[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency

[owlcatz]

moneropool.com -- pending balance is stuck again i'm over 2 XMR and counting

meh.. i'm still at .45 so don't know yet ... payouts seem to go out daily about in about 7 hours from now, so i'm sure youll get it then.

think of it this way, it's just less xfer fees this way...

[e-coinomist]

Contributors are attracted to the project because of the quality of the architecture we're continually designing and the quality of the code that is being written.

Is there an overview of milestones archieved, or which are still in front? Some roadmap on the codechanges since the code fork from the former project.

[akula999]

moneropool.com -- pending balance is stuck again i'm over 2 XMR and counting

meh.. i'm still at .45 so don't know yet ... payouts seem to go out daily about in about 7 hours from now, so i'm sure youll get it then.

think of it this way, it's just less xfer fees this way...

Less fees = No Complaints!! 

[owlcatz]

Contributors are attracted to the project because of the quality of the architecture we're continually designing and the quality of the code that is being written.

Is there an overview of milestones archieved, or which are still in front? Some roadmap on the codechanges since the code fork from the former project.

seriously? do you even google, bro?

all that is out there, just google it, dont waste our time, because you look like another fucking sockpuppet.... seriously.. "Is it true?"  LOL... 

[thefunkybits]

only a few spots left in our Monero XMR giveaway!

Find out how to claim your FREE 0.4 XMR here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=731365.0

[triplef]

where is that old wallet gui called simple wallet ? bitmonero wallet v0.8.8.1.1(0.1-g3b887de)

[sammy007]

where is that old wallet gui called simple wallet ? bitmonero wallet v0.8.8.1.1(0.1-g3b887de)

simplewallet is standard CLI wallet.

[fluffypony]

Contributors are attracted to the project because of the quality of the architecture we're continually designing and the quality of the code that is being written.

Is there an overview of milestones archieved, or which are still in front? Some roadmap on the codechanges since the code fork from the former project.

seriously? do you even google, bro?

all that is out there, just google it, dont waste our time, because you look like another fucking sockpuppet.... seriously.. "Is it true?"  LOL... 

I don't think what he was asking for is, necessarily, sockpuppety:)

We don't have a roadmap right now, because it's hard to peg dates down, and a roadmap is a constantly shifting target. If you want a grasp of what we've achieved and where we're going then reading through the previous Monero Missives is a good start:)

[smfuser]

...
Anyways, it mostly seems that they've offered a transaction method that 'works' in the sense that it can be done .. but also has attack vectors that are not shared by CryptoNote/Monero. Seems like an okay idea, but is outdated with the introduction of CryptoNote.

Thanks for your comments, which I will consider and probably reply to further soon.  Are you aware of better options than CoinShuffle for private Bitcoin transactions?

Another proposal I've seen is Greg Maxwell's CoinSwap:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=321228

[Globb0]

Is there a missives archive where I can review them all in order?

[shitaifan2013]

Is there a missives archive where I can review them all in order?

check the first page of this thread, it's all in the opening post 

[fluffypony]

Is there a missives archive where I can review them all in order?

They're linked in the OP:

August 16 - Monero Missives #11 includes an update on the GUI, breaking the 600 subscribers barrier on reddit, pre-announcement for a donation system that also benefits donators directly, using "account" instead of "wallet", a Twitter campaign, an open-source stratum proxy, QoS bandwith control, easier compilation on Windows.
August 10 - Monero Missives #10 includes debriefing the Monero Fireside Chat #1, state of the art for the GUI, reminder about donations, a price ticker for websites, the move to Continuous Integration for faster development and moving to unmetered downloads
August 05 - Monero Missives #9 includes the announcement of Monero Fireside Chat, market and download statistics, inclusion in CoinsSource's Trust Index and cleaner builds.
July 23 - Monero Missives #8 includes Poloniex adding XMR trading pairs for a number of altcoins, and license changes to Monero.
Archives: #1 #2 #3 #4 #5 #6 #7

[smfuser]

This will never be secure if not every Bitcoin user is forced to use it for every transaction and that will never happen. like kbm already mentioned "This implies a smaller anonymity set, as it requires interested users."
Also i can´t see how an active protocol which needs time for mixing could outperform a totally passive system like ring signatures which are simply instant.

Someone I respect told me that after recently learning about CoinShuffle, he no longer believes that Monero or any other privacy coins can have substantial long-term prospects.  CoinShuffle is discussed here:

Anonymity is just the base of what Monero will offer.

Thanks, any further comments from core team members would be great.  I don't see why every Bitcoin user must be forced to use a privacy protocol for every transaction to provide a sufficient anonymity set.  Even a small percentage of Bitcoin users may be a larger absolute number than the entire user base of a privacy coin.  Also, isn't the primary issue the absolute number of people one is mixing with in a transaction (e.g., 50), rather than the total number of users of a privacy protocol or privacy coin?  It seems the total user base only needs to be above some reasonable absolute number to provide sufficient privacy.  The number of total users of a coin seems most important because of network effects that can determine whether a coin will survive against competitors, rather than its effect on privacy.

[kbm]

...
Anyways, it mostly seems that they've offered a transaction method that 'works' in the sense that it can be done .. but also has attack vectors that are not shared by CryptoNote/Monero. Seems like an okay idea, but is outdated with the introduction of CryptoNote.

Thanks for your comments, which I will consider and probably reply to further soon.  Are you aware of better options than CoinShuffle for private Bitcoin transactions?

Another proposal I've seen is Greg Maxwell's CoinSwap:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=321228

Looking at it real quick .. it also seems like it relies on interested parties and is very slow .. involving multiple tx's that need to confirm before another is sent out .. so you'd have to wait for a long time for these types of tx's to complete (Monero being under ten minutes to completion .. at low speed; coinswap looks like it could take more than double that at top speeds). I'll read more on it, from what I've seen things gmaxwell comes up with are pretty good ideas.

Anoncoin is doing some fantastic things, I believe they're in the middle of trying to work a Zerocoin protocol into their coin (which is a bitcoin or litecoin fork .. I don't remember) .. along with implementing a cpp version of I2P, but are you asking about anon options in bitcoin itself or bitcoin protocol? I have my own grievances with ZC .. but as it doesn't exist yet I feel they're unjustified .. so I'm eagerly awaiting the release.

[doo]

No surprises here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=748507.0

[Globb0]

Is there a missives archive where I can review them all in order?

They're linked in the OP:

/snip

thank you for answering I will go back and remind myself of the OP stuff.

[fluffypony]

Thanks, any further comments from core team members would be great.  I don't see why every Bitcoin user must be forced to use a privacy protocol for every transaction to provide a sufficient anonymity set.  Even a small percentage of Bitcoin users may be a larger absolute number than the entire user base of a privacy coin.  Also, isn't the primary issue the absolute number of people one is mixing with in a transaction (e.g., 50), rather than the total number of users of a privacy protocol or privacy coin?  It seems the total user base only needs to be above some reasonable absolute number to provide sufficient privacy.  The number of total users of a coin seems most important because of network effects that can determine whether a coin will survive against competitors, rather than its effect on privacy.

The anonymity set is more reduced than that. Let me give you an example: say you want to transfer 123.456 Bitcoin. No matter what method you use, if someone can observe you sent 123.456 Bitcoin from your address and 123.456 Bitcoin appeared in another address within an hour or two they can make certain conclusions. These inferences can be cryptographically proven, and this is called "reducing the anonymity set". Eventually the anonymity set can be reduced to the point where you can ascertain undoubtedly prove a certain address sent a transaction regardless of the intermingling and intermixing that occurred.

Now in order to make this really difficult, you have to start with a VERY large anonymity set. In other words, there need to be to very many people potentially involved in a transaction that any reduction is practically meaningless. Mixing typically requires point-in-time availability of people or nodes, and the higher the mix the longer it takes (since you have to go through "rounds" of mixing). Darkcoin gets around this, I believe, by "premixing" your coins. The downside to their approach (and to most of the other approaches I've seen) is that you have massive address churn in your wallet, and any practical use will require you to back your wallet.dat up constantly. Secure and anonymous cold storage is thus observable to anyone with a blockchain explorer (when it really shouldn't be).

One of the solutions Monero and other mixing systems employ to blind amount correlation is it splits inputs (and outputs) by powers of 10, so the earlier example would mean inputs of 100, 20, 3, 0.4, 0.05, and 0.006. Now because of the way Monero works (ring signatures!) you specify you want to mix with, say, 50 other people. So it takes that first input (100) and goes and finds all the unspent transaction outputs (ie. those not spent with a mixin of 0) that have ever occurred in the past and have a value of 100. As you can imagine, this is a pretty huge set, and is growing every day. It can then pick 50 of those at random, add your signature to the ring, and voila. Now it does the same for the other 5 inputs. This means that the total anonymity set here is massive - 51 * 6 = 306 people that could have possibly been involved in the transaction. Most importantly, because all of these are stealthed transactions (Monero uses stealth addresses permanently) some of those outputs you mix with could even have been created by you previously! Thus the potential anonymity set grows and grows even if the userbase stays stagnant - a feature that is not shared by any of the Bitcoin-derived anonymity solutions.

Finally, because Monero uses stealth addresses, you never need to backup anything more than a 300 byte password-encrypted keys file (or just write down the 24 word mnemonic seed you get when you first create a wallet). That 300 byte file will never change no matter how many transactions you do. You back it up once and you are safe from data loss forever.

[triplef]

where is that old wallet gui called simple wallet ? bitmonero wallet v0.8.8.1.1(0.1-g3b887de)

simplewallet is standard CLI wallet.

well is there an update to that wallet  ?

[smooth]

Thanks, any further comments from core team members would be great.  I don't see why every Bitcoin user must be forced to use a privacy protocol for every transaction to provide a sufficient anonymity set.  Even a small percentage of Bitcoin users may be a larger absolute number than the entire user base of a privacy coin.

Surprisingly, this might not be true. Monero already has approximately 3% as many transactions as BTC and this number is likely to grow as improvements to XMR (especially GUI) are rolled out and more avenues for usage appear. So far aside from speculation (exchanges) we have exactly one medical practice and one gambling site.

Bitcoin's growth has stagnated a lot, which is allowing other coins to begin to catch up.

[Jungian]

Thanks, any further comments from core team members would be great.  I don't see why every Bitcoin user must be forced to use a privacy protocol for every transaction to provide a sufficient anonymity set.  Even a small percentage of Bitcoin users may be a larger absolute number than the entire user base of a privacy coin.

Surprisingly, this might not be true. Monero already has approximately 3% as many transactions as BTC and this number is likely to grow as improvements to XMR (especially GUI) are rolled out and more avenues for usage appear. So far aside from speculation (exchanges) we have exactly one medical practice and one gambling site.

Bitcoin's growth has stagnated a lot, which is allowing other coins to begin to catch up.

What metrics do you use to estimate BTC growth?

Thank you in advance