Cast Your Vote for your favourite Physical Bitcoin Designs – Ends 18th November

[Trivelius]

It is a pity that crypto is full with unfulfilled promises. I have not received a total of about 3.5 BTC in various competitions and services that I have met.  

This has nothing to do with crypto, but with the people you deal with and your own stupidity. They don't use escrow? Avoid them like hell. People like this can be found everywhere, no matter where you are or what you do.

   Tell me, Mr. Professor, how to use an escrow in a competition like this? I've never lost money, but I lost time. I guess its the same

[1715362606]

1715362606

[thermost]

I don't think he had any intention on paying the designers, probably just click-bait to keep his threads propped up. Feel sorry for the people who have 'bought' coins from Coinographic.

[Mitchell]

Tell me, Mr. Professor, how to use an escrow in a competition like this? I've never lost money, but I lost time. I guess its the same

That's easy. Let the creator of the competition put the reward in escrow. That way you can still get paid even if he runs. If the creator of a competition doesn't want to do that, well, stay away.

[smoothie]

Here is one of the earlier posts I made concerning Coinographic where I made a strong suggestion that contest funds/prizes be put into escrow before the contest starts:

LINK: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=693176.msg7829616#msg7829616

Quote from: smoothie on July 14, 2014, 12:34:08 AM
I would like to suggest the following given past bounties that were never paid by previous contests (i.e. Coinhoarder's Bitcoin design contest):

Send the 6 Bitcoins to an escrow so entrants are assured they (the winners) will receive the prize

I believe you have sent bounty monies to moderators on the Litecointalk forum for your previous contests. You should do the same here. Use an escrow person like say user/moderator Saltyspitoon who (last time I checked) did not charge any escrow fees.

Good luck to all of the entrants!



Quote from: Coinographic on July 14, 2014, 12:55:01 AM
We are more then happy to send the coins into escrow if the community feel its necessary.  It does create a small problem for us though...  

The first place prize is for a fully loaded coin and not the BTC directly.  If we sent the 5 BTC into escrow then it is not where it should be (on the coin).  We as a company feel that we have already done more then enough to establish our trust.  We have paid 100's of Litecoin in bounty (as you know) for our many contests on Litecointalk.  We have many people within the community who will also vouch for us.  We have always paid every single bounty or service provider we have ever used.

That being said if the community would prefer the BTC in escrow, then it is no problem for us.  I guess the 5btc could be sent to the coin address once it is received by the winner.  From our point of view as long as we can verify the 5 BTC is put onto the verified assembled coin then there would be no issue for us.

We are genuine registered company in the UK with a fixed office address.  We would also be more then willing to meet any bitcointalk member at our offices for any verification the community feel is necessary.  We are in this business for the long term and have no interest in ruining our reputation by not paying a competition bounty.  We have already invested a huge amount of money into the company - Thank you


   
Re: 6 Bitcoins & 2 Ounces of fine Gold in Bounty – Submission Deadline 31st August
QUOTE FROM SMOOTHIE July 14, 2014, 01:03:17 AM
The coin funding can easily be done by either the escrowing party or they can return the funds to you for you to personally fund the coin. There shouldn't be a problem on that front. If escrow ends up being used this should be part of the terms of them holding the bounty (where the coins will end up ultimately).

People need to be more cautious with doing deals on this forum.

[smoothie]

Here is another place where I suggested using escrow:

Do you accept escrow for the auction?

Curious how escrow would work if the coin is special ordered for gold and it will take at least sometime in Jan before its ready.  Will they order the coin without receiving funds to pay for the special order?  Coinographic wont see their money for at least a month, using escrow.

Well, with the problems they just had, I would feel much more confortable with escrow.

If I were to bid on this coin I would require escrow.

[MrBAU]

Tell me, Mr. Professor, how to use an escrow in a competition like this? I've never lost money, but I lost time. I guess its the same

That's easy. Let the creator of the competition put the reward in escrow. That way you can still get paid even if he runs. If the creator of a competition doesn't want to do that, well, stay away.

He couldn't do that, It stated that in competition, the reward was the minted coin + the value funded on hologram. Well they could escrow the full prize but we were in no position to demand, they were very jumpy, and even the competitions were not planned well.

The fact in the end that even us as designers got screwed not just people who bought and even those who already have the minted coins the no one will give even 2 penny's for the coin beside the funded on hologram with all the fuss around Coinographic.

[smoothie]

https://litecointalk.org/index.php?topic=20417.msg253462#msg253462

1. No I don’t expect our customers to pay to wind up our business.  I simply stated that neither the company nor I could afford to do it.  The option is available should anyone wish to wind up the company

2. The 45 bull, 29 chicken and 38 LA coins that we did have in stock have now been retained and collected by the coin manufacture for outstanding invoices.   This stock was not sold and Charles Lee DID NOT buy them nor did anyone else.  We have no silver coins.

3. We had molds and dies made for all of our upcoming collection, including a prototype for the 5 BTC coin and prototype boxes for all coins.  In addition we paid for and ordered the holograms for the 5 BTC and 2btc coins.  We also paid for a surplus stock of boxes for our 25LTC and 10 LTC coins.  We also have 50 boxes for each of the 5BTC and 2 BTC coins.

4. I did not forget any of the conversations I had on the phone and I am glad you recorded them all.  At the time we were talking I had every single intention of filling all orders.  I tried all possibilities to raise additional finance to fund the company and fill all obligations ( I can also prove every avenue that was explored).  All possibilities failed.  I have all invoices and receipts for everything that has been paid.  When this is presented to the court it will account for 100% of the monies received.

5. The designer received 1000’s of euros in payment from us.  It was only the last coins he did not receive payment from us which is a total of 1500 euro. All payments made to the designer can also be proved.

7. Neither of my offices were virtual, they were both physical offices and I can also prove that we occupied those offices. All my evidence will be presented to the court when required.

8. Greg was an investor in the company.  His circumstances changed and he was no longer able to put money in to the company. Greg has not been paid back a penny and has received no money form company funds what so ever.  Delia used to work for us but we had to let her go as we could not afford her wages

9. We have never received any payment in cash, only digital currency

I have tried my best to answer as many questions as possible but it seems people have made up their mind.  Anything else will be presented in court when requested.  I will no longer post here

Is that why you keep avoiding answering the question about funding amounts paid to you for coins purchased that you had in stock that you never shipped?

You are a sorry excuse for a human being by taking people's money, making countless promises, now running away like a coward and not paying a single customer back.

Utterly pathetic.

[LitcoinCollector]

Is there not a way to combine forces and sue Coinographic, I'm not a lawyer so I don't know if we stand a chance.
But this behaviour shouldn't be taken lightly.
He owes me 2,75 BTC, for the competition.

[WEBcreator]

Tell me, Mr. Professor, how to use an escrow in a competition like this? I've never lost money, but I lost time. I guess its the same

That's easy. Let the creator of the competition put the reward in escrow. That way you can still get paid even if he runs. If the creator of a competition doesn't want to do that, well, stay away.

agree, there are tons of new way that scammer comes up with everyday now, it is best to always use escrow even if you are dealing with some reputable member or party, be safe rather than be sorry  

[jcoin200]

Coinographic also lost its main investor at the end of November 2013.  We have tried hard to secure additional finance to keep the company alive but have failed in our attempts.

If your situation looked so dire at the end of November, why were you still trying to get preorders for not yet created coins?  Your post history shows you were taking orders on the site and here up through last month, and made no attempt to be forthright about the situation.  And if you couldn't make the coins from the last design contest, why hold another one?  Then go on saying "this will be delt with, give us some more time" etc.

Theres no way you didn't know you weren't going to be able to pay the contest bounty, or fill all the existing preorders.

You can make all the excuses you want, but that wont change the fact you acted very questionably while knowing things were going down the drain.

[MrBAU]

Is there not a way to combine forces and sue Coinographic, I'm not a lawyer so I don't know if we stand a chance.
But this behaviour shouldn't be taken lightly.
He owes me 2,75 BTC, for the competition.

Well I'm in, He owes me a bit more than 20 BTC

[AT101ET]

He owes a heck of a lot not including the prizes and bounties he promised.
He's run off and it's going to be hard getting him to pay up. I suggest you log onto litecointalk where we're trying to build a case against him.

[smoothie]

https://litecointalk.org/index.php?topic=20417.msg263397#msg263397

UPDATE ON COINOGRAPHIC LEGAL PROCEEDINGS BY SAIGONED:

Update:

Claim History

Your claim was issued on 16/02/2015
You submitted a judgment against Mr Mark Hamilton on 10/03/2015 at 03:08:25
Your judgment against Mr Mark Hamilton was issued on 11/03/2015 at 19:19:12
You can issue a Warrant of Execution against Mr Mark Hamilton on 14/04/2015 at 14.00.00.

I will be issuing a warrant of execution this week - that will enable baliffs to enter his home, a County Court Judgement will also be applied against his credit rating.

I will be reporting this as fraud to the police once the court procedures are completed. I have evidence that our funds were not spent on manufacturing and business costs, rather Mark purchased thousands and thousands of dollars worth of Litecoin Gear shares in Oct/Nov/Dec and obviously we know what happened there. I have details of all of these transactions:)

So the funds were misappropriated, if you wish to be involved in criminal charges against Mark - please PM me. Fraud has been committed and I now have evidence.

[S4VV4S]

I feel sorry for all the members that lost their time due to this.
This is however, the reason I did not participate in the second contest.
(Mostly because it was a battle of votes, not talent)

Mind you though, I did receive the small prize from the first one.

MrBau, I am sorry you did not get your prize.
You really deserved it - which is why I voted for you on the first one.

[AT101ET]

I feel sorry for all the members that lost their time due to this.
This is however, the reason I did not participate in the second contest.
(Mostly because it was a battle of votes, not talent)

Mind you though, I did receive the small prize from the first one.

MrBau, I am sorry you did not get your prize.
You really deserved it - which is why I voted for you on the first one.

The way he ran the competitions showed quite a few flaws in the operating of his business. I for one lost out on both the unpaid bounty from this competition as well as losing out on personal funds that were used to purchase his coins which were never delivered.