[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency

[nioc]

Transferring many inputs costs more but a fee of 1.26 is rather large.  The 175 coins must of consisted of many inputs.  The greater the mixin selected also increases the fee but I believe not by too much.

I took most of my coins out of 2 MyMonero accounts with each transfer consisting of 15 to 20 inputs resulting in a fee of ~0.15 for each of the 2 transfers and I thought that was a lot.  mixin was 6

Monero users are strongly incented to use a single wallet over a long period of time while never drawing it down too low. You should try to avoid "scraping the bottom of the barrel" so to speak. Those small inputs that become a liability when ever you are trying to scrape them togather to form a large transaction are actually an asset when used in a wallet with more funds. They help you find efficient ways to make the change that you need to make a payment.

Think of it like coins irl. It's a pain in the ass when you are trying to pay for an entire meal with it but helpful when used in conjunction will bills to make proper change.

Although I did not seem to me that I was scraping the bottom of the barrel I did move most of my coins off.  One was a long time wallet with significant activity and the other was relatively new with this being the first withdrawal.  No transaction were particularly small.  I believe the fees were 0.17 for the old wallet and 0.13 for the new wallet, about 20 and 15 inputs respectively.

[SLievensDRKSLK]

Is your anonymity solely based around Stealth Addresses with ring signatures and also creating tx's with empty vouts?

Or is there more to it and if so, what?

Because:

Untraceable payments
Unlinkable transactions
Blockchain analysis resistance

all fall under the ring signatures role.

I am looking for a direct answer, not a redirect to a whitepaper.

bump

Do you think you could explain how they "fail under the ring signatures role"
I think its something I would like explained to me

Thanks

I am not here to answer how Monero works. I am here for answers. Let's hope the answer I get envelops your question too.

[Millionero]

Is your anonymity solely based around Stealth Addresses with ring signatures and also creating tx's with empty vouts?

Or is there more to it and if so, what?

Because:

Untraceable payments
Unlinkable transactions
Blockchain analysis resistance

all fall under the ring signatures role.

I am looking for a direct answer, not a redirect to a whitepaper.

bump

Do you think you could explain how they "fail fall under the ring signatures role"
I think its something I would like explained to me

Thanks

"Fall under" means are accounted for, or explained by.
Whtwabbit:  I don't have enough expertise to answer your question, but I think a thorough answer might be darn long.
Also, your writing has a hint of the peremptory about it.  If I am misinterpreting your intent (so easy to do, on an internet forum), please forgive me.

[jwinterm]

Is your anonymity solely based around Stealth Addresses with ring signatures and also creating tx's with empty vouts?

Or is there more to it and if so, what?

Because:

Untraceable payments
Unlinkable transactions
Blockchain analysis resistance

all fall under the ring signatures role.

I am looking for a direct answer, not a redirect to a whitepaper.

bump

Do you think you could explain how they "fail under the ring signatures role"
I think its something I would like explained to me

Thanks

I am not here to answer how Monero works. I am here for answers. Let's hope the answer I get envelops your question too.

They don't all fall under ring signatures role. If you could be bothered to read the white paper or try googling "cryptonote untraceable unlinkable" (first result: https://cryptonote.org/inside ) you would quickly realize that ring signatures provide untraceable payments, and stealth addresses or one-time keys provide unlinkable transactions. So, your premise is wrong.

[SLievensDRKSLK]

Is your anonymity solely based around Stealth Addresses with ring signatures and also creating tx's with empty vouts?

Or is there more to it and if so, what?

Because:

Untraceable payments
Unlinkable transactions
Blockchain analysis resistance

all fall under the ring signatures role.

I am looking for a direct answer, not a redirect to a whitepaper.

bump

Do you think you could explain how they "fail under the ring signatures role"
I think its something I would like explained to me

Thanks

I am not here to answer how Monero works. I am here for answers. Let's hope the answer I get envelops your question too.

They don't all fall under ring signatures role. If you could be bothered to read the white paper or try googling "cryptonote untraceable unlinkable" (first result: https://cryptonote.org/inside ) you would quickly realize that ring signatures provide untraceable payments, and stealth addresses or one-time keys provide unlinkable transactions. So, your premise is wrong.

Well the stealth addresses utilise the ring signatures, sorry for not being precise.

Also I have no need to read the whitepaper when my question is as straightforward as it is.

So in answer to my question, the answer is basically a yes then, Moneros anonymity in transactions is solely handled by Stealth Addresses and Ring Signatures.

[nioc]

Well the stealth addresses utilise the ring signatures, sorry for not being precise.

Also I have no need to read the whitepaper when my question is as straightforward as it is.

So in answer to my question, the answer is basically a yes then, Moneros anonymity in transactions is solely handled by Stealth Addresses and Ring Signatures.

And soon to be improved with RingCT which is sheduled to be added this year.

An improvement after that is i2p, no timeline on that.

Improvements for anonymity are not the only things being worked on.

 https://getmonero.org/design-goals/

[jwinterm]

...

They don't all fall under ring signatures role. If you could be bothered to read the white paper or try googling "cryptonote untraceable unlinkable" (first result: https://cryptonote.org/inside ) you would quickly realize that ring signatures provide untraceable payments, and stealth addresses or one-time keys provide unlinkable transactions. So, your premise is wrong.

Well the stealth addresses utilise the ring signatures, sorry for not being precise.

Also I have no need to read the whitepaper when my question is as straightforward as it is.

So in answer to my question, the answer is basically a yes then, Moneros anonymity in transactions is solely handled by Stealth Addresses and Ring Signatures.

Stealth addresses are independent of ring signatures. Stealth addresses have been implemented on Bitcoin clones such as Vertcoin and Myriadcoin. Ring signatures without stealth addresses are implemented on Bitcoin clone Shadowcash. To say that ring signatures use stealth addresses is the same as saying stealth addresses use ring signatures - they work together in Cryptonotes, but they're not dependent on one another.

At the moment, that is the extent of anonymity, but ring confidential transactions are coming very soon (6-12 months), and built-in kovri/i2p support is probably in that same timeframe, maybe a bit longer, so there is more on the way.

[nioc]

In regards to the fee discussion, almost all of my normal transactions @ mixin of 3-6 have been around 0.02 or less.

[nioc]

At the moment, that is the extent of anonymity, but ring confidential transactions are coming very soon (6-12 months), and built-in kovri/i2p support is probably in that same timeframe, maybe a bit longer, so there is more on the way.

Get with the program buddy, ringCT implementation has been moved up to this year and is currently in testing.

[jwinterm]

At the moment, that is the extent of anonymity, but ring confidential transactions are coming very soon (6-12 months), and built-in kovri/i2p support is probably in that same timeframe, maybe a bit longer, so there is more on the way.

Get with the program buddy, ringCT implementation has been moved up to this year and is currently in testing.

I know, so best case is it gets activated on main net early next year, ~6 months.

[nioc]

At the moment, that is the extent of anonymity, but ring confidential transactions are coming very soon (6-12 months), and built-in kovri/i2p support is probably in that same timeframe, maybe a bit longer, so there is more on the way.

Get with the program buddy, ringCT implementation has been moved up to this year and is currently in testing.

I know, so best case is it gets activated on main net early next year, ~6 months.

I was going by this.  https://getmonero.org/2016/08/28/overview-and-logs-for-the-dev-meeting-held-on-2016-08-28.html

<fluffypony> so even though we wouldn't normally push a fork forward, we have to consider the influx of new users, and maybe we feel that the added privacy is essential enough to do v4 end of Oct, v5 in Dec
<fluffypony> something like that
<gingeropolous> gotcha.
<fluffypony> so we start 2017 with RingCT as the only way to transact

 

[alanshore]

I am a long time lurker and holder of both Monero and Dash. I have made a lot of money holding both but making money has never been the goal. 80% of my cash worth is spread between both currencies because I do not like the direction in which our world is moving and I want to ensure that myself and the people I care about are well taken care of when the facade that now envelopes our society is finally lifted.

I have a plea for both the Monero and Dash communities.


The world markets are at all time highs, standing on a cliff, held steady only by increasingly desperate central banks and supported by governments that have yet to realize that neo-classical economics has failed. Well-intentioned but poorly executed ideas such as the ACA and Eurozone Refugee Policy continue to disintegrate and the media conglomerates appear dedicated to perpetuating fear so they can pad their margins. Our elected leaders are now preying upon this fear to usurp our freedoms and those campaigning for office are using this fear to manipulate their way into power. It is clear that the status quo will not change willingly and will turn to increasingly extreme measures to maintain their control. Our world is in a precarious situation but our involvement in Monero and Dash does allow us to do something about it.

I believe that until recently, true freedom and democracy has not been possible. It is only now, due to advances in technology and novel ideas such as the blockchain and DAO's, that we finally have the tools to ensure our freedom, regardless of what legislation our corrupt and misguided governments decide to pass in the public's "best interest".

The only way to solve many of the problems we face is to create technology that is impervious to government intervention. Where the people get to choose how they wish to transact and what they choose to purchase in complete privacy. I know there is continuous debate regarding which technology is more secure, or scalable, or a multitude of other things but I think the one thing both communities can agree on is they are both vast improvements over fiat transactions and even bitcoin.

The announcement from Jaxx regarding the required removal of Dash from their iOS wallet is a perfect example of the uphill battle anonymous currencies are facing.

https://twitter.com/diiorioanthony/status/771017555930705920
https://twitter.com/diiorioanthony/status/771033721881362432

Let me be clear, this is not a benefit for Monero. While both technologies are taking different approaches to creating a digital equivalent of cash, the greatest hurdle they face will be adoption and this will not happen if the current powers that be continue to discriminate against them. This hurdle becomes a lot smaller if both communities work together.

Right now, the combined marketcap of Monero and Dash is ~200 mil which is miniscule compared to the entrenched systems. In fact, the entire marketcap of the top 100 crypto's is only 11 billion. I trade the S&P eMini during the day and on average, in the last minute of regular market trading, 50+ billion dollars worth of contracts will change hands. In one minute, five times more money changes hands than the top 100 cryptos combined marketcap.

Monero and Dash are currently the two rats in the corner fighting over a crumb while the corrupt banks and remittance companies sit at the table and feast on the entire pie. If we work together, we can have a real shot at taking a larger slice of the pie (while actually benefiting society) and believe me, there is more than enough to go around.

If you are just in Monero or Dash to make a quick buck, I imagine you stopped reading some time ago. If you are still here, I urge you to expand your scope of thinking and imagine what could be accomplished if both currencies were to cooperate.

If I dare to dream, I would envision a future where there are XMR and DASH trading pairs on exchanges, where we encourage others to use both networks, where the communities help test each others releases, where they combine forces to help both get added as payment options for major services and where ideas on how to improve both currencies are openly shared and discussed. If anyone is open to creating a new bitcointalk thread for mutual and friendly discussion of both cryptos, I think that would be a great first step.

We are all in this battle together and I believe the only way we can fail is by remaining divided. The real enemy is the entrenched systems that dictate our lives. Please do your part to help create a more cooperative environment, regardless of your opinion on which technology is superior.

[anders lokka]

monero and dash are way long term coins

[landomata]

Is Coindesk biased on Monero

https://coins.newbium.com/post/698-coindesk-is-biased-on-monero

[Anon136]

Guys. Monero is doomed. Its the end of the line. Abandon ship while you can.

Translation: Fill my order please.

[magico]

Network hashrate is growing. It's 28.75MH/s right now and it's new ATH.
So no more cheap moneroj.

[iCEBREAKER]

I am a long time lurker and holder of both Monero and Dash. I have made a lot of money holding both but making money has never been the goal. 80% of my cash worth is spread between both currencies because I do not like the direction in which our world is moving and I want to ensure that myself and the people I care about are well taken care of when the facade that now envelopes our society is finally lifted.

I have a plea for both the Monero and Dash communities.

[blah blah blah]

[moral equivalence]

[false comparisons]

[blah blah blah]

We are all in this battle together and I believe the only way we can fail is by remaining divided. The real enemy is the entrenched systems that dictate our lives. Please do your part to help create a more cooperative environment, regardless of your opinion on which technology is superior.

How dare you conflate a fairly launched coin with an instamined, centralized trash coin like Dash?

Dash qualifies as an illegal unregistered security, because a single entity (EVAN DUFFIELD AKA/DBA THE DARKCOIN FOUNDATION INC) controls its emission and everything else.

That makes Dash a liability for Apple if they allow Jaxx or whatever in their AppStore.

For the deep dive on the SEC issues, there's a highly informative post here

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1219023.msg13293657#msg13293657

and here

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1218399.msg12775158#msg12775158.

Dash got itself into this mess with its instamine and cult-of-Duffield Dear Leader complex.

Don't expect Monero to help Dash out of its entirely self-imposed fiasco.

PS Isn't it hilarious that Jaxx took Dash's bribe money to include Dash, only to have it result in being kicked off iOS?   

[nioc]

Network hashrate is growing. It's 28.75MH/s right now and it's new ATH.
So no more cheap moneroj.

And now 30MH/s

Does this give any insight into the "debate" about whether price drives HR or HR drives price (with mining technology remaining the same)?

[vokain]

Network hashrate is growing. It's 28.75MH/s right now and it's new ATH.
So no more cheap moneroj.

And now 30MH/s

Does this give any insight into the "debate" about whether price drives HR or HR drives price (with mining technology remaining the same)?

Increased prices encourage a higher hash rate, higher security from higher hash rates adds some value to the chain (but at some diminishing rate)

[iCEBREAKER]

Network hashrate is growing. It's 28.75MH/s right now and it's new ATH.
So no more cheap moneroj.

And now 30MH/s

Does this give any insight into the "debate" about whether price drives HR or HR drives price (with mining technology remaining the same)?

Increased prices encourage a higher hash rate, higher security from higher hash rates adds some value to the chain (but at some diminishing rate)

At some threshold, higher hash rates add value at increased rates.

EG, when XMR's network becomes more expensive to attack than Litecoin's, and in turn, Bitcoin's.