Scam Warning: WoodCollector

[michaeladair]

I made my way here via Reddit, where the news of this has spread.

WoodCollector, the easiest and fastest way to settle this for everybody is to take a few short minutes needed to set up a camera on a small tripod, and take a recording of a carving of any random fine detail from one of the pieces you produce, such as the small font that some have argued is impossible to get such perfection without a laser engraving. That way not only will you put the accusations to be, if they are in fact untrue, but you will also drum up your reputation and show off your skill. There are several issues with relying on clients to chime in:
-if none of them do, it doesn't necessarily mean you are in fact a fraud; it just means no clients have chimed in
-if several people chime in, we would still need to factually establish they were in fact clients
-there is an inherent psychological issue at play here; somebody that has been defrauded and suspects in doing so, may engage in denial and confirmation bias in order to supress their doubt and justify having spent hundreds of dollars

I am just a sideliner here offering suggestions.

Carve a fancy ass interrobang with some internal designs... Prove these people wrong.

[1715074494]

1715074494

[1715074494]

1715074494

[smoothie]

I would say that what he is doing is dishonest if he is lying about how he produces his art. I am fairly confident that his art would probably not be sold for as much or would sell as frequently.

I do however think there would still be a market for his work if he had previously disclosed how he makes his art. I have somewhat thought about buying a piece from him.

Does anyone have any kind of estimate as to the price difference between what he would generally be able to sell his work for if these facts were previously disclosed verses what he actually sold for?

If it were laser-engraved it would sell for far less.

Hand-carved pieces are one off and essentially custom pieces as they will be one of a kind.

Laser engraving is easy as all you need is the design and the same size piece of wood...press the start button on the laser and you're done.

[WoodCollector]

I made my way here via Reddit, where the news of this has spread.

WoodCollector, the easiest and fastest way to settle this for everybody is to take a few short minutes needed to set up a camera on a small tripod, and take a recording of a carving of any random fine detail from one of the pieces you produce, such as the small font that some have argued is impossible to get such perfection without a laser engraving. That way not only will you put the accusations to be, if they are in fact untrue, but you will also drum up your reputation and show off your skill. There are several issues with relying on clients to chime in:
-if none of them do, it doesn't necessarily mean you are in fact a fraud; it just means no clients have chimed in
-if several people chime in, we would still need to factually establish they were in fact clients
-there is an inherent psychological issue at play here; somebody that has been defrauded and suspects in doing so, may engage in denial and confirmation bias in order to supress their doubt and justify having spent hundreds of dollars

I am just a sideliner here offering suggestions.

Carve a fancy ass interrobang with some internal designs... Prove these people wrong.

LOL, Sounds fun, if i do it and make a video of if will you buy it? Tell me what your budget is and i will do it and make a video of it for you.

[Blazed]

I am pretty sure I commissioned the first piece from Woodcollector, and I am 100% happy with it. We never discussed how it would be made or anything, but I do not care either way. He did send me some pictures of it being made along the way so I will try and dig them up. Always a witch hunt here on the boards  

[michaeladair]

I made my way here via Reddit, where the news of this has spread.

WoodCollector, the easiest and fastest way to settle this for everybody is to take a few short minutes needed to set up a camera on a small tripod, and take a recording of a carving of any random fine detail from one of the pieces you produce, such as the small font that some have argued is impossible to get such perfection without a laser engraving. That way not only will you put the accusations to be, if they are in fact untrue, but you will also drum up your reputation and show off your skill. There are several issues with relying on clients to chime in:
-if none of them do, it doesn't necessarily mean you are in fact a fraud; it just means no clients have chimed in
-if several people chime in, we would still need to factually establish they were in fact clients
-there is an inherent psychological issue at play here; somebody that has been defrauded and suspects in doing so, may engage in denial and confirmation bias in order to supress their doubt and justify having spent hundreds of dollars

I am just a sideliner here offering suggestions.

Carve a fancy ass interrobang with some internal designs... Prove these people wrong.

LOL, Sounds fun, if i do it and make a video of if will you buy it? Tell me what your budget is and i will do it and make a video of it for you.

I don't have a lot of money on me right now but I'll see if I can gather some funds up... How does $150 sound? Lol that's most likely the most I could get right now without breaking my investments.

It probably wouldn't be the nicest work you've made considering the price but it's something? :p

If anyone wants to pitch in, I'll let you look at it lol

[WoodCollector]

I am pretty sure I commissioned the first piece from Woodcollector,  and I am 100% happy with it. We never discussed how it would be made or anything, but I do not care either way. He did send me some pictures of it being made along the way so I will try and dig them up. Always a witch hunt here on the boards  

Thanks blazed, i really appreciate it and am happy that you are still pleased with your piece. You were for sure my first client here and i never would have expected it when i only came here to buy wood.

[michaeladair]

You could of course wait for me to get more money which would be an indefinite amount of time lol...

[smoothie]

When I make my chainmaille jewellery is it not hand made because I didn't mine, smelt and coil the metal myself....

Nobody expects him to go out into the woods and cut down trees.
But hand-carved is definitely not the same as "I used my hands to fire up the laser".

That last part gave me a chuckle.

I asked these similar questions a few months back when he first started posting.

When I got to the point that his work looked very similar to laser engraving the discussion quickly got pushed off to Skype or email which I never got around to.

@wood collector, take a camera and video tape an entire piece you have done at the same caliber of your previous pieces. Then fast forward it in a time lapse to show you actually did it with your hands.

To me your work does look laser engraved and not hand carved. Honest opinion.

Smoothie like i said, your entitled to your opinion and i never held it against you, I have messaged one of my clients and asked if he minds if i share a video of his piece being carved. i don't imagine he will have a problem with it, but you know as well as i do that is not going to stop the downward spiral here. It really dosnt stop until Nubbins gets tired of me and moves on to someone else. We see it all the time on this forum.

Assuming this piece is at the same caliber of detail of your other products you've posted and the video does prove you only used your hands to carve the piece (hand tools I presume) then I will support you on this.

Until then I have my doubts as I've expressed months ago when no one else had their doubts.

I will publicly apologize if my opinion of your work turns out to be wrong.

If you know anything about me on this forum is to do the exact same thing nubbins is doing...calling out what the believe is a scam until you are proven wrong. I see nothing wrong with what nubbins has done. If you have proof to make him look like a fool (i.e. wrong) in his assumptions then you should have no problem posting such evidence (i.e. the video).

[smoothie]

I am pretty sure I commissioned the first piece from Woodcollector,  and I am 100% happy with it. We never discussed how it would be made or anything, but I do not care either way. He did send me some pictures of it being made along the way so I will try and dig them up. Always a witch hunt here on the boards  

I'm not sure if I would call it a witch hunt. Asking for someone to prove their legitimacy isn't necessarily a witch hunt. In fact it is attempting to get the facts.

Witch hunts start with shooting then asking questions later. Perhaps nubbins making this thread was too soon but it is so far asking for the right information (i.e. video etc) to disprove any suspicions of the wood pieces not being hand-carved.

[kwukduck]

A detailed clear video would show everyone you're the true artist that you claim to be.


Yet, for some vague reason i don't think there will be one...

Why does somebody have to purchase something from you before you're willing to show that person you're a legit skilled artist? Wouldn't it be better to show everyone, so they start buying your works?

[smoothie]

A detailed clear video would show everyone you're the true artist that you claim to be.


Yet, for some vague reason i don't think there will be one...

Why does somebody have to purchase something from you before you're willing to show that person you're a legit skilled artist? Wouldn't it be better to show everyone, so they start buying your works?

There should be multiple videos of his work. At least one of which he claims exists. I am curious to see from start to finish of him hand-carving the entire piece and not just some of it.

[WoodCollector]

When I make my chainmaille jewellery is it not hand made because I didn't mine, smelt and coil the metal myself....

Nobody expects him to go out into the woods and cut down trees.
But hand-carved is definitely not the same as "I used my hands to fire up the laser".

That last part gave me a chuckle.

I asked these similar questions a few months back when he first started posting.

When I got to the point that his work looked very similar to laser engraving the discussion quickly got pushed off to Skype or email which I never got around to.

@wood collector, take a camera and video tape an entire piece you have done at the same caliber of your previous pieces. Then fast forward it in a time lapse to show you actually did it with your hands.

To me your work does look laser engraved and not hand carved. Honest opinion.

Smoothie like i said, your entitled to your opinion and i never held it against you, I have messaged one of my clients and asked if he minds if i share a video of his piece being carved. i don't imagine he will have a problem with it, but you know as well as i do that is not going to stop the downward spiral here. It really dosnt stop until Nubbins gets tired of me and moves on to someone else. We see it all the time on this forum.

Assuming this piece is at the same caliber of detail of your other products you've posted and the video does prove you only used your hands to carve the piece (hand tools I presume) then I will support you on this.

Until then I have my doubts as I've expressed months ago when no one else had their doubts.

I will publicly apologize if my opinion of your work turns out to be wrong.

If you know anything about me on this forum is to do the exact same thing nubbins is doing...calling out what the believe is a scam until you are proven wrong. I see nothing wrong with what nubbins has done. If you have proof to make him look like a fool (i.e. wrong) in his assumptions then you should have no problem posting such evidence (i.e. the video).

Smoothie, I 100% agree to this and will do a video of a piece specifically for you, free of charge pending a few conditions are met.

1: all this nonsense ends until i have a chance to get the video posted in a few days, i cant do anything if i have to sit behind this computer and keep arguing with kids.

2: once the piece is done and the video is posted, you will send me a shipping address, even if its a drop address and write a full review of the piece including a public recantation of your accusations.

3: You leave negative feedback on Nubbins trust rating PERMANENTLY for jumping to conclusions and making accusations without even bothering to contact me to see if i can prove what i claim before setting out on his public smearing campaign.

The only reason i am agreeing to this for you is because previously when you had concerns you had the decency to contact me directly, ask your questions, and i assumed they were answered to satisfaction as you never said anything after. You had the respect and maturity to contact me directly before starting a public smearing campaign, and i do not believe that Nubbins should go up-punished for being so un-professional.

If you agree, please reply by quoting this post and including in the words "I AGREE TO YOUR TERMS"   So i can reference it in the event i jump through these insane hoops and you do not hold up to your end of the deal.

[erwin45hacked]

When I make my chainmaille jewellery is it not hand made because I didn't mine, smelt and coil the metal myself....

Nobody expects him to go out into the woods and cut down trees.
But hand-carved is definitely not the same as "I used my hands to fire up the laser".

That last part gave me a chuckle.

I asked these similar questions a few months back when he first started posting.

When I got to the point that his work looked very similar to laser engraving the discussion quickly got pushed off to Skype or email which I never got around to.

@wood collector, take a camera and video tape an entire piece you have done at the same caliber of your previous pieces. Then fast forward it in a time lapse to show you actually did it with your hands.

To me your work does look laser engraved and not hand carved. Honest opinion.

Smoothie like i said, your entitled to your opinion and i never held it against you, I have messaged one of my clients and asked if he minds if i share a video of his piece being carved. i don't imagine he will have a problem with it, but you know as well as i do that is not going to stop the downward spiral here. It really dosnt stop until Nubbins gets tired of me and moves on to someone else. We see it all the time on this forum.

Assuming this piece is at the same caliber of detail of your other products you've posted and the video does prove you only used your hands to carve the piece (hand tools I presume) then I will support you on this.

Until then I have my doubts as I've expressed months ago when no one else had their doubts.

I will publicly apologize if my opinion of your work turns out to be wrong.

If you know anything about me on this forum is to do the exact same thing nubbins is doing...calling out what the believe is a scam until you are proven wrong. I see nothing wrong with what nubbins has done. If you have proof to make him look like a fool (i.e. wrong) in his assumptions then you should have no problem posting such evidence (i.e. the video).

Smoothie, I 100% agree to this and will do a video of a piece specifically for you, free of charge pending a few conditions are met.

1: all this nonsense ends until i have a chance to get the video posted in a few days, i cant do anything if i have to sit behind this computer and keep arguing with kids.

2: once the piece is done and the video is posted, you will send me a shipping address, even if its a drop address and write a full review of the piece including a public recantation of your accusations.

3: You leave negative feedback on Nubbins trust rating PERMANENTLY for jumping to conclusions and making accusations without even bothering to contact me to see if i can prove what i claim before setting out on his public smearing campaign.

The only reason i am agreeing to this for you is because previously when you had concerns you had the decency to contact me directly, ask your questions, and i assumed they were answered to satisfaction as you never said anything after. You had the respect and maturity to contact me directly before starting a public smearing campaign, and i do not believe that Nubbins should go up-punished for being so un-professional.

If you agree, please reply by quoting this post and including in the words "I AGREE TO YOUR TERMS"   So i can reference it in the event i jump through these insane hoops and you do not hold up to your end of the deal.

such a bold move i love it

the one thing to ensure the reputation here is video + review from the person who accuse

Great move

i hope you carve a great masterpiece for smoothie

[deliveryman]

Guys (and especially OP),

Honestly I would'nt have a problem with people suspecting something. Its not wrong to do that. However, what is wrong is that the title of this post is called: SCAM WARMING.
How do you know its a scam? Did you buy any piece from him? Are you a wood artist? Its very easy to point fingers and choose sides but it would be better to stay neutral. I'm sure if you asked a normal question about your doubts, there would be no problem at all.

I have paid and witnessed myself how he created my piece "Resolute":
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=927942

Along the way, I have witnessed all sketches and progress done. This is something I personally asked. If you order a piece, you can also choose the "surprise" route, in which he just crafts a beautifull piece and sends it to you without making progression pictures along the way. This guy is 100% legit. If he was not, I would not throw a 1000 EU against it.  

Now if anyone feels cool enough to have further questions. Don't hesistate to PM me. However, this is a piece of art and it should stay that way. I am not going to ask progression pictures of the Mona Lisa either. It's not something art should be about.

[qwk]

Smoothie, I 100% agree to this and will do a video of a piece specifically for you, free of charge pending a few conditions are met.

1: all this nonsense ends until i have a chance to get the video posted in a few days, i cant do anything if i have to sit behind this computer and keep arguing with kids.

How does this thread affect your ability to get to work?
Seriously though, if you really need to take a break from it, just don't go online for a few days.

3: You leave negative feedback on Nubbins trust rating PERMANENTLY for jumping to conclusions and making accusations without even bothering to contact me to see if i can prove what i claim before setting out on his public smearing campaign.

Now that's what I call uncalled for.
Nubbins is trying to warn others, he's not after you.
There's no reason whatsoever for Smoothie to leave negative trust for him.

[Quickseller]

When I make my chainmaille jewellery is it not hand made because I didn't mine, smelt and coil the metal myself....

Nobody expects him to go out into the woods and cut down trees.
But hand-carved is definitely not the same as "I used my hands to fire up the laser".

That last part gave me a chuckle.

I asked these similar questions a few months back when he first started posting.

When I got to the point that his work looked very similar to laser engraving the discussion quickly got pushed off to Skype or email which I never got around to.

@wood collector, take a camera and video tape an entire piece you have done at the same caliber of your previous pieces. Then fast forward it in a time lapse to show you actually did it with your hands.

To me your work does look laser engraved and not hand carved. Honest opinion.

Smoothie like i said, your entitled to your opinion and i never held it against you, I have messaged one of my clients and asked if he minds if i share a video of his piece being carved. i don't imagine he will have a problem with it, but you know as well as i do that is not going to stop the downward spiral here. It really dosnt stop until Nubbins gets tired of me and moves on to someone else. We see it all the time on this forum.

Assuming this piece is at the same caliber of detail of your other products you've posted and the video does prove you only used your hands to carve the piece (hand tools I presume) then I will support you on this.

Until then I have my doubts as I've expressed months ago when no one else had their doubts.

I will publicly apologize if my opinion of your work turns out to be wrong.

If you know anything about me on this forum is to do the exact same thing nubbins is doing...calling out what the believe is a scam until you are proven wrong. I see nothing wrong with what nubbins has done. If you have proof to make him look like a fool (i.e. wrong) in his assumptions then you should have no problem posting such evidence (i.e. the video).

Smoothie, I 100% agree to this and will do a video of a piece specifically for you, free of charge pending a few conditions are met.

1: all this nonsense ends until i have a chance to get the video posted in a few days, i cant do anything if i have to sit behind this computer and keep arguing with kids.

2: once the piece is done and the video is posted, you will send me a shipping address, even if its a drop address and write a full review of the piece including a public recantation of your accusations.

3: You leave negative feedback on Nubbins trust rating PERMANENTLY for jumping to conclusions and making accusations without even bothering to contact me to see if i can prove what i claim before setting out on his public smearing campaign.

The only reason i am agreeing to this for you is because previously when you had concerns you had the decency to contact me directly, ask your questions, and i assumed they were answered to satisfaction as you never said anything after. You had the respect and maturity to contact me directly before starting a public smearing campaign, and i do not believe that Nubbins should go up-punished for being so un-professional.

If you agree, please reply by quoting this post and including in the words "I AGREE TO YOUR TERMS"   So i can reference it in the event i jump through these insane hoops and you do not hold up to your end of the deal.

I AGREE TO YOUR TERMS.

Will PM you what I want done. Thank you!

Are you smoothie? Were you posting from the wrong account?

[b!z]

When I make my chainmaille jewellery is it not hand made because I didn't mine, smelt and coil the metal myself....

Nobody expects him to go out into the woods and cut down trees.
But hand-carved is definitely not the same as "I used my hands to fire up the laser".

That last part gave me a chuckle.

I asked these similar questions a few months back when he first started posting.

When I got to the point that his work looked very similar to laser engraving the discussion quickly got pushed off to Skype or email which I never got around to.

@wood collector, take a camera and video tape an entire piece you have done at the same caliber of your previous pieces. Then fast forward it in a time lapse to show you actually did it with your hands.

To me your work does look laser engraved and not hand carved. Honest opinion.

Smoothie like i said, your entitled to your opinion and i never held it against you, I have messaged one of my clients and asked if he minds if i share a video of his piece being carved. i don't imagine he will have a problem with it, but you know as well as i do that is not going to stop the downward spiral here. It really dosnt stop until Nubbins gets tired of me and moves on to someone else. We see it all the time on this forum.

Assuming this piece is at the same caliber of detail of your other products you've posted and the video does prove you only used your hands to carve the piece (hand tools I presume) then I will support you on this.

Until then I have my doubts as I've expressed months ago when no one else had their doubts.

I will publicly apologize if my opinion of your work turns out to be wrong.

If you know anything about me on this forum is to do the exact same thing nubbins is doing...calling out what the believe is a scam until you are proven wrong. I see nothing wrong with what nubbins has done. If you have proof to make him look like a fool (i.e. wrong) in his assumptions then you should have no problem posting such evidence (i.e. the video).

Smoothie, I 100% agree to this and will do a video of a piece specifically for you, free of charge pending a few conditions are met.

1: all this nonsense ends until i have a chance to get the video posted in a few days, i cant do anything if i have to sit behind this computer and keep arguing with kids.

2: once the piece is done and the video is posted, you will send me a shipping address, even if its a drop address and write a full review of the piece including a public recantation of your accusations.

3: You leave negative feedback on Nubbins trust rating PERMANENTLY for jumping to conclusions and making accusations without even bothering to contact me to see if i can prove what i claim before setting out on his public smearing campaign.

The only reason i am agreeing to this for you is because previously when you had concerns you had the decency to contact me directly, ask your questions, and i assumed they were answered to satisfaction as you never said anything after. You had the respect and maturity to contact me directly before starting a public smearing campaign, and i do not believe that Nubbins should go up-punished for being so un-professional.

If you agree, please reply by quoting this post and including in the words "I AGREE TO YOUR TERMS"   So i can reference it in the event i jump through these insane hoops and you do not hold up to your end of the deal.

I AGREE TO YOUR TERMS.

Will PM you what I want done. Thank you!

How dense are you? He specifically made the offer to Smoothie, not you.

[IronMarvel2]

I commissioned 3 pieces and witnessed on all 3 of them the process of being made!!!
All 3 were drawn before and on all 3 were made changes by my request.
WoodCollector is such a nice person and takes a lot of time for his clients.
AND EVEN, if this pieces were carved by a laser... I would still love them and they would still be unique.

[WoodCollector]

Smoothie, I 100% agree to this and will do a video of a piece specifically for you, free of charge pending a few conditions are met.

1: all this nonsense ends until i have a chance to get the video posted in a few days, i cant do anything if i have to sit behind this computer and keep arguing with kids.

How does this thread affect your ability to get to work?
Seriously though, if you really need to take a break from it, just don't go online for a few days.

3: You leave negative feedback on Nubbins trust rating PERMANENTLY for jumping to conclusions and making accusations without even bothering to contact me to see if i can prove what i claim before setting out on his public smearing campaign.

Now that's what I call uncalled for.
Nubbins is trying to warn others, he's not after you.
There's no reason whatsoever for Smoothie to leave negative trust for him.

There is 10,000% a reason to leave negative trust for him permanently for poor conduct on the forum. As you can see by clicking here Every single one of my clients who requested knows beyond any shadow of a doubt their pieces are 100% legit as i provide them with everything along the way. He was just the first of my clients, Besides blazedout who already chimed in to log in today to set the record straight.

If nubbins would have conducted himself in a professional manner, Contacted me with his questions, hell maybe eve a request for a small piece out of non exotic wood and a video of me carving it to settle his curiousit, i would have provided him with every bit of everything that all my clients already know and have.

Instead he wants to lead a public smear campaign, start a "scam warning" thread when he has nothing to "warn" as his "proofs" are nothing more than self drawn conclusions that he is trying to market to the public to get them to believe. Further he wants to use his default trust status to smear my trust rating as a result of his ill drawn conclusions like they are fact.

He deserves a million times to be scorned for acting in such a rude, unprofessional manner, it is antics like his that cause good people to leave the community when they are the ones providing the true blessings to this place.

Those are my terms, they are agreed to by smoothie or not. If he agrees, then i do it for him, He does not, then i have 0 care in the world as EVERY SINGLE ONE of my clients who requested has been given every bit of proof along the way they wanted and as they log in EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM will tell you the same thing. If i have to jump through hoops on account of someone being reckless and unprofessional, then that person needs to suffer as well. If Nubbins wants to remove his trust rating, be done with and remove this smear campaign thread, and message me like a grown man in a professional manner LIKE HE SHOULD HAVE DONE IN THE FIRST PLACE, then i can directly put his mind at ease and provide him with what he wants. If not, then here we stand, Smoothie agrees to my terms, or i go on not caring. I came here to buy wood, not to argue with irrational people. This smear campaign is more annoying than it is damaging, every one of my clients knows better, and anyone who wants to commission a piece in the future, if i even continue to do pieces for this community in the future after i finish the ones that are already paid for can talk to my clients from here, and request the same step by step pics that all my other clients got.


SMOOTHIE, THE BALL IS IN YOUR COURT!, and only because you were very professional when you contacted me last time with your concerns and i have respect for that.

[qwk]

There is 10,000% a reason to leave negative trust for him permanently for poor conduct on the forum.

I beg to differ. His doubts are reasonable and voiced in the "correct" way here in "Scam Accusations".

If nubbins would have conducted himself in a professional manner, Contacted me with his questions, hell maybe eve a request for a small piece out of non exotic wood and a video of me carving it to settle his curiousit, i would have provided him with every bit of everything that all my clients already know and have.

Well, then where's your reason not to settle this right now, right here, once and for all?

He deserves a million times to be scorned for acting in such a rude, unprofessional manner, it is antics like his that cause good people to leave the community when they are the ones providing the true blessings to this place.

It is people like him who have detected scams on this forum in the past and warned others about it, over and over again.

Those are my terms, they are agreed to by smoothie or not.

Sure, but should Smoothie agree, I might leave negative trust for him as well.
Surrender to blackmail is something I would consider a breach of trust.
So, if you care about Smoothie, drop that request for negative feedback towards nubbins.