[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency

[GingerAle]

For those running into any problems with the monerodo OS, you can file issues on my github:

https://github.com/Gingeropolous/monerodo/issues

And for those that can code bash shell script (oh wait thats anyone who knows linux), don't hesitate to make a pull request Granted, some of the problems may not be addressable (some deeper setting in some random .conf file), but if you install the iso on a VM (i think it works. fluffypony got it on a VM), then you can get a sense of the architecture. A primary architecture note are the upstart daemonizing files: these are created in /home/bob/monerodo/conf_files, then copied to /etc/init/ . Thats the main thing. Everything is managed via upstart: bitmonerod, the simplewallet instance for the pool server, and the nvidia miner. The pool server itself is managed by forever, but is first managed by upstart. So upstart loads forever which loads the init.js . This is the only way I got it to work. And don't listen to the naysayers. Upstart is great. The ability to load things sequentially is great. There's even a way to modify monero core to release a "synchronized" signal that would initiate the simplewallet daemon, but I dropped that.

If you make a pull request, any users script set will be automatically updated because of the automatic git pull and chmod +x *.sh in the first menu.

I've already received a couple of great suggestions for version 2, so please keep them coming.

[ArticMine]

OK, a little bit improved for those confused with cash and digital. Dollar bills are symbols of fiat currency.
I was trying to keep it simple as much as possible, not overcomplicate.

Dollar bills and Credit / Debit cards are very different when to come to privacy / fungiblility vs being digital. With fiat one has a choice either privacy and fungiblility (cash) or digital payments (credit / debit) but not both.  So I would put the dollar bills only in the privacy area and the credit / debit cards only in the digital area.  

Edit: ... and replace Private with Private and Fungible

[Drhiggins]

INTRODUCING THE MONERODO OS

http://nodebox.link/

What is it? Monerodo is a portmanteau (because I love them and love that word) of Monero and Node (well, esperanto for node).

Now you can take any old PC and turn it into a monero node, monero pool server, and nvidia miner. Instructions on the website.



Its not a GUI... but its not CLI either!!!!

Nice work GingerAle!  I think I'll mess around with this on the Raspberry Pi 2 that I have.  Probably can't get around to it until this weekend but looking forward to setting it up.  Thanks for the great contribution to Monero! 

[aiwe]

Dollar bills and Credit / Debit cards are very different when to come to privacy / fungiblility vs being digital. With fiat one has a choice either privacy and fungiblility (cash) or digital payments (credit / debit) but not both.  So I would put the dollar bills only in the privacy area and the credit / debit cards only in the digital area.  

Edit: ... and replace Private with Private and Fungible

If we continue we end up with replacing icons with text - fiat money instead of icon of money, gold bricks with something like "precious metals (gold, silver, platinum etc.)", and Bitcon symbol with something like "cryptocurrency (Bitcoin and it's forks)" It will never end.

Any suggestions to replace words digital, private and decentralized with icons?

There is space to put short notes on privacy, decentralized currencies and digital money.

[twistelaar]

Hey guys, a bit of topic. But I was figuring out when Zcash will launch and how to get them, but couldn't find anything. Somebody maybe knows this? Thanks a lot!

[dEBRUYNE]

Hey guys, a bit of topic. But I was figuring out when Zcash will launch and how to get them, but couldn't find anything. Somebody maybe knows this? Thanks a lot!

There is no specific date yet, Zooko approximated a launch in 6 months from now. However, there is always a possibility that it gets postponed. Also, bear in mind that it's currently only available on testnet.

[Arux]

INTRODUCING THE MONERODO OS

http://nodebox.link/

What is it? Monerodo is a portmanteau (because I love them and love that word) of Monero and Node (well, esperanto for node).

Now you can take any old PC and turn it into a monero node, monero pool server, and nvidia miner. Instructions on the website.



Its not a GUI... but its not CLI either!!!!

Excellent!

a new option could perhaps be added : Restore your accounts from MyMonero seed

i tried it and i was able to restore a wallet from a 12 words seed from MyMonero (the thirteenth word is unused, checksum only)

the test code is here: https://github.com/Arux-BTT/bitmonero.git

Code:

git clone https://github.com/Arux-BTT/bitmonero.git MyMonero_seed_import
cd MyMonero_seed_import
git checkout MyMonero_seed_import
make release

then a simplewallet compatible with mymonero seed will be able into build/release/bin as usual.

Code:

./simplewallet --restore-deterministic-wallet

follow instructions and type the twelve first words of your mymonero seed (not the thirteenth)
at the end, simplewallet will crash (core dumped) but no matter, wallet is successfully creating.

the mymonero seed:

Code:

hydrogen poker assorted zoom leopard reduce dying umpire broken poker cycling keep poker

and accounts details:

Code:

Account Address (Public)
44QGMttSkGcG2Qr3TPndDPBPFWesapi24XgfwyZzEEm6JHFGcWzLdSFgNcoGqqH1dVaWugYJi7zeZ2uLiQb8uGz1F4wCc8j
View Key (Private)
831528d4eb379fd2bd59df9f1df4c809b8561582a84d32ffed2a631b487c1e06
Spend Key (Private)
56d36638130b02f0ee8bc902790bec2669e4b756ae7772771971719e826c5b0d

simplewallet in action: (notice that the last word ("poker" in this example) is missing, seed is twelve words only)



it's crashing but a relaunch later:



funds are spent without MyMonero

a little bug with viewkey command:



a bash script could certainly automate it.

ps: all credit to warptangent's code

[twistelaar]

Hey guys, a bit of topic. But I was figuring out when Zcash will launch and how to get them, but couldn't find anything. Somebody maybe knows this? Thanks a lot!

There is no specific date yet, Zooko approximated a launch in 6 months from now. However, there is always a possibility that it gets postponed. Also, bear in mind that it's currently only available on testnet.

Thanks! Will there be an IPO?

[aiwe]

I made draft of this chart with texts on Trello https://trello.com/c/cIpNQm0J

[smooth]

Hey guys, a bit of topic. But I was figuring out when Zcash will launch and how to get them, but couldn't find anything. Somebody maybe knows this? Thanks a lot!

There is no specific date yet, Zooko approximated a launch in 6 months from now. However, there is always a possibility that it gets postponed. Also, bear in mind that it's currently only available on testnet.

Thanks! Will there be an IPO?

If I recall correctly there will not be an ICO you will have to mine them or buy them. There is to be an 11% devtax on mined coins. Somewhat off topic here though.

[phishead]

When downloading Monerodo OS and installing the universal USB installer of Linux on a thumb drive... what would be a good recommended thumb drive to use?  It says certain ones wont work on here.  I guess just any kind that isn't a "Fat 16, 32, or NTFS" obviously... but what are some good cheap ones that hold a lot of memory?

[dEBRUYNE]

@Arux, great job! Did you know the code for restoring a MyMonero seed was already up on Github? (not merged however)

Perhaps you could take a look at it and merge it with your code such that it becomes bugfree.

The code to add support for MyMonero derivation to simplewallet was already written a year ago: https://github.com/warptangent/bitmonero/commit/35b1500536a98e02ea459ca6ccb42e8248de43a8

[XMRpromotions]

@Arux, great job! Did you know the code for restoring a MyMonero seed was already up on Github? (not merged however)

Perhaps you could take a look at it and merge it with your code such that it becomes bugfree.

The code to add support for MyMonero derivation to simplewallet was already written a year ago: https://github.com/warptangent/bitmonero/commit/35b1500536a98e02ea459ca6ccb42e8248de43a8

This question comes up often enough that I think that merging the code would be beneficial. One less think for people to worry about.

[phishead]

Also I have another question regarding Monerodo.  I downloaded the Monerodo ISO file, and after downloading my computer said this:

Windows cannot open this file:

To open this file, Windows needs to know what program created it. Windows can go online to look it up automatically, or you can manually select from a list of programs on your computer.

Do I need to download something else to open the file?

[GingerAle]

Also I have another question regarding Monerodo.  I downloaded the Monerodo ISO file, and after downloading my computer said this:

Windows cannot open this file:

To open this file, Windows needs to know what program created it. Windows can go online to look it up automatically, or you can manually select from a list of programs on your computer.

Do I need to download something else to open the file?

The instructions are on nodebox.link

You need the universal USB installer. The big 2 gig file is an .iso file, which is a disk image - it has custom operating system on it. The Universal USB Installer takes this ISO and then makes your USB stick an install stick (like a Windows 10 install disc, but so much better). Once the universal USB installer plops the .iso onto the USB stick, you can stick that USB stick into your other computer and force it to boot to it (by getting into the bios menu and changing the boot order). From there it drives itself.

sorry to be flodding our ANN. I didn't want to add more fuel to the ermagerd you monero folk just keep making more threads. Though I guess this could go over to the Monero Support thread.

[GingerAle]

@Arux, great job! Did you know the code for restoring a MyMonero seed was already up on Github? (not merged however)

Perhaps you could take a look at it and merge it with your code such that it becomes bugfree.

The code to add support for MyMonero derivation to simplewallet was already written a year ago: https://github.com/warptangent/bitmonero/commit/35b1500536a98e02ea459ca6ccb42e8248de43a8

This question comes up often enough that I think that merging the code would be beneficial. One less think for people to worry about.

i'll put it in the monerodo so fluffy doesn't have to deal with the politics of it. He explained it elsewhere. I have free agent freedom. I do what I want.

[Hueristic]

...

If I recall correctly there will not be an ICO you will have to mine them or buy them. There is to be an 11% devtax on mined coins. Somewhat off topic here though.

I would like to hear a comparison of the z-cash and monero. what are the benefits and tradeoffs of the two? I have not spent any time looking into it but I'm sure others in this community have so can someone give us a synopsis if this is a threat as it sounds like it tries to fill the same market space as XMR.

[jwinterm]

...

If I recall correctly there will not be an ICO you will have to mine them or buy them. There is to be an 11% devtax on mined coins. Somewhat off topic here though.

I would like to hear a comparison of the z-cash and monero. what are the benefits and tradeoffs of the two? I have not spent any time looking into it but I'm sure others in this community have so can someone give us a synopsis if this is a threat as it sounds like it tries to fill the same market space as XMR.

Quite a bit of discussion here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/41vg68/monero_vs_zcash_eli5_fundamental_differences/

[dEBRUYNE]

...

If I recall correctly there will not be an ICO you will have to mine them or buy them. There is to be an 11% devtax on mined coins. Somewhat off topic here though.

I would like to hear a comparison of the z-cash and monero. what are the benefits and tradeoffs of the two? I have not spent any time looking into it but I'm sure others in this community have so can someone give us a synopsis if this is a threat as it sounds like it tries to fill the same market space as XMR.

I'll just quote myself again:

Relevant post of Monero vs Zcash. There was also a discussion on reddit, most of it is the same though.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/41vg68/monero_vs_zcash_eli5_fundamental_differences

Also, st0at check the last quote where IP obfuscation is mentioned.

zcash alpha has been launched

https://github.com/Electric-Coin-Company/zcash

http://www.wired.com/2016/01/zcash-an-untraceable-bitcoin-alternative-launches-in-alpha/

I'll just copy my reddit comment here:

I've made this list earlier:

List of possible pitfalls wrt ZeroCash/ZeroCoin:

[1] If ZeroCash/ZeroCoin is launched on behalf of a company, which seems the case here, the company can be given a gag order (e.g. to add a line of malicious code).

[2] If I recall correctly, the creator of the genesis block holds some kind of masterkey. As a result, you have to trust this person. Even if this key was held by a group, you still have to trust that particular group. In addition, you have to trust the program they run to create the Genesis block (the masterkey could be in there).

[3] It's too opaque in my opinion. If a bug existed that would create additional coins, there is no way you would see it.

[4] The math and cryptography backing it isn't peer reviewed yet and in an infancy stage.

[1] seems to be confirmed. They will be launching as a for profit company, see:

For its first four years online, a portion of every mined Zcash coin will go directly to Wilcox’s Zcash company

This could also invoke some legal issues, since they are basically not a decentralid currency and bear in mind they are **US** based (http://www.bizapedia.com/de/THE-ZEROCOIN-ELECTRIC-COIN-COMPANY-LLC.html). Just remember what happened with Ripple.

Basically, with Ring Confidential Transactions included in Monero it's basically pepsi vs coke (thanks to u/smooth_xmr for this analogy), where both have their advantages and disadvantages.

P.S. They are currently only on testnet, the "real-version" is at least 6 months away.

P.P.S. It seems like they transactions are also quit inefficient compared to Monero's. See this description on how to get from the basecoins (the transparent ones) to the zerocoins (anonymous ones):

This operation (called a pour) might take a minute or two depending on your hardware. It is producing a zero-knowledge proof. (This operation's performance will be improved in the coming months.)

Shen Noether (aka NobleSir), who is obviously more knowledgeable about this subject than me, also made a comparison on reddit:

I've done a little bit of comparison in the Ring CT paper / you can also look here for some facts on zcash- there are a few I've seen so far

[1] Setup: Monero (Trustless) vs Zerocash (Must Trust zcash company)

[2] Proof Generation: Monero (100's second ) vs Zcash (1/minute)

[3] Algorithm auditability: Monero (a decent number of people seem to understand ring signatures and confidential transactions) vs Zerocash (I'm not sure how many people actually understand the proofs besides the small group of authors) - although this point is certainly subjective.

[4] Poison-pill attack vulnerability: Monero (attacker would need 51%) vs Zerocash Vulnerable, (see zerocash extended paper section 6.4

[5] Anonymity set: Monero (although the zcash proponents note that a ring signature is a "smaller" anonymity set, they usually don't mention that the stealth address factor actually means that each transaction is masked, whereas the ring signatures provide additional plausible liability, furthermore, since keys appear in different ring signatures in different blocks in time, the anonymity set for when a given key is spent grows infinitely, and could eventually grow larger than the zcash anonymity set at any fixed instant in time) vs Zcash (anonymity set is the entire blockchain )

[6]Anonymous Multisig: Monero (yes! see "written up" link on ring ct sticky, this could make things like lightning potentially possible ) vs Zerocash (?)

[7] Mining: Monero (has it's own strongly decentralized mining process) vs Zerocash protocol from the paper lacks it's own mining (it's essentially just a distributed anonymous database), so there must be another coin which is mined to convert to zerocash tokens

--note that point 4. is an actual potential compromise of anonymity, which contradicts some of the statements the zerocash team has made.
.
Other Differences are slight: Slight differences in transaction size - however Monero transactions should end up being a bit larger when transmitted, but cost less in terms of storage (their eventual block-chain cost will be approximately 32 bytes* (n+1) where n is mixin + epsilon, where epsilon is the current tx size - ring signatures (Note in the recent Ring CT drafts, there is pruning mentioned for the range proofs, see the "written up" link)

https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/41vg68/monero_vs_zcash_eli5_fundamental_differences/cz63pqw

And:

TPTB_need_war has repeatedly been stating that Zerocash does not need IP obfuscation and therefore is not subject to I2P/TOR, which are, in his opinion, flawed.

However, it seems like Zerocash actually needs IP obfuscation as well and they seem to go with TOR, see -> https://twitter.com/ioerror/status/689958030859960321

I took out this excerpt from the discussion in this thread -> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1139756.msg13623846#msg13623846 (starting point).

Look way back in 2014 when you launched Monero, I told you smooth and fluffypony that IP address correlation was the weakness. Fluffypony proceed to try to integrate I2P. I warned you all many times that was not an adequate direction. But you wouldn't listen.

I2P, and even somewhat Tor, is perceived as adequate by 99% of the market. The remaining 1% may be smarter but isn't obviously much of a market at all. Very niche-y.

By the speculators because they are clueless.

But the corporations do not use darknets. They want privacy on the block chain, like we have disk encryption. Mention dark nets, illegal drug trade, etc, and they won't touch it with a 100 foot pole.

I would guess that many corporations do use Tor now for certain things. I2P will be integrated and invisible. No one will know or care how it works, except that the obvious network level vulnerabilities having to do with broadcasting transactions will be removed, and it will pass routine (though not intelligence agency level) technical muster for being private sufficient to satisfy most of the market. That's my opinion, and you are welcome to disagree.

Zerocash still needs IP obfuscation for a lot of private usages in practice too. They acknowledge it in the paper.

Zerocash does not need IP obfuscation when all the transactions are in the private zerocoins. Cite the section of the paper. I think you must be misunderstanding something. You are probably conflating the use of the regular non-anonymous coins mentioned in the paper.

Here you are making excuses again. Corporations are not going to trust unprovable shit. And moreover, mixnets are always vulnerable to flood attacks. They are very, very unreliable. Not only do I disagree, but I also think you are ignoring basic fundamental realities about the technologies.

Edit: arguing for Tor/I2P is akin to arguing for Dash's off chain mixing. Now look in the mirror and remember your arguments for End-to-End Principled ring sigs (versus off chain mixing) and realize the same logic applies to why Zerocash is superior to using off chain mixnets. Hypocrite.

Edit#2: okay I see the section you are referring to:

6.4 Additional anonymity considerations
Zerocash only anonymizes the transaction ledger. Network trac used to announce transactions,
retrieve blocks, and contact merchants still leaks identifying information (e.g., IP addresses). Thus
users need some anonymity network to safely use Zerocash. The most obvious way to do this is
via Tor [DMS04]. Given that Zerocash transactions are not low latency themselves, Mixnets (e.g.,
Mixminion [DDM03]) are also a viable way to add anonymity (and one that, unlike Tor, is not as
vulnerable to trac analysis). Using mixnets that provide email-like functionality has the added
benet of providing an out-of-band notication mechanism that can replace
Receive
.
Additionally, although in theory all users have a single view of the block chain, a powerful
attacker could potentially fabricate an additional block
solely
for a targeted user. Spending any
coins with respect to the updated Merkle tree in this \poison-pill" block will uniquely identify the
targeted user. To mitigate such attacks, users should check with trusted peers their view of the
block chain and, for sensitive transactions, only spend coins relative to blocks further back in the
ledger (since creating the illusion for multiple blocks is far harder).

I will need to understand this attack better. Seems to me they are saying that you need to spend from a block where your pour transaction was the only transaction in the block. But the user would I think know this and thus not spend the coin any more. Thus I believe the anonymity remains provable without the use of any mixnet. I will need to understand this more deeply to be sure.

Bear in mind that I2P will be integrated in Monero, but you can always choose to run Monero over TOR if you want.

[Hueristic]

...

[2] If I recall correctly, the creator of the genesis block holds some kind of masterkey. As a result, you have to trust this person. Even if this key was held by a group, you still have to trust that particular group. In addition, you have to trust the program they run to create the Genesis block (the masterkey could be in there)....

Thanks a ton DeBruyne! I've been doing too much skimming and really had no interest in it until just now. AND the bolded is all I need to know to stay FAR FAR away.