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Author Topic: 🎲 DiceSites.com - List of dice sites w/ statistics, graphs & verifiers  (Read 19734 times)
NLNico
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August 08, 2016, 02:21:25 AM
 #221

We are using your site as 3rd party verifier to our rolls. At the moment we are linking to Primedice since we use exactly the same generation process, but it would be cool if you could create a page (even if not visible from the homepage or any other section) for this purpose.
@NLNico any comment regarding this?
No, I won't support your site in any way. Problem is that you are obviously faking stats. My site is all about statistics and doesn't make any stupid subjective ratings, but rather lists sites based on wagered stats as "popularity indicator". When sites like FortuneJack and now you, are faking stats, I see that as serious sketchy behavior. I won't list sites that do shit like that.

You are free to have your own opinion, however you cannot make false accusations without any valid fundament or even a justification of that opinion.
True.

To be honest anyone who ever been on a dice site can just go to https://www.betbtc.co/casino/dice and look at the bet list themselves. All those 100% random amounts and chances.. LOL! That should really show enough for anyone who knows the basics of dice (people betting default 2x option, strategies with same payout, strategies with increasing amounts - martingale, etc.)


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August 08, 2016, 02:32:37 AM
 #222

We are using your site as 3rd party verifier to our rolls. At the moment we are linking to Primedice since we use exactly the same generation process, but it would be cool if you could create a page (even if not visible from the homepage or any other section) for this purpose.
@NLNico any comment regarding this?
No, I won't support your site in any way. Problem is that you are obviously faking stats. My site is all about statistics and doesn't make any stupid subjective ratings, but rather lists sites based on wagered stats as "popularity indicator". When sites like FortuneJack and now you, are faking stats, I see that as serious sketchy behavior. I won't list sites that do shit like that.

You are free to have your own opinion, however you cannot make false accusations without any valid fundament or even a justification of that opinion.
We will use another third party verifier, already working for it.

Regards
I don't think that is the right response to what NLNico accused you of doing. NLNico is generally trusted and his opinion is generally respected throughout the gambling community, but this is besides the point, if more or less anyone made this claim, then you should have responded differently.

A much more appropriate response would have been to say something along the lines of "no, we are not faking our stats, what can I share with you to prove this?", or "yes we are faking our stats, but we did not realize the negative consequences of engaging in this behavior, we are going to change our business practices"

Based on NLNico's post above, I would say that I personally believe that you are faking your stats/volume.

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August 08, 2016, 03:14:04 AM
 #223

We are using your site as 3rd party verifier to our rolls. At the moment we are linking to Primedice since we use exactly the same generation process, but it would be cool if you could create a page (even if not visible from the homepage or any other section) for this purpose.
@NLNico any comment regarding this?
No, I won't support your site in any way. Problem is that you are obviously faking stats. My site is all about statistics and doesn't make any stupid subjective ratings, but rather lists sites based on wagered stats as "popularity indicator". When sites like FortuneJack and now you, are faking stats, I see that as serious sketchy behavior. I won't list sites that do shit like that.



Anyone knows what happened to dicenow.com ?!?
Not sure. Begin June someone posted that most BTC of Dicenow are from a hack. Owner didn't reply, but did change the OP 5 days later saying "Dicenow.com is shutting down at the end of June. Please divest and withdraw all coins ASAP.". So either way, looks like they are gone.

Generally when a site/owner becomes inactive it is a red flag. Ice Dice, Win88, Dicenow, Diggit (was offline for months, no reply from owner), Coinichiwa (owner gone for 6 months now), etc. Always risky to leave coins on a site with inactive owner.



Can you explain more clearly, please?
What's happen if all people or many many people win in a dice site?
More and more people play and the dice site will never die. What's mean that you say?

The maximum profit a player can win per bet, changes after each bet. This should be around 0.5-1% of the bankroll (or the "virtual bankroll" if margin-funding is allowed.) This way the player should never be able to win "all" the money based on the Kelly criterion theory.

Can you tell me more about the FJ faking false stat? I was around for quite some time but i didnt hear about this before.

As i am a fan of your site, is it possible to add more gamble site to it? I see that there are other gambling sites but it is not included in your list.
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August 08, 2016, 03:33:31 AM
 #224

We are using your site as 3rd party verifier to our rolls. At the moment we are linking to Primedice since we use exactly the same generation process, but it would be cool if you could create a page (even if not visible from the homepage or any other section) for this purpose.
@NLNico any comment regarding this?
No, I won't support your site in any way. Problem is that you are obviously faking stats. My site is all about statistics and doesn't make any stupid subjective ratings, but rather lists sites based on wagered stats as "popularity indicator". When sites like FortuneJack and now you, are faking stats, I see that as serious sketchy behavior. I won't list sites that do shit like that.

You are free to have your own opinion, however you cannot make false accusations without any valid fundament or even a justification of that opinion.
We will use another third party verifier, already working for it.

Regards
I don't think that is the right response to what NLNico accused you of doing. NLNico is generally trusted and his opinion is generally respected throughout the gambling community, but this is besides the point, if more or less anyone made this claim, then you should have responded differently.

A much more appropriate response would have been to say something along the lines of "no, we are not faking our stats, what can I share with you to prove this?", or "yes we are faking our stats, but we did not realize the negative consequences of engaging in this behavior, we are going to change our business practices"

Based on NLNico's post above, I would say that I personally believe that you are faking your stats/volume.

We don't fake the stats, it would not just be against our principles, as also we don't need it... we have released our Dice just few months ago, it's logic that we still don't have volumes neither liquidity like the ones verified on casinos operating for years. We feel absolutely no pressure on that, proof of that was our dice being kinda empty on the first days, as we started adding more features and personalising things as our users requested more and more are joining everyday.

It's funny how you claim a site is operating in scam and faking stats just because of the data you see on a table. If we wanted to hide you something, we would just hide the chart, simple.
I don't know if you are familiar with betbtc sports exchange but big part of our users are professional bettors that bet via API (copying other markets like betffair, betdaq, matchbook, etc), that's what is happening now in dice, not too many users but lots of rolls and probably strategies being tested.

If we were about to fake the stats it wouldn't be too smart to just deploy random values, we would make things a little bit more "normal" and "smooth", but we don't need it. With time passing and more users joining, we are sure that soon we would have fluid rolls and not only many and big rolls, but also a big number of users making them.

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August 08, 2016, 03:36:44 AM
 #225

Can you tell me more about the FJ faking false stat? I was around for quite some time but i didnt hear about this before.
The FortuneJack faking stats "discussion" started here: "Are the wagered stats of 14+ million BTC on the homepage correct?", they denied having wrong stats a couple times, so I gave a bit more arguments in this post. Finally they acknowledged it was wrong and claimed it was because of some exchange rate bug and offered me a bug bounty in PM (probably to keep me quite - I refused.) I gave some more arguments on why the wrong stats couldn't be caused by an exchange rate bug. They basically just ignored it from there. Few days later they did lower their stats by 28 times but still basically ignored my arguments.

I know FortuneJack however does have some real players who deposit/withdraw without any problem, so I don't make a huge deal out of it. But it is obviously pretty sketchy and I won't ever list them on my site because of it (impossible for me to trust their stats after that.)

As i am a fan of your site, is it possible to add more gamble site to it? I see that there are other gambling sites but it is not included in your list.
Thanks. I do plan to add several other sites when I finished the new version of my site. Unfortunately that is taking pretty long lol, but it will come eventually.

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August 08, 2016, 03:56:14 AM
 #226

We don't fake the stats, it would not just be against our principles, as also we don't need it... we have released our Dice just few months ago, it's logic that we still don't have volumes neither liquidity like the ones verified on casinos operating for years. We feel absolutely no pressure on that, proof of that was our dice being kinda empty on the first days, as we started adding more features and personalising things as our users requested more and more are joining everyday.
That is good, it would probably reflect poorly on your site if you were in fact faking stats. Although if you are faking stats then it is probably best to change your business practices right away, and maybe you would be eventually able to recover your reputation.

Since you are saying that you are not faking stats, you should give additional information to back up this claim, or you could possibly ask NLNico what information he would like to see in order to believe this claim.

It's funny how you claim a site is operating in scam and faking stats just because of the data you see on a table. If we wanted to hide you something, we would just hide the chart, simple.
I am not the one making this claim, NLNico is, I am saying that I trust what he is saying, however what he is saying also makes logical sense. The claim that NLNico is making is that you are trying to hide the fact that you have low volume by showing excessive activity on your recent bets table.

I don't know if you are familiar with betbtc sports exchange but big part of our users are professional bettors that bet via API (copying other markets like betffair, betdaq, matchbook, etc), that's what is happening now in dice, not too many users but lots of rolls and probably strategies being tested.
While this may make some level of sense in regards to your sports betting, this is simply not how dice betting works. With sports betting, if someone were to place bets on two different sportsbooks, the outcome of the match would be the same. However with dice betting, if you place the same bet on two different casinos, the outcome of the roll is almost certainly going to be different, this is due to how provably fairness works.

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August 08, 2016, 01:55:24 PM
 #227

bitdice will remove clam. and br and profit is wrong probably other stat also on clam.

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August 08, 2016, 03:21:03 PM
 #228

Can you tell me more about the FJ faking false stat? I was around for quite some time but i didnt hear about this before.
The FortuneJack faking stats "discussion" started here: "Are the wagered stats of 14+ million BTC on the homepage correct?", they denied having wrong stats a couple times, so I gave a bit more arguments in this post. Finally they acknowledged it was wrong and claimed it was because of some exchange rate bug and offered me a bug bounty in PM (probably to keep me quite - I refused.) I gave some more arguments on why the wrong stats couldn't be caused by an exchange rate bug. They basically just ignored it from there. Few days later they did lower their stats by 28 times but still basically ignored my arguments.

I know FortuneJack however does have some real players who deposit/withdraw without any problem, so I don't make a huge deal out of it. But it is obviously pretty sketchy and I won't ever list them on my site because of it (impossible for me to trust their stats after that.)

As i am a fan of your site, is it possible to add more gamble site to it? I see that there are other gambling sites but it is not included in your list.
Thanks. I do plan to add several other sites when I finished the new version of my site. Unfortunately that is taking pretty long lol, but it will come eventually.

Thanks for listenting to my suggestion. I really love how you have set a high standard for all these casinos instead of just randomly listing them. This will help us have a lot more understanding on the behavior of the casino.
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August 08, 2016, 03:40:52 PM
 #229

I don't know if you are familiar with betbtc sports exchange but big part of our users are professional bettors that bet via API (copying other markets like betffair, betdaq, matchbook, etc), that's what is happening now in dice, not too many users but lots of rolls and probably strategies being tested.

If you notice professional betters playing your dice via api, you should be very worried. The only time I've ever seen that before are on sites that have messed up the odds that allow people to play +EV.  Tongue

bustabit.com :: The social bitcoin gambling site
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August 09, 2016, 04:08:18 AM
 #230

Could you list some sites that didn't make the cut on your site, but are on the fringe? For example, a site like Bitvest. I'm looking for some more investment options outside of the sites you have already listed.
On new version I will probably add (not all invest-based btw): crypto-games.net, bitinvest, bustabit, luckybit, pocketdice (if they finally fix their PF method) and maybe others. Most of these (and some currently listed) will be hidden by default with some filters. So new visitors see only the "most popular dice sites" while "advanced users" can see more sites.
when are you planning to release new version?
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August 09, 2016, 04:15:42 AM
 #231

Could you list some sites that didn't make the cut on your site, but are on the fringe? For example, a site like Bitvest. I'm looking for some more investment options outside of the sites you have already listed.
On new version I will probably add (not all invest-based btw): crypto-games.net, bitinvest, bustabit, luckybit, pocketdice (if they finally fix their PF method) and maybe others. Most of these (and some currently listed) will be hidden by default with some filters. So new visitors see only the "most popular dice sites" while "advanced users" can see more sites.
when are you planning to release new version?
Like a year ago, lol. No, but next month should be realistic Smiley

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August 12, 2016, 11:49:55 AM
 #232

You have bitvest.io on the radar to be added? I like to know their weekly stats=)

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August 12, 2016, 12:04:16 PM
 #233

Probably Smiley

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August 24, 2016, 05:51:57 AM
 #234

What's about Bitsler?
I see that site is growing every day and I like speed of bet in that site!
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August 24, 2016, 08:27:08 AM
 #235

What's about Bitsler?
I see that site is growing every day and I like speed of bet in that site!
I think BitSler still doesn't show any wagered statistic, so I cannot add them to my site.

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August 24, 2016, 08:46:34 AM
 #236

I would like to know about freebitco.in is that correct don't have any provably fair mechanism to generate the outcome for rolls, hi-low and their lottery, so is there any way to verify the outcome, because so many people claiming they can manipulate the outcome easily, is that is true or not?
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August 24, 2016, 09:19:26 AM
 #237

I never looked at them and only had a quick look now:



Hi/Lo freebitco.in game
First of all the house edge is 5%. There is nothing wrong with that, but most sites have a 0.5 - 1% house edge (and SatoshiDice highest with 1.95%.) Since they do give away free money and lottery entries, again I don't think there is anything wrong with it. But a "real dice player" probably should play somewhere else.

Provably fair
They use a "nonce" but yet they change the serverseed after each roll. So I am not sure why they would use that nonce Huh With the "per roll" provably fair implementation, it's important that the site regenerates an unique client seed in the browser after getting the new serverseed hash after each bet. freebitco.in doesn't do this. This means IMO the provably fair implementation of them is "not really" provably fair.

Basically it allows them to serve a serverseed based on bet patterns (if you always go high, they would generate a low result.) The counter argument is that they shouldn't do this, because if they do this - you as a player can heavily cheat them too (bet 10x high, then a big low bet = easy profits.) Of course they could do it more subtle/smart. But besides that, the least they can do is make a result that isn't 8888 (jackpot), to scam jackpot entries completely unnoticeable.

I don't think they do this, but they should still fix this. Rollin had the same and fixed it: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=687571.msg12122724#msg12122724 You can see more details/fix there too.

Note, that you CAN still bet provably fair on their site. It just takes some time: 1) Click "provably fair" 2) write down "Hash" and "Nonce" 3) change the "Client seed" 4) make bet 5) verify bet (their link seems fine.) You will need to do this for EVERY bet.



Lottery
Lottery is not provably fair at all. So yeh, "house player" can always win everything. If they want to implement a provably fair lottery, they should look into how PevPot used to do it.




TL;DR: personally I would gamble on other sites with proper provably fair implementations (preferably with real nonce-implementation.)

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September 09, 2016, 10:35:24 AM
 #238

What's about Bitsler?
I see that site is growing every day and I like speed of bet in that site!
I think BitSler still doesn't show any wagered statistic, so I cannot add them to my site.

That's too bad, could you just add a verifier for the site?


Edit:
Also could you update the "Provably Fair?!" page when you find the time, these sites no longer excists.

dicenow.com
DogeDice.me
LiteDice.me
MagicalDice.com
RedDice.me
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September 12, 2016, 07:58:47 AM
 #239

What's about Bitsler?
I see that site is growing every day and I like speed of bet in that site!
I think BitSler still doesn't show any wagered statistic, so I cannot add them to my site.

That's too bad, could you just add a verifier for the site?


Edit:
Also could you update the "Provably Fair?!" page when you find the time, these sites no longer excists.

dicenow.com
DogeDice.me
LiteDice.me
MagicalDice.com
RedDice.me

Thnx, removed those old sites.

I can add a verifier for BitSler, but I am busy on new version of site first, so probably after that.

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September 12, 2016, 08:22:48 AM
 #240

Any reason why crypto-games hasn't been added?

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