and stopping the war for good? Honestly, I wont blame those who believe the bible is just another law made by the rulers to keep the masses in check. While the leaders do not follow those laws because the laws are meant to deceive the masses.

the bible preaches peace yes that's true but there are also cases where the bible preaches war, i'm not at this point trying to support trump or any political interest but what i'm simply saying is that there is genocide in Nigeria and no matter people believe it or not, there is and i hope and believe with the right people in power all these news will be put in check.

[Supreme Donvic]

This is really a situation that's affecting everyone in the country, especially the Christian. It's very bad. Nigerian has been experiencing this serious violence attack for years now , including killings of both old and young citizens of the country.
A so called group, called ht boko haram which means Islamists extremist groups has target killing of innocent Nigeria's both Christians and Muslims, including entering churches, mosque to Carry out their mission.
This has made farmers limit there planting products because of fear, because there hide out is in the Bush. This really have to stop because it has affected the economic and everyone at large.Nigeria is really facing difficulty financially as a result of this issue.fears and willingness to scale through is no longer there.

And who will be the one to stop it the government is not ready to stop the killing that is happening in Nigeria they are not even ready to make things easy for the citizens of Nigeria farmers can no longer go to their farm because of the too much of killing happening in Nigeria a lot of people are afraid, I just pity those in the northern part of Nigeria they are really suffering and they are going through a lot I think it is high time that the citizens over there should embrace weapons and start fighting for themselves because the government is not coming to fight for them the government are enjoying the crisis happening in Nigeria they are making more money from it and that is all they care about they don't care about the citizens they are leading all they care about is making money for themselves and their family, God will punish them all.

[Berry2d]

This is really a situation that's affecting everyone in the country, especially the Christian. It's very bad. Nigerian has been experiencing this serious violence attack for years now , including killings of both old and young citizens of the country.
A so called group, called ht boko haram which means Islamists extremist groups has target killing of innocent Nigeria's both Christians and Muslims, including entering churches, mosque to Carry out their mission.
This has made farmers limit there planting products because of fear, because there hide out is in the Bush. This really have to stop because it has affected the economic and everyone at large.Nigeria is really facing difficulty financially as a result of this issue.fears and willingness to scale through is no longer there.

And who will be the one to stop it the government is not ready to stop the killing that is happening in Nigeria they are not even ready to make things easy for the citizens of Nigeria farmers can no longer go to their farm because of the too much of killing happening in Nigeria a lot of people are afraid, I just pity those in the northern part of Nigeria they are really suffering and they are going through a lot I think it is high time that the citizens over there should embrace weapons and start fighting for themselves because the government is not coming to fight for them the government are enjoying the crisis happening in Nigeria they are making more money from it and that is all they care about they don't care about the citizens they are leading all they care about is making money for themselves and their family, God will punish them all.

Waiting on the Nigerian government to bring an end to the constant killing in Nigeria should be the worst thing Nigerian citizens should ever think of because I can't see that coming for now. What the Nigeria government i know is interested at is in no other thing than stealing and initiating an uncontrollable corruption.
Nigeria is not the only country affected by same insecurity crisis but because the Nigerian government is using it as a medium of achieving there wicked plans is why it still persists if not what do they have that the Nigerian military can not put an end to it.

[Queen uloma]

This is really a situation that's affecting everyone in the country, especially the Christian. It's very bad. Nigerian has been experiencing this serious violence attack for years now , including killings of both old and young citizens of the country.
A so called group, called ht boko haram which means Islamists extremist groups has target killing of innocent Nigeria's both Christians and Muslims, including entering churches, mosque to Carry out their mission.
This has made farmers limit there planting products because of fear, because there hide out is in the Bush. This really have to stop because it has affected the economic and everyone at large.Nigeria is really facing difficulty financially as a result of this issue.fears and willingness to scale through is no longer there.

And who will be the one to stop it the government is not ready to stop the killing that is happening in Nigeria they are not even ready to make things easy for the citizens of Nigeria farmers can no longer go to their farm because of the too much of killing happening in Nigeria a lot of people are afraid, I just pity those in the northern part of Nigeria they are really suffering and they are going through a lot I think it is high time that the citizens over there should embrace weapons and start fighting for themselves because the government is not coming to fight for them the government are enjoying the crisis happening in Nigeria they are making more money from it and that is all they care about they don't care about the citizens they are leading all they care about is making money for themselves and their family, God will punish them all.

Waiting on the Nigerian government to bring an end to the constant killing in Nigeria should be the worst thing Nigerian citizens should ever think of because I can't see that coming for now. What the Nigeria government i know is interested at is in no other thing than stealing and initiating an uncontrollable corruption.
Nigeria is not the only country affected by same insecurity crisis but because the Nigerian government is using it as a medium of achieving there wicked plans is why it still persists if not what do they have that the Nigerian military can not put an end to it.

Stop wasting your time on waiting on Nigerian government to stop the insecurity that is happening in the country because they will never stop it and they don’t have the intention to even do that. People have been dying in Nigeria in their thousands and the Nigerian government has not done anything and this did not start today. It has been a long time issue and the killing has not stopped. Is it that in the Nigeria government cannot stop them no the Nigeria government has the capacity and the power to stop all these terrorist but the problem is that they have been benefiting from it and because of that stopping it will make them to get the benefit from the crisis so the more crisis the more benefits they get so insecurity in Nigeria is not stopping anytime soon except we have a very good president which will not happen anytime soon too.

[Accardo]

Stop wasting your time on waiting on Nigerian government to stop the insecurity that is happening in the country because they will never stop it and they don’t have the intention to even do that. People have been dying in Nigeria in their thousands and the Nigerian government has not done anything and this did not start today. It has been a long time issue and the killing has not stopped. Is it that in the Nigeria government cannot stop them no the Nigeria government has the capacity and the power to stop all these terrorist but the problem is that they have been benefiting from it and because of that stopping it will make them to get the benefit from the crisis so the more crisis the more benefits they get so insecurity in Nigeria is not stopping anytime soon except we have a very good president which will not happen anytime soon too.

The US congress has passed a bill, stating that Tinubu has been lobbying the congress for too long, and refused to tackle the problem going on in Nigeria, regarding the killing of Christians. The Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, is obliged to take action on this bill, and see that every single dollar spent on Nigeria counts at putting a stop to this menace.  If the Nigerian government has paid deaf ears to the safety of her citizens, the US government has taken it upon themselves to see that the killing of christains is put to a stop, which bill, is a great development and a welcomed development for the crisis going on in Nigeria.

 

This bill was shared by US congressman Rep Riley M. Moore.

[Oluwa-btc]

The US congress has passed a bill, stating that Tinubu has been lobbying the congress for too long, and refused to tackle the problem going on in Nigeria, regarding the killing of Christians. The Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, is obliged to take action on this bill, and see that every single dollar spent on Nigeria counts at putting a stop to this menace.  If the Nigerian government has paid deaf ears to the safety of her citizens, the US government has taken it upon themselves to see that the killing of christains is put to a stop, which bill, is a great development and a welcomed development for the crisis going on in Nigeria.

 

This bill was shared by US congressman Rep Riley M. Moore.

Nobody cares about them putting that to a stop. Personally I don't. We have more than enough to see our country running but this government will not and it is thanks to the Us government under Barrack Obama who aided the APC government to power in Nigeria. The US government are the least people to care about Nigerian Christians, no they don't. Not Donald Trump, not Nicki Minaj, and not even the Secretary of States who recently said words about colonialism 2.0.

We've gone back and forth on this topic but most of you choose not to read and unlearn things. When it comes to terrorism, we all know who has helped Africans curb and fight against terrorism in Africa. But until we're ready, we should keep telling ourselves grave lies.