FAIRLAY - SPORTS BETTING for experts - highest liquidity, provably best odds

[sbrzol]

@sbrol  - sorry for the delay. Due to increased traffic this weekend our Hot Wallet is already empty. It will be refilled on Monday.  We will consider increasing our Hot Wallet balance to prevent delays in the future.

On Monday when?   I am waiting for my withdrawal more than 40 hours.

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[patt0]

Two questions:

If we bet against each other and there is no commission how do you profit?
Second do you support any sort of software program we can use to bet? (like trading software)

Thank you.

They take a 2% fee if you win except for Sport and Fun category.
I do not see an API support at their site.

Thanks for the reply. 2% is quite decent I will probably try it, to bad there is no support for trading software, that would me amazing for live sports like tennis, at least for my sports trading strategy.

[lorylore]

i have quite a smooth experience with the website. keep it up! hope more matches can be added too.

[bitwager]

Amarican odds has been requested for quite a while. Somehow we always had something more important to do so it somehow got delayed for quite a while. But we will definitely add it soon.

Anyways - today a user was quicker and just wrote some java script lines to add it. You can just past this lines into your Java-script console (you need to open developer tools for this) and it will display the american odds format in addition. Whoever wrote it: nice job!

I am the one who wrote the userscript and posted it on your forum.  Instead of having to open up developer tools and pasting the code, anyone can install Tampermonkey extension in Chrome and the @include statement at the top of the script will make the code execute only on fairlay.

Notes:
1. The script inverts the odds on the Lay side to show what you will pay if you take that side.
2. The script currently only executes on the event listing pages; once you click a specific event they will disappear.  This is good enough for me, but I might enhance the script in the future when I'm bored if fairlay doesn't implement their own American odds option in the meantime.

[debuni]

Once detected, transactions will be processed in the background. You must wait awhile to have their amount credited.

For how long? Already clicked Check for mission transaction.

Missing a deposit? New transactions found! Confirmed - check mark.

Confirmed a long time ago /few hours/

[bitwager]

For how long? Already clicked Check for mission transaction.

Missing a deposit? New transactions found! Confirmed - check mark.

Confirmed a long time ago /few hours/

I have a deposit in the same state right now.  It doesn't show unless I click "Check for missing transactions", then it shows up as confirmed at the bottom but is gone if I refresh and is not credited to my account.

[FairlaySupport]

 We implemented the "check for missing deposit feature" as Armory did not recognize deposit transactions from time to time. However we were not able to test it as the bug appears in quite a unforeseeable and unreproducable manner.  We will look into the matter if you could send us an email with the missing txs.
 

[debuni]

We implemented the "check for missing deposit feature" as Armory did not recognize deposit transactions from time to time. However we were not able to test it as the bug appears in quite a unforeseeable and unreproducable manner.  We will look into the matter if you could send us an email with the missing txs.
 

Email sent. But do you realize you are wasting your clients time with this? As for example I'm making a test deposit /with desire to move my whole betting to BTC/
And if you have such a problem, is it affect your anonymous betting? As anonymous  is the way to bet with us without holding a bankroll with you. And from my point of view - a must for bets over 0.5/b and 20/bets per day.

[sbrzol]

@sbrol  - sorry for the delay. Due to increased traffic this weekend our Hot Wallet is already empty. It will be refilled on Monday.  We will consider increasing our Hot Wallet balance to prevent delays in the future.

On Monday when?   I am waiting for my withdrawal more than 40 hours.

i got it after 42 hours,  thx,  but now i have a missing 0.1 BTC deposit

[fairlay]

Hello - we are getting currently a lot of mails about missing deposits. So we currently recommend not to do any deposits although the Bitcoins are 100% safe it is very likely that they are stuck for some time.

We will use this situation to explain our security architecture. We use a cold and a hot wallet. Unlike most competitors and most exchanges we take the very conservative approach that all deposits go to the cold wallet directly. Most exchanges let user deposit to the hot wallet and only if needed forward some Bitcoin to the secure cold wallet. With this approach you can not 100% control the amount in the hot wallet. If a very large deposit comes in the hot wallet could hold a very big amount. We strictly have an internal policy that we only want an amount in our hot wallet so that we could cover a loss in the unlikely case our server gets hacked.

So on our online server there are two Bitcoin related services. One that can do automatic cashouts from our hotwallet and a second service that just monitors a watch only wallet to detect deposits (into the cold wallet). So what currently happens is that our server does not detect the transaction but the Bitcoins are nevertheless 100% save in our cold wallet.

So currently we can only apologize for the problem and assure you that we are working with high pressure to fix it. We will make an update here as soon as we know more.

- Team Fairlay   

[fairlay]

Ok - during writing this text it seemed that a simple restart of the Bitcoin services had fixed the problem. On the first look into our database it seems like we are in sync again: a) all deposits are detected and b) all cashout requests are currently done. Please let us know if you have an not proceeded cashout or deposit.

[hua_hui]

Ok - during writing this text it seemed that a simple restart of the Bitcoin services had fixed the problem. On the first look into our database it seems like we are in sync again: a) all deposits are detected and b) all cashout requests are currently done. Please let us know if you have an not proceeded cashout or deposit.

that sounds so scary. i hope it is not another case of mgtox. have a very bad experience with them previously and hope it will not happen again.

[bitwager]

My pending cashout and pending deposit have both been resolved.  Thank you.

[sbrzol]

While I was waiting for my withdrawal that took 40 hours  i did some math.

Somebody had a very good week and won  79 BTC  = $20.000  



It was very suspicious that there is lot liability on the markets.  

Basketball (at 2015-10-13 20:40 CET  ) :   1180 market  :  back side: 4589.986; BTC  lay side: 4896.957 BTC
Only basketball :  lay + back : 9487 BTC !!!

If you place bets on both side (lay, back) on the same market that is unmatched then fairly subtract both amount (back amount and lay liability) from your account.  
At betfair if you place $10 on back side and $10 on lay side (liability) then your account balance will decrease only $10.  (Initial account balance 271.06,  after unmatched bets : 261.06)



At fairlay if you place 10 mbtc on back side and 10 mbtc on lay side (liability) then your account balance will decrease 10+10=20 mbtc.  (Initial account balance 27.36,  after unmatched bets : 7.36)



So we have to add lay + back side at fairlay to get  how much BTC is in the system.  

Soccer market is much larger which means that somebody who makes the liability had to deposit at least 35.000 BTC to cover/offer all market .
So you play against fairlay and not other bettors.  (Fairlay did not tell this to you.)
So if somebody won 79 BTC in one week and you have to wait 40 hours for your withdrawal then you start thinking.

Lay to back conversion is inaccurate.  and so the converted amout that is available.
For example:   1.15 lay odds  =  7.67 back odds  (and not 7.71)


if you click on 1.149 you get 7.71 and not the accurate 7.67


lay = 1 + 1 / (back - 1);



However , the conversation sometimes is accurate (near 2 or not game market? )

Liability explained

Your liability is the amount you could lose in your worst-case scenario.
When backing it's simply the stake which you place. When laying however it's the amount it will cost you if your selection wins. Either way, it is how much you are risking.

I run into another bug while testing the lay back system.  I placed back and lay side on the same market that (unfortunately) matched (i gave wrong lay price ) and now there is only 1 matched bet in my history.  My initial account balance was 0.1 BTC and now it is only 0.027 BTC. I  did not get back the cancelled 0.0435 BTC.



So I went back to pinnacle. Fairlay is very risky.

[hua_hui]

My pending cashout and pending deposit have both been resolved.  Thank you.

that is glad to hear that. i just have uneasy feeling when i see such things. although the $$ is not a lot but still it is worth something.

[fairlay]

Cashouts up to 5 BTC are processed immediately right now and we are going to increase this limit step by step.

Regarding the proof of balance, there are some privacy concerns, but if there is really demand for it I will pass the request along. In the meantime I can assure you that we keep all customer funds secure.

What concerns me is that you are offering such high limits while calling 5 BTC cashouts large.  What if someone came to your site and placed a lot of NFL bets?  If they had a good run they could easily win 1000+ BTC.  Does your site have anywhere near that kind of reserves to sustain that type of variance?  And if not why are you offering such high limits?

It was supposed to mean "larger than before" and not necessarily "large".  We can assure you that also higher payouts are no problem - we are just very careful with automated cashouts. In fact some of our customers already won more than 100 BTC.  Keep in mind that you are always betting against another customer, who already deposited all funds you can possibly win.

For our main market makers we also have a different rule regarding the reserving of funds.  They can put as many open orders as they want. The funds will be deducted from their balance before a bet is matched. If the market maker does not have enough funds, we will NOT match the bet.
 
I passed your request along for a proof of balance and still waiting for an answer. I will get back to you asap.

Hey sbrzol,

you math is right but actually for market makers we have different rules. We have discussed them early in this thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=673475.msg12483830#msg12483830
Basically they can make lots of open orders as long as they have funds that cover every single order. If they would run out of funds all remaining orders of a market maker would automatically be canceled.

If you are interested in becoming a market maker and using our API: fairlay.com/api we are happy to provide you with more details. However - from a user perspective: every bet is 100% covered with Bitcoins that have been deposited in advanced.

[fairlay]

I run into another bug while testing the lay back system.  I placed back and lay side on the same market that (unfortunately) matched (i gave wrong lay price ) and now there is only 1 matched bet in my history.  My initial account balance was 0.1 BTC and now it is only 0.027 BTC. I  did not get back the cancelled 0.0435 BTC.



So I went back to pinnacle. Fairlay is very risky.

That seems perfectly fine to me. You had 0.1 and placed two bets for a total of 0.08. However - the "matched amount" are only: 30mBTC + 43.5mBTC. So that is exactly 100 - 30 - 43.5 = 26.5 mBTC. (You said you have 27).

Note that we always show the liability of an bet - regardless of back and lay - so the conversion that you described is already done by our system and thus all amounts are correct. We would really regret to see you go - lets us know what we should improve! Otherways: have fun at Pinny and hopefully see you later again!

[debuni]

Seems your Pinnacle feed is down and so all of your sports are without "default odds". Also because of that almost whole sports section is empty as even event names...

[FairlaySupport]

We are having connectivity issues right now. They should be resolved shortly.

[debuni]

We are having connectivity issues right now. They should be resolved shortly.

Yes, you price feed is OK. BUT MY WHOLE AMOUNT IS BLOCKED of unresolved predictions.... from many many hours. It's just not serious. Especially during the weened action.